M-series Macs versus the rest: Why?

[cateye]

Because people turn everything into sportsball. Everything is a competition. Everything is an argument to be had. They don't buy it as a tool (in which case, the one they need, Mac vs. Windows, and which model with which capabilities made by which company, would be simple enough to determine), they buy it as a lifestyle choice, or due to FOMO, or any one of a number of emotional reasons rather than practical.

You're absolutely correct, the comparison you suggest in your opening message is basic and practical and no one else can do it for an individual. Their needs, their requirements, their budget makes the decision. But then, they don't get to post a message, start an argument, gather 200 follow up posts, and feed the beast.

 

[Jumpthesnark]

Now that I’ve got my rants out of the way, why do people compare prices and specs between Macs and Windows laptop?

Because they live in a world where they think they need to post videos on YouTube (with a thumbnail that shows a MBP and a Windows laptop, plus themselves making a face that looks like it was inspired by an Edvard Munch painting, and a scary headline that yells DON'T MAKE THIS MISTAKE or YOU WON'T BELIEVE WHAT APPLE DID) for clicks.

It serves their needs to discuss Apple vs Windows, and it has little to do with our needs as consumers. It serves to keep their "YouTube tech influencer" ecosystem going, that's why.

 

[AlixSPQR]

This whole thread is so pointless.

Most popular threads are.

 

[Zest28]

Are they? I see them as different products, offering something different to different type of consumers. If one needs a gaming rig, then the obvious choice would be a Windows laptop, regardless of how Apple priced a similar calibre of MacBook in their lineup.

You really think consultants use their Lenovo Thinkpads for gaming?

 

[klasma]

That’s my point. It’s all down to preference. But there are many out there comparing which ones are superior than the other, when in reality it boils down to subjectivity.

You might have a slight preference for Windows, but nevertheless choose a Mac if it performs better for your use case at the same price. Or you might have a slight preference for macOS, but nevertheless choose a Windows laptop if the performance you need comes cheaper that way. Yes, it’s subjective, but performance comparisons play into those considerations. And there are many people not firmly in one camp or the other.

 

[Al Rukh]

You might have a slight preference for Windows, but nevertheless choose a Mac if it performs better for your use case at the same price. Or you might have a slight preference for macOS, but nevertheless chiose a Windows laptop if the performance you need comes cheaper that way. Yes, it’s subjective, but performance comparisons play into those considerations.

I just dislike the notion where PEOPLE (reviewers, consumers and prosumers alike) spew things like ‘this laptop (mostly Windows laptop) has a better spec and cheaper than a MacBook, so do not be fooled by Apple and pay more for less’ nonsense.

This is the level of comparison I was referring to and many of the posters here missed my point and perhaps I’ve not been very clear of my initial post.

 

[klasma]

I just dislike the notion where PEOPLE (reviewers, consumers and prosumers alike) spew things like ‘this laptop (mostly Windows laptop) has a better spec and cheaper than a MacBook, so do not be fooled by Apple and pay more for less’ nonsense.

It’s not nonsense for buyers who don’t care much about Windows vs. macOS, but do care about getting their money’s worth regarding performance.

To me it sounds like you just don’t like MacBooks being unfavorably compared to a system you personally don’t care about.

 

[Al Rukh]

It’s not nonsense for buyers who don’t care much about Windows vs. macOS, but do care about getting their money’s worth regarding performance.

To me it sounds like you just don’t like MacBooks being criticized in comparison to a system you personally don’t care about.

That’s fair, but I’ve laid out an example in my earlier posts. The baseline XPS 15 costs the same as the base M3 MBP. In my opinion the base M3 MBP, as controversial of a purchase it can be, is the better purchase over the XPS 15.

 

[klasma]

That’s fair, but I’ve laid out an example in my earlier posts. The baseline XPS 15 costs the same as the base M3 MBP. In my opinion the base M3 MBP, as controversial of a purchase it can be, is the better purchase over the XPS 15.

That’s your opinion and is fine as such, but I don’t see an implication that spec comparisons are useless. For one, the relative specs of those two models do play a role in your assessment. And aside from that, other people may weigh the various specs differently. So it’s important to compare specs.

 

[Xiao_Xi]

baseline XPS 15 costs the same as the base M3 MBP

This is not true for everyone, especially this weekend. Dell is selling an i7 XPS 15 for $1,100 and Apple is selling the M3 MBP for $1,600.

XPS 15 Laptop: Dell XPS Laptop Computers | Dell USA

Shop the Dell XPS 15 laptop featuring 16:10 4-sided InfinityEdge display & 100% Adobe RGB color, or view all new XPS laptops at Dell.com.

www.dell.com

Buy 14-inch MacBook Pro with M3

Get a new 14-inch MacBook Pro with M3 chip from only $133.25 per month. Select a model or customise your own. Buy now at apple.com.

www.apple.com

 

[TheRoxyTheatre]

It’s 2023, well almost the end of it and we have a lot of people - consumers, prosumers and tech analysts comparing Macs against Windows (especially in the laptop/notebook category).

