I played with the Note 8, and now the iphone looks blah

[Deeds500]

Not really though, what would I use the S pen for the most? The same as I would with the apple pencil and that’s nav round the device. I have no doubt live message is cool but would I use it anymore than when I send animoji with the x? nah I wouldn’t. Some of the S pen features would be nice to use no doubt about it but would I use them much over time? Not really.


So yes there are more features with the S pen but for certain people they will stop using them after a while and just use it as a phone. On the pencil you at least have a massive screen to use the pencil for what you might want to use. On the note I think it’s great don’t get me wrong but from a usage standpoint for ME the usage wouldn’t be much different

What you're basically saying is, the Pencil is a specialised piece of hardware for a specialised group of people, whereas the pen is a bit jack of all trades. I'd agree with that. Perhaps the pencil is better than the pen for drawing, but I don't think Samsung ever intended the pen to be a a specialised artistic tool. It's intended purpose is to do a whole bunch of things, and what it does it does well. But if you don't want to use it, you don't have to, the Note is still a great device without it. Most people who would get the Note wouldn't get it for specialised drawing, though it does draw, and it draws pretty well. I liken it to a swiss knife. Most people who get a swiss knife don't get it for the knife alone. They get it because it comes with a bottle opener, a file, a screwdriver and a whole bunch of other stuff. But if you wanted a serious knife, you'd get a Rambo type knife. If you want a serious virtual pen for drawing, you'd get the Apple pencil. But if you want a virtual pen that draws and does a whole lot of other stuff as well, you'd get the s-pen.
[doublepost=1510922628][/doublepost]

I do agree the S Pen is a Samsung innovation and I am enticed by its features. I especially like the Live Message feature on the Note 8. Looks awesome. The Apple Pencil is a specialised tool for a specialised purpose. You can't compare the two. Heck when Apple comes out with its own version it won't be the Apple Pencil. It will probabbly be a stylus similar to the Note 8 and have a variety of use cases apart from drawing.

Let's see if Samsung figures out in screen fingerprint sensor in the Note 9 as rumoured. If Samsung does this, it will one up Apple in biometrics. I can get a Note 9 without a moments hesitation at that point.

I'm not sure Apple will come out with an iphone stylus. Steve Jobs pretty much set that in stone as far as Apple is concerned. Times change I get that but geez the Apple haters would have a field day. It's ponly probably the most famous quote in the history of the smartphone industry.

Yea a FPS under the screen is where the magic lies.

 

[torana355]

Anything to say on the topic at hand? Just sayin’.

I like Android, you like iOS, i'm happy to leave it at that. Its obvious that anything more then that is a waste of everyones time.

 

[I7guy]

I like Android, you like iOS, i'm happy to leave it at that.

Perfect. An on topic post.

 

[Radon87000]

What you're basically saying is, the Pencil is a specialised piece of hardware for a specialised group of people, whereas the pen is a bit jack of all trades. I'd agree with that. Perhaps the pencil is better than the pen for drawing, but I don't think Samsung ever intended the pen to be a a specialised artistic tool. It's intended purpose is to do a whole bunch of things, and what it does it does well. But if you don't want to use it, you don't have to, the Note is still a great device without it. Most people who would get the Note wouldn't get it for specialised drawing, though it does draw, and it draws pretty well. I liken it to a swiss knife. Most people who get a swiss knife don't get it for the knife alone. They get it because it comes with a bottle opener, a file, a screwdriver and a whole bunch of other stuff. But if you wanted a serious knife, you'd get a Rambo type knife. If you want a serious virtual pen for drawing, you'd get the Apple pencil. But if you want a virtual pen that draws and does a whole lot of other stuff as well, you'd get the s-pen.
[doublepost=1510922628][/doublepost]

I'm not sure Apple will come out with an iphone stylus. Steve Jobs pretty much set that in stone as far as Apple is concerned. Times change I get that but geez the Apple haters would have a field day. It's ponly probably the most famous quote in the history of the smartphone industry.

Yea a FPS under the screen is where the magic lies.

