iPhone X Is the latest wave of attacks on iPhones and iPhone byers orchestrated?

[44267547]

In post #62 I explained how Apple has reduced value to the customer by changing from a 1 iPhone for everyone to a multiple phone with features withheld for up-sell company..

I truthfully don't think you know what force upsell even means. It's mainly taken out of context in the sense that you just don't agree with Apples strategy and they are in a position where they want consumers To have options. ,

However just to reiterate to the other readers, the following listed below is what you refuse to answer these questions, yet, you keep using wiggle room to not have to answer the questions for whatever reason. :

You didn't answer this:

Why does one iPhone have to be able to be for 'everyone'? Do you really think one iPhone because its priced at a much higher dollar that has to be for everyone? .

In post #64 you initiated a straw-man argument by stating, "Why does one iPhone have to be able to be for 'everyone'?".

And you deflected from These questions:

Apple doesn't have to be a one phone company and why should they? They have other offerings in their lineup that some consumers may or may not care about certain features, which leads me to question do consumers even utilize all the features that an iPhone has? Doubtful.

In post #65 I reaffirmed my original statement which is that Apple went from 1 iPhone to many phones with features withheld..

You didn't reaffirm anything, as indicating for a third time, you didn't answer these questions either:

Referencing the bolded in your post, hasn't that been iterated three different times now? And I think it's fairly evident Apple isn't just a 'One phone company', why should they be?

I am stopping you from committing straw-man arguments by keeping the discussion on topic. The core problem is you cannot admit I am right because that would force you to admit that you were wrong.

You seem to be conflating strawman argument versus legitimate questions actually asked of you. This is not about right or wrong, this is about discussion and what others beliefs are as well but the problem is that you fail to acknowledge anyone else's opinions.

The reality is, I'm interested in actual discussion, yet You want to push semantics and off-topic frivolous points versus discussion of actual substance. Unfortunately, the discussion really can't go any further as others have already indicated to you. If you Decide to reply, I find it be helpful if you would actually reply to the questions asked of you that I clearly highlighted in this post.

You have no intention of ever admitting that I am correct because it contradicts your viewpoint.

Actually , this doesn't make any sense. Because you're not contradicting anything by not answering any questions. You're just going off your on tangents, which is fine, but it doesn't help for the sake that your obstructing everyone else's questions asked of you.

However, back to the original point, Apple offering diversity doesn't necessarily hinder this company from having to be anything less than being a one phone company. Having an iPhone priced at $400 and all the way to $1000, it gives the consumers options in between. I don't see anything wrong with that. And, it's not expected for Apple to be the same company they were over 10 years ago.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Nope this is all apple's doing yet, the feeding frenzy is partly due to people hating to see an organization continially succeed. Just look at how people hated the Yankees back when they were winning all the superbowls or the Patriots winning the world series or vice versa

Seriously it seems like human nature to start rooting against the dominant player in a given field. Apple isn't helping itself with the missteps that occurred in 2017

But much of the criticism towards Apple in the last two months has been from their own customers. It would be counterproductive to hope they fail. I’d like to see them do poorly to a lesser degree to force prices back down. I want better products at the price level we’ve become accustomed to. I hate seeing lazy products at super premium prices and being told how wonderful it is, it if we don’t like it but a crap cheap phone instead. It’s unrealistic.

 

[newellj]

Some people will always be unhappy with a new product, sure, but this seems different. Many members didn’t like the new MacBook keyboards or the USB-C ports either and they returned their notebooks, but I don’t remember anyone calling other users to return theirs. This is a first, since I’m here.

I respect you as a very level-headed person and think you raise a good question, but I really think it's just the usual mass-hysteria that prevails here.

I do think the difference between how the Samsung Note 7 situation, which could be actually life-threatening, and the "throttle-gate" situation, have played out is very interesting, however. Apple is being pilloried for dealing with electrical engineering issues. Samsung got away with actual threats to life and safety.

 

[ToroidalZeus]

I find more value in knowing that I have a range of phones to choose from. Rather than it being a one size fits all.

Question: Has Apple changed from a 1 size fits all company?
Answer: I rather have more options.

Real Answer: Yes, Apple has changed or No, Apple has not changed [insert supporting evidence].

It's a straw-man argument and the real Mr. Spock would never commit this common logical fallacy.

snip

Look, I'm not going to respond to these logical fallacies. Yes or No, has Apple changed? That was my original post and I still have not gotten a straight answer out of you. I don't understand how you think I will address any of your straw-man arguments if you can't even give me the decency to answer my point directly. Don't waste my time reading that text and don't waste your time writing that text.

 

[Shanghaichica]

Question: Has Apple changed from a 1 size fits all company?
Answer: I rather have more options.

