I´d consider buying iPad if...

[BobHail]

I´d consider buying iPad if... I wasn't a closed-minded, arrogant troll whose only response to those who disagree with him is to call them "apologists".

I made an valid point of criticism and because of that some close-minded apologists started calling me a troll, because they didn´t have any valid counter arguments, like yourself. Only after that I started calling them apologists. And you´ve just contributed absolutely nothing for the apologists side, but instead made a troll of yourself and made the other apologists look even worse.

People who see iPad as a lame product = Trolls
People who see iPad as a great product = Apologists

What´s the freaking difference?

Now can we discuss this without calling each other trolls and apologists?

And it´s funny that the apologists always pull out the "troll" card first. I guess they know deep down that we "trolls" are right.

And yet you'll find people who think not only that St.Anger is a good record, but one of their BEST because it was different.

People have different opinions, that's fine. That doesn't mean that they are a fanboy or an apologist, just that, TO THEM, it is good.

We can't say anything about the iPad at this time because we don't know how it will do in the market, we don't know if the masses accept it or not. Wait a year, and THEN we can discuss if it is a bad product or not. If it doesn't sell, it was a bad product, if it is successful, it wasn't.

Hondas may not be nearly as good as a Porsche in terms of performance, but that doesn't make them a bad car, and in fact, more people drive Hondas, and they are making money off of the product, so it has to be a good product.

Same thing with St.Anger, if it sold really well, brought in millions of new fans, but pissed of a few hundred thousand die hard fans, it would have still been a good product because it did what it was supposed to do, MAKE MONEY.

iPad the same thing, if it is profitable and brings in new people to the Apple / Mac community, it is a good product from a business stand point. Guess what, companies are out to make money, not make everyone happy.

See now we´re getting somewhere. Okey here we go:

Your practically saying the more records a band or an artist sells, the better the music. Really stupid argument. I guess million flies eating ***** can´t be wrong. Just check out Britney Spears album sales.

Not everything is about money. Which Apple apparently has forgotten. iPad is a sad easy way out attempt to make more money without any new innovation. I don´t respect that. You know riding that "iPhone wave" and taking it easy. This is very lazy and "un-Apple" of them and has gotten lot of people worried about their business. I think they got too comfortable. That´s what usually happens when people get too comfortable, the innovation dies.

St.Anger didn´t bring millions of new fans. It disappointed pretty much everybody. But it still sold millions, so I guess it was a great album then, right?

Some people take pride what they do and don´t sell out for easy money.

 

[CylonGlitch]

Your practically saying the more records a band or an artist sells, the better the music. Really stupid argument. I guess million flies eating ***** can´t be wrong. Just check out Britney Spears album sales.

No, what I said was that an album that sells millions of copies and makes tons of money is a GOOD album from a BUSINESS standpoint. Since that is what the BUSINESS is there for. Believe it or not, people like to make money, few do it just because they want to. Apple is no different, they are a BUSINESS there to make MONEY and believe it or not, it isn't for Jobs, but the share holders. That is why people buy stock in companies. It is HIS responsibility to build what he feels will make the company the most money.

From a business stand point, it matters not one iota what the fans think as long as the product is successful and making money for the company. No matter what you do, you can't please all the fans, and it is stupid to try. If you want to have a successful business venture, you had darn well build what you feel the mass populous wants, not what you think is cool. If Apple sells 20 million iPads, they would be in a much better situation then if they sell 200,000 iPadComputers. Not just from the sales of the hardware, but the sales of the content to go with it.

As hard as it is to believe, any product that is successful (sells well and makes money for the company) will be viewed as the 'better' product because it will be the one that is around later.

And there is no "selling out." It's call business. Unless the company (or person, or band, whatever) has unlimited (virtually) funds and doesn't mind losing money, they are ALL trying to be successful. The ones that are doing it because they love it -- you'll never hear about because they don't last long.

 

[Mkallevik]

Im not talking about a "perfect device"

There is a benchmark that comes and goes as the years go on... You know like now every phone must have a camera... or all car windows are now powered... etc etc.

