I´d consider buying iPad if...

[qtx43]

Very funny... not. Actually quite stupid.

laptop internet = desktop internet Makes sense?

I really don´t get the iPad apologists with their ignorant attitudes.

Laptop internet = comprise that makes it a second rate desktop and a second rate mobile device. Makes sense? Probably not to you, since you seem to have made up your mind that what you don't like must not be liked. By anyone. Ever. You're not necessarily "ignorant" and "stupid", but you are definitely close minded and arrogant. These latter qualities usually prevent people from using the knowledge and intellect that they do posses.

Now, I can see how people like laptops (I do not) and find them useful (they are at times). But to say that they are the equal of desktops is so ludicrous that the idea could only be entertained by someone who isn't actually thinking about what he's saying.

 

[fobfob]

He'll have one by June.

 

[Hmac]

And with each post, you are becoming more troll-like.

Oh, that ship has already sailed....

 

[qtx43]

He'll have one by June.

 

[CylonGlitch]

He'll have one by June.

He'll be a rabid iPad fanboy by July.

 

[eawmp1]

No, in July he'll be complaining about what the next iPhone doesn't do.

 

[smetvid]

One interesting thing all of this debate does bring up however is just how important Flash is to some people. Look not everybody views the web the same way. There are websites I would never visit in a million years. Most of us understand the hated of Flash and we get it load and clear. Some of you hate Flash and do not want to use it. Nobody ever forces anybody to use Flash. The one thing this huge debate does show us is that a lot more people use Flash then some of you may think. Just because you do not use it doesn't mean I may not use it. All we are saying is why not let the users decide what they want to use? It isn't like we are coming on here saying HTML 5 sucks or it must die. All we want is a choice is this transitional period before HTML 5 takes off wide spread. There are many Flash sites I hate as well one of them being portions of Adobe's own site.

Everybody assumes Flash is only used by Youtube and Vimeo and that my friends is just not true. Flash is widely used by web designers all over the weorld for rich content in websites and for entire websites. Like it or not that is the case. I see jobs posted all the time for Flash designers because there is such a high demand for people who can use Flash. These are not just for ads either. You may call me a Flash fanboy if you want but I can tell you I am not. I use what technology companies are willing to pay for and thats it. I am in the business to make money and help clients make money and right now today that is with Flash. Anybody who tells you Flash isn't used anymore is telling you this from their own personal experience and they cannot speak for the entire internet.

Flash is proprietary. Yes that is true but does anybody really care outside of us fools who debate this? My parents or the average Joe doesn't really care as long as it works for them. Nobody ever thinks that Adobe owns Flash so it must be evil. Most people outside of the design world could care less who Adobe is.

I have never bashed the Ipad and in fact I have had posts on here asking questions so I can make a decision of which one to buy. I do plan on getting an Ipad and made it very clear what my uses are going to be for the device.

The reason the Flash subject keeps coming up is because a lot of people do want it.

 

[BobHail]

I do not have an apologist attitude. I welcome reasoned debate, and I have not taken a purely pro-Apple stance on the iPad. Yes, I will buy one, but I do acknowledge it is not the god-slate that everyone including yourself wanted. You seem upset that Apple didn't cater to your every whim. Why do I say that? Because the rational consumer would look at the product offering, decide it was not for him/her, and move on. Your constant attention to and postings about the iPad, which you claim you will not buy in its present form, cannot be explained.



These criticisms were already being made nanoseconds after the blogs made their breathless progress updates on the iPad launch. They are well known, and acknowledged. You have already raised them in several other threads.



The point is, you already have. Many times. You are adding nothing new by starting yet another thread. You are a troll.

See, you´re doing exactly the same thing over and over again, voicing your apologist opinions. Difference is that you´re on the fanboy apologist side of things. So what makes your argument any better? If I´m a troll, you´re an apologist troll. Same thing, different side.

Same goes for all the other apologists here.

 

[wolfpackfan]

Re. Flash - so Apple has made it clear it won't be on the iPad. Why keep complaining? Just don't buy it.

 

[Mkallevik]

...if the web browsing experience would be at least just as good as with my MacBook Pro, but it isn´t.

Oh well, maybe the next tablet will have a FULL internet, not a mobile internet, what do you think?

Oh, have you actually tried it long enough to be able to talk about experience? What was it like?

 

[dgree03]

For you people you who say "flash dont matter"

Whats wrong with having the choice? The option to have "full internet experience"

Apple is gasing the Ipad up as this highly capable device, but it cant do something as simple as view ESPN, DISNEY, HULU, YOUTUBE, and news paper site with flash videos etc, etc....

But then again these are the same people that said iphone MMS didnt matter, Iphone Cut and paste didnt matter etc...

 

[G4R2]

The reason the Flash subject keeps coming up is because a lot of people do want it.

