DIY 5k Monitor - success :-)

[PaulD-UK]

Quote: The standby difference with the computer off vs sleeping is odd.
I wonder if my Cable Matters USB-C to DP cable is perhaps causing this, and not communicating the sleep-state signal properly?
I'll get a Thunderbolt 3 cable to test if there's any difference. I need to get a long enough one.

SEE MY EDIT TO POST #547 : Everything is normal, with sleep power of < 1 watt.

 

[JavD]

Ok, some quick power consumption measurements.

Thanks @i486dx2-66 !
I am also interested for T18. Yet have some questions if you could share:

1. Power consumption & heat: Does T18 work PD supply, i.e. if I have a e.g. 100W PSU, would T18 adjust input watt & voltage automatically? esp. when using USB-C to USB-C with power delivery up to 65W.
2. Your success with USB-C to DP for 5K is encouraging. Would you mind share what's in About =>System Report =>Graphics/Displays ? a screenshot pls.?
3. Does USB-C currently under Thunderbolt3(TB3) activated, i.e. the bandwidth of TB3 is needed for 5K, not simply as e.g. USB-C/USB3.1 with 10GBps?
4. Do you get a brightness bar for the Display? (within System Preferenes/Displays);
5. The T18 backlight cable pictured here, is the orientation first pin black to black or black to red towards its counterpart? Any risk or effect if connected another way around?
6. How is the sharpness comparing to original iMac 5K? Have you tried with Windows PC?

Thanks for sharing!

 

[i486dx2-66]

EDIT: I realise that this means that the Standby power requirement when the computer is connected but Sleeping is 9w (~6w true value), but if the computer is powered Off, then the R1811 is no longer held in Standby mode, and reverts to a board-powered state (with backlight off) requiring ~19w power.

Quote: The standby difference with the computer off vs sleeping is odd.
I wonder if my Cable Matters USB-C to DP cable is perhaps causing this, and not communicating the sleep-state signal properly?

I just tried your tests on my T18 + 2014 iMac panel, using my UNI brand USB-C to DP cable (specifically, this one: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CL31FR6), connected to a M1 Macbook Air, which was running on battery power for the tests.

Cable unplugged + Monitor Off (no LEDs lit): <1W
Cable unplugged + Monitor Standby (red LED on): <1W
Cable plugged in + Macbook awake + Monitor Off (no LEDs lit): <1W
Cable plugged in + Macbook sleeping + Monitor Standby (red LED on) : <1W
Cable plugged in + Macbook shut down after being on/connected + Monitor Standby (red LED on): <1W

So... it looks like the T18 handles this without issue.

 

[i486dx2-66]

Thanks @i486dx2-66 !
I am also interested for T18. Yet have some questions if you could share:

1. Power consumption & heat: Does T18 work PD supply, i.e. if I have a e.g. 100W PSU, would T18 adjust input watt & voltage automatically? esp. when using USB-C to USB-C with power delivery up to 65W.
2. Your success with USB-C to DP for 5K is encouraging. Would you mind share what's in About =>System Report =>Graphics/Displays ? a screenshot pls.?
3. Does USB-C currently under Thunderbolt3(TB3) activated, i.e. the bandwidth of TB3 is needed for 5K, not simply as e.g. USB-C/USB3.1 with 10GBps?
4. Do you get a brightness bar for the Display? (within System Preferenes/Displays);
5. The T18 backlight cable pictured here, is the orientation first pin black to black or black to red towards its counterpart? Any risk or effect if connected another way around?
6. How is the sharpness comparing to original iMac 5K? Have you tried with Windows PC?

Thanks for sharing!

Sure thing!

1) I couldn't say - since I suspect the factory power supply is questionably up to the task of running the display alone, I haven't tested the USB-C display connection or USB-C PD functionality. Given my measurements, I suspect one would want a quality power supply of 160W+ if USB-C PD is used...

2) I don't have the display connected right now, but I'll try to check - remind me if I forget.

3) I don't believe any of these conversion PCBs require or utilize Thunderbolt? I think all of them are USB-C / Display Port only?

