Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up

[Lawney]

Have you used cell phones with oled screen before? If not, your eye strain may be due to oled screens and their refresh rate amongst other things. Alot of people have headaches fro oled screens. Google and youll find alot of posts about it.

I've had eye strain with every OLED screen I've ever used. I believe it's from the PWM backlight (which flashes at an supposedly imperceptible rate). But I have similar issues with LED lights and Fluorescent lights.

It's more common than many people realize, and of any company in the world, I'd think Apple would be the company to lead the fight against unnecessary eye strain (as they have done such a great job with Night Shift, though I know it was an idea copied from Flux).

 

[AKS3003]

I want to buy the upcoming iPhone XS but this PWM issue makes me hesitate. I don't want to buy the phone and regret it. In my country we cannot return electronics once bought. Can someone tell me if the iPhone X uses the same implementation of OLED and PWM as the Samsung OLED phones? I have a S7 Edge lying around at home. I used that phone for a couple of months before moving on to another phone. The S7 edge has an OLED screen, but I never felt any eyestrain or got any headaches while using it. Should I expect the same from the iPhone XS or is the screen different in terms of PWM?

 

[kerplunknet]

The iPhone XS most likely will use the exact same AMOLED display and PWM configuration as last year. If Apple ever decides to change that, 2019 would be the date. I wouldn't expect major changes this year. Fingers crossed that the budget iPhone model doesn't use PWM.

I hope someone gets ahold of these new models and is able to test them all for PWM soon so we can make a decision on purchase.

 

[TDDM]

Fingers crossed that the budget iPhone model doesn't use PWM

The good news: We know the budget iPhone won't have PWM because it has a LCD screen, not OLED.

The bad news: According to rumors, the budget iPhone won't have 3D touch, will have a worse camera setup, have a worse resolution than the current Plus iPhones, and will have a smaller battery (comparable to the current iPhone X)

I've been waiting forever for something like the 6.5" iPhone, it's really disappointing that it's most likely not even an option due to the PWM implementation.

 

[timeconsumer]

The good news: We know the budget iPhone won't have PWM because it has a LCD screen, not OLED.

We actually don’t know for sure. This is a new LCD screen that Apple will be using. There are phones from other companies that use LCD screens and use PWM. We’ve just been spoiled by Apple’s implementation thus far and won’t know until somebody tests it. However, you’re probably correct given Apple’s previous LCD screens, I don’t know why they would change at this point.

 

[TDDM]

We actually don’t know for sure. This is a new LCD screen that Apple will be using. There are phones from other companies that use LCD screens and use PWM. We’ve just been spoiled by Apple’s implementation thus far and won’t know until somebody tests it. However, you’re probably correct given Apple’s previous LCD screens, I don’t know why they would change at this point.

Huh, I didn't even consider that Apple might start using PWM in their LCD models, that would really suck.

 

[Lyn2012]

I usually sell my old phone at the same time as I get the new one, but this year I’ll be keeping my 8 in case I don’t get along with the new screens.

 

[rikg]

Found this which was interesting:

https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2018/03/...to-stop-oled-flickering-in-just-three-clicks/

 

[TDDM]

Found this which was interesting:

https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2018/03/...to-stop-oled-flickering-in-just-three-clicks/

Unfortunately, this doesn't work since the X has PWM at all brightness levels. Some other phones are PWM free at max brightness, so hopefully Apple moves in that direction.

 

[Macalway]

So it has PWM at full brightness? Yikes. I didn't notice anything with my X, so.....

 

[unobtainium]

Does PWM cause some degree of eye strain even for people who don't *feel* the symptoms? If not, what's different about the eyes of PWM-sensitive people?

If *yes* (it does strain everyone's eyes to some extent even if they don't feel it) why doesn't Apple figure out a way to get rid of it?

 

[bushman4]

Looking st a bright white screen does cause eye strain after a while
Try using the ‘Smart Invert’ feature that will help or adjust the color of your screen to a more yellow color

 

[jtl_]

Huh, I didn't even consider that Apple might start using PWM in their LCD models, that would really suck.