Real Answer: Yes, Apple has changed or No, Apple has not changed [insert supporting evidence].

It's a straw-man argument and the real Mr. Spock would never commit this common logical fallacy.



Look, I'm not going to respond to these logical fallacies. Yes or No, has Apple changed? That was my original post and I still have not gotten a straight answer out of you. I don't understand how you think I will address any of your straw-man arguments if you can't even give me the decency to answer my point directly. Don't waste my time reading that text and don't waste your time writing that text.

It’s called evolution. No company can stay the same and expect to stay succesful. Markets don’t stay static. Blackberry did this and look where they are now.

 

[Newtons Apple]

It seems like this year there’s been more haters coming out of the woodwork than usual.

Society has become so polarized. Used to be, if you did not agree, you were not liked now you are hated and they want to kill you!

 

[ToroidalZeus]

It’s called evolution. No company can stay the same and expect to stay succesful. Markets don’t stay static. Blackberry did this and look where they are now.

It's called straw-man arguments which is a logical fallacy.

See here is the problem. I have no problem discussing how Apple as changed and why. In fact that's the next logical set in the conversation. But to get there we need to first admit (explicit state) that they have changed. And both you and @Relentless Power are deflecting that acknowledgment.... because the conversation will then go into a direction that is against your current beliefs or values. To a place where you might have to admit that you are wrong.

 

[DNichter]

I think Apple haters will always be the loudest on these forums. I still don't quite understand why so many Android users flock to an Apple forum to bash everything about Apple and their users. I suppose they just don't have much of a life outside of this, so they feel big and tough behind a screen and a keyboard. That's all it is though, no conspiracy. They get off on feeling like they somehow got over on Apple or its fans, when in reality Apple or the people that are happy with their iPhone, could care less. Apple is a business, they don't owe you anything, and will always be that way. If you like the products, awesome, you should buy one. If you don't, great, there are plenty of other options.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

It seems like this year there’s been more haters coming out of the woodwork than usual.

There’s disgruntled iPhone users in the mix now whereas in previous years it was just anti Apple people being negative.

‘Haters’ is a bit misleading as this suggests Apples own customers fall into this category which would be weird.

 

[sparky08]

Back to the OP's point.

I don't think it's a coordinated effort. I think the $1000 price point really hurt. Apple needed a home run to justify breaking the $1K barrier. Many don't feel that it did.

I think the virtual home button would have been that "Big Wow" feature. The Home Button is what made the iPhone distinctive. And super easy to use. My dad (in his 80's) knows to press the home button on his phone/iPad to get back to a known position. I can't picture him using an X.

 

[newellj]

Yes, but call one of them out- with provable facts- and see what the moderators here do to you.

The moderators here are part of the problem- probably because the craposts drive more traffic.

(Now watch me get suspended or banned for saying the truth here)

Perhaps, but they definitely tolerate the astroturfing. This place is filthy with it. And it’s east to spot.

If you're going to label posts here as astroturfing, you really need to substantiate that claim. Let's see your provable facts.

 

[DNichter]

Back to the OP's point.

I don't think it's a coordinated effort. I think the $1000 price point really hurt. Apple needed a home run to justify breaking the $1K barrier. Many don't feel that it did.

I think the virtual home button would have been that "Big Wow" feature. The Home Button is what made the iPhone distinctive. And super easy to use. My dad (in his 80's) knows to press the home button on his phone/iPad to get back to a known position. I can't picture him using an X.

The gesture UI might be my favorite thing about the X. I wouldn't want to go back to the home button, certainly not a virtual one. Successfully transitioning a home button centric UI that we have used for years to a gesture based UI is probably the biggest innovation of the X.

 

[anitak1982]

My cousin just sold her iphone 7 to go to android because of Apple admitting to throttling. I tried to convince her that I have never noticed a difference with my older apple products in their speed. I am still letting my grandsons use my old 5C. They play games and watch youtube on it. I have yet to see any throttling personally. I am still all about Apple.

 

[maflynn]

My cousin just sold her iphone 7 to go to android because of Apple admitting to throttling.

Android is not perfect, they have an issue where the phones bog down over time, so the net effect is similar.

 

[Puddled]

Android is not perfect, they have an issue where the phones bog down over time, so the net effect is similar.

That isn't quite correct is it?

Androids, like all computers, become gummed up and fragmented. This is a well understood phenomenon of having an open OS. A simple reset clears out the goo and like every pc on the planet, performance is restored.

Absolutel not really the same thing.

 

[boltjames]

But much of the criticism towards Apple in the last two months has been from their own customers. It would be counterproductive to hope they fail. I’d like to see them do poorly to a lesser degree to force prices back down. I want better products at the price level we’ve become accustomed to. I hate seeing lazy products at super premium prices and being told how wonderful it is, it if we don’t like it but a crap cheap phone instead. It’s unrealistic.

