Thanks for everyone's responses, after further consideration, I expect that Apple will not consider this option, although it would respond to a number of us in the community, the fact that Apple let the Mac Pro wither on the vine for 3+ years is a very good indication that they have NO desire to maintain the Mac Pro Classic's platform...This really is too bad. I'll keep my 5,1 and am looking to pick up another soon...
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Let's start a petition to keep the old Mac Pro and rebadge it as the Mac Pro Classic!
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Conspiracy theories require more than one participant, Apple are essentially a single party and have nobody to conspire with on their product lines. Having used Mac OS based computers since the late 1980s I have observed Apple's design and production methodology for quite a while.
Since the iMac first appeared in 1998 Apple have had a knack of designing products which allowed them to directly control the hardware development very closely and almost without any other party having a say in how their products are modified. Only where similarities to PC hardware existed did Apple have less control over what you could add yourself.
My first iMac was upgradeable in many ways, I added a Sonnet Harmoni G3 600 MHz daughter card, 80 GB HDD and firewire to it along with a Voodoo 2 GPU mezzanine card. It accepted 512mb of RAM when Apple claimed the max memory was 128 MB.
Since then Apple's grip has tightened on the expansion of their kit, the "classic" Mac Pro being the main exception. With virtually all the adjustments we have made to Mac Pro towers since 2006 being outside of Apple's control, this machine more than any other has been the opposite of Apple's sealed unit architecture which proliferates throughout the rest of their product range. If you look at iPhone, iPad, iPod, iMac and Macbook design since 2010 all these products are much harder to modify, if not impossible to in some respects. The nMP fits this profile far more than a large tower filled with PCI-E ports and other PC friendly connections.
The nMP re-establishes Apple's complete separation of hardware from the PC parts sphere just as effectively as welding RAM to the logic board, using proprietary SSD drives and gluing batteries into Macbooks ends any ideas of user upgrades.
This is a good philosophy for Apple and will make sure that the majority of revenue from their professional hardware goes to them and not to 3rd parties who sell PC parts that just happen to fit.
I don't think this is a conspiracy I think it is a commercial strategy and I think it will work.
http://youtu.be/XDISI2IL5Ns
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Yeah, you only have to look at all the posts relating to people still happy with their 2006 Mac Pros as to why Apple would go this route. You can make a 2009 Mac Pro nearly as powerful as the new 12-core can be and Apple gets nothing.
The old strategy obviously wasn't working for them. Their behaviour even before we saw this showed that. They went from the best value workstations out there with the 2006 models (probably viable due big Intel discounts for those early years), to 2009 models costing $1,000+ more than the hardware you were getting while not offering the top CPUs, limiting memory to 4 DIMMs per CPU on COPUs with 3 memory controllers, limited I/O and then the 6 month wait in 2010, the 2012 crap-fest and the discontinuation in the EU for 9 months.
I doubt they are doing this for profit directly from Mac Pro sales, it all screams of staying in the market so as not to devalue the Apple brand.
Yes, it will work near term. However, for the longer term, Apple will need to keep their technology competitive and not allow it to stagnate - which is what they've done in the past...and got clobbered for losing the puck.
Apple needs to remember that Hardware only exists to run software productivity applications, and Apple doesn't really own this market, and it would probably take most of their $100B bankroll to buy their way in. While the hobbiest/prosumer might stay brand loyal, unfettered capitalism will not, and the nMP isn't a product for the prosumer/hobbyists.
-hh
Apple does have a history of keeping old products alive for educational purchases. They were still making Apple IIs well into the Mac era for example.
I'd like to think we can still get big box Mac Pros down the line for the labs, broadcast and post people that sincerely NEED multiple PCIe slots and such.
Though I suppose they could always find NOS or refurbed units.
I'd like to think we can still get big box Mac Pros down the line for the labs, broadcast and post people that sincerely NEED multiple PCIe slots and such.
Though I suppose they could always find NOS or refurbed units.
I think all of you guys I've quoted below have entirely missed OP's point. He said "a new updated version". He doesn't mean keep selling the 2012 MP, he means a new-for-2014 cheesegrater.
