Spoilers Dune Books and Movie Talk

[yaxomoxay]

2nd trailer has dropped for those who want to see it... link below.

While I liked to the original Paul... I actually like this one better, just from the previews. He is more inline with what I pictured him looking like.

Agreed.
I am not totally sold about Zendaya as Chani, however I've seen her in only one movie (the Spider Man one) in which I felt that her acting was heavily influenced in a bad way by the direction. I am ready to be proven totally wrong. I still don't understand why they decided to change Liet Kynes as he would be Paul's father-in-law. The movie might clarify things, but when I read about the change I was seriously puzzled as Liet is one of those characters that is not central but at the same time is fundamental to move the plot and characters ahead. We shall see!

 

[th0masp]

I still don't understand why they decided to change Liet Kynes as he would be Paul's father-in-law. The movie might clarify things, but when I read about the change I was seriously puzzled as Liet is one of those characters that is not central but at the same time is fundamental to move the plot and characters ahead. We shall see!

Probably same reason they seem to call Herbert's Jihad a crusade now: to fit contemporary sensibilities.

And I don't think Chani was ever married to Paul? How could have Kynes become the father-in-law? The lucky one turned out to be Shaddam if memory serves.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Probably same reason they seem to call Herbert's Jihad a crusade now: to fit contemporary sensibilities.

My understanding is that it's not clear if it will be called a Jihad (as it should be) or a crusade, or both. The trailer mentions crusade if I recall correctly.

And I don't think Chani was ever married to Paul? How could have Kynes become the father-in-law? The lucky one turned out to be Shaddam if memory serves.

True, Paul married Irulan. Liet was the de-facto leader of the Fremen, and considering their culture I am not entirely convinced that the swap will work without changing the idea behind the Fremen and the importance of Paul being in love with Liet's daughter. Again, I am ready to be proven wrong by the director, but the questions remain.

 

[rhett7660]

Probably same reason they seem to call Herbert's Jihad a crusade now: to fit contemporary sensibilities.

And I don't think Chani was ever married to Paul? How could have Kynes become the father-in-law? The lucky one turned out to be Shaddam if memory serves.

I read the book for the first time last year... and didn't Jihad have some importance to the movement? Changing it to the Crusade, to me changes the meaning of what they are about.

 

[romanof]

I remember reading it, or trying to, when the book first came out in the 60s. I was a SciFi nut as a youngster, and read everything about space that I could find. But, although the book was fascinating with space travel and sandworms and such, I just couldn't follow the involved plots within plots to where I could actually understand the novel. It was several years later on re-reading that I put the whole thing together. It is a great tale, but...

The first movie in 1984 was a horrible piece of crap. If I remember right, I didn't even stay to the end.

 

[th0masp]

I read the book for the first time last year... and didn't Jihad have some importance to the movement? Changing it to the Crusade, to me changes the meaning of what they are about.

Isn't that just different words for the same concept?

Reasonable to expect that Fremen culture received an overhaul for this film adaption in my opinion. Would any film publisher really want Jihad associated with the 'good' guys in 2021? Or show women gifted like lifestock to the winner of a duel. There's probably loads more in there that would present the film makers with a Twitter storm right after the sand storm.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Isn't that just different words for the same concept?

not really. Jihad is more about struggle and it can be even between the same tribe/group/country/religion. A crusade is a specific mission which utilizes the Christian religion as its basis.

In Dune, Paul Atreides led a jihad, not a crusade

Here is why that matters.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[yaxomoxay]

The first movie in 1984 was a horrible piece of crap. If I remember right, I didn't even stay to the end.

It was messy due to the editing imposed by the studio over the Director (in some versions he even changed his name, and he doesn’t even want to talk about it), but the movie was also far ahead of its times under many aspects. It’s flawed, and certainly Lynch’s worst movie, but it’s not a bad movie per se.

 

[400]

Have to say I await the new film with some trepidation. I do not think you can portray these books in films, they need a set time TV series with a good budget. "Set time" as in stick to the outline of the book and don't go off the rails to milk it if it turns out popular. The film (1984) I found wanting a great deal, the TV series is good for my money when you get past the production expense not being great. and the set looking like it had just come from ikea and had a lick of paint etc.

Happen to be struggling through the last few books written by his son, sheesh, not a patch on the style of Herbert senior. And it is a my second read through!

Plot wise I get the implications of the feudal system, power structures etc. They sit well in my imagination if that makes sense. The reasons for existing and restraints and so on.

I still watch the 84 rendition but usually FF through a lot.

 

[yaxomoxay]

and the set looking like it had just come from ikea and had a lick of paint etc

The Empire might crumble, the Golden Path might fail, the Spice might stop flowing, but Ikea will stay forever.

I kind of enjoy Brian Herbert/Kevin J Anderson’s books but I have to remind myself that they are just action novels in the Duniverse. Nothing even remotely close to what FH wrote, but they do their job on an entertainment factor level.

 

[mikzn]

The Empire might crumble, the Golden Path might fail, the Spice might stop flowing, but Ikea will stay forever.

I kind of enjoy Brian Herbert/Kevin J Anderson’s books but I have to remind myself that they are just action novels in the Duniverse. Nothing even remotely close to what FH wrote, but they do their job on an entertainment factor level.

