Those are design decisions. Say what you will about Apple but I’m reasonably certain that they don’t intentionally design a graphics flaw.
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iMac 2020, 5700XT - graphical glitch?
- Thread starter torifile
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Are you not also reasonably certain that Apple didn’t intentionally design (and re-design, and re-design) a keyboard that had durability flaws? How are these two known-issues any different?
They are different in that butterfly keyboards have no defects out of the box. They work as designed. Screen glitches are obviously not as designed. It's also not something that develops over time, as is the case with the butterfly keyboards going bad.
Are you really asking if Apple intentionally designed a flaw in the iMac’s GPU? Really? I’ve been around the Apple criticism block a few times but that’s a new level of tin-foil-hattedness. Nice work.
To answer the question of the butterfly keyboards - yes, they were flawed designs and they were stuck with for far too long. They should have been kicked to the curb after the 2015 MacBook started to exhibit problems rather than going through 4 iterations before they finally got fixed (the 2019 keyboard is actually reliable. I have one that’s problem-free and I haven’t heard of a single complaint about that iteration) and ultimately dropped.
But we *all* know why they designed the mechanism. And it wasn’t because Apple wanted to design a flaw into their hardware. Agree or disagree with the rationale and reckless drive for thinness Ive exhibited but you can’t say they weren’t working towards some objective.
So, to answer your initial question “how are these two known-issues any different?” They are different because one has no purpose (iMac GPU issue) and one was very clearly a (mis)guided design principle. If you can’t see that, there’s nothing more for us to discuss.
Haha, they do not “work as designed”. How absurd to think that it’s an acceptable design and working flawlessly, but when a speck of dust happens across it and it fails catastrophicly that it’s unrelated to the design that allows for such failures. Apple really intended to give out free four-year keyboard warranties with every laptop they sold…
Of course not. I’m asking the rhetorical question designed to help you come to the understanding of “if Apple could knowingly ship a busted keyboard for five years they could knowlingly ship a busted line of GPUs for years and never truly make it right”. Just because something isn’t intentional doesn’t mean they didn’t knowingly sell it to you anyways.
One is no more incidental than the other. You have no idea what the cause of the GPU glitch is. You can’t sit here and state the GPU and its compute units weren’t designed with a purpose. You can’t believe someone didn’t design Metal and design the drivers for the card. You can’t believe those design decisions couldn’t lead to the graphical corruption. I’m sure more design went in to the GPU than did the butterfly keyboard, well, maybe not after they re-engineered it three times.
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As others have pointed out, you could could have picked better examples. Apple obviously didn't do this on purpose to anyone. Tim Cook isn't sitting around a conference room with his minions trying to figure out how to screw the American consumer. Apple will fix it.
Just like they fixed they keyboards? Just like they released a repair extension for new laptops the day they were released? I’m genuinely stunned you think that’s a counter-point. Offering a repair program doesnt fix the issue, it puts it off until the program is over but the problem remains. It’s an excellent example of Apple knowingly shipping bad hardware, and proves that it is very possible whether it makes you feel good or not.
Come on now, don’t put words in my mouth.
Whilst I agree on the whole about Apple’s attitude, this is a fault. Anti-glare screen is a feature.
A summary of the posts I collected on the net :
white line glitch
black line glitch
corner issue
true tone refresh issues
intermittent lockups
beachball icon
unexpected reboots
vram issues
fan issues
you can hardly call this a stable machine, isn’t it ?
You can add freezing on load bar at start up - me and another forum member had this
I buy Apple hardware for its build quality and for its design. When I buy a machine that costs $ 4,500 I have a right to expect a certain quality in both hardware and software.
It can happen exceptionally that there remain one or two bugs for which a quick information must be given by the manufacturer, I can understand that.
I note on the part of APPLE a breach of these simple obligations of respect for its buyers. It's a shame for us who love this brand and their products. If these facts were to last as long as we directly buy low-end products, cheaper, but we would be less surprised by this lack of quality and transparency ... But that's of course only my humble opinion
So sorry for my bad English...
It can happen exceptionally that there remain one or two bugs for which a quick information must be given by the manufacturer, I can understand that.
I note on the part of APPLE a breach of these simple obligations of respect for its buyers. It's a shame for us who love this brand and their products. If these facts were to last as long as we directly buy low-end products, cheaper, but we would be less surprised by this lack of quality and transparency ... But that's of course only my humble opinion
So sorry for my bad English...
Are those widespread or are you just picking the individual incidents?
Look, I’m not here to be an Apple apologist. You want to bitch and moan about Apple’s lost quality or how bad things are now. About how Steve would never have let that happen yada yada, have at it. It’s not new to Apple users. It’s been going on for *years*. People like @quagmire and @PBG4 Dude know me from years ago and we’ve all seen these complaints.
So, if you want to say that this iMac is the most awful release ever, you do you. (It’s not but there’s no point in arguing the issue.) I like my computer and it’s doing the job for me and countless untold people who don’t spend all day combing through forums looking for problems.
