I just ordered a studio with the education discount. Pricing being the same with both of my mini m2 pro spec and Studio spec I figured the gpu bump was better and more noticeable then the 10-20% cpu bump which I may or may not see during my time using it. I can only assume with the over lap that there will be a small price jump with the next studio and this should serve me well for at least 3 years or so.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Mac Studio Speculation [Merged]
- Thread starter darkus
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
The problem with that idea is twofold, I think.
1. Mac Pro buyers are a completely different buying group price-wise to Studio Max buyers (and even most Studio Ultra buyers too!), due to the MP likely starting at $7-8k absolute minimum (plus extra to get the machine those buyers really need) and going well into double-digit thousands – maybe as high as $50k if the current MPs are a guide, depending on how Apple handles what goes into the machine to justify its pricing structure.
No other desktop machine other than the Studio has the Max chip in it, as it's clear Apple now delineates each Mac by the name of the chip within and the extra cooling needed for Max and Ultra chips that each Studio offers (Max has much bigger fans than the Mini Pro, while Ultra has those even beefier copper fans). Thus only the Studio will get the Max chips in the desktops.
2. As the second gen Max chip (M2 Max) already exists in the laptop line (in MBPs), Apple must realise buyers will wonder why they don't just put this chip into the desktop Studio in the near future, with a great many now holding-off buying a Studio Max until then if they don't need one right now – especially as we all now understand Apple's philosophy with the Mini's only getting the standard & Pro chips due to the cooling constraints.
Sure, MP is logical to update first as it's very overdue, so around WWDC makes sense for Apple, and they'll want to release it before any Studio update, so the latter doesn't eat into MP sales. With the MP likely have its own new chip name like M2 Extreme, or perhaps its own double/quad versions of the Ultra (Ultra Duo / Ultra Quad), and top pro buyers who need and can afford them will purchase.
But the majority of buyers waiting will not be in that MP buying group due to the very high cost, so will then be dying to buy an updated Studio with the Max chip ASAP. Autumn makes sense for that (~20 months since Mar 2022 release of current model), as the standard M3 chip is likely to hit MBAs in early 2024 (~18 months since Jun 2022 release of current model), then some months delay before they can do M3 Pro & Max variants for MBPs at end of 2024 (~18 months from Jan 2023).
We'll have to see, of course!
Apple may think that if Studio users want more up to date CPU and more GPU cores, they'd have to pay for a (basic) MP. Which might be priced for a basic configuration even as low as 3999 dollars. I think actually that's Apple's new strategy.The problem with that idea is twofold, I think.
1. Mac Pro buyers are a completely different buying group price-wise to Studio Max buyers (and even most Studio Ultra buyers too!), due to the MP likely starting at $7-8k absolute minimum (plus extra to get the machine those buyers really need) and going well into double-digit thousands – maybe as high as $50k if the current MPs are a guide, depending on how Apple handles what goes into the machine to justify its pricing structure.
No other desktop machine other than the Studio has the Max chip in it, as it's clear Apple now delineates each Mac by the name of the chip within and the extra cooling needed for Max and Ultra chips that each Studio offers (Max has much bigger fans than the Mini Pro, while Ultra has those even beefier copper fans). Thus only the Studio will get the Max chips in the desktops.
2. As the second gen Max chip (M2 Max) already exists in the laptop line (in MBPs), Apple must realise buyers will wonder why they don't just put this chip into the desktop Studio in the near future, with a great many now holding-off buying a Studio Max until then if they don't need one right now – especially as we all now understand Apple's philosophy with the Mini's only getting the standard & Pro chips due to the cooling constraints.
Sure, MP is logical to update first as it's very overdue, so around WWDC makes sense for Apple, and they'll want to release it before any Studio update, so the latter doesn't eat into MP sales. With the MP likely have its own new chip name like M2 Extreme, or perhaps its own double/quad versions of the Ultra (Ultra Duo / Ultra Quad), and top pro buyers who need and can afford them will purchase.