The rumours have confirmed Apple is working on a stylus for a future iPhone and it will probably work like the Note SPen. Knowing Apple though they will sell it separately because of their greed just like they sell fast chargers separately for a $1200 phone.

Apple has backpedalled on much of what Steve said to get money so the stylus won't be any different. Apple nowadays just looks at the hot item on Android and implements it after fixing any issues with it. If Jobs was still alive we would have had another product category like the iPhone. iPhone iPad iPod and Mac which are the bread and butter of Apple,are Steve's products all within a difference of 10 years or less from each other. Haven't seen a single new category from Apple since his death.

 

[I7guy]

The rumours have confirmed Apple is working on a stylus for a future iPhone and it will probably work like the Note SPen. Knowing Apple though they will sell it separately because of their greed just like they sell fast chargers separately for a $1200 phone.

Apple has backpedalled on much of what Steve said to get money so the stylus won't be any different. Apple nowadays just looks at the hot item on Android and implements it after fixing any issues with it. If Jobs was still alive we would have had another product category like the iPhone. iPhone iPad iPod and Mac which are the bread and butter of Apple,are Steve's products all within a difference of 10 years or less from each other. Haven't seen a single new category from Apple since his death.

So in essence Apple is working to integrate the Apple Pencil across its line, thankfully moving forward in different directions than Jobs. It’s up to you if you want to purchase it.

That’s not backpedaling and as Tim says shouldn’t be afraid to admit mistakes, especially from the past. As Apple heads toward a trillion dollars gave you noticed that Apple has been on a roll, even through your own “opinions.” Impressive from a company that has milked the past and hadn’t had any new products in 10 years. All companies should fail line this.

 

[Radon87000]

So in essence Apple is working to integrate the Apple Pencil across its line, thankfully moving forward in different directions than Jobs. It’s up to you if you want to purchase it.

That’s not backpedaling and as Tim says shouldn’t be afraid to admit mistakes, especially from the past. As Apple heads toward a trillion dollars gave you noticed that Apple has been on a roll, even through your own “opinions.” Impressive from a company that has milked the past and hadn’t had any new products in 10 years. All companies should fail line this.

What you said changes nothing because I said Apple would be on a super cycle over a year ago. Things will fall back into stagnation in 2019. Down quarters will once again happen around that time.


They have been given 1 cash cow from Steve and they are improving it after looking at the Android competition. Apart from FaceID there is nothing here which Android hasn’t already done.

 

[I7guy]

What you said changes nothing because I said Apple would be on a super cycle over a year ago. Things will fall back into stagnation in 2019. Down quarters will once again happen around that time.


They have been given 1 cash cow from Steve and they are improving it after looking at the Android competition. Apart from FaceID there is nothing here which Android hasn’t already done.

Apple under Timmy's direction invented the iphone 6, 6s, etc, additional ipads, apple pencil, airpods, homepod, apple tv 4, apple watch etc. So apple is on a roll, not a super cycle and yes what I said changes the entire thing. My apple stock portfolio cares not about how they improve the products and where it came from, only that my stock goes up. Stock goes up; company; shareholders, board is happy (but not certain MR posters ).

But don't worry about the down quarters...Timmy's massive bonus this year will take the company through that.

And don't forget this. Time says Apple had a new invention. I will believe Time as an authoritative source over some of what is posted here.

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-of-2017-by-time.2088990/page-5#post-25481831

 

[Radon87000]

Apple under Timmy's direction invented the iphone 6, 6s, etc, additional ipads, apple pencil, airpods, homepod, apple tv 4, apple watch etc. So apple is on a roll, not a super cycle and yes what I said changes the entire thing. My apple stock portfolio cares not about how they improve the products and where it came from, only that my stock goes up. Stock goes up; company; shareholders, board is happy (but not certain MR posters )



But don't worry about the down quarters...Timmy's massive bonus this year will take the company through that.

None of what you said is a product category. About the HomePod and the other products, call me when they make up 65% Apple’s revenue.

I think you are the one who is most worried about his bonus here considering you keep mentioning it every now and then.

