Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up

[MICHAELSD]

I agree, but the Apple watch display has noticable color shift at low brightness. Would be color accurate enough to edit photos on. I personally don't care about absolute color accuracy on a phone. I want it to be color accurate enough to look good but it's a phone. I have a computer for color work.

They could maybe make it an accessibility option if nothing else.

If they could make it an Accessibility option they probably would have by now. I suppose they could build a setting directly into the brightness controller on future generations.

Theoretically it must be possible for them to calibrate the best possible color accuracy they can to a setting that flickers without the use of PWM.

It’s a shame because it’s almost possible for me to use and keep iPhone 13 Mini. Compared to iPhone X eye strain and persistent headaches are at around a 4.

The reference is 24/7 intense throbbing behind the eyes so unfortunately a 4 on the eye strain scale still means that there are persistent headaches, otherwise I’d be much more likely to hold on to it.

I have no desire to box this up and send it back to Apple but we’ve learned that long-term these headaches won’t magically go away.

Intermittent throbbing headaches that are a fraction of where they once were are still headaches that shouldn’t exist, and that absolutely correlate to the phone.

 

[user1234]

If they could make it an Accessibility option they probably would have by now. I suppose they could build a setting directly into the brightness controller on future generations.

Theoretically it must be possible for them to calibrate the best possible color accuracy they can to a setting that flickers without the use of PWM.

It’s a shame because it’s almost possible for me to use and keep iPhone 13 Mini. Compared to iPhone X eye strain and persistent headaches are at around a 4.

The reference is 24/7 intense throbbing behind the eyes so unfortunately a 4 on the eye strain scale still means that there are persistent headaches, otherwise I’d be much more likely to hold on to it.

I have no desire to box this up and send it back to Apple but we’ve learned that long-term these headaches won’t magically go away.

Intermittent throbbing headaches that are a fraction of where they once were are still headaches that shouldn’t exist, and that absolutely correlate to the phone.

They could absolutely do it on future hardware if they wanted to. Not sure about current hardware.

It sucks not being able to use the newer iPhones, but as you say the issues won't magically go away and not even the latest Apple product is worth putting your health at risk over.

I wish they solve this before I have to upgrade from the 11 or I will be in trouble. I also hope my 11 will hold up because now they aren't selling the 256 GB option anymore and I can't get away with any less.

I have some amount of hope for the iPhone 14 series based on rumors but I'll manage my expectations until I see for myself.

 

[MICHAELSD]

They could absolutely do it on future hardware if they wanted to. Not sure about current hardware.

It sucks not being able to use the newer iPhones, but as you say the issues won't magically go away and not even the latest Apple product is worth putting your health at risk over.

I wish they solve this before I have to upgrade from the 11 or I will be in trouble. I also hope my 11 will hold up because now they aren't selling the 256 GB option anymore and I can't get away with any less.

I have some amount of hope for the iPhone 14 series based on rumors but I'll manage my expectations until I see for myself.

Are there rumors about the display?

It’s frustrating since this iPhone 13 Mini is perfect otherwise. Even the white it displays is the purest white I’ve seen on an OLED iPhone or any iPhone for that matter and the colors are second-to-none. I oddly like this more than iPhone 13 Pro. For those that appreciate the display the colors and contrast of OLED are approaching end game territory. Unfortunately, it’s not perfect as we’re familiar with the limitations by now. On the other hand burn-in hasn’t been an issue even with other manufacturers. At this point the main problem with OLED remains the PWM flicker.

 

[now i see it]

and the main problem with Antarctica is the cold.

and the main problem with driving on dirt washboard roads is the vibration

and the main problem with traveling to Proxima Centauri is the distance

——-

OLED displays can’t exist in an acceptable form without PWM.
The main problem with OLED screens is OLED.

 

[MICHAELSD]

and the main problem with Antarctica is the cold.

and the main problem with driving on dirt washboard roads is the vibration

and the main problem with traveling to Proxima Centauri is the distance

——-

OLED displays can’t exist in an acceptable form without PWM.
The main problem with OLED screens is OLED.