All I think people are asking for is that apple AT LEAST meet the benchmark that has been set for other platforms that it competes with. If it cant meet that benchmark, especially from a innovative company like apple... then why should people buy it? The way I see, apple worshippers will buy it no matter what they give... because then they just dismiss the "benchmark" for a device in its relative catergory.... but as a techie and a informed apple follower why do people accept mediocrity from apple?

This is what I dont get?

The problem is, if everyone is suppose to meet theese benchmarks of yours every time, the world will not move foreward. You may allready have a laptop that supports theese benchmaks. This is not that. This is something else, something new, and I don't think you can compare it to the devices that are around today.

 

[smetvid]

What this controversy has made clear, at least in these forums, is that some web users who are vocal proponents of Flash have no idea what they want or why they want it.

The best I can discern is that some of them want Flash simply for the sake of having Flash and could care less about the content that it delivers. Perhaps this has something to do with kids pirating Flash authoring tools and believing that certifies them to be authorities as ubiquitous and laughable "web designers," which explains why the majority of self proclaimed web designers are under the age of 15. This irrational subset of internet users make similar arguments to those who for some reason can't distinguish Flash from the content it delivers.

If Flash is phased out by either HTML 5, or even some other proprietary technology such as Silverlight, it's very likely that whatever content that Flash was delivering would simply migrate to whatever replaced it.

Not to be condescending, but life lesson to be learned here is that transitions can be difficult. And even if Flash does get phased out it will always remain popular among flat earthers who continue to use leaded gasoline because it was going to be too difficult and costly in the 70's to switch the infrastructure to the unleaded variety despite the benefits of not causing major brain damage to children. These are likely the same people who refuse to switch to HDTV's because of paranoia that the high def signals are being transmitted by black helicopters as a means of population control.

Do you really want to argue with these people?

Now that is a very narrow minded view of Flash in the world. Do you even understand what is used in the web design industry? Just because you don't like Flash and the circle of people and clients you live in doesn't like Flash doesn't mean that is true for everybody. I guess all the people that get hired all the time to create Flash content is some sort of fantasy world I have been living in the past 10 years. Perhaps I should start to tell my students not to accept jobs as a Flash designer because a few disgruntled people on the internet think Flash sucks.

 

[Mkallevik]

Now that is a very narrow minded view of Flash in the world. Do you even understand what is used in the web design industry? Just because you don't like Flash and the circle of people and clients you live in doesn't like Flash doesn't mean that is true for everybody. I guess all the people that get hired all the time to create Flash content is some sort of fantasy world I have been living in the past 10 years. Perhaps I should start to tell my students not to accept jobs as a Flash designer because a few disgruntled people on the internet think Flash sucks.

Thats exactly the problem. Flash have been around for so long. It`s allways been buggy (only my experience with it) and when people try to get rid of the old to make way for the new, there will allways be problems. If we want to get rid of flash then someone has to take a stand. Otherwise it will continue to exist.

Apple probably think it is time to kill flash and therefor they don't support it. Live with it or don't buy the iPad.

 

[eawmp1]

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/856073/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/855959/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/855827/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/855694/

Since January 28th, this is the 5th thread you've started bashing the iPad. Most have them have been closed by the Mods. We get it...you don't like the iPad. It's not for you. Your problem is that you think if it's not right for you, it's not right for ANYONE.

You know the old saying about opinions and ***holes...everyone has got one. Let others have an opinion about the iPad. Their opinions are every bit as valid as yours. Those who like the device shouldn't bother you so much. Rant to Apple if you want to make a difference. And as to whether you meet troll criteria or not, let's let the audience decide based on the evidence at hand.

Have a nice life!

 

[BobHail]

No, what I said was that an album that sells millions of copies and makes tons of money is a GOOD album from a BUSINESS standpoint. Since that is what the BUSINESS is there for. Believe it or not, people like to make money, few do it just because they want to. Apple is no different, they are a BUSINESS there to make MONEY and believe it or not, it isn't for Jobs, but the share holders. That is why people buy stock in companies. It is HIS responsibility to build what he feels will make the company the most money.