Anyone who wants an actual old cheesegrater will be able to buy them forever on the used market.
That is not an updated cheesegrater.
An updated cheesegrater could have compliant fans.
That poll says nothing about an updated cheesegrater.
Old products for educational purposes is not the same as an updated cheesegrater.
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In any case, I agree with all those saying it's not going to happen.
Anyone who wants an actual old cheesegrater will be able to buy them forever on the used market.
That is not an updated cheesegrater.
An updated cheesegrater could have compliant fans.
That poll says nothing about an updated cheesegrater.
Old products for educational purposes is not the same as an updated cheesegrater.
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In any case, I agree with all those saying it's not going to happen.
But that would add 51¢ to the BOM for the cheesegrater - totally ruining Apple's profit margins.
</sarcasm>
I hope you are wrong, but this may happen. The next year to two years will tell us a true story of the Mac Pro Line.
I hope people will buy thousands of them but I doubt it will happen. Will wait and see.
And so it begins - the shrinking PC
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/velocity-micro-smallblock-compact-desktop,25569.html
Lead and they will follow.
(Don't get me wrong - I am waiting for my nMP to be delivered. This just shows how things are changing)
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/velocity-micro-smallblock-compact-desktop,25569.html
Lead and they will follow.
(Don't get me wrong - I am waiting for my nMP to be delivered. This just shows how things are changing)
That is a Lian-Li PC-Q28 chassis which is the latest in a long line of Lian-Li small form factor machines. That particular model was introduced a few months prior to the Mac Pro presentation.
Someone may eventually copy the nMP but this is not it. Small form factor PCs have been around for ages.
Thanks for that info:
I have not been following PC models. I guess it's like buying a car - been out of the market so long that everything is new to me.
I have not been following PC models. I guess it's like buying a car - been out of the market so long that everything is new to me.
it is not a theory
This is absolutely the entire strategy of Apple for years now.
Instead of the open heterogeneous Linux or the semi-open Wintel environments, it is a closed, curated environment.
Restricting hardware is only one facet. They likewise restrict what you can install on most of their products. On the Mac side we still have a choice of "only from the App store", "app store and trusted developers" or "anywhere". But expect those choices to diminish over time down to just "only the app store".
Restricting hardware is also a tactic to make it easier to develop for the Mac, and you have to recognize here that computers are second to both itunes, app store and mobile devices in terms of revenue. So I am happy that they are merely restricting the profile of what they support rather than abandoning efforts to develop anything beyond the 13" unibody MBP.
We also reap the benefits of this restriction such that Macs are still generally FAR more stable than Windows. Though Win 7 sp1 is pretty decent in that regard.
Well, because people like their acronyms of course. Why call it the Mac Pro Classic when you could, as many have, simply stick with "MP" or the slightly more elegant, in-the-know-about-tech-acronyms-sounding "oMP" (as opposed to the "nMP"). Notice the very cool mixing of upper and lower case letters.
That is of course unless one were to start using a corresponding "MPC" acronym to represent "Mac Pro Classic" (or perhaps "MPCl", the "l" being a lowercase "L"), in which case anyone that sees the acronym would have to be acquainted with this thread so they'd know what it meant. Otherwise they'd be like, WITW?
Although FWIW Mac Pro Classic is a clever and catchy non-acronym name IMHO. For anyone reading this, YOMV, and that's AOK. TY for your time.
I have built a gaming PC of that form factor years ago. Mini-ITX has been around since 2001
These are anti-malware security features. I do not believe they will close down the system, that would be a very stupid move. The only area where Apple indeed seems to be forcing signed software only are kernel extensions - which is a good thing, because that is the most dangerous form of malware.
I was also hoping for a miracle that Apple would still offer the classic Mac Pro and nMac Pro though it's a longshot given the direction Apple is headed. They're downsizing the physical size of their Macs.
Nah, I think most people seem to like oMP or the old Mac Pro. It seems to fit the nomenclature since we call the new model the nMP
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Please explain, are you saying that you could afford to buy 10 but now because of the price you can only justify one purchase, or its so powerful there is no need for multiple purchases?