I raise you LG OLED TV.

 

[iSheep5S]

Haven’t read the whole thread but.

Rumours are there is one LED based iPhone set to release, the SE. Then apple will be OLED only. I have the 12. I did worry but no problems. I had a minor issue with Samsung OLED but I used it and the issue of sore eyes went away.

Apple won’t change for a minority.

 

[user1234]

Are there rumors about the display?

It’s frustrating since this iPhone 13 Mini is perfect otherwise. Even the white it displays is the purest white I’ve seen on an OLED iPhone or any iPhone for that matter and the colors are second-to-none. I oddly like this more than iPhone 13 Pro. For those that appreciate the display the colors and contrast of OLED are approaching end game territory. Unfortunately, it’s not perfect as we’re familiar with the limitations by now. On the other hand burn-in hasn’t been an issue even with other manufacturers. At this point the main problem with OLED remains the PWM flicker.

I don't remember where I read it but I did read a rumor about changes that may reduce flicker, but I'll believe it when I see it since rumors aren't very reliable and even if the tech could be flicker free there's nothing saying the particular implementation will be.

 

[MICHAELSD]

I don't remember where I read it but I did read a rumor about changes that may reduce flicker, but I'll believe it when I see it since rumors aren't very reliable and even if the tech could be flicker free there's nothing saying the particular implementation will be.

That would be good news.

This is frustrating since I have no desire to return this phone even if I know I’ll inevitably have to and eventually get over it. I also have no desire to box this up and try a standard iPhone 13 to see if the slightly higher rate further reduces my eye strain symptoms, but at the same time I don’t want to go back to my iPhone SE. I suppose I’ll have a third-generation iPhone SE to look forward to even if if doesn’t seem super exciting.

 

[jimmy_uk]

That would be good news.

This is frustrating since I have no desire to return this phone even if I know I’ll inevitably have to and eventually get over it. I also have no desire to box this up and try a standard iPhone 13 to see if the slightly higher rate further reduces my eye strain symptoms, but at the same time I don’t want to go back to my iPhone SE. I suppose I’ll have a third-generation iPhone SE to look forward to even if if doesn’t seem super exciting.

Reads like you have tested it enough to know it's not comfortable to use. Better to rip off the band-aid now.

 

[now i see it]

iPhone OLED screens are the cure for iPhone addiction. The more you use them the more painful it gets.

 

[MICHAELSD]

Reads like you have tested it enough to know it's not comfortable to use. Better to rip off the band-aid now.

My problem is it’s becoming more usable over time. As noted it’s been surprisingly comfortable to use at night. If I could completely rule out issues I wouldn’t still be in this thread but the conversation to keep it wouldn’t have been possible with iPhone X or iPhone 12 Pro Max.

iPhone OLED screens are the cure for iPhone addiction. The more you use them the more painful it gets.

That’s my other problem. My goal for the year is to limit my iPhone usage, and oddly enough this helps towards it. Not getting excessive with usage and spending hours on iPhone 13 Mini is one of the ways to limit eye strain. Basically limiting it to a need-to-use basis with the occasional YouTube video and also not reaching for it too early on in the day. HDR videos look incredible but are unfortunately one of the most migraine-inducing experiences. It’s enjoyable in practice, and now the iPhone SE I previously enjoyed feels archaic in comparison. Perhaps slightly too outdated for me to be able to happily go back.

I still am slightly curious to try iPhone 13 to see if the rates and amplitudes are better before committing. As long as Apple continues making improvements I’ll likely be able to start upgrading annually. My prediction is that a 1000Hz+ rate would reduce eye strain symptoms to a 2 relative to iPhone X. A 0 would probably entail a flicker-free approach or flicker without PWM.

 

[jimmy_uk]

My problem is it’s becoming more usable over time. As noted it’s been surprisingly comfortable to use at night. If I could completely rule out issues I wouldn’t still be in this thread but the conversation to keep it wouldn’t have been possible with iPhone X or iPhone 12 Pro Max.