From a business stand point, it matters not one iota what the fans think as long as the product is successful and making money for the company. No matter what you do, you can't please all the fans, and it is stupid to try. If you want to have a successful business venture, you had darn well build what you feel the mass populous wants, not what you think is cool. If Apple sells 20 million iPads, they would be in a much better situation then if they sell 200,000 iPadComputers. Not just from the sales of the hardware, but the sales of the content to go with it.

As hard as it is to believe, any product that is successful (sells well and makes money for the company) will be viewed as the 'better' product because it will be the one that is around later.

And there is no "selling out." It's call business. Unless the company (or person, or band, whatever) has unlimited (virtually) funds and doesn't mind losing money, they are ALL trying to be successful. The ones that are doing it because they love it -- you'll never hear about because they don't last long.

Like I said, if 20 million flies buys the iPad, is it a good product? Absolutely not! (Read my Britney Spears analogy again). Maybe from business point, yes. But money isn't everything.

Besides truly innovative and revolutionizing products like the iPhone will always sell better. iPad is far from that. It's just a sad excuse to milk littlebit more easy money without any effort.

If you're buying it, you are sending a message. The same message when you buy crappy processed foods, cheap Wal-Mart products, top charts one hit wonder artists albums that are forgotten the next year and other consumer *****.

It's a bad message for humankind. We are already buying too much useless junk. Vote with your wallets people. Think! Buy only quality products that have some true value!

Send Apple a message that they need to get their priorities straight again!

 

[Gr80Likes2Boogi]

That´s like saying:

"Metallica made St.Anger, ´cause they wanted to; if you don't like it, that's fine, there are plenty of other records for you, this one isn't. There isn't a single thing on this planet that is perfect for everyone."

While this is true, the facts still are that St.Anger was a bad record and iPad is a bad product (as it is now).

And anyone stating otherwise is just plain wrong and pure apologist.

OK I've been reading but NOW have to reply about this one.

REALLY? Really? Ok, now I'm gonna side with you on St. Anger, cause it's a terrible record, but that's only my opinion. That record may really speak to some person, or group of people. Doesn't make them apologist at all. But that's art, open to interpretation.

As far as the iPad goes, I've been watching this thread with humor/disgust. You do tend to just say "apologist" and smarmy off. And in case I get the apologist brand, I just want you to know (and really everyone, for that matter) that I have NO desire to get the iPad, I have no NEED for an iPad, and I think people who get iPads are consumers who want that product =) However you choose to you use your iPad in whatever configuration or storage capacity you choose, go with gusto and more power to you.

a⋅pol⋅o⋅gist  [uh-pol-uh-jist]
–noun
1. a person who makes a defense in speech or writing of a belief, idea, etc.
2. Ecclesiastical.
a. Also, a⋅pol⋅o⋅gete  [uh-pol-uh-jeet] a person skilled in apologetics.
b. one of the authors of the early Christian apologies in defense of the faith.

 

[Mkallevik]

Like I said, if 20 million flies buys the iPad, is it a good product? Absolutely not! (Read my Britney Spears analogy again). Maybe from business point, yes. But money isn't everything.

Besides truly innovative and revolutionizing products like the iPhone will always sell better. iPad is far from that. It's just a sad excuse to milk littlebit more easy money without any effort.

If you're buying it, you are sending a message. The same message when you buy crappy processed foods, cheap Wal-Mart products, top charts one hit wonder artists albums that are forgotten the next year and other consumer *****.

It's a bad message for humankind. We are already buying too much useless junk. Vote with your wallets people. Think! Buy only quality products that have some true value!

Send Apple a message that they need to get their priorities straight again!

Do you really think this is a bad quality product? No matter how much you argue, this is not a bad quality product.

Sure, it doesn't have every feature you can imagine, but it is definetly not a bad quality product.

 

[BobHail]

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/856073/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/855959/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/855827/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/855694/

Since January 28th, this is the 5th thread you've started bashing the iPad. Most have them have been closed by the Mods. We get it...you don't like the iPad. It's not for you. Your problem is that you think if it's not right for you, it's not right for ANYONE.

