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geta

macrumors 68000
May 18, 2010
1,602
1,394
The Moon
Since iPadOS is limited, the latest M1 iPad Pro (special the 12.9”) are waste of money, unless you need it for specific task/app.
Even with MK, it cant be computer replacement, unless your usage are very basic.
 

MajorFubar

macrumors 68020
Oct 27, 2021
2,174
3,826
Lancashire UK
Since iPadOS is limited, the latest M1 iPad Pro (special the 12.9”) are waste of money, unless you need it for specific task/app.
Even with MK, it cant be computer replacement, unless your usage are very basic.
I'd mostly agree except I'd change 'very basic' for 'requires, or is significantly enhanced by, the inherent touch-screen interface'. That's where the iPad excels over the Mac.
For every other task the Mac KO's it.
 
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Mackilroy

macrumors 601
Jun 29, 2006
4,053
898
It's no real surprise that apps like ProCreate obviously benefit from something with a touch-interface, to be fair. They're designed for it. I've not seen Shapr3D. But I have seen Ferrite: it's strictly amateur-grade, on par with the free 'Cakewalk by Bandlab' on PCs.

iPad Pro hardware has the power to run pro-grade apps like the full version of Office, Adobe Suite, Logic, Final Cut, ProTools, and so on. So why are they just not there? For the money you can spend on one, they should be an option.

I don't consider my phone to be at all competing with a desktop computer, it's almost apples an oranges, whereas Apple are literally advertising iPads as computer replacements.
That’s as much up to the people writing software as it is to Apple. Look at Office on macOS versus Windows for years - while the capability was there, Microsoft didn’t take advantage of it.

Further, for a huge number of people, tablets can replace laptops or desktops. Just as most people don’t need the power of a desktop, which is why laptop sales boomed. People here are a niche, not the norm.
 

mjs916

macrumors 6502a
Apr 1, 2018
823
1,000
Sacramento, CA
Yeah I agree although I have both an iPad mini and Pro, I just feel like Apple are really letting the iPad down at the moment especially the Pro models, and as each year passes it’s getting harder and harder for people to justify the price tag of the pros.

Even reviewers are advising getting quality refurbished 2018 iPad Pro models to this day, now that is concerning considering that device is nearing 4 years old now…

that’s the equivalent to being recommended to buy the iPhone X or XS over the current gen iPhone, or the Apple Watch series 4 over the current gen… something which is seldom recommended at this point.
I watched a video my Max Tech (I think that’s the name of the channel) where he says he’s be selling his iMac Pro.

I don’t own an iPad and haven’t since the 3rd Gen (what a?that became 2 years later).

Anyway, I was surprised to hear that they are still artificially limiting the devices for various tasks while implying that they can do it all. You can check out the video here:
 
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UBS28

macrumors 68030
Oct 2, 2012
2,893
2,340
I rarely use my iPad too. The 16” M1 Max MBP is basically better at everything except for stuff that requires the Apple pencil.

I have it as a supporting device in the end.
 
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arvinsim

macrumors 6502a
May 17, 2018
823
1,143
The problem with running MacOS on iPad, is that if you do that, it'll basically turn into a laptop with touchscreen and detachable keyboard. The problem with Microsoft's attempts at making a one-for-all OS that run on both desktop and tablet, is that touchscreen UI becomes an afterthought. So you get a so-so laptop (because detachable or foldable keyboard just isn't as good as a regular laptop keyboard), and a so-so tablet (because software isn't optimized for tablet). If Apple put MacOS on the iPad, the iPad will also turn into a so-so laptop and a so-so tablet. Unless they allow it to switch to iOS when in tablet mode.

I had hoped that with time, Apple would be able to grow iOS into a system that is as full-featured and powerful as MacOS, but with touch interface. However, they seem to have stalled. I think one reason is the physical limitations of the tablet form. Like, if I'm editing a complex document, I want a bigger screen than even the biggest iPad Pro. I don't like doing that on a laptop even. I want a full-size desktop monitor. I suspect that's the case with a lot of professional computer work -- they are best done on a full-size monitor. And while there are people who want/need to do that kind of work on the go, as people have been saying, the laptop already fulfills that need, and so there's little incentive for developers to port professional apps to the touchscreen interface. I suspect that's why even Apple hasn't yet gotten around to making iPad versions of their professional apps.
Eh, that can be solved by having iPads have proper support for external monitors
 
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James Godfrey

macrumors 68020
Oct 13, 2011
2,068
1,710
I watched a video my Max Tech (I think that’s the name of the channel) where he says he’s be selling his iMac Pro.

I don’t own an iPad and haven’t since the 3rd Gen (what a?that became 2 years later).

