Mac Pro Rising

[rawweb]

probably something more customizable.. currently, everybody needs at least one drive.. after that, there is no standard.. so have it set up where the user can optimize the storage arrangements to their needs and workflow..
4 drives? that's just an arbitrary number.. odds are, for the vast majority of users, 4 drives is either too little or too much.. for people using high data workflows (video etc), it's certainly too little.
4 drives accommodates low to mid range users.. not 'power' users..

further, it's tying all the data to that one single computer and making it a bit more difficult to access it unless you're at this exact computer.





i know.
ie- even if your computer has 4 drive bays, you still have to use external drives.. that was what i meant to get across in the earlier post.




[doublepost=1467779750][/doublepost]
[edit]
that said, nmp is designed to house 2 drives..
so 2 @ 2TB+ each should satisfy a significant amount of people desiring multiple internal spinners i would imagine.

Never understood the great internal hard drive debate either F5. I've got a 6,1 at work that replaced a 5,1 that used to sit on the floor. Same amount of wires, so no messier than before. (I think there is a common misconception that this machine is super messy, at least not in our experience) I actually much prefer my rack thunderbolt raid array (8 drive raid 5). From a professional standpoint, this machine has served me and my company well since 2014.

Proof is in the pudding...

 

[ITguy2016]

Never understood the great internal hard drive debate either F5. I've got a 6,1 at work that replaced a 5,1 that used to sit on the floor. Same amount of wires, so no messier than before. (I think there is a common misconception that this machine is super messy, at least not in our experience) I actually much prefer my rack thunderbolt raid array (8 drive raid 5). From a professional standpoint, this machine has served me and my company well since 2014.

Proof is in the pudding...

View attachment 639170 View attachment 639169 View attachment 639168

You don't have to understand it. All you need to know is there are those who prefer to have internal expansion. That's it. They don't need to justify it to you. They don't need to rationalize it to you. They don't have to explain it to you. All they have to say is they want it.

 

[rawweb]

You don't have to understand it. All you need to know is there are those who prefer to have internal expansion. That's it. They don't need to justify it to you. They don't need to rationalize it to you. They don't have to explain it to you. All they have to say is they want it.

That's a lot of "you", chief. I offered a use case justification. What have you provided? Meaningless banter? Get real.

 

[ITguy2016]

That's a lot of "you", chief. I offered a use case justification. What have you provided? Meaningless banter? Get real.

When it comes to my use you're right...it's all about me because it is my preference. Who are you to tell me how I should do things? Awful arrogant of you to try to impose your preferences on others. You don't want to use internal storage? Fine...use external storage...you won't fine me trying to convince you to do things my way.

 

[rawweb]

When it comes to my use you're right...it's all about me because it is my preference. Who are you to tell me how I should do things? Awful arrogant of you to try to impose your preferences on others. You don't want to use internal storage? Fine...use external storage...you won't fine me trying to convince you to do things my way.

You're literally exaggerating everything I said and putting words where there are none. Lay off, crazy.

Let's see...all I said is I didn't fully understand the internal/external thing. If you feel better making fights out of thin air, keep going.

 

[lowendlinux]

You're literally exaggerating everything I said and putting words where there are none. Lay off, crazy.

He loves his internal spinners *shrug*

 

[koyoot]

When it comes to my use you're right...it's all about me because it is my preference. Who are you to tell me how I should do things? Awful arrogant of you to try to impose your preferences on others. You don't want to use internal storage? Fine...use external storage...you won't fine me trying to convince you to do things my way.

The problem is, what I suppose not everyone of you see it, that you do exactly what you have described. Imposing your preferences on others, who have different preferences than you.

There is a lot of professionals who enjoy work on their 6.1 MP. Yet, most people here, especially MVC ridicule them and say that they are not enough Pro if they think that way.

You are not right, or wrong. Change platform, if you are not satisfied with Mac Pro. Most of you already did, or are going to do this. And that is fair enough. Leave Apple platforms alone if you want to constantly complain how awful they are for YOUR needs. But don't make yourselves more important than others.

 

[rawweb]

The problem is, what I suppose not everyone of you see it, that you do exactly what you have described. Imposing your preferences on others, who have different preferences than you.

There is a lot of professionals who enjoy work on their 6.1 MP. Yet, most people here, especially MVC ridicule them and say that they are not enough Pro if they think that way.

You are not right, or wrong. Change platform, if you are not satisfied with Mac Pro. Most of you already did, or are going to do this. And that is fair enough. Leave Apple platforms alone if you want to constantly complain how awful they are for YOUR needs. But don't make yourselves more important than others.

Amen brotha.

 

[mattspace]

I suppose a lot of folks here who are critical of the nMP would be less so, if its cost were the equivalent of where the cMP was when new, minus the cost of a PCI expansion chassis, and a multibay drive enclosure (and the rack to hold them).