You know the old saying about opinions and ***holes...everyone has got one. Let others have an opinion about the iPad. Their opinions are every bit as valid as yours. Those who like the device shouldn't bother you so much. Rant to Apple if you want to make a difference. And as to whether you meet troll criteria or not, let's let the audience decide based on the evidence at hand.

Have a nice life!

You don't have to read my threads. Nobody is forcing you. Is it so hard to ignore them? There are many who agrees 100% with me, so why don't you keep in your iPad fanboy threads and let us with different opinion discuss in our own threads, unless you haven't got any valid arguments.

 

[CylonGlitch]

Like I said, if 20 million flies buys the iPad, is it a good product? Absolutely not! (Read my Britney Spears analogy again). Maybe from business point, yes. But money isn't everything.

Tell that to the share holders. Sorry, in Business, MONEY IS EVERYTHING! Last I checked, Apple was a BUSINESS.

BTW, for flies, that pile of shyte is the best thing in the world. I'm not a fly, so not my cup of tea.

Besides truly innovative and revolutionizing products like the iPhone will always sell better. iPad is far from that. It's just a sad excuse to milk littlebit more easy money without any effort.

The iPod wasn't revolutionary either, there were MP3 players at the time. Guess it is sucks too? Since we haven't seen what the iPad can do yet, there is no way of knowing what it is capable of. People bashed the iPhone as well; but that doesn't mean it sucked. This is 100% your OPINION! I think that the iPad does have a chance to revolutionize books (specifically) especially at colleges! Will it? We don't know, it remains to be seen, but I can see it happening. It may revolutionize mobile email as well, especially for those without Smart Phones. Same thing with mobile web content. Could also be said about magazines and newpapers that are dearly needing a good shot in the arm. This may be their saving grace. Only time will tell. Just because it doesn't appear to be revolutionary at this time, doesn't mean it won't turn out to be.

If you're buying it, you are sending a message. The same message when you buy crappy processed foods, cheap Wal-Mart products, top charts one hit wonder artists albums that are forgotten the next year and other consumer *****.

And since you don't know what it really is, just like everyone else, or what is in the works for it, you're just ASSUMING it is junk. But then again, billions of people shop Walmart, and for them that is good enough. Just because YOU don't like it, doesn't mean it isn't good. Why buy the latest "Harry Potter" book at Barns and Noble when you can buy it at Walmart for 1/4th the price. Some would call you a sucker.

It's a bad message for humankind. We are already buying too much useless junk. Vote with your wallets people. Think! Buy only quality products that have some true value!

Why not just **** until the product fails, and THEN you can bitch all you want. But guess what, to those buying the product, it was worth the value TO THEM.

Send Apple a message that they need to get their priorities straight again!

Yeah, MAKE MONEY! Go Apple, Go. If the iPad is successful, AWESOME, I hope your stock doubles again! (being a share holder, that is what I want!)

Seems like Apple does have the right priorities, to the SHARE HOLDERS, make money. They own you NOTHING. You could go, buy out all the outstanding shares, become the primary share holder, get yourself a seat on the board, and convince the rest of the board that it isn't about making money, but being innovative and revolutionary at any cost, even if it means you'll lose billions! Until then, it is just your opinion, but not necessarily anyone else's. Let me know when you start buying your shares; I need to get more first.

 

[dgree03]

Tell that to the share holders. Sorry, in Business, MONEY IS EVERYTHING! Last I checked, Apple was a BUSINESS.

BTW, for flies, that pile of shyte is the best thing in the world. I'm not a fly, so not my cup of tea.


The iPod wasn't revolutionary either, there were MP3 players at the time. Guess it is sucks too? Since we haven't seen what the iPad can do yet, there is no way of knowing what it is capable of. People bashed the iPhone as well; but that doesn't mean it sucked. This is 100% your OPINION! I think that the iPad does have a chance to revolutionize books (specifically) especially at colleges! Will it? We don't know, it remains to be seen, but I can see it happening. It may revolutionize mobile email as well, especially for those without Smart Phones. Same thing with mobile web content. Could also be said about magazines and newpapers that are dearly needing a good shot in the arm. This may be their saving grace. Only time will tell. Just because it doesn't appear to be revolutionary at this time, doesn't mean it won't turn out to be.




