Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Is the new Mac Pro a failure?
- Thread starter ZombiePhysicist
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
- Status
Try hooked on phonics? Ok, a little mean, but really?!? you need a translation?
Few... You mean hundreds of workstations, yes. And I work for one of the major energy engineering firm in the world and we do upgrade workstation because it bloody make sense to do it and not waste investors money.
Exclusive News! Since the opening of Star Wars movie, Master Yoda stated this, "I sense a dark presence in the mac world forces...yes, indeed, I see. Jedi mac users we are, yes, do not go to the dark side of the mac force! Beward....it can twist your mind like Darth Vader who fell to the dark side of the mac due to pride...and whatever knowledge he had. Forseen I have among Jedi Mac Users...war they shall see...beware! Jedi Mac users we are, yes, types of mac weapon we use...matter not. Jedi mac user can't adapt....gone to the dark side....like.....vader."
In my 25 years working for a major computer manufacturer with large corporate customers I have never heard of any of them even upgrading RAM in their PCs or workstations never mind swapping out disks or graphics cards. The systems are basically disposable they get used for three years then replaced. It's just too much time & hassle & a support nightmare to deviate from the corporate standard.
Upgrading computers is something that only hobbyists or very low end cash strapped businesses do.
Your company does not speak for the majority of companies who don't upgrade their computers on a regular basis.
So YOU find it rare. You speak for everyone? Do you speak for 50% of everyone? 25%? 5%, 1%?, .0001%?
You've worked at every company in every department in each one? What about 50% of them? 25%? 5%? .00001%?
And neither do you speak for anybody else buddy...
In my 25 years of working in small startups to Fortune 100 companies along with side consulting I see upgrades every day. Memory being the most prevalent. Just helped a small business owner upgrade the CPU in his Thinkstation over the summer.
Oh, and answer me this: Who do you think all those upgrades that are available everywhere are being sold to? Landfills?
I've been working for Oil Industry (I'm engineer if you didn't aware) since 2000, I've been at BP, Aramco, PDVSA, and NONE OF THEM UPGRADE NOTHING, Just Replace at Age, sometimes they use to get extended warranties (on manufacturer basis, according internal stats), and the only exception maybe Aramco years ago replaced their Hard drives before a trojan deleted all the corporate data, but this was a contingency not a planned upgrade.
BP, ARAMCO, PDVSA (at least) use workstations to do calculations on Well Profiling (pointing out where is the oil), the most powerful workstations are used on this, also supercomputers, neither the supercomputers are upgraded, besides failing parts they retire systems as they got it.
You said something true here, the most common upgrade at corporate is memory, because most IT departments use to underestimate the systems requirements along the life cycle and some OS upgrades (win 8 a.e) just enforce expand memory, besides that other components are rare to upgrade, also HDD are uncommon to upgrade, most dead inside the original system, and by far is more common to repalce a dead Spinner HDD than to upgrade, also GPU upgrades are the strangest thing I've heard. Until now I've see GPU upgrades only from DIYers and very small companies managed by DIYers minds.
Its my time to said, you speak only by yourself.
Case in point that Nigelbb & I were just talking about. Small business owners & independent free lancers would be the ones upgrading more on a regular basis then medium companies & corporations. In fact upgrading a CPU would be the least upgraded for enterprise besides a few specialty type scenarios. More then likely upgrading a CPU would not be considered an end user replaceable part while still in warrantee. And definitely not on a wide scale in an enterprise environment.
IT in those situations are not quick to upgrade hardware or software. They need stability and reliability over all else or risk effecting work productivity.
In my experience, for the CPU, if real work is really being done on a machine, the company will just max it out at the time of purchase negating the upgrade path on the CPU. RAM, GPUs and hard drives though, I've seen those upgraded plenty.
I just came to MacRumors after looking at MacTracker(Mac Pro Late 2013), and I was like "I gotta post how great the nMP is" These are things are beasts. I got a R9 280x in a Mac Pro 2009, and it's sweet, I mean I gotta dual ssd PCIe raid card, but one of the fans makes a noise a little here and there. And then I look at my Mac Pro 2006 those are so dope, at $300 a pop plus $300 for 5770 and 16GB, so $600. But man these new ones (kinda, 2013 it's 2015) are freakin sick.
I am looking at mine 2006 and 2009 going, "Hey 2016 will be 9 years and 6 years" but they are kinda getting long in the tooth if you will. The size is kinda eh. I have maxed them out with SSDs etc, and it's been a freakin blast. But this is getting old now. You start thinking about getting a new system, and I am serious man, that Mac Pro with it's cooling and silence factor with 2 Beastly Video Cards! Dude an 8-core could go 10 if not 20 years. CPUs are not getting any faster we all know that. So I mean hey this is the man...