4) I'll have to check once I have it connected again....

5) On mine, the end pin with the red wire connects to the GREY end pin on the display. I have no idea what happens if it is connected the other way around... The wiring of this is a mystery to me - I'd love to know what the circuit looks like on the display panel side - does anyone have an iMac schematic?

6a) The panel really does look great. This is a 2014 iMac 5K panel, which by specifications is the worst of the 5K iMac panels, and is also nearly a decade old at this point. Mine also came from a prior life at a farm shop(!), and has a particularly bad case of the lower corner dust issue. Even so, it looks amazing. I can't wait to finish it up and get rid of my 28" 4K Samsung.

6b) I don't have any Windows machines capable of driving this at full resolution - or even any with USB-C. But an old Windows laptop had no issues driving it via HDMI at 3840x2160.

 

[i486dx2-66]

And just in case anyone else is just joining the thread, and like myself was trying to sort things out, there appears to be five separate conversion board options available now:

R1811
R9A18
U49
T18
T19

So I was doing some blind Googling last night, and believe I found two more - a sixth and seventh option!


The first is the "JY29XT_PH_WS_R10.1", which has "Paramount Technology" branding on the PCB and appears to be sold under the simplified name JY29XT.

There is one brief forum reference to the PCB being used here:

Loading...

The conversion PCB is available on Amazon of all places ($716.99 ):

Occus - Cables 5K Universal hd Driver Board HDR Freesync edp VBO 60hz LCD Driver Board can be Driven LM270QQ1 LM270QQ2 LCD Screen - (Cable Length: Type A or Type B, Color: Type B)

Occus - Cables 5K Universal hd Driver Board HDR Freesync edp VBO 60hz LCD Driver Board can be Driven LM270QQ1 LM270QQ2 LCD Screen - (Cable Length: Type A or Type B, Color: Type B)

www.amazon.com

... and also on Taobao:

taobao | 淘寶

淘寶（Taobao）讓您隨心淘超值商品，爲您提供流行服飾、美妝洗護、3C數碼、大小家電、家俬家居、箱包皮具、運動戶外、五金工具、玩具等千萬件熱銷好貨，淘寶支持文字或圖片搜索商品。天貓淘寶海外作爲Taobao面向華人的跨境電商平台，覆蓋200多個國家和地區的消費者，其中核心站點包括：淘寶香港（taobao hk）、淘寶台灣（taobao tw）、淘寶澳門、淘宝新加坡、淘宝马来西亚、淘宝韩国（타오바오 사이트）、淘宝澳洲、淘宝加拿大、taobao world。

www.taobao.com

The listing on Taobao has a number of screenshots of the OSD, which has prominent Realtek branding.

 

[i486dx2-66]

The second new board is the JRY-W9CUHD-AA1. The brand may be "Jiarunyuan", but that is machine translated.

It appears to be mostly available on ruten.com.tw, for a price of $3350-$5900 (presumed to be Taiwan New Dollars, so approximately $109.60 to $193.04 USD?)


A few links:

全新嘉潤源4k 5K驅動板 type-c JRY-W9CUHD-AA1 HDR Freesync | 露天市集

直購價: 3350 - 3350, 庫存: 99, 物品狀況: 全新,物品所在地: 台灣.台中市, 價格更新時間:, 上架時間: 2023-05-19, 分類: 電腦電子 > 電子零件、材料 > 其他, 賣場: 隆發賣場, #有多種顏色 #有多種尺寸

www-ruten-com-tw.translate.goog

全新嘉潤源4k 5K驅動板 type-c JRY-W9CUHD-AA1 HDR Freesync | 露天市集

規格: 4K主板+屏線+按鍵板+背光線, 5K主板+屏線+按鍵板+背光線, 直購價: 3450 - 5900, 庫存: 74, 物品狀況: 全新,物品所在地: 台灣.新北市, 價格更新時間:2022-11-10, 上架時間: 2022-11-10, 分類: ?芸??憿?, 賣場: , #可開收據