Why would they. I've seen almost every iPhone from the 2G to the 8+, haven't seen PWM on any unit I've tried (although I've heard rumors of isolated "batches" of displays using high Khz PWM)

 

[badger1212]

Unfortunately, this doesn't work since the X has PWM at all brightness levels. Some other phones are PWM free at max brightness, so hopefully Apple moves in that direction.

Are you saying the graph of the modulation showing relatively little at 50% brightness is wrong then? How do you know this? (I'm genuinely interested as I was affected by the X's screen)

 

[TDDM]

Are you saying the graph of the modulation showing relatively little at 50% brightness is wrong then? How do you know this? (I'm genuinely interested as I was affected by the X's screen)

As far as I've tested with the X, there's no way to fully stop the PWM flickering. Even at 50% brightness, unfortunately.

According to notebookcheck.com:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-iPhone-X-Smartphone-Review.264436.0.html

"We can measure a comparatively low frequency of 240 Hz as soon as the luminance is at 50% or below. In addition to the 240 Hz PWM, we can also measure a slight flickering at 60 Hz (see screenshots below) at higher brightness levels (even at the maximum).

The display backlight flickers at 240 Hz (Likely utilizing PWM) Flickering detected at a brightness setting of 100 % and below. There should be no flickering or PWM above this brightness setting. The frequency of 240 Hz is relatively low, so sensitive users will likely notice flickering and experience eyestrain at the stated brightness setting and below."


I *really* hope Apple addressed this issue for the new OLED phones. Especially with the rumors that the LCD model has a 720p screen, last years A11 chip, and a higher starting price

 

[badger1212]

Yep I agree. If I can't get on with the new OLED models and the spec of the LCD one is low as you say I may have to look elsewhere, though I presume all OLED phones have the same issue (though I did use the Note 8 for a few days last year and seemed to be OK). I shall probably be taking advantage of Apple's 14 day return policy to see if it still bothers me.

 

[5105973]

Yep I agree. If I can't get on with the new OLED models and the spec of the LCD one is low as you say I may have to look elsewhere, though I presume all OLED phones have the same issue (though I did use the Note 8 for a few days last year and seemed to be OK). I shall probably be taking advantage of Apple's 14 day return policy to see if it still bothers me.

I’ve got an S9+ and though I can sometimes detect a hint of a flicker, I’m pretty comfortable using it. So not all OLED displays have to cause people problems. However, there still remains a chance some people are just not going to be compatible with any flicker rate.

 

[TDDM]

It really sucks seeing the new premium iPhones knowing we can't even use the damn things.

Not even blaming Apple, I'm just frustrated that we have this stupid PWM sensitivity issue in general.

 

[karinatwork]

There is still hope that the new screens have a higher flicker rate!!
[doublepost=1536778149][/doublepost]Well, the iPhone XR doesn't sound bad at all. I will most likely buy it. Hopefully the screen is as nice as the screen on the 8, and then I'm all good.

 

[majkom]

It will be better screen than 8s one

 

[odvan]

Xr is using the same LG screen as G7?

 

[TDDM]

Xr is using the same LG screen as G7?

Why would you think that?

 

[MICHAELSD]

Xr is using the same LG screen as G7?

Apple uses custom-made displays.

That being said I would be cautiously optimistic about the new generation of iPhone Xs phones until we hear otherwise. We should know soon if they were improved.

 

[kerplunknet]

1. Does anyone know of a foolproof way to test for PWM? I've just been recording slow-mo video from my current iPhone and playing it back to see if it flickers, but apparently if both frequencies are in sync it won't show up.

2. Who is going to test the XS, XS Max, and XR for PWM?

 

[TDDM]

Apple uses custom-made displays.

That being said I would be cautiously optimistic about the new generation of iPhone Xs phones until we hear otherwise. We should know soon if they were improved.

Can I ask why you're cautiously optimistic at all? Do we have a reason to think they changed it?

Not trying to be negative, just realistic.