Plus in 1-2-3 years we are going to get the update/refresh, and those are just going to be insane. But here is the main point, you plop down, $40,000 for a new SUV, right? in freaking 5 years that thing is MAX $15,000 blue book. That's a ridiculous loss $25,000! You spend $4,000 on a sweet BTO Mac Pro, and that thing is going to be around for 10 years guaranteed (and hold at around $2,000) after those 10 years, and then you could just put it to work doing some Render Job, Media Server, or WHATEVER, 10 years from now.
Thing is BOSS NASTY. It really is. And plus, runs os x....the best...
Laters...
EDIT:
That being said. And this is serious if you don't have an absolute reason to put this machine to work for at least 50% of it's capability, then this Computer is A WASTE. I mean to me, I look the model I want and it's $6,099, which I would love to get. But I don't have an immediate workload for that monster, so that would be such a waste, compared to having a SECURE MacBook/MacMini Future, consisting of 2 MacBook Pro 15" purchased at the proper moment every 5 years (black friday-ish etc) for $1799, and then 2 MacMini's for $1099 each, purchased right when they came out, those machines would be a complete eco system containment center for 10 years also) So yeah if you don't have anything but TOY USAGE, it's a waste. But a Marvel of a computer!
I am looking at mine 2006 and 2009 going, "Hey 2016 will be 9 years and 6 years" but they are kinda getting long in the tooth if you will. The size is kinda eh. I have maxed them out with SSDs etc, and it's been a freakin blast. But this is getting old now. You start thinking about getting a new system, and I am serious man, that Mac Pro with it's cooling and silence factor with 2 Beastly Video Cards! Dude an 8-core could go 10 if not 20 years. CPUs are not getting any faster we all know that. So I mean hey this is the man...
Plus in 1-2-3 years we are going to get the update/refresh, and those are just going to be insane. But here is the main point, you plop down, $40,000 for a new SUV, right? in freaking 5 years that thing is MAX $15,000 blue book. That's a ridiculous loss $25,000! You spend $4,000 on a sweet BTO Mac Pro, and that thing is going to be around for 10 years guaranteed (and hold at around $2,000) after those 10 years, and then you could just put it to work doing some Render Job, Media Server, or WHATEVER, 10 years from now.
Thing is BOSS NASTY. It really is. And plus, runs os x....the best...
Laters...
EDIT:
That being said. And this is serious if you don't have an absolute reason to put this machine to work for at least 50% of it's capability, then this Computer is A WASTE. I mean to me, I look the model I want and it's $6,099, which I would love to get. But I don't have an immediate workload for that monster, so that would be such a waste, compared to having a SECURE MacBook/MacMini Future, consisting of 2 MacBook Pro 15" purchased at the proper moment every 5 years (black friday-ish etc) for $1799, and then 2 MacMini's for $1099 each, purchased right when they came out, those machines would be a complete eco system containment center for 10 years also) So yeah if you don't have anything but TOY USAGE, it's a waste. But a Marvel of a computer!
Last edited:
On what planet do you live where a decade old computer will retain 50% of its value, not to mention still be a viable computer for its original purpose at that point in its lifecycle?
I voted for a Failure.
I am a digital painter / photo manipulator. I do matte paintings and most of my work is at minimaal 600 dpi and my PSD files grow to 2GB and more that i have to safe to .PSB. With other adobe programs open in the background, i need some brutal horsepower and lots of memory. A very fast single GPU with cuda support helps too.
At this moment, I work with an iMac 2011 27" and a Cintiq 27" as my daily driver. I want to upgrade to something more beast and stay away from the all in one systems simply because i don't want to send my system away if 1 part fails. With the nMP I can not configure my needs. I don't need an Xeon CPU. An i7 6-core will do the job. I dont need ECC memory. Give me 64GB DDR4 and my system wil fly. I don't need a dual ATI GPU as this is my only option. I want to have a little bit more choices.
If there was some more to choose at, i was in the market for a Mac Pro with no doubt. But, like many others here, and many others in my network I speak daily, they have to switch or switched all-ready to a Windows based machine. Not because they really want to. Because they didn't find the muscle for there needs like I mention above.
I think, between the iMac and MacPro is a gab which need a system in between. For powerusers who are not into video editing. Who dont need expensive Xeons and ECC memory, and who like to have a single machine without an build in monitor, and who dont like to spend 5000+ euro for a system (Xeon, 16GB ECC, Dual ATI) and feeling to be fooled.
So, my only choice is to leave my loved OSX which hurt me. I am a little bit afraid of what is coming to me with W10. We will see. I still hope Apple will come with an update for the Mac Pro and surprises us. A part of me knows its wishful thinking. There will be no machine in between the iMac and MacPro because it would hurt the sales for the iMacs. And there will be no update to the Mac Pro like i want to.