Anyway, I was surprised to hear that they are still artificially limiting the devices for various tasks while implying that they can do it all. You can check out the video here:
I am sure Apple lifted the limits of RAM per app after user complaints, not sure though.

The issue is Apple do not want the iPad to do more, they want it to be limited as they want you to need a Mac too, yeah some people will get by with just an iPad, but many of those users will run into occasions where they still require a desktop or laptop of some kind unfortunately.

If Apple created a unique OS for iPad or allowed it to boot into MacOS I can guarantee their Mac sales would plummet, and with how much they have invested into the Mac recently I doubt they will want anything eating into those Mac sales anytime soon.

For iPadOS I expect minor improvements and refinements for at least the next 5 years with nothing revolutionary coming to the table.
 
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prospervic

macrumors 65816
Aug 2, 2007
1,154
1,433
NYC
Since iPadOS is limited, the latest M1 iPad Pro (special the 12.9”) are waste of money, unless you need it for specific task/app.
Even with MK, it cant be computer replacement, unless your usage are very basic.
For me, iPadOS is not limited because of the many awesome iPad-dedicated apps (Luma Fusion, ProCreate, etc.) I use, and also because I’m NOT trying to make into a desktop OS. That’s what my Mac is for!
 

Mackilroy

macrumors 601
Jun 29, 2006
4,053
898
For me, iPadOS is not limited because of the many awesome iPad-dedicated apps (Luma Fusion, ProCreate, etc.) I use, and also because I’m NOT trying to make into a desktop OS. That’s what my Mac is for!
I can sympathize with the people who want to replace all of their devices with one machine. Perhaps down the line Apple will do so themselves. I do like the simplicity of the iPad, though, and that it isn’t trying to be all devices to all people. I hear some people like Samsung’s DeX mode, but overall reviews of it seem mixed.
 

Unami

macrumors 65816
Jul 27, 2010
1,446
1,725
Austria
For me, the ipad has a place. I like carrying it around for reading, photo editing with the apple pen, playing games, websurfing, it's my main e-mail machine and I sometimes use it for writing texts - which is fine as long as you don't have to look things up in other apps.

Basically, it's a better, mobile addition to my iphone for those things. I don't like doing them on a small phone screen, and I like my phone to have a small footprint when I put it into my trousers' pockets.

I wouldn't want to pull out and fold apart a laptop when I'm just reading on the subway, and as a video-editor I need a powerful desktop anyway for "real" work. Also, a laptop would still be bigger, the 10" ipad fits perfectly into a man-purse or even large coat-pockets.

I hardly ever run into hardware limitations on the ipad - the little video-editing you can do on it works fine on the air3. Only some audio-apps would benefit from the greater amount of RAM the pro offers.

But again, it's the software. While you can do some work on the iPad, you usually have to jump through hoops to do it and it takes about double the time than doing it on a mac with proper software. So, while I'm glad that it enables me to do some work on it in case of an emergency (e.g. while on vacation), it's just not feasible as a work machine for most cases, because as a professional, time equals money.
 
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ddhhddhh2

macrumors regular
Jun 2, 2021
242
374
Taipei
The iPad has always been a rather confusing product for me. In the early days, it wasn't good enough, maybe the equivalent of a cell phone with a larger screen. But years after iPad was launched, I bought the first generation of iPad Air.
For a long time, I didn't use it very much. Although the screen was bigger, it was still a bit heavy, and the kids liked to surf and watch youtube with it, so I banned them from using it in bed. Now, it's still in my living room, and occasionally someone will pick it up and slide it around a few times, or say: zero battery.
However, I am excited about the iPad Mini that came out last year. Although I am a developer and I always dream of a large iPad Pro that can completely replace a desktop or laptop, the reality is that you can never do any good development work with an iPad Pro.
The solutions are always varied, but mostly impractical. The most ridiculous solution is to connect remotely to your home or work computer. iPad Pro is just a display terminal, yes, purely for terminal use.
Yes I admit that was quite creative, considering its price, the iPad Pro should not be used as a terminal only, not to mention you need to buy more peripherals for it to be a competent terminal.
And unfortunately, my colleague's iPad Pro is bent and she laughs and says, "Look, I can bend it back .... This makes me so unsure about the iPad Pro that I won't consider any larger iPads.
However, I was quite excited by the iPad Mini last year, and before that my girlfriend bought a new iPad Air. She loves paint as much as I do, so she also bought an apple pencel 2, and now she prefers to create with the iPad Air than with my Wacom. For the same reason I do, she doesn't like the large size of the ipad Pro (I thought every woman likes the large size). I tried her ipad Air. + AP2 and had a good experience, except for certain apps, I can almost say it can replace my Wacom.
So I paid quite a bit of attention to the iPad Mini that was released last year, yes, even though I later learned that it has some flaws, such as jelly, I don't care much and I can say that I am not affected at all. And in recent years, I started to get used to using e-books, as mentioned before, my first generation ipad Air is quite old, the system is not updated and slow, even the kids don't use it much anymore. But the new iPad Mini has a much larger screen in a similar size, and the texture is quite good.
Finally, after the iPad Mini6 was released for a while, I decided to buy it again, this time I also bought the AP2, now I like to use it to read e-books, occasionally I use it to draw something, and it's easy to hold it in one hand while lying in bed surfing.
So, in the end, I think the ipad can only be a "small device with some additional professional use", and specific people can rely on it as a professional tool, but for me, even the iPad Pro can't replace a desktop or laptop.
I had so much hope that I could replace it, but then I knew it was impossible for the simple reason that Apple's interests were at stake, so I gave up on the idea. While my colleague doesn't have this problem because he doesn't use an ipad and uses Microsoft devices, and in a way, that's enviable.
In the end, most of the people who were disappointed with the iPad Pro, like me, expected it to be a productivity tool, replacing a desktop or laptop, high performance, a board to take with you wherever you want to go, but as we all know now, Apple said: No, you can't use it that way, even now that it has an M processor, it still can't.
So that's the main reason I haven't considered the larger iPad so far, because I know I'll be disappointed, but for other uses, the smaller size, the iPad is quite competent.
 