 

[lowendlinux]

I suppose a lot of folks here who are critical of the nMP would be less so, if its cost were the equivalent of where the cMP was when new, minus the cost of a PCI expansion chassis, and a multibay drive enclosure (and the rack to hold them).

I really think Apple can kill the griping by simply using MXM cards and M.2 SSD's

 

[ITguy2016]

You're literally exaggerating everything I said and putting words where there are none. Lay off, crazy.

Let's see...all I said is I didn't fully understand the internal/external thing. If you feel better making fights out of thin air, keep going.

And I said you don't have to. Whether you understand it or not is irrelevant as to others preference for it.

 

[Hank Carter]

You don't know that those are thermal failures, you just know the GPU failed. I don't do any intensive 3D on my nMP and I had to have the GPUs replaced twice. Yes, there are GPU defects on the nMP.

Try reading what I wrote again. This time slowly.

They had to replace the GPU on all three machines.
I have seen this at more than one company.
Reports of GPU failure in the nMP is not uncommom on post production forums that use GPU intensive software i.e. generate a lot of heat.
Apple just had a recall on the nMP due to GPU failure.

No, I don't think it's conclusively proven they're thermal related.

And Santa Clause has nothing to do with Christmas.
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fwiw, i also went through 3 gpus in a cmp

Of course you did.

 

[rawweb]

I suppose a lot of folks here who are critical of the nMP would be less so, if its cost were the equivalent of where the cMP was when new, minus the cost of a PCI expansion chassis, and a multibay drive enclosure (and the rack to hold them).

5,1 (2012 Apple Store)
Computer (8-Core) - $3,499.00
64GB Ram - $3,550.00
512GB SSD - $1,250.00
Extra 5770 - $250
TOTAL - $8,549

6,1 (2013 Apple Store)
Computer (8-Core) - $5,499.00
64GB Ram - $1,200
512GB PCIe SSD - $300
Dual D500 - Included
Dual D700 - $600
TOTAL - $6,999 or $7,599 with x2-D700

Add a grand to get the OWC thunder bay ... http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1075759-REG/owc_other_world_computing_16tb_4_x_4tb.html

About the same price...

 

[ITguy2016]

5,1 (2012 Apple Store)
Computer (8-Core) - $3,499.00
64GB Ram - $3,550.00
512GB SSD - $1,250.00
Extra 5770 - $250
TOTAL - $8,549

6,1 (2013 Apple Store)
Computer (8-Core) - $5,499.00
64GB Ram - $1,200
512GB PCIe SSD - $300
Dual D500 - Included
Dual D700 - $600
TOTAL - $6,999 or $7,599 with x2-D700

Add a grand to get the OWC thunder bay ... http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1075759-REG/owc_other_world_computing_16tb_4_x_4tb.html

About the same price...

I believe he's referring to the base system itself...which is $2,000 more with the 6,1.

 

[mattspace]

5,1 (2012 Apple Store)

About the same price...

I'm not sure id include the historical storage and ram costs (given theyre currently purchasable new), since they distort the picture - what we're effectively comparing is what we have now in the nMP, vs what we could have had, had the 6,1 been an evolution of the 5,1.

It's too reminiscent of the G4 cube, intended to command a premium for being compact and its nifty design, it was responded to as "it's less computer, it should be proportionally cheaper".

 

[koyoot]

I believe he's referring to the base system itself...which is $2,000 more with the 6,1.

Base MP 5.1 cost 2499$ with 4 core CPU, 6 GB of RAM, 500 GB HDD(!), and HD5770. That is if I remember correctly.

You got for 2999$ in 6.1: quad core CPU, 12 GB RAM, dual GPUs, that were much faster than HD5770, and 256 GB SSD.

When MP 6.1 was announced it was one of the best values you could get for money in professional space.

Currently it is way overpriced. If they would update hardware to latest Intel Broadwell-EP CPUs, latest AMD/Nvidia silicon with HBM/HBM2 then it would have made sense.

 

[lowendlinux]

Base MP 5.1 cost 2499$ with 4 core CPU, 6 GB of RAM, 500 GB HDD(!), and HD5770. That is if I remember correctly.

You got for 2999$ in 6.1: quad core CPU, 12 GB RAM, dual GPUs, that were much faster than HD5770, and 256 GB SSD.

When MP 6.1 was announced it was one of the best values you could get for money in professional space.

Currently it is way overpriced. If they would update hardware to latest Intel Broadwell-EP CPUs, latest AMD silicon with HBM/HBM2 then it would have made sense.

This is correct

 

[AidenShaw]

...
When MP 6.1 was announced it was one of the best values you could get for money in professional space.
...