What this controversy has made clear, at least in these forums, is that some web users who are vocal proponents of Flash have no idea what they want or why they want it.

The best I can discern is that some of them want Flash simply for the sake of having Flash and could care less about the content that it delivers. Perhaps this has something to do with kids pirating Flash authoring tools and believing that certifies them to be authorities as ubiquitous and laughable "web designers," which explains why the majority of self proclaimed web designers are under the age of 15. This irrational subset of internet users make similar arguments to those who for some reason can't distinguish Flash from the content it delivers.

If Flash is phased out by either HTML 5, or even some other proprietary technology such as Silverlight, it's very likely that whatever content that Flash was delivering would simply migrate to whatever replaced it.

Not to be condescending, but life lesson to be learned here is that transitions can be difficult. And even if Flash does get phased out it will always remain popular among flat earthers who continue to use leaded gasoline because it was going to be too difficult and costly in the 70's to switch the infrastructure to the unleaded variety despite the benefits of not causing major brain damage to children. These are likely the same people who refuse to switch to HDTV's because of paranoia that the high def signals are being transmitted by black helicopters as a means of population control.

Do you really want to argue with these people?

 

[CylonGlitch]

For you people you who say "flash dont matter"

Whats wrong with having the choice? The option to have "full internet experience"

Apple is gasing the Ipad up as this highly capable device, but it cant do something as simple as view ESPN, DISNEY, HULU, YOUTUBE, and news paper site with flash videos etc, etc....

But then again these are the same people that said iphone MMS didnt matter, Iphone Cut and paste didnt matter etc...

ESPN, DISNEY, YOUTUBE, and many of the newpapers have their own apps, and in the case of YouTube, the app is better then it's website.

MMS was because of AT&T not Apple.
Cut & Paste was being developed from early on, never heard Apple say it didn't matter. (please provide your source)

As for why not? Well, Flash is a known processor hog, always has been and it has had it's share of security holes, some of which took a very long time to patch. At some point Apple has to make a line saying "this is what we support." If you try to support everything, you get a massive pile of steaming poo that doesn't do anything well; so they (as they have always done) chose what they would support (typically ONLY open standards) and make sure it does that well. It is one of Apple's strong points.

I have had flash turned off on my computer for years, many years. Outside of not playing an occasional flash game, I don't miss it at all. In fact, I prefer the web with it off.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But Apple developed the product that they wanted to; if you don't like it, that's fine, there are plenty of other machines for you, this one isn't. There isn't a single thing on this planet that is perfect for everyone.

 

[BaldiMac]

For you people you who say "flash dont matter"

Whats wrong with having the choice?

I'm not in the "flash don't matter" camp, but rather the "flash is bad" camp. The problem with giving people the choice is that it will extend flash's lifespan and stunt the growth of alternatives.

The option to have "full internet experience"

That phrase is such FUD as pro-flash supporters use it. All you really mean is that it doesn't support flash. There isn't a mobile browser on the planet capable of the "full internet experience". Heck there probably isn't a browser on the planet capable of the "full internet experience" if you are referring to the the ability to install and use every plugin in use on the internet.

Apple is gasing the Ipad up as this highly capable device, but it cant do something as simple as view ESPN, DISNEY, HULU, YOUTUBE, and news paper site with flash videos etc, etc....

But then again these are the same people that said iphone MMS didnt matter, Iphone Cut and paste didnt matter etc...

It can view all of those sites. Just not the flash parts.

 

[qtx43]

For you people you who say "flash dont matter" ... ESPN, DISNEY, HULU, YOUTUBE, and news paper site with flash videos
...Iphone Cut and paste didnt matter etc...

Flash doesn't matter to me. Yes, Steve Jobs engages in hyperbole, he's a salesman. The iPad does have shortcomings, as does anything you're going to buy, ever. Viewing videos on youtube will not be one of them, but yes, other flash sites will likely take many years to change. And yes, the cut and paste thing was particularly bad, but I don't have an iPhone, so what do I care? I don't bash people who use an iPhone. You've got to judge it on what you're going to use it for, and if it's worth the money to you. For me, the biggest drawback is only 16GB storage, and the high price of upgrades. But again, part of the judgment there will be how seamless it is to use WiFi to access docs on my home server, which remains to be seen. But from just what I've seen so far, I'm getting one. If that makes me stupid and ignorant, then guilty as charged!

 

[dgree03]

ESPN, DISNEY, YOUTUBE, and many of the newpapers have their own apps, and in the case of YouTube, the app is better then it's website.

MMS was because of AT&T not Apple.
Cut & Paste was being developed from early on, never heard Apple say it didn't matter. (please provide your source)

As for why not? Well, Flash is a known processor hog, always has been and it has had it's share of security holes, some of which took a very long time to patch. At some point Apple has to make a line saying "this is what we support." If you try to support everything, you get a massive pile of steaming poo that doesn't do anything well; so they (as they have always done) chose what they would support (typically ONLY open standards) and make sure it does that well. It is one of Apple's strong points.