And since you don't know what it really is, just like everyone else, or what is in the works for it, you're just ASSUMING it is junk. But then again, billions of people shop Walmart, and for them that is good enough. Just because YOU don't like it, doesn't mean it isn't good. Why buy the latest "Harry Potter" book at Barns and Noble when you can buy it at Walmart for 1/4th the price. Some would call you a sucker.


Why not just **** until the product fails, and THEN you can bitch all you want. But guess what, to those buying the product, it was worth the value TO THEM.


Yeah, MAKE MONEY! Go Apple, Go. If the iPad is successful, AWESOME, I hope your stock doubles again! (being a share holder, that is what I want!)

Seems like Apple does have the right priorities, to the SHARE HOLDERS, make money. They own you NOTHING. You could go, buy out all the outstanding shares, become the primary share holder, get yourself a seat on the board, and convince the rest of the board that it isn't about making money, but being innovative and revolutionary at any cost, even if it means you'll lose billions! Until then, it is just your opinion, but not necessarily anyone else's. Let me know when you start buying your shares; I need to get more first.

So you accept mediocrity, so long as a company is making money? Money that you will never see at all... or if you are a shareholder money that is micro compared to what the company made.

At least someone is being truthful

 

[dgree03]

The problem is, if everyone is suppose to meet theese benchmarks of yours every time, the world will not move foreward. You may allready have a laptop that supports theese benchmaks. This is not that. This is something else, something new, and I don't think you can compare it to the devices that are around today.

Yes it will lol.. this is a BENCHMARK... and baseline if you will...

Cars have power windows standard... does that stop a company from putting a 400hp hybrid engine in the car?

All phones have cameras... does that mean that someone cant put a 10.1mp camera on the phone with s 2ghz processor and a nvida chip?

Again it is only a BENCHMARk... why cant appl at least meet the bench mark of it "perceived" competitiors?

 

[DaveSW]

...if the web browsing experience would be at least just as good as with my MacBook Pro, but it isn´t.

Oh well, maybe the next tablet will have a FULL internet, not a mobile internet, what do you think?

i think you're free to use whatever product you like. nobody's forcing you to buy an iPad

 

[Carouser]

"I would like to buy an iPad. It looks like I'd use it and it does everything I need it to. But wait! Some internet blowhards say it doesn't do things that are irrelevant to me (uh oh) and they also say that Apple is selling out because they made something people want. Oh no, now what do I do... Oh right, I'll buy it anyway because those are pointless objections, silly me."

 

[Carouser]

"Hey you! Don't buy that product! You need to justify it to other people first according to their standards, not yours. Maybe you should just wait and buy a different product you didn't want anyway, 'cause I think it's better. Or maybe you should wait until the company sells my fantasy product instead. Sorry, I don't know when or if it will get here, or how much it will cost. Phew. Glad I caught you in time."

 

[CylonGlitch]

So you accept mediocrity, so long as a company is making money? Money that you will never see at all... or if you are a shareholder money that is micro compared to what the company made.

At least someone is being truthful

The reason I invest my money into other companies is to make more money. Thus in this respect, yes. I sure the heck hope that they make money. Do I think that the iPad is mediocre? Not really, it isn't targeting most hardcore users, but it is targeting the masses. I realize that, and think that is the smart move, they have done a great job selling to that market.

 

[sampsas]

Did you have trouble getting into uni much? I think soooooo, oh yes I do!
Anyone who uses sites like myspace and facebook, and watches TV on the internet is a loser anyway, and flash? pfff. no losertube and adverts. oh noes!

Ok so you say people who watch TV on the internet are LOSERS??? So where I live I get wireless highspeed internet, BUT DO NOT HAVE ACCESS TO cable OR SAT TV!?!?!?! SO I guess I am a loser then?!?!?!???? NOT!!!!!! IPAD just a big touch!!! I will keep my linux toshiba tablet (YES FULL Desktop internet experiance) So all apple lovers remember HP and TOSHIBA BOTH had some form of tablets out BEFORE YOU!!!! I know APPLE VS Winblows..... hate winblows!!!