That’s my other problem. My goal for the year is to limit my iPhone usage, and oddly enough this helps towards it. Not getting excessive with usage and spending hours on iPhone 13 Mini is one of the ways to limit eye strain. Basically limiting it to a need-to-use basis with the occasional YouTube video and also not reaching for it too early on in the day. HDR videos look incredible but are unfortunately one of the most migraine-inducing experiences. It’s enjoyable in practice, and now the iPhone SE I previously enjoyed feels archaic in comparison. Perhaps slightly too outdated for me to be able to happily go back.

I still am slightly curious to try iPhone 13 to see if the rates and amplitudes are better before committing. As long as Apple continues making improvements I’ll likely be able to start upgrading annually. My prediction is that a 1000Hz+ rate would reduce eye strain symptoms to a 2 relative to iPhone X. A 0 would probably entail a flicker-free approach or flicker without PWM.

I assume you've been able to take advantage of the longer Christmas returns period as it reads like you have tested the 13 Mini for some time?

As you write that you cannot use this phone comfortably in all situations then is it not time to just return it for the sake of your health, physical and mental? I get you love the design and newer technology, as do I, but isnt it just harder when you become accustomed to using it knowing you cannot realistically keep it? Or just make the choice to keep it and use it less. ?‍♂️

 

[jimmy_uk]

I've just been into my local Apple store while I was in town to have a play with the iPads, trying to convince myself a tablet would allow me to use my aged iPhone 7 Plus less. But I still don't really want one (weight, iPadOS) so I moved over to the iPhones. The Mini 6 would almost be perfect but the jelly scroll still looks bloody awful to me! I can now also see jelly scroll on the 12.9 and 11 which is ridiculous!

First time in hand with the 13 Pro Max: it's stunning! It would do me perfectly as a consumption device but quickly I could feel my eyes straining. The 120hz display is buttery smooth and makes looking at a 60hz display straight afterwards seem like it's going in slow motion - literally. My eyes have a weird adjustment period as the world seems to slow down after scrolling with the 13 Pro's. I think the 120hz on the two Pros might be making using them even harder as my brain tries to compute the flickering and different motion. Scrolling is almost surreal because it's so smooth and nothing else in my life looks like this, not sure my brain is adjusting.

It's the most frustrating feeling knowing I can easily afford these products and I want them - I even try to talk to myself that "maybe I could try a 13 again and this time might be alright". I know deep down it won't and I hate it, but this is just the way it is. I feel everyone's frustrating and I understand the desire to persevere.

 

[The.Glorious.Son]

My goal for the year is to limit my iPhone usage, and oddly enough this helps towards it.

I remember you saying this when you first got the SE as well so my question is, do you use something other than your phone for forum use lol? I kid, I kid! Kinda 😁

 

[matthijst]

Wondering if it may also have to do with contrast. I know oled is supposed to have infinite contrast. But when I put my 8plus next to any OLED iphone small text seems more defined in the 8 plus.

 

[dimitricook]

I did send all my findings and offerd to volunteer in finding a solution, didn't really got an reply at that time so i did send a reminder. this was their answer.



Hello,

Thank you for following up. Pardon us for responding in English.

While we don’t have any news to share with you at this time, we do want to note that this matter is under investigation.

We’ve continued to improve features, and add new ones, to support more customers in more ways, and your voice is a vital part of that process.

Sincerely,

Apple Accessibility

 

[dimitricook]

My advice is to really do the same, so contact the team! this is the only way we get noticed by Apple and they might give this more prio. Imagine a accessiblity feature that solves the whole problem

 

[jimmy_uk]

I did send all my findings and offerd to volunteer in finding a solution, didn't really got an reply at that time so i did send a reminder. this was their answer.



Hello,

Thank you for following up. Pardon us for responding in English.

While we don’t have any news to share with you at this time, we do want to note that this matter is under investigation.

We’ve continued to improve features, and add new ones, to support more customers in more ways, and your voice is a vital part of that process.

Sincerely,

Apple Accessibility

Thanks for sharing. I've never had a response to the dozens of emails/feedback I've sent about this. But I agree - email Apple everyone!

 

[MICHAELSD]

iPhone 13 in hand.