Have fun waiting for a fully problem-free hardware release. I’ll get some work done in macOS and play some games in Windows.
I love the passion, I love the debates. But every argument boils down to the following unknown question:
IS THIS A HARDWARE GLITCH OR SOFTWARE GLITCH ?
If it's a hardware glitch, we all purchased lemons and many of us would have returned the computer to Apple had we known. If it's software, we'll continue to complain and deal with it until a patch comes out and then we'll all be very happy.
So our collective goal at this point should be to get an acknowledgment from Apple of what is causing the GLITCH, so current and new iMac purchasers can make an educated decision whether or not to purchase a new iMac with the 5700XT or return the ones we just purchased.
Is this a fair conclusion summary of this 53 page thread?
IS THIS A HARDWARE GLITCH OR SOFTWARE GLITCH ?
If it's a hardware glitch, we all purchased lemons and many of us would have returned the computer to Apple had we known. If it's software, we'll continue to complain and deal with it until a patch comes out and then we'll all be very happy.
So our collective goal at this point should be to get an acknowledgment from Apple of what is causing the GLITCH, so current and new iMac purchasers can make an educated decision whether or not to purchase a new iMac with the 5700XT or return the ones we just purchased.
Is this a fair conclusion summary of this 53 page thread?
Considering people aren’t seeing the lines in bootcamp Windows, or when a second monitor is connected, or when the display’s resolution is changed from default, I’m going with software. That’s just my personal opinion on the internet, so we all know how much that’s worth.
Anyone can search the internet for issues relating to any product and one will likely find a long list. Bravo for being good at searching, copying, and pasting. I have an iMac w/ 5700 XT and I don't have any white line glitch when I use it. You know why? Because I employed what people on the internet call a "work around" until a permanent solution is offered. My machine is a perfectly stable speed demon.
[sarcasm]
That's why we stay in denial and insist that anybody that does not see the white line is either blind, stupid, uses non-standard resolution or a secondary monitor. Hence it must be a software issue.
I don't know which category I'm in ;-)
[/sarcasm]
Anyway... I'm yet to see the white line and would like some info on how frequent it appears?
Future post from ninecows said:
Yep.
I will take an occasional white line glitch that is likely software related over past issues I have experienced with Apple.
Such as you know the iPhone 5 discoloration issues( want to talk about poor QC), the iPhone 6 bending issues, the iPad Pro bending issues, the iPhone 4 antenna issues( though I think this one was a bit overblown and easily adjusted for), the GeForce 8600M issues in my 17" MBP( that was hardware and not software), etc. Hardware design defects is far more serious to me than software. Software will be fixed and I am sorry it wasn't 3 days after the issue was reported, the fix will take time.
Either I have ignored these parts of the forums for too long and forgot the incredible overblowing issues effect people tend to create which is hard to dissuade people from or these forums are quickly going downhill in pushing out any moderate people and only the extreme mindsets are allowed. I am sick of seeing people going, " XXX-Gate!?!?!" whenever they experience an issue because they want to be hip or start the trend ever since antennagate. Calm down, wait to see what others post, and if you have issues report it to Apple. Mass produced products will have common failures. Doesn't mean it is a new "antennagate".....
I am still taken a bit a back from being accused of spreading misinformation yesterday regarding the RAM configuration change we see in the 2020 iMac. I can accept that I can be wrong, but don't run away the moment I reply with proof that my comments are accurate without being able to apologize yourself.
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I’m not sure who, in this thread, is making anything overblown. If you are 100% satisfied with your iMac20,2 purchase, why read this thread at all or why accuse people of making the issue overblown? Clearly, to some of us, it is a bigger issue than it is to others.
As I said the last time someone asked "why read this thread, then?", it's to provide balance. Just think what this thread would be like if the only posts were @auralux's incessant "DAY XX WITHOUT A FIX" and people asking "is the worst thing since that time Tim Cook ate an aborted fetus or what?!?"
We wouldn't have the perfectly reasonable workaround for people who need to get their work done while this, almost assuredly, software issue is worked out. If people only complain and gripe on forums that's all anyone will see.
Have people accusing those who say no they don't have it as lying, only posting DAY 35 without a fix, etc. Or demand that Apple publicly acknowledges the issue? Apple has very rarely acknowledges an issue until it is in the software update release notes. Or how act surprised how a third party company who is contracted to Apple for customer support doesn't know of the issue? Does it make you feel better to get that scripted response that "Apple is looking into it"? Especially since you know they are by reading this thread so you calling them again to see is just freaking pointless and borderline harassment.
What I want to see in this thread is the little bit of useful info that has come from it vs the white noise the majority of this thread has turned into. The useful info being those who have been in contact with Apple engineering, how changing the display modes seems to mitigate the issue or having an external monitor does as well. Or the fact doesn't really happen in Windows. That is useful info I want to come into this thread to find.
THIS IS THE FIX for now... implement this and the world can turn again... Switch to any scaled resolution other than default! Pick any one of the red boxes and get back to living again. How hard is this?
