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I wonder if the environment around software development has gotten a little too lax under Craig Federighi and post-Jobs. None of us know what Craig is like to work for, maybe he does run a pretty tight ship, but if we go by his on-stage personality he seems pretty laid back compared to Jobs.

Under Jobs the software guys would have worked under threat of 3AM phone calls over the most minor quirks or problems. Maybe now it's become a little too relaxed and things that would have been called out in the past are let by or pushed down the priority list.
Pretty much my thoughts.As long as brand sells nowadays,Apple no longer gives a damn about the smooth experience which Steve was obsessed with
 
Pretty much my thoughts.As long as brand sells nowadays,Apple no longer gives a damn about the smooth experience which Steve was obsessed with
Yep it's a different company under TC and should be. Thankfully they seem to be on track for lots of new innovative functionality centered around high-performance phones.
 
I've been using iPhones since the very first one, and to be perfectly honest, everything from iOS 7 onwards has been trash.
Trash seems harsh
But I agree to the sentiment
After iOS 7, things just don't seem to be as polished
I don't mean bugs - those are inevitable and were present in the early days.
Design wise, things seem more thought out before iOS 7. Even the littlest design choices made sense. Now, aesthetic design choices supersede and in some cases fully took over from functional design.
 
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I've been using iPhones since the very first one (currently have a 4s, 5, 5s and 2 iPhone 6 in the family), and to be perfectly honest, everything from iOS 7 onwards has been excellent. I don't understand all the incessant whining about iOS 9 when from my perspective, Apple is continuing the positive evolution of the best mobile phone platform out there. The fact that Apple continues to bend over backwards to allow older devices to upgrade to the latest iOS with the critical security fixes is to be commended. Consider the awful fragmentation of the other side, aka. Android. But as always, these are only my opinions (although I suspect there are millions and millions like me...considering the ever increasingly domination of iOS in the marketplace, but that is another discussion). The good news for those who don't like iOS for whatever reason is that you have many other options including running outdated iOS on outdated devices or buying one of those lovely Androids in which case have fun reading the numerous forums blasting battery life, freezes, performance issues, lack of OS updating options, etc.!
 
I've been using iPhones since the very first one, and to be perfectly honest, everything from iOS 7 onwards has been trash.

Yea pretty much. Jony Ive must have been smoking some good **** when he designed ios 7, or some bad ****
 
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3 of the top 10 songs on Billboard's Hot 100 are Justin Bieber songs, so I hope you like his music if you're going to keep responding to complaints with that argument.
We're not discussing JB are we? We are discussing apple and apple products and apple operating systems. Very simple point, one persons opinion may not be the majority opinion. Nothing wrong with that.
 
3 of the top 10 songs on Billboard's Hot 100 are Justin Bieber songs, so I hope you like his music if you're going to keep responding to complaints with that argument.

This is what I hate about the argument of sales numbers and market share. Apple is making more money than ever, selling more phones than ever, but they are achieving it for the wrong reasons and are getting praise for things that are not praiseworthy, in my opinion (of course). I hold Apple to a higher standard, one they don't seem to (want to) achieve anymore. It's great that Apple has become a very influential personal-technology company, but it matters so little when the distinctive qualities that brought it there become diluted.
 
We're not discussing JB are we? We are discussing apple and apple products and apple operating systems. Very simple point, one persons opinion may not be the majority opinion. Nothing wrong with that.
It's called an analogy. Surely if sales mean that something is good, the best selling music would be seen as good music by most people, but obviously, Justin Bieber is one of the most hated things of all time.

Therefore, you telling people who complain about iOS 7-9 being bad with "IT SOLD A LOT SO WHY WOULD IT BE BAD????!!!?11!" makes no sense.
 
Yep it's a different company under TC and should be. Thankfully they seem to be on track for lots of new innovative functionality centered around high-performance phones.
Apple is a different company under Tim Cook and that's not necessarily a good thing. Apple was a one-of-a-kind company under Jobs and now Cook is turning Apple into just another consumer electronics brand.
 
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It's called an analogy. Surely if sales mean that something is good, the best selling music would be seen as good music by most people, but obviously, Justin Bieber is one of the most hated things of all time.

Therefore, you telling people who complain about iOS 7-9 being bad with "IT SOLD A LOT SO WHY WOULD IT BE BAD????!!!?11!" makes no sense.
The analogy would be fine if we were discussing one JB album vs another JB album. But comparing JB to Stravinsky is quite the non-sequitor.
 
Yep it's a different company under TC and should be. Thankfully they seem to be on track for lots of new innovative functionality centered around high-performance phones.

Are you suggesting that the company is now more functionally innovative and more focussed on high-performance phones than under Jobs/Forstal? If so, how do you infer that?
 
Are you suggesting that the company is now more functionally innovative and more focussed on high-performance phones than under Jobs/Forstal? If so, how do you infer that?
Because of the 6s. This phone is what the 6 should have been, just as innovative as the 5s to 5 was.
 
Is that why launch day phones since the 5s have set sales records for the last few years?
Typical apologist defense mechanism: citing sales.