But the majority of buyers waiting will not be in that MP buying group due to the very high cost, so will then be dying to buy an updated Studio with the Max chip ASAP. Autumn makes sense for that (~20 months since Mar 2022 release of current model), as the standard M3 chip is likely to hit MBAs in early 2024 (~18 months since Jun 2022 release of current model), then some months delay before they can do M3 Pro & Max variants for MBPs at end of 2024 (~18 months from Jan 2023).
We'll have to see, of course!
I think you're right that the Studio likely won't get an update until after the Pro releases.
For me there is nearly nothing they could do that would cause me to change out my Studio. It would need to have some sort of functionality that I want. Chip speed means nothing as the current one is far past my needs. My point is there are different types of Studio buyers - some (like me) that bought it because the Mini couldn't do what I wanted, others who use if for "pro" needs. There's really a wide range of configurations - the base Studio and a fully specced Ultra are sort of different animals.
That's wishful thinking. There's no way in hell they're gonna start at $4k for MPs, given they already get buyers to pay that as a starting price for the Studio Ultra. Unless they completely dismantle their current very high-end usership of the MP, which is highly unlikely as they already have the Studio Ultra for buyers in the $4-8k price range.
Agree, while prices deliberately cross-over to tempt going up to the higher machine, their main price points are separate... i.e. Mini vs. Mini Pro are different animals. And Studio Max vs. Studio Ultra are different animals.
And no doubt the same will be true of the MP, e.g. MP Duo / MP Quad (Duo: $7-15k / Quad: $14-50k), very different price points, but with that same cross-over.
Last edited:
The iMac is a bit of an anomaly. I am not sure. I wouldn’t be surprised if they announced an M2 model in the spring. But I also wouldn’t be surprised if they waited until M3 and released an M3 air and iMac at the same time.
something is off with the 27” being discontinued. I don’t think that’s a long term move. But I haven’t figured that one out yet. Maybe they’re waiting to update both at the same time?
Im not sure why it would start at such a high price? The only rumors we have right now say the baseline Mac Pro comes with the Ultra chip. The Ultra studio starts at $4K. As far as we know, the only real difference with the Mac Pro will be expandability. Does that warrant another $3-4K just for a few PCIe slots? I doubt it. I think they’ll keep the baseline price of $6K at the very most but they would really have to sell us on expandability for it to really make sense. Especially since those PCIe slots may not even be that useful for many if we can’t add another GPU card.
I would argue the majority of Mac Studio sales already happened. People who need that kind of desktop power have likely already gotten the machine. A few who held out got the new mini instead. The Ultra is still a beast. Also keep in mind the Studio accounts for 1% of all Mac sales, and I’m sure that number has gone down in recent months. It’s such a trivial number Apple can afford to not care about it. In reality it makes more business sense to not update it every generation due to such low volume.
You are right. A16 was a disappointment when you consider the insane leaps forward the chip team have done over the last decade. (For the iPhone it’s plenty of power though). That’s not something I thought about in consideration with macs, but I do think that’s where they will skip a generation.
We’ve already seen rumors that claim M3 will be on 3nm too so that would confirm our theory. And seems like we could see it later this year.
this difference is a huge deal for folks who need it and will come with a hefty premium.
(besides, what's an extra 3K$ on a 50+K$ machine when that's what needed for the job?)
Exact headline starting price is not that important. The point is that the current MP goes up rapidly in price after adding a couple of very basic obvious add-ons (out of the whopping SIX options available!). Sure, they likely won't have the same options that Intel machines need, but don't worry, Apple aren't going to give up all that tasty upgrade income from professionals with often very large budgets – they'll be plenty of needy expensive options, as there always has been. ;-)
Some rumours state the MP might have Ultra's, but what they don't stipulate is that they'll probably be Duo or Quad Ultra's (or named Extreme or similar).
Anyway, this conversation is becoming circular now. So we'll really have to see about the Studio after the MP arrives.
There is absolutely NO way that the new Mac Pro will be any cheaper than CAD7K. What you are saying is wishful thinking... The Mac Pro buyer is NOT price sensitive, and it is not only the CPU that drives that purchase but the entire ecosystem inside that computer, the expandability, the PSU, the RAM possibilities, the storage addition, etc. The fact that you can put in 2+ GPUs is a huge deal for that market.