www-ruten-com-tw.translate.goog

（限時秒殺)全新嘉潤源4k 5K驅動板 type-c JRY-W9CUHD-AA1 HDR Freesync | 露天市集

規格: 4K主板+屏線+按鍵板+背光線, 5K主板+屏線+按鍵板+背光線, 直購價: 3450 - 5900, 庫存: 99, 物品狀況: 全新,物品所在地: 台灣.台北市, 價格更新時間:, 上架時間: 2022-12-28, 分類: 電腦電子 > 電子零件、材料 > 連接器 > 其他, 賣場: , #賣家保固 #公司貨 #可開收據 #有多種尺寸

www-ruten-com-tw.translate.goog

全新4k 5K驱动板JRY-W9CUHD-AA1 typec LM270QQ1-SDA2/C1 2K165hz-Taobao

欢迎来到淘宝显源电子，选购全新4k 5K驱动板JRY-W9CUHD-AA1 typec LM270QQ1-SDA2/C1 2K165hz，该商品累计热卖100+件，好评率100%，17用户购后写下真实评论。颜色分类：4K主板+屏线+按键板+背光线,5K主板+屏线+按键板+背光线,LM270QQ1驱动板套件,LM270QQ2驱动板套件，快来查看更多买家秀和测评，让你放心淘到宝！

www-taobao-com.translate.goog

This PCB has by far the smallest heatsink of any of them. Perhaps that hints of a different brand or model of input processor being used?

 

[kitsunesoba]

It's interesting and unexpected that there's enough of a market for these boards that new ones keep popping up. It's not a bad thing though, I hope they continue to be developed and manufactured so the scores of nice 5k display panels previously destined for the scrapyard instead find new homes.

One thing that crossed my mind, has anybody used one of these boards to rehabilitate one of those earlier highly troubled models of LG Ultrasharp 5k?

 

[uller6]

It's interesting and unexpected that there's enough of a market for these boards that new ones keep popping up. It's not a bad thing though, I hope they continue to be developed and manufactured so the scores of nice 5k display panels previously destined for the scrapyard instead find new homes.

One thing that crossed my mind, has anybody used one of these boards to rehabilitate one of those earlier highly troubled models of LG Ultrasharp 5k?

I’m using the R9A18 board with my former LG ultra sharp 5k panel. It works great at 5k resolution with my M1 Pro and a single DP to usb-c cable. I don’t know about 8 bit vs 10 bit color, but it looks fine to me.

 

[i486dx2-66]

It's interesting and unexpected that there's enough of a market for these boards that new ones keep popping up. It's not a bad thing though, I hope they continue to be developed and manufactured so the scores of nice 5k display panels previously destined for the scrapyard instead find new homes.

I think the last one I found is actually from a big OEM. If you take that part number, "JRY-W9CUHD-AA1", and just search for the first part ("JRY-W9CUHD"), you get a ton of results for used parts from a variety of name-brand monitors.

I'm not sure how big our specific part of the market is - but a vendor could immediately become the favorite if they made a PCB with a hole mounting pattern that matched the standoffs inside an iMac enclosure - particularly if it positioned the ports near the RAM access door.

 

[i486dx2-66]

If your PSU is getting too hot, then I would suspect that its a lack of Power Factor Correction.
My PSU has active electronic PFC, which reduces its mains power requirements and makes it more efficient.

That very well could be. I also forgot to mention that with the factory power supply, the monitor had a faint high-frequency audible noise, sort of a squeal from the power brick, and a low frequency (2Hz or so?) cycling high frequency sound from the display itself. Both went away entirely with the name-brand power supply - the display was silent.

 

[i486dx2-66]

- I had occasional dropouts. When my automated plant light turns on (same wall-outlet), it might trigger a reset and the board restarts. But this also happens with other screens — I should probably avoid these minisurges 😅.
- A bit more worriesome was one random shutdown after a few hours of use. Only a full power-cycle helped, disconnecting the power supply from the wall-outlet. I briefly checked the temps of the board and psu, both were warm to touch but not worse than a macbook under load. I think this might be due to the powerbrick. I will keep monitoring and might replace it for a spare magsafe, but since it only happened once its a low prio.