 

[BaldiMac]

Yes it will lol.. this is a BENCHMARK... and baseline if you will...

Cars have power windows standard... does that stop a company from putting a 400hp hybrid engine in the car?

All phones have cameras... does that mean that someone cant put a 10.1mp camera on the phone with s 2ghz processor and a nvida chip?

Again it is only a BENCHMARk... why cant appl at least meet the bench mark of it "perceived" competitiors?

Because there are always trade offs. It's pretty close to impossible to match all the specs of your competitors AND improve in the areas that Apple does AND remain price competitive.

 

[Mkallevik]

Yes it will lol.. this is a BENCHMARK... and baseline if you will...

Cars have power windows standard... does that stop a company from putting a 400hp hybrid engine in the car?

All phones have cameras... does that mean that someone cant put a 10.1mp camera on the phone with s 2ghz processor and a nvida chip?

Again it is only a BENCHMARk... why cant appl at least meet the bench mark of it "perceived" competitiors?

No it wont lol.. I think we can agree that the tires on the car is standard. But what if the tires was in the way of building wings on it? Would it be acceptable to remove the tires then?

Ofcourse I see your point on the camera, but with flash, some people might argue that you have to remove Flash in order to maintain a good user experience.

 

[dgree03]

No it wont lol.. I think we can agree that the tires on the car is standard. But what if the tires was in the way of building wings on it? Would it be acceptable to remove the tires then?

Ofcourse I see your point on the camera, but with flash, some people might argue that you have to remove Flash in order to maintain a good user experience.

Airplanes still use tires lol... they just tuck them in when in flight(some of them do)

There is a benchmark... why cant apple do at least the MINIMUM that other competitors are using or will be using?

And with flash eventually every phone will have flash... that will be the benchmark... a camera with flash...

every computer needs to have a built in camera... the industry made that standard... and now they will just IMPROVE upon that standard...

Every computer has the capablity to run flash... thats a benchmark...

Every Phone OS or Tablet OS or desktop OS can multitask, that is AND has been the benchmark since GUI OS systems became the staple.

it is sad that, that techies accept less than mediocrity from such a supposed "innovative" company..

 

[dgree03]

Because there are always trade offs. It's pretty close to impossible to match all the specs of your competitors AND improve in the areas that Apple does AND remain price competitive.

I didnt say all the specs of competitors... I said the BASELINE of what the industry has billed(this including apple) as a standard... like my example for a camera.

why cant apple AT LEAST meet those baselines? and apple has had NO problem pricing there products higher than the competitor, so why stop now? it didnt stop them with the original iphone... their laptops or desktops.

 

[BaldiMac]

I didnt say all the specs of competitors... I said the BASELINE of what the industry has billed(this including apple) as a standard... like my example for a camera.

why cant apple AT LEAST meet those baselines? and apple has had NO problem pricing there products higher than the competitor, so why stop now? it didnt stop them with the original iphone... their laptops or desktops.

There is no baseline for products like the iPad.

And again, there is a trade off for anything. If you want to add a camera, it must come at the expense of something else.

 

[dgree03]

There is no baseline for products like the iPad.

And again, there is a trade off for anything. If you want to add a camera, it must come at the expense of something else.

How about apples very own Iphone? lol
Netbooks could be considered a competitor...
Hp Slate will be...
EE Pad will be...

and they all meet what most would consider a baseline for what should be standard on a tablet/netbook/touch device.

How can a phone add a camera or have a OS with multitasking or have flash with a lessor processor. But the bigger ipad cannot? that doesnt make sense...

That would be like walking up to a 2010 BMW and them saying it doesnt have power steering?

ME: what my honda has that...
BMW: But, but we had to sacrafic something to keep the cost down...
Me: so you eliminate a basic feature?

 

[Carouser]

Apple doesn't think the product needs those features to be successful. Some people think it should have those features because other products do. What else is there to say?