Oh I don’t expect it either, I just see feasibility. If anything were to happen on that space I’d think it would be more in line with supplying their data centers to reduce power consumption.
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Mac Pro 2023 = Another Mac Pro 2013 crisis and failure.
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There is a market: the one where a workstation is effectively data center hardware on your desk. You use it to develop and test software that will run in the data center, and for quickly running small jobs that need higher-end hardware. You could do all that in the data center, but the productivity gains from not having to deal with the infrastructure and bureacracy of doing things in the cloud / HPC cluster can be substantial.
For some reason, Apple has never cared about that market. From their perspective, a professional has always been someone who works with something visual or with sound, not someone working with data.
I'm not sure if Apple is capable of making competitive data center hardware for external users. The people working for Apple can, but Apple as a company probably not. The corporate culture of a company making consumer devices may be incompatible with the demands of that business.
For me it was realizing my iPhone Xs was better at some video tasks than my fully loaded 2015 MBP. And then that an A12x iPad Pro was a much better computer than any 2016-2019 15" MBP in every measurable way. It lasted far longer on battery, it was quiet and cool to touch. It was a powerful photo and video editor, etc. So I knew I wanted iPad guts in a Mac, or I might as well just switch to an iPad and hackintosh tower and save several grand. But that 16" intel was mighty tempting. If I ever found a good refurb deal on one with the 9980hk and 5600M GPU I probably would have lept on it. As it is, I bought and returned refurb 9980hk + 5300m models several times in late 2020. So much more capable than what came before, so close to being my ideal laptop, but at that point the M1 was out and I decided to wait for the AS MBP. (Still a bit of regret, I ended up owning both the M1Max and a compact PC gaming laptop when the intel 16" would have done both jobs passably)
exactly. It would require setting up an entire new division that runs totally differently and when there are still consumer markets to access, why would you bother?
+ Author miss the point this MacPro does not support ECC RAM which is crucial for professional and complex data compilation against data corruption
I am not very familiar with video production industry. Do those who use FCP also need to run something else? I would expect so but I have no first hand information. In any case, FCP alone probably is not sufficient to sustain Mac Pro.
For those who want to know the line by line difference between the Mac Pro & Mac Studio.
As can see then I was actually responding your question about 3k for PCI-E slots. And showing you how would get to 3k. As well as being slower would also be 3 chassis as well for your 2.2k so there is only 800 in effect. If using TB to get to PCI-E not suitable then actually adds even more value to the Mac Pro over the Studio doesn’t it.
so not understandino why quoting me in that post. Not sure what it has to do with adding 3k over a studio.
I guess when M3 Ultra comes out Apple will just use the M2 Ultra as the baseline SoC for Mac Pro and then you can configure it to M3 Ultra.
And when M4 Ultra comes out, Apple may use M3 Ultra as the baseline or even keep the M2 Ultra but drop the price.
And when M4 Ultra comes out, Apple may use M3 Ultra as the baseline or even keep the M2 Ultra but drop the price.
Yes, I meant Mac Pro 2019. 2021 is the date on the Mac Pro Overview document.
I think if Apple says a PCIe slot is twice as fast as a PCIe slot in the 2019 Mac Pro then it means the slot is full bandwidth. So we can assume that there is at least one PCIe 4.0 x16 connection to the CPU. Or it's a high possibility. The alternative interpretation is that there is a PCIe 4.0 x16 connection to the PCIe switch and this bandwidth can only be used to communicate with other PCIe cards connected to the same PCIe switch which I believe is not a feature that most people need or use.
Thunderbolt has limited bandwidth (2750-3100 MB/s) and has higher latency than PCIe. If you want more PCIe devices, then use a PCIe expansion box like the Netstor NA255A (though that's kind of overkill since you can't use GPUs with Apple Silicon).
Right. The 2019 Mac Pro could have 12 Thunderbolt ports. 6 Thunderbolt controllers. So you could connect 12 4K displays. I'm not sure why the Mac Pro Overview says it can only connect 6 XDRs. If the limit were 3 per GPU, then two Radeon Pro W6800X Duo MPX Modules should allow 12 XDRs but https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT210228 says only 10 which probably means the top and I/O Thunderbolt controllers are not divided between the Duos efficiently.