Coming back to this - Can you reliably trigger those dropouts with your plant light?

I've been doing some testing, and again had the restarts, but also had one time where it didn't come back until it was unplugged for 5+ minutes. Still not sure if that's the power supply or the controller board... That was with the alternate power supply, run within its limits, and it wasn't appreciably hot and neither was the T18 PCB.

After that revived itself, I dropped the backlight down to 20 (which is 40W power consumption at the wall)... and ran it like that for 20-25 minutes, then dropped it down to 10 (which is 32W at the wall), and I've been at that for over a half hour, and no dropouts at all the whole time. (edit: still no dropouts at the 2 hour mark.)

So with very little data, it *seems* like the restart issue might be related to the backlight brightness. If you can reliably trigger the dropouts with your plant light, @pSpitzner, I'd be interested in knowing if it still did it at lower and higher backlight values...

 

[i486dx2-66]

Hey guys new to this thread and project. I ended up ordering one of those new T18 boards. I'm going to test it out. Any particular tests you'd like me to run on it once I get it?

Just curious, did you ever get your T18 up and running, and how has your experience been?

 

[i486dx2-66]

Your success with USB-C to DP for 5K is encouraging. Would you mind share what's in About =>System Report =>Graphics/Displays ? a screenshot pls.?

Apple M1:
Chipset Model: Apple M1
Type: GPU
Bus: Built-In
Total Number of Cores: 8
Vendor: Apple (0x106b)
Metal Support: Metal 3
Displays:
DP:
Resolution: 5120 x 2880 (5K/UHD+ - Ultra High Definition Plus)
UI Looks like: 2560 x 1440 @ 60.00Hz
Main Display: Yes
Mirror: Off
Online: Yes
Rotation: Supported

Do you get a brightness bar for the Display? (within System Preferenes/Displays);

Nope, only when the MacBook Air's internal display is detected. The connected monitor does not natively have a brightness control within system settings.

 

[i486dx2-66]

Ok, some quick power consumption measurements. These were taken with a P3 P4400 "Kill A Watt" meter, and the provided no-name 19V 4.74A power adapter. This is with the T18, on a 2014 5K iMac panel, with no supplementary backlight driver board.

Power adapter alone (unplugged from the T18): <1W
Display connected but in sleep (no backlight, red LED lit on the button board): <1W
Display on (0% backlight brightness, which is still "on" and visible, just low): 25W
Display on (50% backlight brightness, the default value): 72W
Display on (100% backlight brightness): 82W

So, given that the original power adapter is only rated at 90W, there's not really a lot of overhead there...

I don't have any 24V power supplies handy, but I ran another set of tests with a beefy 19.5V 9.23A (180W) Dell power supply (DA180PM111, with a modified cord for a 2.5x5.5mm plug).

The <1W measurements all bumped up to 2W. But the other three measurements (0%, 50%, and 100% backlight) dropped down to 23W, 64W, and 72W!! So aside from the higher standby consumption, there are some significant efficiency differences between these supplies.

 

[webhdx]

Does LM270QQ1(SD)(D1) 5K panel from iMac 5K 27" 2018 fit into A1419 chassis? Need confirmation before I buy the panel.

 

[PaulD-UK]

Yes:
1. If you remove the A1419 Bluetooth antenna - the one on the top right. I'm not sure if the side wifi antennas will get in the way and also need removing.
2. If you remove all or part of the D1's screen iMac Pro iSight camera/mic fixtures, and slightly remove some of the top plastic adhesive screen mount either side of the A1419 camera position.

