It’s a keeper!
I haven’t had any migraines since.
So hopefully that’s good news for anyone who hasn’t given the regular 14 a try yet.
I’ll keep monitoring it over time. Hopefully I won’t have to sell it.
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Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up
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I haven’t had any migraines since.
So hopefully that’s good news for anyone who hasn’t given the regular 14 a try yet.
I’ll keep monitoring it over time. Hopefully I won’t have to sell it.
Yours is the rare success story, so if you would permit me a few questions please
Are you experiencing mild symptoms? If so, what are they and how are you accommodating them with settings, etc.?
Or is it symptom free and it's pretty much like an LCD screen for you?
Thanks, and congrats!
My holdup with iPhone 14 is that the 59/60Hz PWM rate looks nearly identical to the 60Hz rate on iPhone 13 Mini at under 15% brightness, which still caused headaches for me:
Compared to iPhone 14 Plus:
iPhone 14 as well for good measure:
Perhaps amplitudes aren’t as steep on iPhone 14 Plus. The curves still aren’t as flat as an Apple Watch. FWIW iPhone 14 looks slightly better and flatter than the Plus.
All of that being said, iPhone 14 Pro Max remains my best OLED iPhone experience to date. I’m not quite sure I’m attached to this iPhone and wouldn’t mind having a slightly smaller device if for no reason other than it’s too distracting, but I was able to solve 90% of my issues by disabling Auto-Brightness and keeping the brightness at 38% or less.
I notice headaches and migraines most when the display is constantly changing brightness levels. I can perceive the difference each time, leading to some sort of headache response. The 480Hz rate may be better in theory, but having to adapt to two different frequencies presents the biggest issue. Suffice to say I notice more migraines surprisingly at the higher rate.
It is like I’ve adapted to an extent since I’m able to focus on the display currently and mostly enjoy it as intended. Staying off of my 14” Mini LED MacBook Pro may be helping, and perhaps I should sell that and revisit the iPhone with the lowest amplitudes.
Compared to iPhone 14 Plus:
iPhone 14 as well for good measure:
Perhaps amplitudes aren’t as steep on iPhone 14 Plus. The curves still aren’t as flat as an Apple Watch. FWIW iPhone 14 looks slightly better and flatter than the Plus.
All of that being said, iPhone 14 Pro Max remains my best OLED iPhone experience to date. I’m not quite sure I’m attached to this iPhone and wouldn’t mind having a slightly smaller device if for no reason other than it’s too distracting, but I was able to solve 90% of my issues by disabling Auto-Brightness and keeping the brightness at 38% or less.
I notice headaches and migraines most when the display is constantly changing brightness levels. I can perceive the difference each time, leading to some sort of headache response. The 480Hz rate may be better in theory, but having to adapt to two different frequencies presents the biggest issue. Suffice to say I notice more migraines surprisingly at the higher rate.
It is like I’ve adapted to an extent since I’m able to focus on the display currently and mostly enjoy it as intended. Staying off of my 14” Mini LED MacBook Pro may be helping, and perhaps I should sell that and revisit the iPhone with the lowest amplitudes.
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All of this concern over an OLED display on iPhone SE is unnecessary if Apple fixes the issue on flagship devices.
A 6.1” OLED iPhone SE, while competitive in its market, would compare too favorably to a modern iPhone and gets too far away from the point of iPhone SE IMO.
My guess is they will just put an A16 or whatever in the iPhone 11 and call it a day. But who knows...
I suspect you are close, but it would maybe make more sense that they just throw the A16 in an XR- with the single camera that it has vs the 11- and leave it at that. Not sure they would want to give the next SE two cameras, or that might really confuse people and compete too closely with the standard iPhone 15, assuming it would still only have two lenses on the back.
I will still hold out my hope, though, for it to be smaller as the XR (and 11) were gigantic beasts- and some of us are interested in the SE for the small size.
It really is interesting to ponder given the choices they have in front of them. I also think the 11 with updated hardware would be the easiest move if it doesn't come out until spring 2024. Going single camera is going to be a hard sell by that point I would think. But then again, the current SE doesn't have night mode... so..