First impression: out of the box it feels like an upgrade over iPhone 13 Mini simply because it’s bigger. At the same time the display seems noticeably less vibrant and sharp in comparison. I haven’t had a major issue with iPhone 13 Mini today. So far I’m experiencing more of a headache with iPhone 13 after a few minutes. I may very well end up keeping iPhone 13 Mini, but I had to try iPhone 13 purely for scientific purposes. SIM card in so I’ll do some testing and report back per usual.

 

[MICHAELSD]

I assume you've been able to take advantage of the longer Christmas returns period as it reads like you have tested the 13 Mini for some time?

As you write that you cannot use this phone comfortably in all situations then is it not time to just return it for the sake of your health, physical and mental? I get you love the design and newer technology, as do I, but isnt it just harder when you become accustomed to using it knowing you cannot realistically keep it? Or just make the choice to keep it and use it less. ?‍♂️

Yup, even with iPhone 13 in hand I still have quite a fondness for the Mini. I do have the return label printed so it’s technically an option as it’s unlikely Apple would decline the return. I’m still torn, but I suppose if I wait long enough it’ll make up my mind for me. I’ll do one last comparison with iPhone SE and consider the persistence of headaches before ultimately deciding.

I did send all my findings and offerd to volunteer in finding a solution, didn't really got an reply at that time so i did send a reminder. this was their answer.



Hello,

Thank you for following up. Pardon us for responding in English.

While we don’t have any news to share with you at this time, we do want to note that this matter is under investigation.

We’ve continued to improve features, and add new ones, to support more customers in more ways, and your voice is a vital part of that process.

Sincerely,

Apple Accessibility

This seems like a generic response, although I do think that they’re still committed to figuring out a solution. It’s simply not a priority where it’s essential.

I've just been into my local Apple store while I was in town to have a play with the iPads, trying to convince myself a tablet would allow me to use my aged iPhone 7 Plus less. But I still don't really want one (weight, iPadOS) so I moved over to the iPhones. The Mini 6 would almost be perfect but the jelly scroll still looks bloody awful to me! I can now also see jelly scroll on the 12.9 and 11 which is ridiculous!

First time in hand with the 13 Pro Max: it's stunning! It would do me perfectly as a consumption device but quickly I could feel my eyes straining. The 120hz display is buttery smooth and makes looking at a 60hz display straight afterwards seem like it's going in slow motion - literally. My eyes have a weird adjustment period as the world seems to slow down after scrolling with the 13 Pro's. I think the 120hz on the two Pros might be making using them even harder as my brain tries to compute the flickering and different motion. Scrolling is almost surreal because it's so smooth and nothing else in my life looks like this, not sure my brain is adjusting.

It's the most frustrating feeling knowing I can easily afford these products and I want them - I even try to talk to myself that "maybe I could try a 13 again and this time might be alright". I know deep down it won't and I hate it, but this is just the way it is. I feel everyone's frustrating and I understand the desire to persevere.

I agree: Max-sized iPhone over iPad all the way. I’d rather have the OLED display in theory and all of the latest technologies, even if Apple does usually update iPad to the latest silicon. Although, the Mini is changing my perspective on iPhone. Frankly iPhone Mini + iPad + MacBook Air/Pro or iMac? may be the best combination of Apple devices.

Holding iPhone 13 now I wouldn’t mind upgrading to iPhone 13 Pro or iPhone 13 Pro Max as a consumer, but I already know those displays don’t agree with me. Also, the larger the display the more usage it leads to as can be evidenced by this post.

The comparison between iPhone 13 Mini and iPhone 13 is going to be interesting. Perhaps I should have continued as an iPhone blogger or at least tech reviewer as I still live for this: I wouldn’t mind trying every new iPhone model each year. It’s unlikely I’ll keep an iPhone for multiple generations unless I have to do so as I did with iPhone 8+, which was my least favorite iPhone of all-time to be honest.