Look at my sig... My Mac Pros do vastly different work than my Mac Studio.
I agreed all of them with you. I watched a benchmark video and Blender render times for base 14'' M2 MBPro looks very fast. On a YT video 14'' M2 MBPro 16 core GPU classroom scene 2:11, I render out same scene with and 48 core M1 Ultra 00:55. This is a huge improvement on GPU side for M2. There is another 14'' MBPro model with 30 GPU, with a perfect scaling if anyone could render out same scene it has to be rendered out more or less 1:10. If M2's GPU Scales better than M1, M2 Ultra will have 2X or X3 GPU power than M1 Ultra, if Apple will release M2 Ultra in the future. I hope Apple could be fixed GPU scaling on M2.
That’s assuming they sell a $50K machine. and if they do, that model isn’t likely a top seller for this category.
The difference could be huge, but is it worth $3-4K for those who are getting sub-$10K machines? No.
I’m not sure why people think this. Just because *some* are not price sensitive does not mean that all buyers are. I know many that buy Mac Pro’s every 5-7 years that are assuredly price sensitive and an extra $3-4K would be a big deal if they’re already spending $6-7K.
The more I think about it, I wonder if the studio would slot in as a sort of SE model in the desktop lineup, that would continue to exist with the top end chipset from the previous iteration. For example give the pro the M2 ultra and studio gets the m1 ultra.
Then when its time, move the pro to an m3 ultra and give the studio m2 ultra
TBH I wouldn’t mind that arrangement at all, since the studio form factor needs to continue, it’s just so good.
Then when its time, move the pro to an m3 ultra and give the studio m2 ultra
TBH I wouldn’t mind that arrangement at all, since the studio form factor needs to continue, it’s just so good.
Last edited:
Exactly right. The Mini Pro and Studio base model meet similar (but not the same) needs. My guess is most people probably will find the Mini Pro a better fit, but not everyone (including me). The only thing the Studio affords me that I couldn't get with the Mini Pro is the ability to support 3-4 TB monitors. I'd probably just go with two monitors (one 32") and the Mini Pro if I were buying today. But no regrets as I love my current set-up (3 monitors is sweet overkill).
Yep. Thats why I didn't wait to get a M2 mini. I want that big ram and big ssd. More of everything. I was thinking of generic pc and running os/x on it. Not legal but it works and works well for a lot cheaper than Apple
I could be mistaken, but I seem to recall Quo or Gurman saying last year that the iMac may skip the m2 and get the m3 in the 2nd half of 2023. Who knows though…
Fair enough - not ALL Mac Pro owners are price insensitive, but the majority really do not care if their Mac Pro will cost $7, $8, or $10k. I worked in professional graphics and if I wanted a new Mac Pro, or any other PC, or if I “just” wanted to add new GPUs, all I had to do was call my technical dept. I once got 4xAMD FirePro cards ($2K a pop) for CAD work for just one project. Shaving literally days of rendering time made the purchase worth it.
I know there are hobbyists/prosumers buying Mac Pros, but they probably would be a lot better off buying Mac Studios.
With the Apple Silicon challenges surrounding expanding RAM and multiple GPUs, I believe the AS CPU they will end up using in the upcoming Mac Pro will be so highly customized that price will be even higher than today’s offerings…
Its is impossible because Apple never upgrade top-expensive models after 1 year .
The Studios will get M2 chips only next year .
Or, the Mac Studios will get M3 Max and Ultra next year. I think the M2 generation CPUs have such little improvements over the M1 CPUs, that the Mac Studio will skip that series.
I agree with you, it's to little improvement as the M1 Ultra can handle up to 128GB of ram already so the 96GB are not needed.
My guess is like yours that studio will skip that version.
I did buy M1 Max 64GB / 1TB yesterday as the 32GB M1 Pro MacBook was not good enugh for me when I was developing. So now that's my mobile devices and the studio is my work machine.
Love it.