I also know a lot of people who really want the X/XS size and style to return, so I could see them trying to work that out as well to get OLED across the board. But changing material from stainless steel to aluminum feels like more work than they would be willing to put into the SE. And keeping it stainless would make it too nice. Or they could go super lazy and just rename the iPhone 12 to SE and call it done. 🤣
Now an iPhone X, with an aluminum frame and LCD screen. That would be my dream phone. But the XR/11 are as beefy as they are thanks to the LCD. So likely not going to happen. But I can dream.
On second thought, iPhone 14 has a slight dip to account for the refresh rate. It’s not nearly as steep as iPhone 13 Mini. Based on the above, it could be the best of the iPhone 14 lineup in theory. I only wish the rest of the curve was slightly flatter.
The good news is that Apple has made the best progress yet this year. I’ve been able to figure out settings that make this iPhone work better, and if iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Plus are 60Hz DC dimming then I’m fairly confident about making those better yet.
The good news is that Apple has made the best progress yet this year. I’ve been able to figure out settings that make this iPhone work better, and if iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Plus are 60Hz DC dimming then I’m fairly confident about making those better yet.
I get bloodshot eyes using it in the dark with no lights on but that would happen with the 11 sometimes so I’m not too concerned about that.Yours is the rare success story, so if you would permit me a few questions please
Are you experiencing mild symptoms? If so, what are they and how are you accommodating them with settings, etc.?
Or is it symptom free and it's pretty much like an LCD screen for you?
Thanks, and congrats!
I get watery eyes sometimes that makes my vision slightly blurry but that’s usually after hours and hours of use.
Otherwise it does feel like using an LCD. From what I can tell it hasn’t been the cause of a migraine.
I’m not using any accessibility settings and auto brightness is turned on. I’m using the brightness at 75%/50%/25% most of the time.
This is mostly the conclusion I’ve seen about iPhone 14. It seems like the biggest issues have been motion sickness and dizziness, but not the typical migraines. Glad to hear you found a modern iPhone that works.
Any consensus yet on whether it would be better or worse than the Plus?
Where did you find your iPP 11" 2021 refurbished? Not Apple yet?
I love my SS watches; I have a 41 and 45 because I like them and SS bands so well, so I feel your pull there. The Ultra seems a vibe: it either goes with you...or maybe not. It didn't really go with me, but I still like it.
Yeah, I have an iP8 I'll be retiring for work soon. I was planning to wait until next fall, but this talk of love for the SE2022 is making me thinking maybe I get it sooner?
As for the 2024 (?) SE, I'm still trying to process the loss of Face ID on an XR/11 model. I love my FaceID. Long story short, I have issues with Touch ID, so I would be sad to lose FaceID with a new SE. My brain is screaming "that's one compromise too far!"
Have you tested iPhone 14 or iPhone 14 Plus? It’s getting hard to keep track. iPhone SE 2022 is a viable alternative.
I know. I wish we had a little side panel in this thread with our names and models we've tried. Maybe we need to start adding this enough to our signatures.
I've not purchased the 14 or 14 Plus, but the Plus bothered me in the store. I loved everything about that phone except the way I felt it flickering. When I stood there and played with it about five minutes, I felt my stomach getting queasy. Walked out of the store, walked around the shops outside for a few minutes, and was fine. So I'm leery of trying the 14 or 14 Plus.
Plus the other day, I said to my boyfriend, "I have an idea..."
"--No more phones."
There was panic in his concerned voice.
This can seem insane to the layman. Even the UPS guy picked up on my love of Apple.I know. I wish we had a little side panel in this thread with our names and models we've tried. Maybe we need to start adding this enough to our signatures.
I've not purchased the 14 or 14 Plus, but the Plus bothered me in the store. I loved everything about that phone except the way I felt it flickering. When I stood there and played with it about five minutes, I felt my stomach getting queasy. Walked out of the store, walked around the shops outside for a few minutes, and was fine. So I'm leery of trying the 14 or 14 Plus.
Plus the other day, I said to my boyfriend, "I have an idea..."
"--No more phones."