You might need to flash a Mac firmware to the add-in card or add an SSDT using Open Core to get full use of the Thunderbolt ports (hot-plug, PCIe tunnelling, Thunderbolt networking, Thunderbolt target display mode, Thunderbolt target disk mode).
Because I have one and no matter how hard I push it, even with the CPU and GPU cores maxed in activity monitor, the fans barely speed up and it doesn’t overheat.
The Studio doesn’t have thermal limitations.
Cloud workloads, we no longer do things locally on hardware. Instead of holding an on-premise racked Macs for rendering and computing we eventually shifted off alongside the rest of the company to the cloud.
I have an RTX 3090 at home, and just like I told to the previous person most companies included mine have moved to the Cloud Workloads as on-premise data centres are being discontinued.
Completely understand what you mean, not having scalability sucks for this who are still rocking this for years and want to change their hardware.
Looks like the only option now for these people is x86.
I don’t quit follow. M1 Ultra looks like a fairly capable system for developing HPC workloads. Watts missing exactly?
It is a Mac Studio+. True to the markets Apple are addressing: video and music that may need custom cards. The Mac Pro and Mac Studio will support most of Vision Pro app work development as these apps seem to be mainly 2D apps arranged in a 3D space.
We may come to terms that Apple will not care for all markets. Everyone survives having the odd windows machine for special compute demands. I recently bought a DNA sequencer and the computer that drives it will be a Windows machine because of a GTX card requirement. Who actually cares that you need different computer tools for different jobs?
We may come to terms that Apple will not care for all markets. Everyone survives having the odd windows machine for special compute demands. I recently bought a DNA sequencer and the computer that drives it will be a Windows machine because of a GTX card requirement. Who actually cares that you need different computer tools for different jobs?
The Mac Pro is at the price it is for a reason. It reflects the very low number of units it expects to sell in this space. If they considered it good enough to take a large market share they would price it accordingly ($4,000)
Their figures don’t show this at all. This is just a figure. Head, a status symbol, not a solution the market is erupts about.
I avoided most of the damage because I bought lightly used/discounted and resold maybe 1 year after.
But I mercilessly purged from the household one 2017 12" rMB and one 2019 16" MBP i7, while the 2013 13" Air still sticks in the proximities of my couch.
Maybe the low number of units is a direct consequence of pricing it that way.
If the Studio M2U was $3999 and the Pro M2U was $4999, you could expect roughly a 50/50 market share split between them.
Also if the Pro M2U was $4999, then you could release a Mac Mini M2 Max at $1999 and maybe delete the Studio altogether.
I suspect they pondered to do this when there were rumors about the Studio being discontinued.
You're Apple. You just built a 40-core SoC for Mac Pro. Now what?
Mark Gurman is saying that Apple is working on a 40-core SoC for the Mac Pro for 2022. You're Tim Cook, sitting in his nice office, looking at how much money you just spent to make this giant SoC for a relatively small market. In fact, you have to do this every year or every two years to keep...
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I've been advocating/speculating that the Extrem SoC needs to have a cloud version in order to justify its cost of development.
Most people in the thread argued against the idea. I have a feeling that a lot of people here still live in 2006 - when heavy workloads were still mostly done on local machines. Today, heavy workloads have moved to the cloud. How could Apple justify spending hundreds of millions to engineer an Extrem SoC, keep it up to date, but only sell in the tens of thousands each year? Made no sense.
Maybe. They have decades of data and if there is one thing this company knows, it’s how to turn a profit. They don’t do loss leaders and they don’t do pricing themselves out of a market.
I still hold that this is a vanity product for them. And this small group of buyers are vanity users. There are much better solutions out there for the price. Much better.
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They are run by humans and humans make mistakes even with all the data of the world.
Actually more data can lead people to be confused and make more mistakes sometimes.
Just think for a minute how much money, mindshare, marketshare they've lost over the 2013 Mac Pro and even the subsequent 2017 iMac Pro, when they could have just refreshed the 2006 Mac Pro design until literally last week...
Would've been a much better deal for them, it's easy to see in hindsight but they've still done it even with top management.
I bet that Michael Spindler's Apple had lots of data and know-how as well....
You’re assuming that the 2006 was remotely profitable. If it were I assure you that refreshes would have come by the dozen.
No serious IT professionals would use a network of Mac Pros. It smacks of all your eggs in one basket, waiting for one company to update hardware in a competition free vacuum. It’s vanity I’m sure.
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