EPO75

Suspended
Oct 12, 2016
162
167
Rotterdam
I have the first gen iPad Pro 11 inch, which is now about 3,5 years old. I LOVE IT! It’s great for browsing on the coach, great to take it on a journey and do simple tasks. Great for movies in the Airplane.
It is too small anyways for it to be it a real pc, that was never the reason for me to buy it and Apple never advertised it as such a product. I love Pro Motion, using the pencil also and faceID. F* touchID and 60hz screens. Yeah it is not cheap but neither am I.
I also have a iPhone 13 Pro Max but not gonna browse on that screen if there is an iPad. Also have a Air for work in the office and a Mini for work at home. Anyways I love my iPad, waiting for one with Oled or Mini-Led will do also.
 
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saudor

macrumors 68000
Jul 18, 2011
1,512
2,115
For iPadOS I expect minor improvements and refinements for at least the next 5 years with nothing revolutionary coming to the table.
The problem with iPad is a lack of proper competitors. Apple is basically doing what Intel did when they were #1 and AMD couldn't even catch up with their FX CPUs. No real need to improve and especially if it potentially takes away from mac sales as someone mentioned. It's because of AMD Ryzen that we finally got something more than 4 core/8 threads after almost a decade of stagnation.

If the iphone was in a similar position - we'd still have 3.5" iphones and no other options.
 

iPadified

macrumors 68020
Apr 25, 2017
2,014
2,257
I dont think this is the case.

If i want to paint something or make fast Notes in a meeting the ipad ist way better.
If i want to build a presentation or work with excel or a scientifici document in word, the laptop is the way to go.

And i think thats what annoys many people. The iPad would be capable of working with full-scale Desktop Apps, but Apple DECIDES that the software will not run on an ipad.

Apple is trying to keep a hard gap between a full scale OS and iOS, and i really dont see the point anymore.

Ofc there is an obvious one: Money. Apple would sell fewer Laptops if the iPad could run Desktop Apps and had a better file Manager and could be more customized. I really think thats the only reason why we dont have a Mac OS running on an iPad.

(If they would release something like that, my Windows-Laptop and Desktop would have a hard time and the 12.9" iPad Pro would be a nobrainer for me)
Why would Apple block that the desktop version of Office is put on the iPad? They have no influence on that at all. Office on iPad is sufficient to write a scientific manuscript for publication in journal. The reason is that Mendeley has got a plugin so references can be managed in a good way! Equation many graphs cannot be efficiently be produce in the desktop office app for Mac anyway. Someday I will write an entire research proposal or scientific manuscript non iPad and share the experience. Biggest issue is like the small screen.
 

Starscape

macrumors 6502
Sep 23, 2016
345
503
Florida and New York
I rely on my iPad Pro 11 (2020) everyday and like my previous iPad Pro 9.7, it is regularly used in a pretty harsh environment (out on the ocean for hours, south Florida heat/sun, salt spray often) and they have never let me down. For what it does, it's irreplaceable, however, sometimes the extra run-around steps that need to be done for what should be very simple and quick tasks gets very frustrating.

I very much wish Apple would really unleash the hardware, but they won't. I could understand why, but there are some very basic needs that have no excuse for not being present - such as real multitasking. For example, when I am encoding a video, I have to keep the app open and wait until it's finished before I can move on to something else. That is extremely frustrating, especially since the hardware could very easily handle it.