 

[MICHAELSD]

Good news / bad news - iPhone 13 does cause slightly reduced eye strain compared to iPhone 13 Mini and iPhone 13 Pro. In fact, it may be the most usable OLED iPhone to date. Headaches are still there but at a noticeably reduced rate compared to iPhone X. It may even be possible to watch the occasional HDR movie. I would say that it’s perhaps even ~ 20% better than iPhone 13 Mini as hypothesized.

The problem is that I’ve become smitten with iPhone 13 Mini. I love the size and display quality: colors pop more, and I’ve become attached to this little iPhone. The OLED display on this device is absolutely incredible.

I like iPhone 13 whereas I love iPhone 13 Mini. I’ll continue testing since it seems like I get less headaches with iPhone 13 as I can tell comparatively typing this on iPhone 13 Mini. Yet I still can’t bring myself to box up this phone, and I’m almost tempted to reset iPhone 13 and keep the Mini regardless.

 

[DJTaurus]

I was setting up my sisters iPhone 12. What an awful tech for reading/writing oled is. Only for videos oled is better. What a joy to be back on my iPhone 11….. text is more sharp and the screen feels brighter. Seriously how do you stand the yellow dirty screen effect on your oleds.

 

[MICHAELSD]

I was setting up my sisters iPhone 12. What an awful tech for reading/writing oled is. Only for videos oled is better. What a joy to be back on my iPhone 11….. text is more sharp and the screen feels brighter. Seriously how do you stand the yellow dirty screen effect on your oleds.

They’ve moved away from the yellow tint on iPhone 13. iPhone 13 Mini in particular displays a pure, bright white.

I’ve pretty much made up my mind on preferring iPhone 13 Mini over iPhone 13. Switching back and forth between the phones leads to more headaches, yet it does seem after a slight adjustment period that iPhone 13 comparatively causes less headaches and may be more comfortable for watching videos.

I wonder if by keeping it I’m essentially telling Apple that they’ve done enough, when I do still get headaches including persistent headaches. Hopefully we can continue to see improvements made generation-over-generation. Like I’ve said I’m more optimistic that they can make these phones more usable by increasing the PWM rate and lowering amplitudes if they aren’t able to eliminate it altogether. A ~ 2000Hz rate would probably be the sweet spot, with an indiscernibly high rate such as 20,000Hz being ideal.

 

[JM]

They’ve moved away from the yellow tint on iPhone 13. iPhone 13 Mini in particular displays a pure, bright white.

I’ve pretty much made up my mind on preferring iPhone 13 Mini over iPhone 13. Switching back and forth between the phones leads to more headaches, yet it does seem after a slight adjustment period that iPhone 13 comparatively causes less headaches and may be more comfortable for watching videos.

I wonder if by keeping it I’m essentially telling Apple that they’ve done enough, when I do still get headaches including persistent headaches. Hopefully we can continue to see improvements made generation-over-generation. Like I’ve said I’m more optimistic that they can make these phones more usable by increasing the PWM rate and lowering amplitudes if they aren’t able to eliminate it altogether. A ~ 2000Hz rate would probably be the sweet spot, with an indiscernibly high rate such as 20,000Hz being ideal.

So true about the whiter mini 13 vs the 12 mini… the only tolerable screen was with True Tone off on the 12 mini.

I’m this 14 mini I got, when True Tone is on, is does get yellow indoors, but I think maybe it is only to allow for the white balance correction to seem the same as when you go outside in natural white sunlight.

With True Tone off, indoors it has that nice non-yellow screen (or perfect whites as you put it).

 

[now i see it]

The eyes’ (and brain’s perception) of ‘ideal’ screen tone is something the brain adapts to. All iPhones’s native color, all the way back to the 4S, seem harsh to me. Too blue.
When Night Shift was finally implemented in iOS 9, it was a godsend to me. I have always slid the Night Shift slider about 2/3s of the way before 1/2 to warm up the display to my liking - and leave it like that permanently, 24 hours a day.
Whenever I turn it off or set up a new iPhone without it, the native (non adjusted) screen looks incredibly harsh and bluish to me - like Who T F could ever look at that screen. Really glaring and bugs my eyes.

Yet some people prefer that color — so everyone is different.