I'm sorry but quantity does not equate to quality whatsoever. I think the reason why Apple has these record sales with the iPhone is because of brand recognition and nothing more. Apple products are deeply ingrained into our culture and the company does have quite a loyal fanbase. It's almost the consumer market equivalent of having senioritis in high school whereas you know you're in the clear and there's nothing more you need to do to prove yourself. People will always buy Apple products regardless of how good or bad they are and Apple has been riding on the success that Jobs laid out but they won't be able to coast forever.
 
Because of the 6s. This phone is what the 6 should have been, just as innovative as the 5s to 5 was.

That doesn't answer my question and raises even more questions on its own.

Is that why launch day phones since the 5s have set sales records for the last few years?

Sales records that were impacted by factors that are not inherent to newer iPhones. Apple has since entered and focussed on China and sees tremendous growth there (they even dedicated the gold iPhones to this market, further improving their position there). The high-end smartphone market is also still growing. Moreover, Apple has again attracted more customers by finally offering bigger iPhones, which is something the market had decided years before Apple followed.

So far the growth of the iPhone is fairly organic to overall market growth and strongly related to antecedent factors. iPhone is also the only high-end alternative to high-end Android phones, which puts Apple in a unique spot. All of this doesn't tell us anything about an improvement in product quality since Jobs passed away.
 
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That doesn't answer my question and raises even more questions on its own.



Sales records that were impacted by factors that are not inherent to newer iPhones. Apple has since entered and focussed on China and sees tremendous growth there. The high-end smartphone market is also still growing. Moreover, Apple has again attracted more customers by finally offering bigger iPhones, which is something the market had decided for years. So far the growth of the iPhone is fairly organic to overall market growth and strongly related to antecedent factors.
What has what you posted have to do with the number of units sold? You have a stock answer; China, financing, antecedent factors? anything to discredit the sales growth amid the changing cell phone landscape. Isn't that what agile and innovative companies do?
 
Isn't that what agile and innovative companies do?

Look again at the context:
You: "Yep it's a different company under TC and should be. Thankfully they seem to be on track for lots of new innovative functionality centered around high-performance phones."
Me: "Are you suggesting that the company is now more functionally innovative and more focussed on high-performance phones than under Jobs/Forstal? If so, how do you infer that?"
You: "Because of the 6s. This phone is what the 6 should have been, just as innovative as the 5s to 5 was." "Is that why launch day phones since the 5s have set sales records for the last few years?"

Again the question: what is it that makes the iPhone more innovative or more high-performance under Tim Cook than under Steve Jobs? Apple had started to focus on China when Jobs was still alive and the iPhones 3GS and 4S were likewise focussed on high performance. All I see is a company that pretty much grows organically along with the developments of the market: more demand in China, more demand in high-end phones, more demand in bigger screens, more demand in alternatives to Android. There isn't a compelling case for something about the iPhone that made it absolutely clear that it could only have happened under Cook.
 
Look again at the context:
You: "Yep it's a different company under TC and should be. Thankfully they seem to be on track for lots of new innovative functionality centered around high-performance phones."
Me: "Are you suggesting that the company is now more functionally innovative and more focussed on high-performance phones than under Jobs/Forstal? If so, how do you infer that?"
You: "Because of the 6s. This phone is what the 6 should have been, just as innovative as the 5s to 5 was." "Is that why launch day phones since the 5s have set sales records for the last few years?"

Again the question: what is it that makes the iPhone more innovative or more high-performance under Tim Cook than under Steve Jobs? Apple had started to focus on China when Jobs was still alive and the iPhones 3GS and 4S were likewise focussed on high performance. All I see is a company that pretty much grows organically along with the developments of the market: more demand in China, more demand in high-end phones, more demand in bigger screens, more demand in alternatives to Android. There isn't a compelling case for something about the iPhone that made it absolutely clear that it could only have happened under Cook.
Let's try it again; Why do you think it's not more innovative. What's the purpose of even mentioning China? That is normal business in 2015, China as a consumer these days?
 
Sale numbers/records are also marketing. There are various ways to affect those. One can play with regions, sell from stock to stock etc.
 
Let's try it again; Why do you think it's not more innovative. What's the purpose of even mentioning China? That is normal business in 2015, China as a consumer these days?

No, that's not how it works. You implied (and confirmed) that the company is now more innovative and more focussed on high-performance phones. I asked you why you think that. You inferred that from sales records, which I refuse to accept as an argument, because sales records are not inherent to Tim Cook's leadership of Apple, but are strongly intertwined with industry-wide developments in China and elsewhere. When you say this, I could easily claim that the same would have happened under Jobs and your argument would fall apart. In any case, sales numbers have nothing to do with what you claimed in the first place. What makes Apple relatively more innovative and focussed in high-performance phones under Cook than under Jobs?
 
No, that's not how it works. You implied (and confirmed) that the company is now more innovative and more focussed on high-performance phones. I asked you why you think that. You inferred that from sales records, which I refuse to accept as an argument, because sales records are not inherent to Tim Cook's leadership of Apple, but are strongly intertwined with industry-wide developments in China and elsewhere. When you say this, I could easily claim that the same would have happened under Jobs and your argument would fall apart. In any case, sales numbers have nothing to do with what you claimed in the first place. What makes Apple relatively more innovative and focussed in high-performance phones under Cook than under Jobs?
Well to start the a9 and 2 gig and the a9x plus pencil plus 3D Touch plus live pictures plus the iPad pro.
 
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