 

[i486dx2-66]

A few more T18 observations:

• The T18 powers on with a black splash screen with "Haijing Cool" text in large red letters. After living for years with the eye-searing full-white splash screen of my old Auria WQHD display, this is a welcome improvement. The splash screen is only shown when the monitor is fully powered off and back on (via the control buttons or unplugged) - it doesn't show when it wakes up from standby.
• The wakeup time from standby is fairly quick. Probably in the neighborhood of ~3 seconds?
• Brightness control via MonitorControl seems to work via my USB-C to DisplayPort cable as well as HDMI. However, when connected via HDMI to my 2018 Mac Mini and sliding the MonitorControl brightness slider up and down, the display went blank and the input disconnected. I'm not sure what happened - perhaps some invalid value was generated? But the HDMI connection is effectively dead now - powering off didn't help, restarting didn't help, disconnecting and reconnecting the display didn't help. The HDMI input on the T18 still works fine from other devices, and the 2018 Mac Mini can still drive the T18 via the USB-C/DisplayPort cable, so it seems to be something the Mac Mini (via MonitorControl) is "remembering" for the HDMI port?
• Unlike my 4K Samsung, input switching on the T18 is automatic and works very well.
• I had planned on making a custom PCB to align the OSD buttons to the USB port cutouts in the rear of the iMac... but with the combination of a good reliable auto-switching, low standby power draw, and the software brightness control (see caveat above), I no longer think this is worth doing. The button panel can basically be taped (or otherwise electrically insulated) and tucked away inside, as it won't be needed in regular usage.
• As far as I can tell, the 2018 Mac Mini cannot drive this display at full resolution. Instead, regardless of the interface, the resolution seems to top out at 3840x2160. Lowering the refresh rate doesn't help. I'm going to tag the resident expert @joevt and see if he has any thoughts on that... (That machine is still on Mojave, so there's a chance that is a factor.)

 

[Amethyst1]

As far as I can tell, the 2018 Mac Mini cannot drive this display at full resolution. Instead, regardless of the interface, the resolution seems to top out at 3840x2160.

The 2018 Mac mini is limited to DisplayPort 1.2 (HBR2) which is insufficient for 5K at 60 Hz and 8bpc or 10bpc RGB. Unless you're using dual-link SST (dual HBR2), you need DisplayPort 1.4 (HBR3) for 5K at 60 Hz and 8bpc RGB or HBR2+DSC for 10bpc RGB.

Lowering the refresh rate doesn't help. I'm going to tag the resident expert @joevt and see if he has any thoughts on that... (That machine is still on Mojave, so there's a chance that is a factor.)

Resolutions wider than 4096 pixels (up to 5120 pixels) are supported on the 2018 Mac mini but only on macOS Big Sur and later versions. Can you get 5K at 30 Hz on Big Sur or later?

 

[yurikhan]

The T18 powers on with a black splash screen with "Haijing Cool" text in large red letters. After living for years with the eye-searing full-white splash screen of my old Auria WQHD display, this is a welcome improvement.

Cannot confirm. Mine powers on with a white background and a blue logo/letters. Might be firmware version difference.

 

[i486dx2-66]

Cannot confirm. Mine powers on with a white background and a blue logo/letters. Might be firmware version difference.

Oh wow, that's interesting. How long ago did you order yours?

I Googled (and auto-translated the characters, which matches the text below it) that logo thinking it might unveil a clue to the mystery of the manufacturer/origins of these PCBs... but instead just got a whole bunch of anime? 🤷‍♂️

 

[yurikhan]

Oh wow, that's interesting. How long ago did you order yours?

I Googled (and auto-translated the characters, which matches the text below it) that logo thinking it might unveil a clue to the mystery of the manufacturer/origins of these PCBs... but instead just got a whole bunch of anime? 🤷‍♂️

Ordered 2023-02-20, received 2023-03-24. No idea how long ago it was flashed.

 

[yurikhan]

Hm. Also possibly of interest for somebody: my T18’s EDID seems to be malformed, causing the edid-decode utility to crash. Before crashing, it manages to report that the manufacturer name is SGT, model 4660, display product name DP, made in week 40 of 2019, image size 31×17 cm — a gross underestimation.

