iOS 12 and planned obsolescence

[I7guy]

Because you don't know how many were affected by Throttlegate. Many of those who did had already bought newer phones unaware of this. For instance, the Air 2 was getting too slow for my needs. Hence I bought a newer iPad. How am I supposed to know if it was a hardware flaw? The Apple Store wont even replace the battery until it qualifies their arbitrary number. Those who were affected by slowdowns and Throttlegate already bought newer phones by the time this came out.

Which is why Apple was ignoring this issue till it became more widespread. Now that everyone knows about it, Apple has a job on their hands trying to convince everyone there was nothing nefarious going on. Hence the refund for batteries despite no proof being there whether phones were throttled and an iOS 12 update.





He did not say sales weren't affected which means they where. If they weren't he would say so. He has the data after all




You were here on these very forums saying this was anecdotal and Apple would not respond and boy did they respond all right. I am getting a refund of that iPhone 6 battery replacement I did last here. And I know how miserly Apple is when it comes to stuff like this. This is a company which tried to save costs on an underfill and VESA mount screws.

Throttlegate and Touch Disease and slowdowns affect older phones. Many of these customers have al;ready upgraded to newer models.

You don’t know either who was or had an opinion about power management. And one can’t draw any conclusions.

You can’t make up “facts”, which is what you are doing. Nobody on forums are prescient and know the reasons why tens of millions of people buy new phones.

 

[Radon87000]

You don’t know either who was or had an opinion about power management. And one can’t draw any conclusions.

You can’t make up “facts”, which is what you are doing. Nobody on forums are prescient and know the reasons why tens of millions of people buy new phones.

I am just saying both these issues had a bad impact on Apple's rep and before it affects sales, Apple is trying to win back customer satisfaction with these goodies. Users of older devices will be happy to learn of the speed increase as the devices have become slow at this point.

I am saying there is a percentage of those customers who have upgraded because of a slower phone unaware of the throttling which is a fact. I don't know why everyone upgraded their phones. Theres plenty of people I know who upgraded from older iPhones because of speed issues. Now there will be doubts if perhaps a battery replacement was all that was needed and they will be angry. Hence the reason for a focus on performance in iOS 12.

 

[Radon87000]

I don’t even know why people argue against planned obsolescence. As of now if you update to a newer ios and it becomes slow, its all over for your device. There is no way out.

 

[I7guy]

I am just saying both these issues had a bad impact on Apple's rep and before it affects sales, Apple is trying to win back customer satisfaction with these goodies. Users of older devices will be happy to learn of the speed increase as the devices have become slow at this point.

I am saying there is a percentage of those customers who have upgraded because of a slower phone unaware of the throttling which is a fact. I don't know why everyone upgraded their phones. Theres plenty of people I know who upgraded from older iPhones because of speed issues. Now there will be doubts if perhaps a battery replacement was all that was needed and they will be angry. Hence the reason for a focus on performance in iOS 12.

Basically you are making generalized statements. I’m sure there are unhappy Apple customers. Sone customers of every corporation is not happy for their reasons. But beyond some generalized statement you can’t get into the heads and mindset of tens of millions of customers.
[doublepost=1528574229][/doublepost]

I don’t even know why people argue against planned obsolescence. As of now if you update to a newer ios and it becomes slow, its all over for your device. There is no way out.

My 5s and 6s has essentially had the same performance over the years with the various iOS updates. With some releases being better or worse. That doesn’t seem to be planned obsolescence to me.

 

[macfacts]

Somewhat of an overreaction. Let's wait until the keynote is over and all the features are discovered via the developer previews.

Siri looks much smarter, Group Notifications, Faster performance, group FaceTime, etc are all things that needed to be corrected. Let's see how well they work.

Isn't the big feature bug fixes?

 

[ediks]

it doesnt look like planned obsolence at all , i cant wait to see the final version with optimized 3rd party apps in fall

 

[C DM]

I don’t even know why people argue against planned obsolescence. As of now if you update to a newer ios and it becomes slow, its all over for your device. There is no way out.