It didn’t make sense then, and it doesn’t now. In my country, a baseline i7 XPS 15 is the same price as the baseline M3 MBP. To me it is a rather clear-cut decision to make.

Now that I’ve got my rants out of the way, why do people compare prices and specs between Macs and Windows laptop?

On the next episode, Mania89 will question why some people compare apples to oranges.

 

[antiprotest]

In my country, a baseline i7 XPS 15 is the same price as the baseline M3 MBP. To me it is a rather clear-cut decision to make.

It's actually not clear to me what's your decision in this case. Let us know.

 

[h.gilbert]

So the base M3 MBP and XPS 15 are both priced at $2299. Hence, the reason why I had to post this thread. There should be no comparison in this case. I’ll choose the base M3 MBP every day of the week.

Is that the crux of this thread then? You would 100% unequivocally chose a mac over a PC and and it's beyond you that anyone would get a PC. Another classic MR thread, thanks.

 

[h.gilbert]

I don't know where you are but here in the UK for £100 less than the base 8/512 14" Pro you can get a 16/1TB XPS 15 with RTX 4050, and a 3.5k touchscreen OLED. Also remember it's 15" instead of 14" and look how much Apple charges to go from 13.6" to 15" with the M2 Air.

How could you not compare those models if you were in the market for a laptop and were mostly indifferent to what OS it runs?

 

[0339327]

It’s 2023, well almost the end of it and we have a lot of people - consumers, prosumers and tech analysts comparing Macs against Windows (especially in the laptop/notebook category).

It didn’t make sense then, and it doesn’t now. In my country, a baseline i7 XPS 15 is the same price as the baseline M3 MBP. To me it is a rather clear-cut decision to make.

Now that I’ve got my rants out of the way, why do people compare prices and specs between Macs and Windows laptop?

Windows machines hold significantly lower resale value. Therefore, if you know the specs that you want, you can get a used Windows machine for significantly less than a comparably used Mac.

We recently spent thousands of dollars on two MBP for events just for reliable video playback. For a particular setup, we had to go with Windows, due to Mac bugs that affected the setup. The windows machines were refurbished and were a third of the price of the (new) Macs. Given that the current value of refurbished Macs is only 10%-20% lower than new, this was still a significant difference.

 

[Strider64]

At 59 years old, I've transitioned to being a Mac user after spending a significant portion of my life using Windows. My switch to Apple happened around 2014. Before that, I even earned a tech certification for computer repair and built my own Windows-based computers for about 10 to 12 years. My shift to Apple was mainly because I found myself more productive with their systems, and now, I've really hit my stride with the M1 Mac Studio Max. I view computers as tools, without prioritizing one over the other. Although, if I had to go back to using a PC, I might need a bit of time to reacquaint myself with it.

 

[falainber]

This is not true for everyone, especially this weekend. Dell is selling an i7 XPS 15 for $1,100 and Apple is selling the M3 MBP for $1,600.

XPS 15 Laptop: Dell XPS Laptop Computers | Dell USA

Shop the Dell XPS 15 laptop featuring 16:10 4-sided InfinityEdge display & 100% Adobe RGB color, or view all new XPS laptops at Dell.com.

www.dell.com

Buy 14-inch MacBook Pro with M3

Get a new 14-inch MacBook Pro with M3 chip from only $133.25 per month. Select a model or customise your own. Buy now at apple.com.

www.apple.com

The OP actually clarified that he meant M3 baseline MacBook Pro which starts at $2K (vs $1100 for Dell). But beyond the price there are many reasons why people may prefer or need Dell laptop:

• they need Windows (a lot of people do) - that's the most important reason
• they need Linux
• they need NVIDIA GPU
• they need 64GB RAM
• they prefer to get 4 (or even 8) TB SSD for a reasonable price (as I understand, Dell uses standard M2 SSD)
• they prefer OLED screen
• they want a touch screen

 

[seek3r]

It’s 2023, well almost the end of it and we have a lot of people - consumers, prosumers and tech analysts comparing Macs against Windows (especially in the laptop/notebook category).

It didn’t make sense then, and it doesn’t now. In my country, a baseline i7 XPS 15 is the same price as the baseline M3 MBP. To me it is a rather clear-cut decision to make.

Now that I’ve got my rants out of the way, why do people compare prices and specs between Macs and Windows laptop?

Because that’s comparing equivalent general computing tools?

 

[Abazigal]

It’s 2023, well almost the end of it and we have a lot of people - consumers, prosumers and tech analysts comparing Macs against Windows (especially in the laptop/notebook category).

It didn’t make sense then, and it doesn’t now. In my country, a baseline i7 XPS 15 is the same price as the baseline M3 MBP. To me it is a rather clear-cut decision to make.

Now that I’ve got my rants out of the way, why do people compare prices and specs between Macs and Windows laptop?

It's the only way they can show that windows computers are "winning", by showing that they are either cheaper, or have better paper specs than an equivalently-priced Mac.