About the down quarters, why should I care about that. The down quarters only indicate customers aren’t finding the newer phones as upradeworthy. This should happen in the coming years as Apple milks this design for the next 5 years.

 

[I7guy]

None of what you said is a product category. About the HomePod and the other products, call me when they make up 65% Apple’s revenue.

I think you are the one who is most worried about his bonus here considering you keep mentioning it every now and then.

About the down quarters, why should I care about that. The down quarters only indicate customers aren’t finding the newer phones as upradeworthy. This should happen in the coming years as Apple milks this design for the next 5 years.

So by your definition Steve Jobs didn't invent a product category either. Cell phones, computers, windows/linux tables and mp3 players existed prior to that. And by that logic, watches, bluetooth earphones, speakers etc all existed aren't new. As far as the percentage of a category to the total, only some people focus on the red-herring type metric. Do you seriously believe airpods will ever make up 50% of apples revenue, or dishwashers will make up 50% of Samsungs revenue.

I'm not worried about Tim's bonus, but I think you are. You keep mentioning down quarters for apple. I'm looking for the post where you predicted this year would be a disaster for apple; but cannot yet find it.

Every company has down quarters. Just ask Samsung.

 

[Radon87000]

So by your definition Steve Jobs didn't invent a product category either. Cell phones, computers, windows/linux tables and mp3 players existed prior to that. And by that logic, watches, bluetooth earphones, speakers etc all existed aren't new. As far as the percentage of a category to the total, only some people focus on the red-herring type metric. Do you seriously believe airpods will ever make up 50% of apples revenue, or dishwashers will make up 50% of Samsungs revenue.

He did. There wasnt a single device which compared to the iPhone at that time in ALL aspects. Regarding the AirPods,Homepod, Apple Watch, competitors do exist and they do some things better as well. Maybe not so much for the Apple Watch but as far as fitness goes, Fitbit and Garmin do a lot of things better than it. And Apple Watch

I only focus on the cash cows. Ads for Google, Windows/Office for Microsoft, iPhone for Apple. The people who come up with these ideas are the ones who are truly innovative. IpHONE revolutionised the smartphone as did iPad for the tablets. But none of Apple's current products do that. Steve made an awesome product and Tim is improving on that just like how Nadella does with Microsoft. Coming up with these devices is a different story altogether

I'm not worried about Tim's bonus, but I think you are. You keep mentioning down quarters for apple. I'm looking for the post where you predicted this year would be a disaster for apple; but cannot yet find it.

Every company has down quarters. Just ask Samsung.

You won't find the post because even if I did predict that, it was before the rumors of the X started swirling. The instant I knew Apple did a design change, I knew it was a done deal. Design changes sell. I predict 2019-20 which is when we get the next round of down quarters

 

[I7guy]

He did. There wasnt a single device which compared to the iPhone at that time in ALL aspects. Regarding the AirPods,Homepod, Apple Watch, competitors do exist and they do some things better as well. Maybe not so much for the Apple Watch but as far as fitness goes, Fitbit and Garmin do a lot of things better than it. And Apple Watch

I only focus on the cash cows. Ads for Google, Windows/Office for Microsoft, iPhone for Apple. The people who come up with these ideas are the ones who are truly innovative. IpHONE revolutionised the smartphone as did iPad for the tablets. But none of Apple's current products do that. Steve made an awesome product and Tim is improving on that just like how Nadella does with Microsoft. Coming up with these devices is a different story altogether



You won't find the post because even if I did predict that, it was before the rumors of the X started swirling. The instant I knew Apple did a design change, I knew it was a done deal. Design changes sell. I predict 2019-20 which is when we get the next round of down quarters

Seems like this has been covered. Jobs invented the iPhone 1 like Cook invented the iPhone 6.

Other than the iPhone 5s, iphone 7 and iPhone X you’re right no other iPhone revolutionized the industry post jobs. And Tim has been changing the culture at Apple, AirPods, aw, HomePod etc, and it shows by every measure.

Whatever you focus on the rest of the world doesn’t, smaller things matter.