Because that by itself doesn't make for planned obsolescence? Because logic?
[doublepost=1528579650][/doublepost]

Isn't the big feature bug fixes?

There are big fixes, but that's not really a feature or anything like that.

 

[Radon87000]

Because that by itself doesn't make for planned obsolescence? Because logic?
[doublepost=1528579650][/doublepost]
There are big fixes, but that's not really a feature or anything like that.

It does because the phone slows down as the Years pass. No one can do anything about it and people end up buying a newer phone.
[doublepost=1528605264][/doublepost]

it doesnt look like planned obsolence at all , i cant wait to see the final version with optimized 3rd party apps in fall

See the videos comparing iOS 11 with iOS 10 if you want to see planned obsolescence. It's not surprising ios 12 turns out faster than 10. They had done zero optimisations for older devices all this time.
[doublepost=1528605918][/doublepost]

Basically you are making generalized statements. I’m sure there are unhappy Apple customers. Sone customers of every corporation is not happy for their reasons. But beyond some generalized statement you can’t get into the heads and mindset of tens of millions of customers

How is it incorrect to say customers upgraded because of a slower phone? That's one of the main reasons for getting a new one.
[doublepost=1528574229][/doublepost]

My 5s and 6s has essentially had the same performance over the years with the various iOS updates. With some releases being better or worse. That doesn’t seem to be planned obsolescence to me.

For me every new iOS version till iOS 12 has slowed down all devices I have owned. The iPhone 6 is basically unusable at this point. iPad 2 was horrible and the iOad Air 2 is starting to go the same way on iOS 11.

 

[borgranta]

The Apple lawyers may claim in court that planned obsolescence can not exist because Apple does not want to destroy the perceived quality of their brand as well as not wanting to be sued by the FTC as well as all the Attorney Generals from all the states for violating consumer protection laws since planned obsolescence could be construed as a defect and building the defect into it makes them defective. Defective items or also known as lemons.

 

[Abazigal]

How is it incorrect to say customers upgraded because of a slower phone? That's one of the main reasons for getting a new one.

You speak as though the software update's sole purpose was to slow down the phone, while adding absolutely nothing of value to it.

The way I see it, iOS devices slowing down is simply a consequence of code getting more bloated as more features are tacked on to it. And given the breakneck speed at which Apple operates, the software team simply didn't have the opportunity to get round to giving iOS the overhaul it so desperately needed.

We can argue until the cows come home as to whether Apple made the right decision to prioritise newer features with each new iOS release over stability and fluidity. Bottom line is - Apple didn't set out to deliberately slow down your iOS devices with the express intention of irritating users to the point where they felt "compelled" to upgrade their devices. Which doesn't make sense when you think about it. Apple dicks around with my phone and my first impulse is to thrash it and buy another phone from the very company who just screwed me over?

Intent matters. And I don't believe Apple was being malicious here when they did what they did.

 

[borgranta]

You speak as though the software update's sole purpose was to slow down the phone, while adding absolutely nothing of value to it.

The way I see it, iOS devices slowing down is simply a consequence of code getting more bloated as more features are tacked on to it. And given the breakneck speed at which Apple operates, the software team simply didn't have the opportunity to get round to giving iOS the overhaul it so desperately needed.

We can argue until the cows come home as to whether Apple made the right decision to prioritise newer features with each new iOS release over stability and fluidity. Bottom line is - Apple didn't set out to deliberately slow down your iOS devices with the express intention of irritating users to the point where they felt "compelled" to upgrade their devices. Which doesn't make sense when you think about it. Apple dicks around with my phone and my first impulse is to thrash it and buy another phone from the very company who just screwed me over?

Intent matters. And I don't believe Apple was being malicious here when they did what they did.

A business that deliberately cripples its own phones would be committing financial suicide.

