always makes it extra irritating when something is not directly reproducible doesn't it!
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Mac studio v1 fan noise - it's going to be one of the loudest Macs at idle.
- Thread starter AdamSeen
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ABSOLUTELY, I've tried everything to reproduce it or make it stop, however, it's TOTALLY random. I would say it's 99.9% PSU, but the situation with whine changing when you change RPM makes it extra difficult to understand the problem, however, I'm sure it's not possible for a fan to make that noise randomly. It would either do it all the time or not at all.
I agree that it probably won’t make much difference at idle, but if I start using it. Now I’ve tried using macsfancontrol to track the combined cpu temp…think 37-70c was what I had it; that’ll probably be fine…but it’s an awful lot of money for a computer to start hacking it, and accepting “probably”…especially since these really aren’t user repairable…
Anyway regarding your intermittent whine, are you sure you’re not just noticing it under different circumstances…for example, it’s mostly reflected sound you’re hearing, unless you have the back pointed towards you…I’ve found moving my head one way and it goes away…any other noises in the room will mask it also, especially during the day…so far I would say it’s 100% consistent…I stick my ear to the back of it every so often to check also…
I'm also on the fence whether it's an airflow whistling, or actual coil whine...I'm leaning towards airflow whistling, even though I agree it doesn't sound like it...but FWIW I have an air-purifier that makes a very similar sound (Levoit 300S), and pretty sure it's airflow in that case also.
The whole thing is a design flaw...it should just have one large fan like the 2013 Mac Pro etc...
Anyway, give my theory a try, every time you hear it, check how loud it is by putting your ear to the back of it, but also every time you notice you can't hear it, check with a close up also. It might be just your perception of it that's intermittent...I thought the same at first...but I've settled that it's 100% consistent on mine...
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Not sure if you get it, but it's literally whistling xD. Once it starts, I adjust the RPM between 1180 and 1260 for the rest of the day. One RPM point always mitigates the issue for the rest of the day, or sometimes two. Over the time it starts being more noticeable (ofc, not during the day when I have window open, but specifically when it's quiet) and eventually starts literally whistling. At this time there's shortage of units in my country so I'll live with it for a few more months, especially as I wear headphones so I never actually hear it, but as soon as I see more units coming in I will gladly take it to my store and replace it for a new one, and if that one starts whistling/whining, I'll replace it for another one and another one until eventually I get money back or stable unit
Hope you are not fighting a losing battle Opensource03 .
I have decided to go with the M1 Mac Mini, amazing reports. and silent
I have decided to go with the M1 Mac Mini, amazing reports. and silent
Is this the sound:Not sure if you get it, but it's literally whistling xD. Once it starts, I adjust the RPM between 1180 and 1260 for the rest of the day. One RPM point always mitigates the issue for the rest of the day, or sometimes two. Over the time it starts being more noticeable (ofc, not during the day when I have window open, but specifically when it's quiet) and eventually starts literally whistling. At this time there's shortage of units in my country so I'll live with it for a few more months, especially as I wear headphones so I never actually hear it, but as soon as I see more units coming in I will gladly take it to my store and replace it for a new one, and if that one starts whistling/whining, I'll replace it for another one and another one until eventually I get money back or stable unit
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Yes Simacc
You could adjust the fan speed.
I think that video sounds like the whistling sound many people are hearing, thats why I have decided to avoid it, as it would sit just 1 foot from me in my totally silent treated room, I couldnt live with that noise, and it seems crazy to have to adjust a fan speed on a £2000 Professional computer.
You could adjust the fan speed.
I think that video sounds like the whistling sound many people are hearing, thats why I have decided to avoid it, as it would sit just 1 foot from me in my totally silent treated room, I couldnt live with that noise, and it seems crazy to have to adjust a fan speed on a £2000 Professional computer.
I just realised it's a tritone, F# and C...can't believe I didn't notice that earlier...probably why it's so annoying...it wants to go to G....though if I left a low D droning in my studio all day it wouldn't bother me lol...the F# is very close to 12tet 440...the C is about a 1/4 tone sharp...I'm hearing it as a (sharp) C though...not a (flat) C# (probably because the F# is bang on)...
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It's a joke, I have a near silent studio also...it's not unbearable, but it's irritating, you won't hear it mixing TBH though, I monitor at about 82-88dB...I'm probably going to return it for a Mac Mini M1 TBH, for music it's really not much faster...I've only had it two days...
Just imagine the sound when he changes fan speed, that's the one this one constantly sounds like...
If it just had 24GB option like M2s have, I would've very much go for it.
I really wouldn't worry about the RAM, I thought that for months, but imagine if you could only get 8GB RAM, and suddenly you can now get 16GB! you would go for it! 16GB RAM on the M1 is meant to be the same as an Intel 32GB RAM anyways. So many amazing reviews too.
It pains me to say that my Refurbished Max 32 Core GPU/1TB HD has a slight whine. The computer is in perfect condition but the whine it makes is louder than the whine my APC Battery backup makes.