00ffffffffffff004cf4341200000000
281d0104b51f11782b87e5a456509e26
0d5054210800d1c0010181c0a9c00101
0101010101014dd000a0f0703e803020
3500dd0c1100001e000000fc0044500a
20202020202020202020000000fd0030
4bfefe6c010a202020202020000000ff
000a202020202020202020202020028d
02033ec2230907078301000052010203
0411121f2021223c3d3e5d5e5f606100
0000000000000000000000000000000c
e200c0e305c300e6060501606055565e
00a0a0a029503020350000000000001a
00000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000009e
7012170000030014f7690184ff139f00
2f801f003f0b2c0002000400e0000000
00000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000090

 

[joevt]

Hm. Also possibly of interest for somebody: my T18’s EDID seems to be malformed, causing the edid-decode utility to crash. Before crashing, it manages to report that the manufacturer name is SGT, model 4660, display product name DP, made in week 40 of 2019, image size 31×17 cm — a gross underestimation.

What version of edid-decode are you using? The latest version doesn't crash. It does report some strangeness in the CTA data block.

git clone https://git.linuxtv.org/edid-decode.git linuxtv-edid-decode
cd linuxtv-edid-decode
make
make install

Also, each port of the display may have a different EDID so you should check them all.

Brightness control via MonitorControl seems to work via my USB-C to DisplayPort cable as well as HDMI. However, when connected via HDMI to my 2018 Mac Mini and sliding the MonitorControl brightness slider up and down, the display went blank and the input disconnected. I'm not sure what happened - perhaps some invalid value was generated? But the HDMI connection is effectively dead now - powering off didn't help, restarting didn't help, disconnecting and reconnecting the display didn't help. The HDMI input on the T18 still works fine from other devices, and the 2018 Mac Mini can still drive the T18 via the USB-C/DisplayPort cable, so it seems to be something the Mac Mini (via MonitorControl) is "remembering" for the HDMI port?

Can a different display be connected to Mac mini 2018 HDMI?
May disconnect power from the Mac mini and wait a minute.

As far as I can tell, the 2018 Mac Mini cannot drive this display at full resolution. Instead, regardless of the interface, the resolution seems to top out at 3840x2160. Lowering the refresh rate doesn't help. I'm going to tag the resident expert @joevt and see if he has any thoughts on that... (That machine is still on Mojave, so there's a chance that is a factor.)

You need to run Big Sur or later. The EDID only has a 60Hz mode for 5K so you need to create a custom 5K timing with pixel clock under 720MHz (47Hz) for 8bpc or 576MHz (37Hz) for 10bpc #80 . HDMI is limited to < 600MHz so it might allow 39Hz (8bpc). You might be able to get 5K60 from Windows using 6bpc or there might be a pixel clock limit on top of the bandwidth limit.

 

[yurikhan]

What version of edid-decode are you using? The latest version doesn't crash. It does report some strangeness in the CTA data block.

I’m using the version that is packaged in Ubuntu 22.04. Nice to know it’s been fixed.

Also, each port of the display may have a different EDID so you should check them all.

Good idea. I only tried DP because I’m not exactly confident in the quality/bandwidth of my HDMI cables, and I strongly suspect my laptop’s Thunderbolt port is defective.

 

[wearyoftrying]

How are you dealing with connecting other USB accessories, like mice, keyboards, etc? I've spent some time looking for a hub that inputs Thunderbolt 3/4 and outputs 1 DP 1.4 or two DP 1.2s AND also has USB ports and haven't found many reasonably priced options. Here's one, but its reviews are mixed:

Thunderbolt 3 Dock Station Dual Monitor 4K/Single 5K,USB C Docking Station with Dual DisplayPort for Mac/Windows Laptop,USB C Thunderbolt 3 Port,Gigabit Ethernet,SD/TF Card Reader,USB 3.0 A Port

Thunderbolt 3 Dock Station Dual Monitor 4K/Single 5K,USB C Docking Station with Dual DisplayPort for Mac/Windows Laptop,USB-C Thunderbolt 3 Port,Gigabit Ethernet,SD/TF Card Reader,USB 3.0 A Port

www.amazon.com