 

[Abazigal]

A business that deliberately cripples its own phones would be committing financial suicide.

And yet this conspiracy theory surrounding Apple never dies. Because Apple grew to be so huge and successful precisely by pissing off each and every one of their customers...

 

[aleni]

Google: Watch this demo of our AI assistant place a phone call to a human and make an appointment.

Apple: This year, we're taking Animoji to a whole new level with breakthrough new technology we call Tongue Detection.

Just wait till the release of google Ai talking to a real person to book a table. Remember, demo will always be good.

 

[I7guy]

It does because the phone slows down as the Years pass. No one can do anything about it and people end up buying a newer phone.
[doublepost=1528605264][/doublepost]
See the videos comparing iOS 11 with iOS 10 if you want to see planned obsolescence. It's not surprising ios 12 turns out faster than 10. They had done zero optimisations for older devices all this time.
[doublepost=1528605918][/doublepost]

I've seen the videos comparing ios 10 and ios 11 and why it disproves planned obsolescence. Why is it not surprising ios 12 is faster then ios 10? Ios 9 was faster then ios 8.

How is it incorrect to say customers upgraded because of a slower phone? That's one of the main reasons for getting a new one.
[doublepost=1528574229][/doublepost]

I can think of other reasons.

• newer functions that make my life easier better
• new methods
• better display
• dropped my phone, screen shattered and now I want a new one
• newer form factor
• new models have a better look
• newer models have better performance

Where is slowness and planned obsolescence on this list?

For me every new iOS version till iOS 12 has slowed down all devices I have owned. The iPhone 6 is basically unusable at this point. iPad 2 was horrible and the iOad Air 2 is starting to go the same way on iOS 11.

That's not been my experience.

 

[C DM]

It does because the phone slows down as the Years pass. No one can do anything about it and people end up buying a newer phone.
[doublepost=1528605264][/doublepost]
See the videos comparing iOS 11 with iOS 10 if you want to see planned obsolescence. It's not surprising ios 12 turns out faster than 10. They had done zero optimisations for older devices all this time.
[doublepost=1528605918][/doublepost]

How is it incorrect to say customers upgraded because of a slower phone? That's one of the main reasons for getting a new one.
[doublepost=1528574229][/doublepost]


For me every new iOS version till iOS 12 has slowed down all devices I have owned. The iPhone 6 is basically unusable at this point. iPad 2 was horrible and the iOad Air 2 is starting to go the same way on iOS 11.

And yet that doesn't mean a malicious conspiracy is behind it. We've been over that way too many times across way too many threads.

 

[charlituna]

Google: Watch this demo of our AI assistant place a phone call to a human and make an appointment.

Apple: This year, we're taking Animoji to a whole new level with breakthrough new technology we call Tongue Detection.

So you missed the whole thing about Siri Shortcuts. Good to know.

Although I do agree that the Photos app update for ios was highly underwhelming. Folks screaming for years about manual location tagging, face outlining etc and we get ‘better sharing with friends’. Meh

 

[MEJHarrison]

I can think of other reasons.

• newer functions that make my life easier better
• new methods
• better display
• dropped my phone, screen shattered and now I want a new one
• newer form factor
• new models have a better look
• newer models have better performance

I think you forgot one. And I happen to believe this is one of the largest categories (with no proof whatsoever). It's the same reason I upgraded.

• I'm tired of my old phone and want something shiny and new.

There's nothing wrong with wanting the latest and greatest. And let's not forget...

• It's just my year to upgrade

Some upgrade because they always upgrade after x amount of time.

 

[Radon87000]

You speak as though the software update's sole purpose was to slow down the phone, while adding absolutely nothing of value to it.

The way I see it, iOS devices slowing down is simply a consequence of code getting more bloated as more features are tacked on to it. And given the breakneck speed at which Apple operates, the software team simply didn't have the opportunity to get round to giving iOS the overhaul it so desperately needed.