I honestly don't mind loud fans since I have a gaming computer with tons of fans its just the high pitch sounds drive me bonkers. Especially for a device that was going to cost me over 2k....
Starting the return process
I honestly don't mind loud fans since I have a gaming computer with tons of fans its just the high pitch sounds drive me bonkers. Especially for a device that was going to cost me over 2k....
Starting the return process
Try this, completely cover the vents on the bottom with both hands for ten seconds, you'll really hear that whistle go mad for a few seconds, but the rpm won't increase...I'm going bet it's airflow whistling and not coil whine...this happens in airconditioning systems when there's not enough return airflow...when those intake vents on the bottom get full of dust this yoke is going to whistle like crazy...I seriously doubt there's a silent one out there at all, and replacing them is pointless, this looks like a design flaw...f*** it, think I'm going to have to return it.
I sincerely recommend that anyone who is sensitive to noise doesn't buy one of these...it's a heartbreaker...feel like I wasted all my savings on a gone off lemon...the performance in Logic Studio is not impressive either...buy an M1 Mac Mini, 16GB, 1TB, 10G, done; had a loan of that exact machine for a month...
I sincerely recommend that anyone who is sensitive to noise doesn't buy one of these...it's a heartbreaker...feel like I wasted all my savings on a gone off lemon...the performance in Logic Studio is not impressive either...buy an M1 Mac Mini, 16GB, 1TB, 10G, done; had a loan of that exact machine for a month...
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I hardly believe it’s every unit, apple would for sure be sued or something. It would be in public eyes in matter of weeks. Seems like about 10-20% of units have this problem, whatever it is.
And it’s most likely not dust. There are people using it for months without any issues… Some people, though, experience the issue the first day. Dust can’t accumulate in one day and does for sure accumulate over one month. Doesn’t make much sense.
i'm guessing (using this thread as a metric), that estimate is at least an order of magnitude high.
(~35 complaints/1600 posts).
^ the number of posts can’t be the denominator, as many have posted multiple times for various reasons. For our metric we ideally need the number of machines with the whine (but a standardized definition is needed) versus the number of machines received.
I estimated at most 6% (but probably less) in the thread with the poll asking how noisy is your studio max versus ultra.
Note that the whine was not specified as part of this poll.
IIRC @southerndoc created a new poll, cut off when 100 votes had been collected, that addressed the whine and got 30 positives! However, though this particular poll was a good idea I fear it overestimates, as those with the whine would - I think - have been much more likely to notice that thread and be motivated to vote when they did.
Therefore, I used the "how noisy" figures instead, and made the dubious assumption those who returned their studio have the whine and those who didn’t, don’t.
For the denominator I used the number of orders in another thread with a poll of studio orders (some 604 at the time IIRC).
However, I noted not everyone who could vote necessarily did vote in either poll (though maybe those with a noise issue are more likely to vote in the noise poll than those who made an order).
And it’s clear the noise poll is now out of date (perhaps because it’s slipped out of view) as there have been recent new reports of the noise issue in this thread but no new votes in that one. We now have 39 at least including one with a refurbished unit - not good.
I agree 10-20% sounds too high. I think 6% sounds too high as well. But, really, my estimate is largely futile as the margin of error is likely to be much higher than if these were fair samples (low confidence in the assumptions, differential voting proclivities, different ambient noise levels, different hearing acuities and special sensitivities in some cases, etc).
The one check I was able to make was that, with one of our luckless fellow members striking out four times and the figure of 6% one could estimate about 80,000 studios had been shipped to that date. However, I don’t know we’ll even find out this number…
Conclusion? I have no confidence in any estimate at this point. I do have confidence that some of us have studios with a whine issue. For the record, my machine doesn’t have this problem, at least not yet.
I estimated at most 6% (but probably less) in the thread with the poll asking how noisy is your studio max versus ultra.
Note that the whine was not specified as part of this poll.
IIRC @southerndoc created a new poll, cut off when 100 votes had been collected, that addressed the whine and got 30 positives! However, though this particular poll was a good idea I fear it overestimates, as those with the whine would - I think - have been much more likely to notice that thread and be motivated to vote when they did.
Therefore, I used the "how noisy" figures instead, and made the dubious assumption those who returned their studio have the whine and those who didn’t, don’t.
For the denominator I used the number of orders in another thread with a poll of studio orders (some 604 at the time IIRC).
However, I noted not everyone who could vote necessarily did vote in either poll (though maybe those with a noise issue are more likely to vote in the noise poll than those who made an order).
And it’s clear the noise poll is now out of date (perhaps because it’s slipped out of view) as there have been recent new reports of the noise issue in this thread but no new votes in that one. We now have 39 at least including one with a refurbished unit - not good.
I agree 10-20% sounds too high. I think 6% sounds too high as well. But, really, my estimate is largely futile as the margin of error is likely to be much higher than if these were fair samples (low confidence in the assumptions, differential voting proclivities, different ambient noise levels, different hearing acuities and special sensitivities in some cases, etc).