I really enjoyed them - especially the prequels - they filled out and explained a lot things referenced in the original series. Even FH's later efforts "God Emperor" / Heretics and Chapterhouse were not as good as the first 3 originals - IMHO

Lots of good Sci Fi entertainment in almost all of the Books

 

[400]

I find the add on books hard going, I expect that I am applying Frank Herberts particular style in the telling and trying to translate or something. I stick them out for the story, assuming there are a lot from Seniors notes in them.

I have quite a few of the later ones given as xmas gifts I have not delved into yet. The film led me to start the read through from Dune all the way to the end. Forget how many times I have read the main series.

Thinking back, I first saw the TV series on a whopping 28" CRT. I lost the disks, now they are on Apple TV and popping up on the larger panel, a lot is obvious but I can forget that when the tale is there (grew up with Dr Who, some scenery there that is fun and wobbly), wonder why I get hung up on the later books.

 

[th0masp]

The film (1984) I found wanting a great deal, the TV series is good for my money when you get past the production expense not being great. and the set looking like it had just come from ikea and had a lick of paint etc.

I only have very faint memories of the miniseries apart from the funny looking costumes all around and the Wing Commander-like CGI but the casting was just terrible IMO. Paul, Chani, Stilgar, questionable choices with a lot of screentime. William Hurt also looked really out of place for his character - balding, tired and pale like he just slid off the pages of the novel. Some novel anyway.

In both the Lynch movie and the miniseries (from what I see in image search) the Atreides troops always dress like Rommel's Afrikakorps. 🤔 Interesting choice for sure.

 

[yaxomoxay]

I actually like the other miniseries, Children of Dune (it covers the books Messiah and Children). Amazing soundtrack too.

 

[400]

I only have very faint memories of the miniseries apart from the funny looking costumes all around and the Wing Commander-like CGI but the casting was just terrible IMO. Paul, Chani, Stilgar, questionable choices with a lot of screentime. William Hurt also looked really out of place for his character - balding, tired and pale like he just slid off the pages of the novel. Some novel anyway.

In both the Lynch movie and the miniseries (from what I see in image search) the Atreides troops always dress like Rommel's Afrikakorps. 🤔 Interesting choice for sure.

Tricky I suppose. I followed what I could of production on line at the time (dial up eh?). I understood production was on a tight and small budget. I likened it to going to see a play, the waving obviously painted backdrop in the breeze is there to set the tone, just follow the story the actors are playing out.

Though watching it through again on the larger screen is akin to seeing the brush strokes on the plays wafting city back drop

 

[mikzn]

Update - hopefully no delays for the "official" release - 22 October 2021 - Release Info Here

‘Dune’ already has excellent reviews - FWIW - "Jason Momoa says he watched ‘Dune’ like he ‘wasn’t in it"

Starting to get excited about this

 

[retta283]

I haven't read Dune since probably 1986, but I will always love Iron Maiden's 'To Tame a Land' inspired by the book, funny story about that as they tried to call it Dune but Frank Herbert wouldn't let them as he didn't like metal bands. I may need to read the book again, only problem is I used to trade all my books in so I have next to nothing left.

Theaters are open here. If I can get into a showing of this I may well do so. The 1984 one I saw while intoxicated so I don't remember it. Obviously it doesn't have the best reputation. Never saw the TV show.

 

[Expos of 1969]

I have not read the book. Is it foolish to see the new film before reading the book? By the time I start and finish the book the film will likely not still be playing here in Finland. Opinions?

 

[yaxomoxay]

I have not read the book. Is it foolish to see the new film before reading the book? By the time I start and finish the book the film will likely not still be playing here in Finland. Opinions?

No it’s not foolish. The movie will cover only the very first part of the book, many of the fundamental characters and subplots won’t even appear. Also, the book is quite complex, in a way that no movie will be able to capture, and I’d say that the bare minimum for a good Duniverse reading are the first three books (Dune, Dune Messiah, Children of Dune).

 

[mikzn]

I have not read the book. Is it foolish to see the new film before reading the book? By the time I start and finish the book the film will likely not still be playing here in Finland. Opinions?

I would say there are pro's and con's

Pro's - if you read the book you will understand the movie better - even the book is worth reading more than once

Con's - if you read the book in advance (from a spoiler point of view) you will know what is comming and loose some of the suspense and suprises of the plot

Kippis

 

[rhett7660]

After it is all said and done, I am more worried that we don't get part II to finish it off. So I am hoping it does well and they give him the green light to finish it!

 

[th0masp]

It would seem kinda silly for them to leave Dune unfinished unless this movie really bombs and goes down in flames. They already have a spinoff series about the BG in the works after all. 🤔

 

[ugru]

Seen the Movie....

A real cinematic Masterpiece and a faithful adaptation of the source material....9 out of 10

The only regret is that some underlying narratives and some of the secondary characters are not fully developed, but I understand, with such a complex source material, the movie must kind of be streamlined...maybe in the second half some of them will be explored...

Go end watch the movie on the biggest screen available in your area...it deserve it.

 

[decafjava]

Seen the Movie....

A real cinematic Masterpiece and a faithful adaptation of the source material....9 out of 10

The only regret is that some underlying narratives and some of the secondary characters are not fully developed, but I understand, with such a complex source material, the movie must kind of be streamlined...maybe in the second half some of them will be explored...

Go end watch the movie on the biggest screen available in your area...it deserve it.

Wow, I guess I will have to go then. Looking forward to it.

 

[ugru]

Go please....

More people must see the movie in theaters so we can have Part II and maybe Dune Messiah and Children of Dune...