We can argue until the cows come home as to whether Apple made the right decision to prioritise newer features with each new iOS release over stability and fluidity. Bottom line is - Apple didn't set out to deliberately slow down your iOS devices with the express intention of irritating users to the point where they felt "compelled" to upgrade their devices. Which doesn't make sense when you think about it. Apple dicks around with my phone and my first impulse is to thrash it and buy another phone from the very company who just screwed me over?

Intent matters. And I don't believe Apple was being malicious here when they did what they did.

If their intent is noble, why not allow the user to downgrade? I absolutely hate what they did to the home button in iOS 11. I also do not like the small stutters here and there on my older iPhones which happen on iOS 11. All I want is to be able to downgrade to an enjoyable experience. I had to buy an iPhone X because the slowdowns irked me. I am very sensitive to stuttering and performance and coupled with the lack of downgrades, this recent story about how they shipped a throttle for older iPhones without telling anyone makes me doubt their intentions. Why all this secrecy? Were they trying to avoid a recall? Why is Apple the only company incapable of supporting multiple versions?

I perfectly understand adding features compromises performance but why not have the option to choose? I had a factory image of Android 4.3 Jellybean an OS from 2013 which I used on my Nexus 7. Yes its insecure but it worked fine like it did on Day 1. Google released Android Lollipop which was the iOS 11 of Android to me.It ruined my tablet. But the freedom to downgrade tells me Google's intentions. If that was Apple, Lollipop would be forcibly downloaded and I MUST buy a newer device to escape the lag.

And while on the subject of features, iOS 11 added almost nothing to the iPhone apart from some minor design tweaks. Most of whats added were simply app updates. Why are simple app updates slowing down devices? iOS 12 added more to the iPhone than iOS 11 did to iOS 10 and yet iOS 12 manages to be faster than iOS 11 but iOS 11 is slower than iOS 10.

And as far as why buy devices from a company who screws the user? Answer- Integration. I like the integration between the Watch, iPad, and the iPhone. Currently changing even one of these makes for a disjointed experience. Its already somewhat disjointed as I use Windows. If I change my phone to Android, for one there is no Watch, and secondly, it wont work with the iPad as well. I also lose iMessage. So all things considered, there is simply no alternative at this point. And Apple knows this very well and exploits it.

I've seen the videos comparing ios 10 and ios 11 and why it disproves planned obsolescence. Why is it not surprising ios 12 is faster then ios 10? Ios 9 was faster then ios 8.

Link to the video which shows iOS 11 faster than iOS 10.

I can think of other reasons.

• newer functions that make my life easier better
• new methods
• better display
• dropped my phone, screen shattered and now I want a new one
• newer form factor
• new models have a better look
• newer models have better performance

Where is slowness and planned obsolescence on this list?

Definitely those are factors. But slowness is also a factor. People upgrade when devices become slow. Theres at least 10-15 persons I know who upgraded from 3-4 year old iPhones in the past year because they were slow. Slowness is a consequence of planned obsolescence.

I never denied there were other reasons people upgrade phones. I am saying this is also one of them and speed is a very important factor.
[doublepost=1528652218][/doublepost]

And yet that doesn't mean a malicious conspiracy is behind it.

If their intentions are not malicious, Apple should have no problem restoring all my devices to the performance and battery life I paid for.

 

[FeliApple]

If their intent is noble, why not allow the user to downgrade? I absolutely hate what they did to the home button in iOS 11. I also do not like the small stutters here and there on my older iPhones which happen on iOS 11. All I want is to be able to downgrade to an enjoyable experience. I had to buy an iPhone X because the slowdowns irked me. I am very sensitive to stuttering and performance and coupled with the lack of downgrades, this recent story about how they shipped a throttle for older iPhones without telling anyone makes me doubt their intentions. Why all this secrecy? Were they trying to avoid a recall? Why is Apple the only company incapable of supporting multiple versions?