I have had flash turned off on my computer for years, many years. Outside of not playing an occasional flash game, I don't miss it at all. In fact, I prefer the web with it off.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But Apple developed the product that they wanted to; if you don't like it, that's fine, there are plenty of other machines for you, this one isn't. There isn't a single thing on this planet that is perfect for everyone.

Im not talking about a "perfect device"

There is a benchmark that comes and goes as the years go on... You know like now every phone must have a camera... or all car windows are now powered... etc etc.

All I think people are asking for is that apple AT LEAST meet the benchmark that has been set for other platforms that it competes with. If it cant meet that benchmark, especially from a innovative company like apple... then why should people buy it? The way I see, apple worshippers will buy it no matter what they give... because then they just dismiss the "benchmark" for a device in its relative catergory.... but as a techie and a informed apple follower why do people accept mediocrity from apple?

This is what I dont get?

 

[BobHail]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But Apple developed the product that they wanted to; if you don't like it, that's fine, there are plenty of other machines for you, this one isn't. There isn't a single thing on this planet that is perfect for everyone.

That´s like saying:

"Metallica made St.Anger, ´cause they wanted to; if you don't like it, that's fine, there are plenty of other records for you, this one isn't. There isn't a single thing on this planet that is perfect for everyone."

While this is true, the facts still are that St.Anger was a bad record and iPad is a bad product (as it is now).

And anyone stating otherwise is just plain wrong and pure apologist.

 

[BaldiMac]

but as a techie and a informed apple follower why do people accept mediocrity from apple?

This is what I dont get?

Why should Apple accept mediocrity from Adobe?

 

[G4R2]

Whats wrong with having the choice? The option to have "full internet experience"

Who says you don't have a choice? You don't have to buy it. It's a choice.

And the counterargument is why can't users have a choice to receive the same content without Flash?

 

[eawmp1]

I´d consider buying iPad if... I wasn't a closed-minded, arrogant troll whose only response to those who disagree with him is to call them "apologists".

 

[dgree03]

Why should Apple accept mediocrity from Adobe?

Good point, but in all honesty I have never had problems with flash in safari or firefox. I have used the flash on the N900 and it work beautifully and it has the same processor class as the iphone.

 

[dgree03]

Who says you don't have a choice? You don't have to buy it. It's a choice.

And the counterargument is why can't users have a choice to receive the same content without Flash?

True, I dont have to buy it... but does that mean we HAVE accept mediocrity from apple also? As long a people keep buying these crippled products, then there is no incentive for apple to make a better product... I think thats what apple fans are missing... BUT if and when the competition makes a tablet that is better... I guess that will be a little bit of a wakeup call to the tablet.

Kind of like what the iphone is going through now... a wake up call.

 

[Hmac]

True, I dont have to buy it... but does that mean we HAVE accept mediocrity from apple also? As long a people keep buying these crippled products, then there is no incentive for apple to make a better product... I think thats what apple fans are missing... BUT if and when the competition makes a tablet that is better... I guess that will be a little bit of a wakeup call to the tablet.

Kind of like what the iphone is going through now... a wake up call.

You assume that everyone defines "mediocrity" the same way you do. They don't.

Most people don't even know what Flash is.

 

[CylonGlitch]

While this is true, the facts still are that St.Anger was a bad record and iPad is a bad product (as it is now).

And anyone stating otherwise is just plain wrong and pure apologist.

And yet you'll find people who think not only that St.Anger is a good record, but one of their BEST because it was different.

People have different opinions, that's fine. That doesn't mean that they are a fanboy or an apologist, just that, TO THEM, it is good.

We can't say anything about the iPad at this time because we don't know how it will do in the market, we don't know if the masses accept it or not. Wait a year, and THEN we can discuss if it is a bad product or not. If it doesn't sell, it was a bad product, if it is successful, it wasn't.

Hondas may not be nearly as good as a Porsche in terms of performance, but that doesn't make them a bad car, and in fact, more people drive Hondas, and they are making money off of the product, so it has to be a good product.

Same thing with St.Anger, if it sold really well, brought in millions of new fans, but pissed of a few hundred thousand die hard fans, it would have still been a good product because it did what it was supposed to do, MAKE MONEY.

iPad the same thing, if it is profitable and brings in new people to the Apple / Mac community, it is a good product from a business stand point. Guess what, companies are out to make money, not make everyone happy.

 

[Carouser]

the facts still are that . . . . iPad is a bad product (as it is now).

And anyone stating otherwise is just plain wrong and pure apologist.

Why would anybody respond to this rubbish? "The fact is that I am right and you are wrong. Also, you're not just wrong, but your position is held in bad faith." Come on.