Apple just adds very basic functionality in very small drips. We all celebrate when, after more than a decade of development, iOS finally allows widgets on the home screen. Last year Apple was advertising the iPad as a computer, and it is, though obviously not in the Windows/Mac sense. I won't be upgrading to an M1 iPad next year unless Apple adds significant functionality to the iPad.
 

AppZ.Zero

macrumors member
Nov 29, 2021
99
244
Why would Apple block that the desktop version of Office is put on the iPad?
Why wouldnt Apple allow the Desktop Version on the ipad? It's the same Chip. the same underlying OS, it would be easily possible to just let Users run Desktop Apps.
 

Starscape

macrumors 6502
Sep 23, 2016
345
503
Florida and New York
Why wouldnt Apple allow the Desktop Version on the ipad? It's the same Chip. the same underlying OS, it would be easily possible to just let Users run Desktop Apps.

I think Apple wants to keep the iPad and Macbooks clearly delineated. I feel the same way about Photoshop on iOS, which i feel is so far off in terms of functionality compared to its desktop counterpart, that it shouldn't even be called Photoshop,.
 

MajorFubar

macrumors 68020
Oct 27, 2021
2,174
3,826
Lancashire UK
That’s as much up to the people writing software as it is to Apple.
Only in part. Currently the OS is too basic and inflexible to effectively run the pro-grade apps I listed. So that's an Apple thing.

Look at Office on macOS versus Windows for years - while the capability was there, Microsoft didn’t take advantage of it.
That's was as much an MS marketing decision to look after its own interests, as any thing else.
Further, for a huge number of people, tablets can replace laptops or desktops. Just as most people don’t need the power of a desktop, which is why laptop sales boomed. People here are a niche, not the norm.
I'd go further and say most people get away with using just a phone these days.

Maybe it's a catch-22: developers of Mac/PC pro-grade productivity apps won't develop iPad equivalents because they don't think there's a market because of the iPad's image as a media consumption device that you can draw pretty pictures on with a pencil. Professional creators won't switch from Mac/PC to an iPad because the apps they're trained to use don't exist on iPadOS. If that's the case then Apple can help to break the deadlock by bringing its pro-grade productivity software to the iPad. But for that to happen iPadOS needs a full overhaul, which I don't think they'll do because they don't want to blur the lines further between iPadOS vs MacOS.
 
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Sword86

macrumors 6502
Oct 6, 2012
345
163
I think Apple wants to keep the iPad and Macbooks clearly delineated. I feel the same way about Photoshop on iOS, which i feel is so far off in terms of functionality compared to its desktop counterpart, that it shouldn't even be called Photoshop,.
I agree. I bought the Gen 9 iPad recently for the convenience, but will always own a computer. (Currently a 2020 MBA i5 which I have decided to replace in the next year or so) Anything intensive requires trotting out the laptop. I couldn’t live with just an iPad. S
 
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thejadedmonkey

macrumors G3
May 28, 2005
9,240
3,499
Pennsylvania
Maybe it's a catch-22: developers of Mac/PC pro-grade productivity apps won't develop iPad equivalents because they don't think there's a market because of the iPad's image as a media consumption device that you can draw pretty pictures on with a pencil. Professional creators won't switch from Mac/PC to an iPad because the apps they're trained to use don't exist on iPadOS. If that's the case then Apple can help to break the deadlock by bringing its pro-grade productivity software to the iPad. But for that to happen iPadOS needs a full overhaul, which I don't think they'll do because they don't want to blur the lines further between iPadOS vs MacOS.
Nahh, it's 100% Apple's insistence on the app store. As long as everything has to be "blessed" by Apple, and Apple insists on keeping it closed off, as well as limited in I/O, it can't be anything except a content consumption device.

Who cares how fast it can render something with an m1 CPU in it, if you can't get your media from a portable HDD into an editing app, and then into a grading app, and then an animation app, before exporting it back to a NAS, without having to suffer through USB 2.0 transfer speeds.

And before anyone gives me a hypothetical scenario where you can do this, my point is that Apple makes it as hard as possible to do this sort of workflow, so that when you need to work you instinctually pick up the mac, or a PC, or even a Surface, but not an iPad.

I think, with the pencil everywhere, Apple's getting on the right track, but they still need to overhaul the Files app, as well as how apps interact with the file system.
 

MajorFubar

macrumors 68020
Oct 27, 2021
2,174
3,826
Lancashire UK
IMO Apple need to do something to facilitate the unleashing of the power of the iPad. For all the multitude of reasons listed in this thread, and no doubt others, the iPad with an M1 processor is a powerful sportscar currently limited to being driven in a 20-zone.
 
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