You keep saying this over and over again. Let's have the detail please. Here, here's a template. Show us the Top 10 market shake-up's and next level features coming from Android that we iPhone users are missing out on:

1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.

Detail. Enough with the boiler plate generalities. Detail. Top 10 Next-Level Features. Show us what's so 'lazy' about Apple by telling us what so innovative and special about Android. Go.

 

[brian3uk]

I think people are waking up to the fact the the overall iPhone experience hasn't changed much to necessitate the yearly upgrade. The fact that the home screen hasn't changed is baffling. The bloat in imessage and overall inconsistent design is frustrating. The music app is gross. People are tired of chasing a "new device high" and being let down. Just my two cents.

 

[AlphaGuitarist]

I think Apple haters will always be the loudest on these forums. I still don't quite understand why so many Android users flock to an Apple forum to bash everything about Apple and their users. I suppose they just don't have much of a life outside of this, so they feel big and tough behind a screen and a keyboard. That's all it is though, no conspiracy. They get off on feeling like they somehow got over on Apple or its fans, when in reality Apple or the people that are happy with their iPhone, could care less. Apple is a business, they don't owe you anything, and will always be that way. If you like the products, awesome, you should buy one. If you don't, great, there are plenty of other options.

What really gets me are the overzealous Samsung fans calling Apple users "sheep". Pot, meet kettle.

 

[maflynn]

That isn't quite correct is it?

Why is that not correct, you're agreeing with me that android does get bogged down.

like all computers, become gummed up and fragmented.

Not for nothing, but unlike windows, my Mac doesn't get bogged down, likewise iOS, so I don't think it's an issue with all computers/devices.

 

[sparky08]

The gesture UI might be my favorite thing about the X. I wouldn't want to go back to the home button, certainly not a virtual one.

I wish Apple would have figured it out so people could have a choice.

 

[DNichter]

I wish Apple would have figured it out so people could have a choice.

Figured what out?

 

[AlphaGuitarist]

Android is not perfect, they have an issue where the phones bog down over time, so the net effect is similar.

Here's an interesting Note 8 review, published by Android Central, a highly reputable Android blog. The author of the review wrote it after having used the phone for 3 months. This specific paragraph directly pertains to your statement:

"The styling and features not jiving with my personal tastes are one thing, but I've been seriously underwhelmed once again with how the Note 8's speed has held up after a few months of installing apps and loading it up with data. Precisely as I experienced after three months with my Galaxy S8, the Note 8's daily performance has started to slow. Most things I do are quick and smooth, but there are still far too many instances now where apps hang up just a few beats before launching or scrolling, or animations stutter and drop frames."

https://www.androidcentral.com/samsung-galaxy-note-8-review-three-months

 

[boltjames]

I think people are waking up to the fact the the overall iPhone experience hasn't changed much to necessitate the yearly upgrade. The fact that the home screen hasn't changed is baffling. The bloat in imessage and overall inconsistent design is frustrating. The music app is gross. People are tired of chasing a "new device high" and being let down. Just my two cents.

So tell us what your solutions are please. We're Apple people. Very few of us know anything of the Android world.

The Home Screen "hasn't changed" you say. So what's missing? For many of us coming from the 6 to the X for the first time we have 3D Touch which is a major win to a secondary layer of time-saving shortcuts, we have Folders, we have a clock and status indicators....where is Apple missing the boat?

Bloat in iMessage you say. What bloat? On my X iMessage is incredibly fast and anything but bloated and slow. Where is Apple going wrong and bloated?

The Music app is gross you say. Why? How is someone else's better? Do people actually use a Music app anymore with Siri ("play the new Maroon 5 LP") or Spotlight search just a swipe away? Where is Apple wrong?

My experience with these elements you criticize is completely different than yours. Please shed some light.

 

[HallStevenson]

I used Android phones for 7+ years and am now using my first iPhone. My wife and daughter have iPhones, youngest daughter got an iPod Touch for Christmas, bought our daughter (the one with an iPhone) a Macbook Air for her birthday, I have a Macbook Air and use an iMac at work. When Apple does something stupid (in my opinion), I will call them out. What's sad is there are some people who are incapable of being critical of Apple, no matter what. No company is perfect and if people accept Apple's way of doing things or their explanation of something as gospel, well, since I can't say anything nice, I won't say anything at all....

 

[Archer1440]

If you're going to label posts here as astroturfing, you really need to substantiate that claim. Let's see your provable facts.

I can give you at least three specific examples, but not without consequences from the moderators. They have decreed that topic off limits.