The one check I was able to make was that, with one of our luckless fellow members striking out four times and the figure of 6% one could estimate about 80,000 studios had been shipped to that date. However, I don’t know we’ll even find out this number…
Conclusion? I have no confidence in any estimate at this point. I do have confidence that some of us have studios with a whine issue. For the record, my machine doesn’t have this problem, at least not yet.
I think the only one can be reasonably drawn from this, as its been discussed in a Mac centric discussion forum since the rollout of the studio… For this problem to continue on as it has leads me to the opinion this is a problem Apple was very much aware of early on and has done nothing of substance about it to date… these machines are not cheap, and they are making money hand over fist on them, and are still serving these flawed, many w/known, manufacture defects, to a much disappointed loyal fan base. As soon as i heard about this i put my purchasing decision on hold and its still on hold, much to my disappointment.
The only conclusion one can reasonably come to is Apple is now allowing their dark and small segment of parasitical Wall Street types to continue to push out a defective product; cost to the companies QC reputation be damned. Instead of people having quality to use in justification of an expensive product, Apple has now taken the quality defense away… and now we have to justify why we (or anyone) would pay excessive prices for run of the mill low quality junk…
In the meantime I will chug away on my 10 year old Mac waiting for Apple to possibly produce something that i can justify the expenditure on… perhaps they will focus their Quality Control process on the Mac Pro models or maybe even a high end mini… the Mac Pro lineup will be interesting to see how they handle the end user “expandability“ aspect they are trying really hard to take away from everyone…
It's not the kind of thing many people would notice...everyone I know would say I'm being OTT...I've read at least 10 posts where people have returned it two or three times with no change...pretty much everyone who puts their ear up to the back of it can detect the whine...so far every video or recording of it sounds the same to me, even ones where people are trying to say there's no whine, the differences are only how it's recorded...those frequencies are always there.
also if you have any kind of hearing damage at all, around 2kHz is where you'll have a dip (ask any audiologist), could be up to 30dB down or more around there...I have no significant hearing damage or tinnitus, and yes I've had my ears tested...I have a slight dip around 2k in my right ear from an ear infection as a kid (so he thinks), but only a few dB, I do actually find it harder to detect the noise if I put the computer on my right...besides being an audio engineer, I can tune a piano by ear, my ears are way above average.
I said "when" those intake vents get full of dust it's going to get way way worse, which they will...as my test where I partially covered them with my hands proves...try it.
For anyone that's interested the two most predominant frequencies are about 1499 (F#) and 2155 (C +50) at idle (for 1330 or so rpm)...I haven't set up a measurement mic and smaart yet, but got those the old fashioned way, by moving a signal gen and listening for beats, they're close...but of course it doesn't stay at the same rpm, so those will change a little (it seems to wander around 1320 to about 1348 rpm on mine)...
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Has anyone posted about there being at least 2 completely different PSU designs? Could 1 design be responsible for the noise.
I was watching Linus Tech Tips trying to do a Mac Studio SSD swap and he had 2 mac studios and noticed 2 completely different PSU designs as shown below. the one on the left is liteon power technology and the one on the right is delta. I wonder if the people complaining about the noise all have the same psu manufacturer. Linus swapped them to see if they would work and they worked fine in both studio display units.
I was watching Linus Tech Tips trying to do a Mac Studio SSD swap and he had 2 mac studios and noticed 2 completely different PSU designs as shown below. the one on the left is liteon power technology and the one on the right is delta. I wonder if the people complaining about the noise all have the same psu manufacturer. Linus swapped them to see if they would work and they worked fine in both studio display units.
That's one theory OK, I think there's actually 3 different types...but who's going to open their one and void return or warranty...It doesn't look that difficult to open at all, but the cover on the screws is going to be a giveaway that you've been in there.
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There's another "silent" one...note the two frequencies in the middle graph:
And if you want to do it by ear...note he has it under his desk...but I can still hear the noise at his listening position.
Comparing it to a RAID array of HDDs, I mean really...
Compared to my NAS with enterprise drives, boy is the Mac Studio silent…ditto Mac Pro 4,1…but compared to my 2012 15” MBP, it’s loud…(in fairness I turned off turboboost on the 2012 and haven’t heard the fans in years)…
actually I find the Mac Studio more annoying than the Mac Pro 4,1…there’s no tonal elements to the Mac Pro…if you look up the literature on making noise measurements, it’s well documented that noise that has “tonal” components is way more annoying…it's going to drive me mad now that I've spotted it's a tritone...
And if you want to do it by ear...note he has it under his desk...but I can still hear the noise at his listening position.
Comparing it to a RAID array of HDDs, I mean really...
Compared to my NAS with enterprise drives, boy is the Mac Studio silent…ditto Mac Pro 4,1…but compared to my 2012 15” MBP, it’s loud…(in fairness I turned off turboboost on the 2012 and haven’t heard the fans in years)…
actually I find the Mac Studio more annoying than the Mac Pro 4,1…there’s no tonal elements to the Mac Pro…if you look up the literature on making noise measurements, it’s well documented that noise that has “tonal” components is way more annoying…it's going to drive me mad now that I've spotted it's a tritone...
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