There was panic in his concerned voice.
iPhone 14 Pro Max - tolerable, but not without headaches or migraines at times. Still much better than previous Max-sized iPhones.
iPhone 14 Plus may have the best overall display of the iPhone 14 lineup, objectively speaking. Meanwhile, the standard iPhone 14 should have the best PWM implementation in theory.
This all sounds like alien science that isn’t practical outside of this thread, but I’m still curious to know the amplitudes for each of the iPhone 14 devices to make a more informed decision.
Sounds like somebody is getting ready to place an order 🤪
I might just trade the Max off for the Plus.
iPhone SE really isn’t bad for one more year either, it’s just hard to get over the impulse. The new generation is especially nice and modern where I feel like I could keep it for a year or more in theory if needed.
The Max feels natural and fine in the hand, yet also bigger than what I want. Then again I know from experience the 6.1” size feels awkward to me, so it’s a bit of a moot point. Perhaps a trip to the Apple Store might be in order?
I suppose another option would be to stick with iPhone SE and upgrade next year since if the 60Hz DC dimming is improved further then it sounds like it could be the first viable generation.
After a week and a half now on my new SE, I am dumbfounded that I am having some minor issues.
The moment I turned it on to start setting it up, I started feeling a bit of a dry, "sizzling" feeling in my eyes, so to speak. No strain, no headaches- just that annoying sensation and dry eyes within minutes of using it. The dry eye feeling persists for a while after looking away.
I can go a few hours just fine using my computer for work or even using my personal laptop, but as soon as I look at the SE this feeling returns. Some days it's very light and others it's much more noticeable.
The weird thing is I had an SE about a month ago that I tried for two weeks as well, and had zero trouble with it. I returned it thinking I wanted a different phone, which I tried and ended up returning for another SE.
This makes no sense to me how I could have zero trouble AT ALL with the SE I tried a month or so ago and now with this one, this happens every time I use it.
I am a few days away from the end of the return window on this phone- I love it in every way, but am wondering if I need to get a different SE just in case there is something problematic with the display on this particular unit. (And SE's are a 2-3 week wait on apple.com, and are out of stock in every color and storage capacity at all Apple stores in my area)
Very odd...
On another note- I think with OLED displays I have some very light PWM sensitivity, as I definitely noticed it when I tried using an XS when they were released, and still get those symptoms when I try using my wife's XS Max.
However I had a 12 Mini for a year and didn't have much trouble, and have had a 13 Pro for a year without much trouble. I had brightness up to 85% and reduce white point up to 95% to mitigate the flicker as much as possible- and mostly was fine, though I think the brightness along with the added crispness/sharpness on the display seems to occasionally bother me.
But with that said, what I like about the SE is the small size and the fact that it has LCD, just to rule PWM out as a potential eye irritant (even if a mild irritant).
Since my current SE is still having some weird effects, I now wonder if I should just try a 13 Mini- still a very small phone, with a few of the things I would be missing on the SE (Slightly better camera, second camera lens) but yet with a slightly bigger display.
I have seen some discussion on this thread about the 13 mini- and it seems the consensus is that the 13 Mini is the easiest on the eyes out of the 13 series, and possibly out of all of the OLED phones previous to the 14 series, correct?
The moment I turned it on to start setting it up, I started feeling a bit of a dry, "sizzling" feeling in my eyes, so to speak. No strain, no headaches- just that annoying sensation and dry eyes within minutes of using it. The dry eye feeling persists for a while after looking away.
I can go a few hours just fine using my computer for work or even using my personal laptop, but as soon as I look at the SE this feeling returns. Some days it's very light and others it's much more noticeable.
The weird thing is I had an SE about a month ago that I tried for two weeks as well, and had zero trouble with it. I returned it thinking I wanted a different phone, which I tried and ended up returning for another SE.
This makes no sense to me how I could have zero trouble AT ALL with the SE I tried a month or so ago and now with this one, this happens every time I use it.
I am a few days away from the end of the return window on this phone- I love it in every way, but am wondering if I need to get a different SE just in case there is something problematic with the display on this particular unit. (And SE's are a 2-3 week wait on apple.com, and are out of stock in every color and storage capacity at all Apple stores in my area)
Very odd...