And you admit your “prediction “ was wrong wow. If we’re both still here in 19/20 we’ll get to see whose right. At that point Apple should be worth $1.2T or so.

The “Apple is doomed” meme is as old at this point as the “planned obsolescence” meme. One hasn’t happened and one can’t be proven.

 

[IowaLynn]

https://www.sammobile.com/2017/11/14/four-things-love-about-samsung-galaxy-note-8

 

[KingslayerG5]

 

[Deeds500]

The rumours have confirmed Apple is working on a stylus for a future iPhone and it will probably work like the Note SPen. Knowing Apple though they will sell it separately because of their greed just like they sell fast chargers separately for a $1200 phone.

Apple has backpedalled on much of what Steve said to get money so the stylus won't be any different. Apple nowadays just looks at the hot item on Android and implements it after fixing any issues with it. If Jobs was still alive we would have had another product category like the iPhone. iPhone iPad iPod and Mac which are the bread and butter of Apple,are Steve's products all within a difference of 10 years or less from each other. Haven't seen a single new category from Apple since his death.

Wasn't the watch Tim Cook? Anyeay if this iphone pen doesn't come with a sihlo like the S-Pen, then it won't be the same. "You gotta get them, put them away, you lose them, yuck".

But I share your frustration about the lack of products under Cook.

 

[Radon87000]

Wasn't the watch Tim Cook? Anyeay if this iphone pen doesn't come with a sihlo like the S-Pen, then it won't be the same. "You gotta get them, put them away, you lose them, yuck".

But I share your frustration about the lack of products under Cook.

It will come with a dedicated silo like the Note but the Pen itself will be sold separately. This is one thing I don’t need Kuo to confirm.


Yeah but the Watch isn’t exactly ground breaking. I have one and love it but at the end of the day it’s just a notification centre and a fitness hub. Definitely not on the level of an iPhone or iPad.

Garmin outclasses the Apple Watch in one aspect. Fitbit and Garmin aren’t going bankrupt because of Apple Watch. When the iPhone or iPad launched it obliterated the competition. A company like Nokia went under. Even now there isn’t a proper iPad competitor.

 

[Deeds500]

It will come with a dedicated silo like the Note but the Pen itself will be sold separately. This is one thing I don’t need Kuo to confirm.


Yeah but the Watch isn’t exactly ground breaking. I have one and love it but at the end of the day it’s just a notification centre and a fitness hub. Definitely not on the level of an iPhone or iPad.

Garmin outclasses the Apple Watch in one aspect. Fitbit and Garmin aren’t going bankrupt because of Apple Watch. When the iPhone or iPad launched it obliterated the competition. A company like Nokia went under. Even now there isn’t a proper iPad competitor.

I have never had any interest in the Apple watch or smart watches in general. Played with them in the stores, but to me they're just mini smart phones on your wrist.

The Apple pen sounds interesting. I assume it's still 3 or 4 years away? Hopefully it opens up the iphone to a whole range of new capabilities.
[doublepost=1511178163][/doublepost]

You do realise that for every youtube video of a person going from the Note 8 to the iphone X, there's just as many going vice versa? It's ratio of 1 : 1.

 

[Radon87000]

I have never had any interest in the Apple watch or smart watches in general. Played with them in the stores, but to me they're just mini smart phones on your wrist.

The Apple pen sounds interesting. I assume it's still 3 or 4 years away? Hopefully it opens up the iphone to a whole range of new capabilities.
[doublepost=1511178163][/doublepost]

You do realise that for every youtube video of a person going from the Note 8 to the iphone X, there's just as many going vice versa? It's ratio of 1 : 1.

Even Google doesn't know what to do with them. The Android Wear market is stagnant at the moment. What's comedic is that the best competitor for Apple Watch is the Galaxy Gear running Tizen. Android Wear is nowhere to be seen. I don't understand why. On Apple Watch there are a limited number of Watch faces while on Android Wear there are thousands. Google Assistamt is better than Siri. Google Maps is better than Apple Maps. Not sure why Google doesn't seem interested in this area.