More or less true IFF:

• You needed dual GPUs
• You needed modest amounts of ECC memory (12 - 64 GiB)
• You needed a modest number of cores (4 to 12)
• 256 GB of SSD was all you needed
• You didn't have special peripherals (or you already owned T-Bolt versions of them)

If you didn't need dual GPUs or ECC, there were much better values available. If you needed more storage, there was a big T-Bolt tax to pay. If you had PCIe peripherals, another big T-Bolt tax.

The MP6,1's price was competitive if you optioned another system to closely match an MP6,1 config. If you optioned the other system to meet your task requirements, the MP6,1 could be a poor value.

 

[edanuff]

Reports of GPU failure in the nMP is not uncommom on post production forums that use GPU intensive software

Reports of GPU failure in the nMP is not uncommon period.

 

[ITguy2016]

Base MP 5.1 cost 2499$ with 4 core CPU, 6 GB of RAM, 500 GB HDD(!), and HD5770. That is if I remember correctly.

You got for 2999$ in 6.1: quad core CPU, 12 GB RAM, dual GPUs, that were much faster than HD5770, and 256 GB SSD.

When MP 6.1 was announced it was one of the best values you could get for money in professional space.

Currently it is way overpriced. If they would update hardware to latest Intel Broadwell-EP CPUs, latest AMD/Nvidia silicon with HBM/HBM2 then it would have made sense.

I was going off of his example base system. Is it any surprise over time the cost of memory, SSDs, and other things have decreased in price? That is for everything but the computer? The eight core system may be more expensive today based on the cost of the processor alone. But the nMP forced the use of a single, higher cost processor to achieve the same core count as the cMP which could be configured to use two, lower cost processors.

Whether the 6,1 is a better value than competing systems isn't relevant is a discussion comparing the old Mac Pro with the current Mac Pro.

 

[koyoot]

More or less true IFF:

• You needed dual GPUs
• You needed modest amounts of ECC memory (12 - 64 GiB)
• You needed a modest number of cores (4 to 12)
• 256 GB of SSD was all you needed
• You didn't have special peripherals (or you already owned T-Bolt versions of them)

If you didn't need dual GPUs or ECC, there were much better values available. If you needed more storage, there was a big T-Bolt tax to pay. If you had PCIe peripherals, another big T-Bolt tax.

The MP6,1's price was competitive if you optioned another system to closely match an MP6,1 config. If you optioned the other system to meet your task requirements, the MP6,1 could be a poor value.

If all what you described was actually true for anyone, it made Mac Pro even better value.

I was going off of his example base system. Is it any surprise over time the cost of memory, SSDs, and other things have decreased in price? That is for everything but the computer? The eight core system may be more expensive today based on the cost of the processor alone. But the nMP forced the use of a single, higher cost processor to achieve the same core count as the cMP which could be configured to use two, lower cost processors.

Whether the 6,1 is a better value than competing systems isn't relevant is a discussion comparing the old Mac Pro with the current Mac Pro.

What if Next Mac Pro will sport only Fiji ASIC as GPUs, what if base model will have 6 core CPU, with 16 GB of RAM 2400 MHz, and 512 GB SSD NVMe, for the same price as base model 6.1?

6 core Xeon E5v4 3.4 GHz, 16 GB RAM 2400 ECC, Dual Fury level GPUs, 512 GB SSD NVMe. 2999$. Is that good or not good value?

For me it is very good value. How does it look for you?

 

[linuxcooldude]

Whether the 6,1 is a better value than competing systems isn't relevant is a discussion comparing the old Mac Pro with the current Mac Pro.

It certainly could be in the used 6,1 market.

 

[lowendlinux]

If all what you described was actually true for anyone, it made Mac Pro even better value.

What if Next Mac Pro will sport only Fiji ASIC as GPUs, what if base model will have 6 core CPU, with 16 GB of RAM 2400 MHz, and 512 GB SSD NVMe, for the same price as base model 6.1?

6 core Xeon E5 3.4 GHz, 16 GB RAM 2400 ECC, Dual Fury level GPUs, 512 GB SSD NVMe. 2999$. Is that good or not good value?

For me it is very good value. How does it look for you?

If that were to happen I'd buy the tube even if I think it's kinda dumb..

 

[flat five]

Of course you did.

you care to elaborate?

 

[ITguy2016]

What if Next Mac Pro will sport only Fiji ASIC as GPUs, what if base model will have 6 core CPU, with 16 GB of RAM 2400 MHz, and 512 GB SSD NVMe, for the same price as base model 6.1?

6 core Xeon E5v4 3.4 GHz, 16 GB RAM 2400 ECC, Dual Fury level GPUs, 512 GB SSD NVMe. 2999$. Is that good or not good value?

For me it is very good value. How does it look for you?

I'm not going to play the "what if" game. No use discussing something which doesn't yet exist.