I perfectly understand adding features compromises performance but why not have the option to choose? I still have a factory image of Android 4.3 Jellybean an OS from 2013 which I use on my Nexus 7. Yes its insecure but it just works fine like it did on Day 1. Google released Android Lollipop which was the iOS 11 of Android to me.It ruined my tablet. But the freedom to downgrade tells me Google's intentions. If that was Apple, Lollipop would be forcibly downloaded and I MUST buy a newer device to escape the lag.

And while on the subject of features, iOS 11 added almost nothing to the iPhone apart from some minor design tweaks. Most of whats added were simply app updates. Why are simple app updates slowing down devices? iOS 12 added more to the iPhone than iOS 11 did to iOS 10 and yet iOS 12 manages to be faster than iOS 11 but iOS 11 is slower than iOS 10.

And as far as why buy devices from a company who screws the user? Answer- Integration. I like the integration between the Watch, iPad, and the iPhone. Currently changing even one of these makes for a disjointed experience. Its already somewhat disjointed as I use Windows. If I change my phone to Android, for one there is no Watch, and secondly, it wont work with the iPad as well. I also lose iMessage. So all things considered, there is simply no alternative at this point. And Apple knows this very well and exploits it.




Link to the video which shows iOS 11 faster than iOS 10.



Definitely those are factors. But slowness is also a factor. People upgrade when devices become slow. Theres at least 10-15 persons I know who upgraded from 3-4 year old iPhones in the past year because they were slow. Slowness is a consequence of planned obsolescence.

I never denied there were other reasons people upgrade phones. I am saying this is also one of them and speed is a very important factor.

Here I have an example for what you're saying. Now, right now, a family member's iPad 4 is on iOS 7 and stuck on recovery mode. It entered it on its own. I can't get out of it, Apple tells me to restore, action which will result in a forcible update to iOS 10. I refuse. The iPad is stuck there, unresponsive, and there's nothing I can do but restore it. I know that. If Apple allowed downgrading, I'd have restored several hours ago. Planned Obsolescence? I don't know. What I do know is that I am being forced to update because of an error, that will unavoidably bring about huge performance hits.

 

[Radon87000]

Here I have an example for what you're saying. Now, right now, a family member's iPad 4 is on iOS 7 and stuck on recovery mode. It entered it on its own. I can't get out of it, Apple tells me to restore, action which will result in a forcible update to iOS 10. I refuse. The iPad is stuck there, unresponsive, and there's nothing I can do but restore it. I know that. If Apple allowed downgrading, I'd have restored several hours ago. Planned Obsolescence? I don't know. What I do know is that I am being forced to update because of an error, that will unavoidably bring about huge performance hits.

Its a problem which will be much more frequent on iPhones as battery needs to be replaced every 3 years or so and Apple will refuse a replacement till its updated to the latest version.

Everytime I ask about a problem, its that same crap about updating the phone, doing a restore. Like it does any good. Its never worked for me

 

[CavemanUK]

For years people have been claiming that “new APIs” and “new features” are causing old phones to slowdown, I’d like to say that that theory is looking less and less believable. After the announcement of iOS 12, it’s more than possible to support older devices using their full potential.

Now that Apple has its PR backs against the wall with the battery throttle scandal, they magically created software capable of faster performance on older phones. This is the first time they have ever done this. Coincidence? I think not.

Apple loves when people update their devices, but they love their brand even more. Now that the brand is under attack, they are doing everything in their power to win over the trust of their consumers. iOS 12 is proof of this.

I don't think this is the first time.. over the years there have been times when Apple takes a year and has a "service release" that optimizes and increases performance without adding a huge amount of extras. Granted this time its more than likely influenced by the throttle scandal but it's not the first time ever.

 

[Radon87000]

I don't think this is the first time.. over the years there have been times when Apple takes a year and has a "service release" that optimizes and increases performance without adding a huge amount of extras. Granted this time its more than likely influenced by the throttle scandal but it's not the first time ever.