So for me personally, this nMP is a failure and is Apple losing me as customer. If i go to W10, I will change my local eco system too (i think)
I am a digital painter / photo manipulator. I do matte paintings and most of my work is at minimaal 600 dpi and my PSD files grow to 2GB and more that i have to safe to .PSB. With other adobe programs open in the background, i need some brutal horsepower and lots of memory. A very fast single GPU with cuda support helps too.
At this moment, I work with an iMac 2011 27" and a Cintiq 27" as my daily driver. I want to upgrade to something more beast and stay away from the all in one systems simply because i don't want to send my system away if 1 part fails. With the nMP I can not configure my needs. I don't need an Xeon CPU. An i7 6-core will do the job. I dont need ECC memory. Give me 64GB DDR4 and my system wil fly. I don't need a dual ATI GPU as this is my only option. I want to have a little bit more choices.
If there was some more to choose at, i was in the market for a Mac Pro with no doubt. But, like many others here, and many others in my network I speak daily, they have to switch or switched all-ready to a Windows based machine. Not because they really want to. Because they didn't find the muscle for there needs like I mention above.
I think, between the iMac and MacPro is a gab which need a system in between. For powerusers who are not into video editing. Who dont need expensive Xeons and ECC memory, and who like to have a single machine without an build in monitor, and who dont like to spend 5000+ euro for a system (Xeon, 16GB ECC, Dual ATI) and feeling to be fooled.
So, my only choice is to leave my loved OSX which hurt me. I am a little bit afraid of what is coming to me with W10. We will see. I still hope Apple will come with an update for the Mac Pro and surprises us. A part of me knows its wishful thinking. There will be no machine in between the iMac and MacPro because it would hurt the sales for the iMacs. And there will be no update to the Mac Pro like i want to.
So for me personally, this nMP is a failure and is Apple losing me as customer. If i go to W10, I will change my local eco system too (i think)
Roykor, indeed a shame that it does not fit your needs.
I guess not everybody will find it suitable for their own needs, that's quite normal. This machine is very much focused, and some workflows might not fit.
I do see it as the future of workstations though, the trend setter. We'll see if others won't follow!!!
But finally someone spoke his mind without going about saying it's garbage or that it's dead, or whatever. Thanx for that.
I don't see Apple introducing a new model as well in between.
Still, would it be a lot cheaper if you configure a Dell/HP/Lenovo/Boxx workstation, even if without the WS parts? Or will you go for a regular PC?
The new nMP should come soon with better specs. CPU performance increase shouldn't be something to write home about but newer GPUs should bring some welcome fresh air.
Maybe with Purley they'll introduce a new 2S or even 4S server machine, but that's highly unlikely.
I guess not everybody will find it suitable for their own needs, that's quite normal. This machine is very much focused, and some workflows might not fit.
I do see it as the future of workstations though, the trend setter. We'll see if others won't follow!!!
But finally someone spoke his mind without going about saying it's garbage or that it's dead, or whatever. Thanx for that.
I don't see Apple introducing a new model as well in between.
Still, would it be a lot cheaper if you configure a Dell/HP/Lenovo/Boxx workstation, even if without the WS parts? Or will you go for a regular PC?
The new nMP should come soon with better specs. CPU performance increase shouldn't be something to write home about but newer GPUs should bring some welcome fresh air.
Maybe with Purley they'll introduce a new 2S or even 4S server machine, but that's highly unlikely.
I might going for a self build system and pick all the components by hand. I am in the market for an i7 5820K, 64GB mem, GTX980TI and a bunch of SSD's and a M2 SSD as boot. I think this will be an beast. And, its exciting to build this all in a nice tower (Define R5). But, i am in no rush. I expect some more updates on several area's and I'll keep an eye on what Apple is going to do. By not going for an new Apple in the future, the cash i safe on the investment of a new system (PC is much cheaper as we all know), i can spend on a new NAS I need. An extra plus in this case.
Never bad to have both Windows and Mac Workstations. For my 5.1 Mac Backup, I have a 5960X with 64GB of RAM and a 980Ti for all my Adobe needs.
I agree with that emphasized comment of yours. However it needs to be applied to the nMP advocates who keep telling us how no one ever upgrades their systems. As I said I have seen all manner of upgrades to a system having worked in small businesses (as small as four people) all the way up to Fortune 100 companies. There is an entire industry dedicated to the upgrade market yet, according to the nMP advocates, outside of a small handful of enthusiasts no one upgrades.
IME the CPU is the least likely upgraded component of a system. I brought it up merely to show an example where I performed an upgrade for a small business. Video adapters, hard disks, memory, various expansion cards (too numerous to list individually) are the common parts which are upgraded.
- Status