Until you look at factors like build quality, battery life, or sustained performance when not plugged in to an external power source, or the ecosystem (eg: Final Cut Pro) or the integration with the rest of the Apple ecosystem (iCloud, airdrop, continuity).

Which you can be sure none of the competition will ever bring up.

 

[ThunderSkunk]

How is a Mac not competing in the same market as Windows machine (i.e. Dell)? Specs should be compared between the two systems, because they perform similar tasks (general computing activities).

Well an iPad does "general computing activities" too but comparing specs between a CAD workstation and an iPad seems pretty silly. The rift between what Macs can do and what Windows machines can do has been widening again since Apple Silicon, so comparing the two is either meaningless or needs to take into account the birds nest of incompatibilities, bodges, workarounds and shortcomings on the software side with regard to each too. Ultimately Mx chips have made ipads and now macs extremely specialized. If you have no overlap with that area of specialization, all of ARM's low power efficiency gains amount to little more than a zippier iphone.

 

[Al Rukh]

I owe the posters here an apology for wasting their time on reading/replying to this thread.

I’m not in any way implying that everyone should choose MacBooks over Windows laptops all the time. Please let me clarify.

When I said there should be no comparison made between the two categories of laptops, I meant it in a way that reviewers and consumers alike shouldn’t recommend one over the other just because one has a better spec (while being cheaper or about the same price) over the other.

I think it’s not productive when someone reviewing a base M3 MBP says ‘you can get a base *insert a Windows laptop here* for a similar priced at 16GB RAM and 1TB of storage and do not be fooled by Apple’s daylight robbery of your precious dollars’. It’s condescending to consumers because I like to think that we know there are cheaper and better/similarly specced machines out there on Windows world. Specs alone do not translate into experience. If the XPS 15 cost me say $1800 and that I’m considering to get the cheapest laptop for my use then the argument can be made to get it over the base M3 MBP. But as per my example, they both cost the same price and I think it’s insulting when someone think it’s a good idea to get the XPS just because it has a higher SSD storage and RAM over the M3, when there are no specific requirements to make the purchase apart from preference.

 

[Al Rukh]

It's the only way they can show that windows computers are "winning", by showing that they are either cheaper, or have better paper specs than an equivalently-priced Mac.

Until you look at factors like build quality, battery life, or sustained performance when not plugged in to an external power source, or the ecosystem (eg: Final Cut Pro) or the integration with the rest of the Apple ecosystem (iCloud, airdrop, continuity).

Which you can be sure none of the competition will ever bring up.

Exactly! The whole ‘you can get a better specced Windows laptop for the same price’ argument is very outdated and not productive at all.

 

[Al Rukh]

I don't know where you are but here in the UK for £100 less than the base 8/512 14" Pro you can get a 16/1TB XPS 15 with RTX 4050, and a 3.5k touchscreen OLED. Also remember it's 15" instead of 14" and look how much Apple charges to go from 13.6" to 15" with the M2 Air.

How could you not compare those models if you were in the market for a laptop and were mostly indifferent to what OS it runs?

That’s all well and good that for £100 you get a bigger screen with better specs. Is the XPS able to regulate the refresh rate up to 120Hz? My point is, just buy the machine you need. Don’t buy one over the other just because it’s cheaper with better specs. If in some other parallel universe it’s the MBP that’s on offer with 16GB of RAM and 1TB of storage, if you think the XPS is a better purchase to your needs and requirements, don’t make a comparison and choose the M3 over the XPS. That’s what I’m trying to say.

 

[Tagbert]

So the base M3 MBP and XPS 15 are both priced at $2299. Hence, the reason why I had to post this thread. There should be no comparison in this case. I’ll choose the base M3 MBP every day of the week.

You just did a (very simple) comparison there and made a choice. That is what people often do. While the decision may be obvious to you with your needs, it isn’t the same for everyone.

Some people are very price sensitive so the comparisons are often tied to price. Others value other factors more and may pay more for a Mac because of other factors.

 

[Xiao_Xi]

I think it’s not productive when someone reviewing a base M3 MBP says ‘you can get a base *insert a Windows laptop here* for a similar priced at 16GB RAM and 1TB of storage and do not be fooled by Apple’s daylight robbery of your precious dollars’. It’s condescending to consumers because I like to think that we know there are cheaper and better/similarly specced machines out there on Windows world.

If you know that PC laptops are cheaper and have better specs, why does it bother you so much when a reviewer says that? Comparisons helps to understand what value each notebook brings.

Specs alone do not translate into experience.

Explaining user experience is difficult because it is very subjective and depends on many factors. Therefore, I think it should be Apple's marketing job to explain it and not third party reviewers.

My point is, just buy the machine you need. Don’t buy one over the other just because it’s cheaper with better specs.

People tend to buy the cheapest laptop that meets their requirements. However, some people have very specific requirements that narrow the pool of possible laptops to a few and that increases the price of possible purchases. It sounds like one of your requirements is to run macOS and you don't mind paying more for it.