On another note- I think with OLED displays I have some very light PWM sensitivity, as I definitely noticed it when I tried using an XS when they were released, and still get those symptoms when I try using my wife's XS Max.
However I had a 12 Mini for a year and didn't have much trouble, and have had a 13 Pro for a year without much trouble. I had brightness up to 85% and reduce white point up to 95% to mitigate the flicker as much as possible- and mostly was fine, though I think the brightness along with the added crispness/sharpness on the display seems to occasionally bother me.
But with that said, what I like about the SE is the small size and the fact that it has LCD, just to rule PWM out as a potential eye irritant (even if a mild irritant).
Since my current SE is still having some weird effects, I now wonder if I should just try a 13 Mini- still a very small phone, with a few of the things I would be missing on the SE (Slightly better camera, second camera lens) but yet with a slightly bigger display.
I have seen some discussion on this thread about the 13 mini- and it seems the consensus is that the 13 Mini is the easiest on the eyes out of the 13 series, and possibly out of all of the OLED phones previous to the 14 series, correct?
Oh I love this: how did the UPS guy pick up on your apple ardor?
I’m with you on the 14PM being the best of all the OLED models until this year. Was so tempted to keep it, both times. But I just couldn’t get past using something that was likely hurting my brain—and spending over a grand to do it.
I am absolutely intrigued about the possibility that the 14 or 14 Plus could be better. I would love the 14 Plus because of its intended or unintended homage to the 8+.
I could be wrong though. I’ve had some wine tonight.
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Did you say something about impulse? @MICHAELSD, have you had wine too?
Your thinking is correct. If you’re set on sticking with the smaller size, iPhone 13 Mini is your best option. I’m fairly confident if you could use one OLED iPhone there’s at least one in the iPhone 13 or iPhone 14 lineup you could use again. It’s weird being PWM sensitive and having to choose specific iPhone models based around it, isn’t it?
I’m still surprised at how much better iPhone 14 Pro Max has been. In retrospect the constant and persistent headaches were significantly worse on iPhone 13 Mini.
If I’m being honest the size is beginning to feel a little large for me as it may be for you, and it’s not free of issues but it’s good enough that I am curious to try either an iPhone 14 or iPhone 14 Pro—although Apple remarkably seemed to add the same PWM implementation to the Pro and the Max. I’d still like to know which devices have the lowest amplitudes, but I’m not sure I’m patient enough.
By all means try iPhone 13 Mini, but iPhone 14 series devices should be better.
The most experienced drivers, or probably most drivers, know that any boxes featuring a company beginning with an abbreviation of A are usually Apple. I did purchase a new Mac over the summer, and it helps that my iPhone was delivered on launch day.
Any thoughts on the standard iPhone 14 Pro?
It’s slightly annoying since once I think I’m having a headache-free experience with the Max they slowly begin again.
Truth be told I’m more tempted by the Plus, while at the same time I want a smaller iPhone.
No, Apple is the fruit of my impulse.
No going back now:
Slightly relieved, slightly nervous. But hopefully I’ve made the right decision to keep this 14.
Slightly relieved, slightly nervous. But hopefully I’ve made the right decision to keep this 14.
Have you tried the older Pro Max’s? The 11P killed my eyes and head as well as the 13P but so far I’m about 2 weeks in using the 12PM and it’s been basically symptom free.The most experienced drivers, or probably most drivers, know that any boxes featuring a company beginning with an abbreviation of A are usually Apple. I did purchase a new Mac over the summer, and it helps that my iPhone was delivered on launch day.
Any thoughts on the standard iPhone 14 Pro?
It’s slightly annoying since once I think I’m having a headache-free experience with the Max they slowly begin again.
Truth be told I’m more tempted by the Plus, while at the same time I want a smaller iPhone.
No, Apple is the fruit of my impulse.
I came from a smaller Android phone that didn’t bother me but I’m wondering if for me the size step up has something to do with it being easier on my eyes than the regular Pro.
100% agree that every screen is different though too - side by side, my 13P and 12PM, 12PM was noticeably warmer with all settings the same.