I'd buy that in a heartbeat. Core i7 standalone Mac with proper desktop graphics none of this mobile stuff.
The design direction of the nMP suits an environment were the intention is to have all of the peripherals external - probably with storage located in a separate room because it is noisy and hot. It's designed so it can be moved around movie sets, etc with ease.
The needs for the home enthusiast are very different and this is where Apple is getting it wrong. There is huge demand for a stand alone core i7 with proper desktop graphcs - none of this mobile crap.
So back to the original question. I don't want them to bring back the 'Classic' Mac Pro. I want a new machine instead. Same principals (stand-alone with internal expansion) but much smaller. 2.5" drive bays (6-8), 4 x PCIe 16 and at least 4 DIMM sockets. Would I want an optical bay? Maybe. I wouldn't object to one being there. This machine could be around the size of an HP Microserver, or one of these LAN party gaming cases, but obviously cooler cos Apple make it. I personally think this should have been the machine Apple made instead of the nMP. In my mind they got it wrong as their current effort is focused too much in one area (FCP) and isn't enough of an all-rounder.
With only one CPU and mediocre GPU it's not powerful enough. So we've moved to PC. Will get one for footage ingest as Thunderbolt is handy for that.
Apple would like to think this (stupid) nMP move will checkmate their users and corner the market. The reality (as I see it) is they'd have lost quite a few segments of the over all market who used to play, but those segments have been alienated due to Apple's own penny pinching profit agendas. Apple simply does not create products these users want or need. Apple have lost sight of what their customers need and instead build machines based on what they think is financially best for them. In this market segment, I think that dictating hardware design as they do to the skinny jeaned joe bloggz iPhone consumer is the wrong strategy.
I wonder if Apple are concerned about the longtime users dejected by the strategies of the past few years, who are now being driven away to build hackintoshes.
I personally haven't bought any new Apple hardware for 4 years now and that's purely because they don't build anything I can use anymore. They started by removing the default antiglare displays on laptops, replacing them with glass mirrors, then with the audacity to make the anti glare panels a built to order option and charge us $150 more, that spitefulness angered me!! Same situation but no option with the iMac and the glass mirror, i'd have a 27" with Matte panel as a backup machine. They killed off the 17" Macbook Pro which i'll only use due to the size of the display and the perfect (for me) 1920x1200 resolution. Then we come to the Mac Pro. Last one I bought was the 2009 machine but even then I was apprehensive because the power supply delivery design on that machine, was then and is now, inadequate since it uses the old 2002 ATX specification, rather than the 2007 spec which provided more auxiliary power to PCIe cards. Sure I have two of those machines with slots full to the gills. Now what? I'm close to the end of the road, Apple don't have a machine with slots. I could build a hackintosh but I question how long that can be sustained, Apple inevitably plans to support only ATI graphics. Abandoning the Mac completely and move in to the alien Win/PC world is the only other end of the world like choice, but the way they are going with the Mac OS I fear the end of the world is near for most other Mac users.
It's just sad that Apple won't get back to where it once belongs and find a balance between profit seeking and product design with their user in mind. While I appreciate the clever design of the black cylinder thing, and while I accept it does have a place in the Mac product line up (where the iMac and it's glass mirror display doesn't work for people, and the Mac Mini isn't powerful enough to work for other people), it is no replacement of a real Mac Pro.
Apple, go back to the real Mac pro, modify the case in such a way that the handles turn into rack ears (with slots in rack ears to become handles to pick up), sure remove the optical drive bays, remove the 3.5" HDD and fit in 4 x 2.5" SATA bays (SSD) put a PCIe SSD slot on the main board for a boot disk, make sure the 4 PCIe slots are spaced enough for dual wide cards, redesign the PSU to allow auxiliary power to feed up to 4 PCIe video cards (with 8 pin connectors). Xeon's shouldn't be the only choice.
Guys... it's extremely hard to innovate when you've been as successful as Apple has been over the past few years. This is Apple for the next few years. I don't like it but it's all part of the ebb and flow of successes and failures.