It will be 3 years away. Next year Apple will launch the X Plus which won't come with much upgrades over the existing X. Just some ram upgrades, a better display and a better camera and better FaceID and dual sim support. Then in 2019 there will be an upgrade to ProMotion and by 2020 I expect a real Note competitor.

I am just not excited like I used to be in the past though. Reading between the lines, Apple is pushing towards a $2000 iPhone because they can and want to be a premium manufacturer for the elite. That iPhone will cost a crazy amount of money. What's worse is that Samsung will follow Apple because when they charge slightly below Apple's asking price no one bats an eye but on their own they can't charge ridiculous amounts and get away with it. Imagine if the Note were the only smartphone costing $950. Sales would be abysmal. Now people compare it with the X and don't find it overpriced. If Apple charges $1300 for the 64GB iPhone X Plus which I know they will, Samsung will charge around 1200 for the next Note.

Google unfortunately can't seem to make a good phone without a glaring flaw. So it's just a duopoly going on at the top end of the smartphone market. HTC and LG seem down in the dumps ATM.

Sony is stuck doing their own thing bringing out that big bezelled XZ Premium in 2017. Even on Android I am amazed it's so difficult to find a good flagship which is not Samsung

 

[I7guy]

Wasn't the watch Tim Cook? Anyeay if this iphone pen doesn't come with a sihlo like the S-Pen, then it won't be the same. "You gotta get them, put them away, you lose them, yuck".

But I share your frustration about the lack of products under Cook.

And yet, many, it seems, like what Apple is doing.

I doubt the Apple Pencil will have a silo.

 

[Puddled]

And yet, many, it seems, like what Apple is doing.

I doubt the Apple Pencil will have a silo.

The iPhone pencil will only work with iPhones, It will not have a silo as that would require a new iphone. It will however, be marketed with a new holder called a "Pencil Case" which will be an iphone wallet case with a silo built into it. This case will cost the same €110 as the Pencil.

Both items will NOT be covered by Applecare.

 

[I7guy]

The iPhone pencil will only work with iPhones, It will not have a silo as that would require a new iphone. It will however, be marketed with a new holder called a "Pencil Case" which will be an iphone wallet case with a silo built into it. This case will cost the same €110 as the Pencil.

Both items will NOT be covered by Applecare.

That is not how Apple rolls. I have no facts to back up my opinions and everything is rumor at this point.

 

[DakotaGuy]

What you're basically saying is, the Pencil is a specialised piece of hardware for a specialised group of people, whereas the pen is a bit jack of all trades. I'd agree with that. Perhaps the pencil is better than the pen for drawing, but I don't think Samsung ever intended the pen to be a a specialised artistic tool. It's intended purpose is to do a whole bunch of things, and what it does it does well. But if you don't want to use it, you don't have to, the Note is still a great device without it. Most people who would get the Note wouldn't get it for specialised drawing, though it does draw, and it draws pretty well. I liken it to a swiss knife. Most people who get a swiss knife don't get it for the knife alone. They get it because it comes with a bottle opener, a file, a screwdriver and a whole bunch of other stuff. But if you wanted a serious knife, you'd get a Rambo type knife. If you want a serious virtual pen for drawing, you'd get the Apple pencil. But if you want a virtual pen that draws and does a whole lot of other stuff as well, you'd get the s-pen.
[doublepost=1510922628][/doublepost]

I'm not sure Apple will come out with an iphone stylus. Steve Jobs pretty much set that in stone as far as Apple is concerned. Times change I get that but geez the Apple haters would have a field day. It's ponly probably the most famous quote in the history of the smartphone industry.

Yea a FPS under the screen is where the magic lies.

Steve Jobs hated any sort of stylus so much I doubt we would have ever gotten the Apple Pencil if he was still alive and running Apple. You might eventually see a fingerprint sensor under a screen, but it’ll probably come from an Android phone manufacturer because Apple says Face ID is superior and it’s the direction they are going.

 

[convergent]

Even Google doesn't know what to do with them. The Android Wear market is stagnant at the moment. What's comedic is that the best competitor for Apple Watch is the Galaxy Gear running Tizen. Android Wear is nowhere to be seen. I don't understand why. On Apple Watch there are a limited number of Watch faces while on Android Wear there are thousands. Google Assistamt is better than Siri. Google Maps is better than Apple Maps. Not sure why Google doesn't seem interested in this area.