This is the first time they explicitly advertised performance improvements for older devices and even provided measurements. The last time was iOS 9. If you will visit their marketing page for iOS 9

https://web.archive.org/web/20151022100331/http://www.apple.com/ios/whats-new/

Under-the-hood refinements bring you more responsive performance, easier updates, better battery life, and tighter security. So your device works that much better — for everything you do with it.

Across the entire operating system, apps and key technologies have been made more efficient to trim battery usage wherever possible — so you get more battery life for the things you do every day. Thanks to ambient light and proximity sensors, your iPhone knows if it’s facedown on the table and prevents the screen from turning on, even when you receive a notification.4 And the new Low Power mode lets you extend your battery life even further.

The apps in iOS 9 now take advantage of Metal, making more efficient use of the CPU and GPU to deliver faster scrolling, smoother animation, and better overall performance. Email, messages, web pages, and PDFs render faster. And multitasking features on iPad feel fluid and natural.

They do not explicitly say performance and battery life has been improved on all devices. Its just a general statement that performance is better.

Whereas on iOS 12

Whether you’re using your iPhone or iPad, iOS has been enhanced for a faster and more responsive experience all around. Things you do all the time, like launching Camera and typing with the keyboard, happen faster than ever. And there are even more significant improvements when you’re doing a lot on your device at once. These enhancements improve performance on all supported devices, going all the way back to iPhone 5s and iPad Air.

Up to 70% faster swipe to Camera
Up to 50%faster keyboard display
Up to 2x faster app launch under heavy workload

Refer the bolded. Its a stronger statement than the one they made with iOS 9. Older devices like the 5s and Air are explicitly referred with data on the improvements.

iOS 12 is the first release in almost a decade which improves performance on older devices. Not a coincidence this came after Throttlegate.

 

[FeliApple]

Its a problem which will be much more frequent on iPhones as battery needs to be replaced every 3 years or so and Apple will refuse a replacement till its updated to the latest version.

Everytime I ask about a problem, its that same crap about updating the phone, doing a restore. Like it does any good. Its never worked for me

Every conversation I have with Apple is: Ok, I have this issue, but my iPhone/iPad is on iOS 9. I am not updating, so help me try something different. I never used restoring as troubleshooting, but being FORCED to use it as troubleshooting? That's a whole new level.

 

[I7guy]

If their intent is noble, why not allow the user to downgrade? I absolutely hate what they did to the home button in iOS 11....

Because downgrading is not their business model. Just like apple ditched the headphone jack and people are still buying their phones.

Apple didn't do anything to the home button in IOS 11. It's been proven on almost every video claiming to show they did.

Link to the video which shows iOS 11 faster than iOS 10.

Let's try this from the other way. Link to a video which "proves" planned obsolescence and then we will dissect it.

...People upgrade when devices become slow. Theres at least 10-15 persons I know who upgraded from 3-4 year old iPhones in the past year because they were slow. Slowness is a consequence of planned obsolescence.

Strawman period along with anecdotal experience. Just because someone claims something doesn't mean it scales up to the masses.

I never denied there were other reasons people upgrade phones. I am saying this is also one of them and speed is a very important factor.

No, you stated it was a major factor, when in reality no one knows why the masses upgrade. All of this has been talked about for the last x years across countless posts and threads.

If their intentions are not malicious, Apple should have no problem restoring all my devices to the performance and battery life I paid for.

You shouldn't have upgraded then. Apple did not force you to upgrade.
[doublepost=1528654922][/doublepost]

iOS 12 is the first release in almost a decade which improves performance on older devices. Not a coincidence this came after Throttlegate.

Not anything that is provable as in a conspiracy theory, except these plans have been in the works for a while.

 

[FeliApple]

You shouldn't have upgraded then. Apple did not force you to upgrade.
[doublepost=1528654922][/doublepost]
Not anything that is provable as in a conspiracy theory, except these plans have been in the works for a while.

Sorry, but they are trying to do that right now, in the example I posted about earlier.