It will be 3 years away. Next year Apple will launch the X Plus which won't come with much upgrades over the existing X. Just some ram upgrades, a better display and a better camera and better FaceID and dual sim support. Then in 2019 there will be an upgrade to ProMotion and by 2020 I expect a real Note competitor.

I am just not excited like I used to be in the past though. Reading between the lines, Apple is pushing towards a $2000 iPhone because they can and want to be a premium manufacturer for the elite. That iPhone will cost a crazy amount of money. What's worse is that Samsung will follow Apple because when they charge slightly below Apple's asking price no one bats an eye but on their own they can't charge ridiculous amounts and get away with it. Imagine if the Note were the only smartphone costing $950. Sales would be abysmal. Now people compare it with the X and don't find it overpriced. If Apple charges $1300 for the 64GB iPhone X Plus which I know they will, Samsung will charge around 1200 for the next Note.

Google unfortunately can't seem to make a good phone without a glaring flaw. So it's just a duopoly going on at the top end of the smartphone market. HTC and LG seem down in the dumps ATM.

Sony is stuck doing their own thing bringing out that big bezelled XZ Premium in 2017. Even on Android I am amazed it's so difficult to find a good flagship which is not Samsung

It is an exciting time to be in the smartphone market... there are so many really good competitors.

You said in another post Apple would put a silo in their phone but not include a pen. I don't know much about what Apple is going to do, but I am positive that isn't going to happen. You are suggesting they are going to sell a $2000 phone that comes with an unused hole in it? No.

You are also talking about Apple having a Note competitor by 2020? And you think Samsung will be sitting around between now and then doing nothing? All indications are a folding display will be in a Note before then. Apple just got OMLED now... years after the competition. And why would Apple even make a Note competitor... its a very small niche market.

Finally, no one pays $950 for a Note 8. Samsung devices are frequently available with incentives and discounts. I got $300 off, and an additional $300 off on the Gear S3 at the same time. Compared to Apple prices, the value comparison is not even close.

 

[Puddled]

Steve Jobs hated any sort of stylus so much I doubt we would have ever gotten the Apple Pencil if he was still alive and running Apple. You might eventually see a fingerprint sensor under a screen, but it’ll probably come from an Android phone manufacturer because Apple says Face ID is superior and it’s the direction they are going.

I think the response to Face ID by android will be this:

Device unlock and low level security: Normal camera. ( I wonder if all the bells and whistles of Face ID is really needed. It is a lot of effort and cost for something which can be done by a normal camera 95% of the time.)
Payments and personal data: FP.

Having a FP resolves the failures and inaccuracies of the camera face unlock.


Samsung may well refine and improve the Iris scanner but i don't see the 3D face unlock technology of Apple being a priority for android.
It is too expensive

 

[widgeteer]

Steve Jobs hated any sort of stylus so much I doubt we would have ever gotten the Apple Pencil if he was still alive and running Apple. You might eventually see a fingerprint sensor under a screen, but it’ll probably come from an Android phone manufacturer because Apple says Face ID is superior and it’s the direction they are going.

Face ID is superior. Android OEMs are all going to rush to adopt it over the next two generations.

 

[jamezr]

I think the response to Face ID by android will be this:

Device unlock and low level security: Normal camera. ( I wonder if all the bells and whistles of Face ID is really needed. It is a lot of effort and cost for something which can be done by a normal camera 95% of the time.)
Payments and personal data: FP.

Having a FP resolves the failures and inaccuracies of the camera face unlock.


Samsung may well refine and improve the Iris scanner but i don't see the 3D face unlock technology of Apple being a priority for android.
It is too expensive

I agree....I don't see an Android OEM full mass scramble to switch away for the FPS.
I have the iPhone X and 8+ and prefer the FPS to FaceID 100 times over.
FID is not as fast as a FPS to unlock a phone and get to the home screen.