Mountain Lion - are MacPros screwed?

[goMac]

I know, another thread... However looking at the iOS features of Mountain Lion coming again to Macs, is there even slightest support for professionals in Apple's future?

Anyway, I am happy I bought 2010 Mac Pro. I am good to go for couple of years and have time to think what to do if...

Just because it's not publicized doesn't mean it's not there.

Mountain Lion contains a lot of new goodies for Pro apps under the hood, especially video apps. And as already has been noted, there are driver enhancements for Pro GPUs.

I have an NDA, so I can't really talk about it, but what Apple publicizes isn't necessarily all the changes.

 

[Amethyst]

A few things.
1) there was no option E
2) You think those are product that will NEVER, EVER go away? So in the 3011 apple will still be selling Mac Pros, Mac Books, iMacs, and iPhones?
3) I should have been more clear. This is a thought experiment. A game.
4) I ask the question because i'm curious, not because i have an agenda or am trying to make a point.

I apologize for any confusion I may have caused.

That my opinion. Atleast in near future.

 

[minifridge1138]

That's a tough call in some ways. The MacBook lines may be getting a new name... does that count?

I would say that counts.
The Mac Pro would go away, but could be replaced with an iMac Pro or Mini Pro, etc.
XServe was discontinued and replaced with a Mini Server and a Pro Server.
The plain Mac Book was discontinued, but the Mac Book Air/Pro still lives strong.

I think that IF <--- IF ---> it goes away, Apple will have something to fill the void (in their eye). Maybe it's beefed up iMac or Mini, or a PRO thunderbolt device. No idea.

 

[Honbe]

Your thread title is "Are MacPros Screwed".

Expect a variety of answers due to the ambiguity of the title.

Yes some Mac Pro computers won't run ML. That's the natural progression of computers.

Some PC's won't run Windows 8 either.

What will those Mac Pro computers be running then? IF Apple will not have "professional" desktop operating system, why to offer workstation for pro users? I do not see any logic for Apple here, however my name is certainly not Tim Cook.

 

[toxic]

complaining about poor multi-monitor and mixed OS environment support is valid but has nothing to do with iOS. complaining about some bundled applications is a waste of time. just because OS X gets some iOS ports and iCloud integration doesn't make it less powerful than it was before.

 

[dergaderg]

Apple's not going to kill the pro line or kill pro features.

They need these Workstations and everything for people to develop apps for the mac. Xcode!

 

[Peace]

What will those Mac Pro computers be running then? IF Apple will not have "professional" desktop operating system, why to offer workstation for pro users? I do not see any logic for Apple here, however my name is certainly not Tim Cook.

They will be running the same O/S that is running on them now.

Other than that I don't know what to tell you. Mountain Lion is not less professional than Leopard or Snow Leopard.

 

[Honbe]

complaining about poor multi-monitor and mixed OS environment support is valid but has nothing to do with iOS. complaining about some bundled applications is a waste of time. just because OS X gets some iOS ports and iCloud integration doesn't make it less powerful than it was before.

THIS is true. The problem does not necessarily lies in the fact, that Apple introduces iOS features into OSX. The question is, if it will still be stable powerful system for pro users despite that. Will that be on Apple's list?
Judging by Lion, I am not so sure here.

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They will be running the same O/S that is running on them now.

Other than that I don't know what to tell you. Mountain Lion is not less professional than Leopard or Snow Leopard.

Don't want to argue, but they won't as it will not be supported. Lion is less professional than Snow Leopard in MY opinion and if Apple continues this path with ML...

 

[jasonvp]

Lion is less professional than Snow Leopard in MY opinion and if Apple continues this path with ML...

But that's YOUR opinion. I'm a professional, as it turns out (definition of professional: gets paid for work). I use Lion on a daily basis and it works perfectly for me. It's no less or more "professional" than SL is. An OS isn't "professional", like it or not. It may have features and functionality that make it difficult for some people to accomplish what they do on a daily basis. It doesn't mean it's "unprofessional".

jas

 

[Honbe]

Just because it's not publicized doesn't mean it's not there.

Mountain Lion contains a lot of new goodies for Pro apps under the hood, especially video apps. And as already has been noted, there are driver enhancements for Pro GPUs.

I have an NDA, so I can't really talk about it, but what Apple publicizes isn't necessarily all the changes.

Well than this is rather good...

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But that's YOUR opinion. I'm a professional, as it turns out (definition of professional: gets paid for work). I use Lion on a daily basis and it works perfectly for me. It's no less or more "professional" than SL is. An OS isn't "professional", like it or not. It may have features and functionality that make it difficult for some people to accomplish what they do on a daily basis. It doesn't mean it's "unprofessional".

jas

I used the word "professional" to describe what pro users expect from an OS - professional features (as per your definition those used to get paid for work done) and stability. According to this, Lion is less professional than SL as it lacks these features, they do not work as they should / are expected to or because Lion is less stable.

Lion works perfectly for many people, I for one love it on my Macbook Air.

 

[jasonvp]

I used the word "professional" to describe what pro users expect from an OS - professional features

And what "professional features" are those?

Wait. Don't. This is the wrong forum for such discussions. (hint hint).

(as per your definition those used to get paid for work done)

But I'm a professional in that I also get paid to do work with my Mac. And as it turns out, Lion works fine for me, as is. Does that, perhaps, make me less professional? Or others more professional?

and stability.

Lion's been no more or less stable than any previous version of OS X I've used.

According to this, Lion is less professional than SL as it lacks these features, they do not work as they should / are expected to or because Lion is less stable.

No offense meant but I think you're grasping at straws; I'm sensing you're not using your Mac to make money and are just making ASSumptions about what folks need for their work based on what you're choosing to read here.

Or more accurately, what you're reading in the Lion section of this forum (hint hint).

jas

 

[Honbe]

And what "professional features" are those?

Wait. Don't. This is the wrong forum for such discussions. (hint hint).



But I'm a professional in that I also get paid to do work with my Mac. And as it turns out, Lion works fine for me, as is. Does that, perhaps, make me less professional? Or others more professional?



Lion's been no more or less stable than any previous version of OS X I've used.



No offense meant but I think you're grasping at straws; I'm sensing you're not using your Mac to make money and are just making ASSumptions about what folks need for their work based on what you're choosing to read here.

Or more accurately, what you're reading in the Lion section of this forum (hint hint).

jas

I am being honest and you are funny...
I've stated before what these features I am talking about are, please read in case you want to find out.
I am making money using Mac Pro as you are (maybe you need to work on your senses). None of us is less "professional" and I am happy Lion works for you. Not so much for me compare to SL.

My original ASSumption was, that if this path continues I am getting a feeling Apple is leaving "pro" users behind.

 

[wonderspark]

I have a dual-boot PC for the purpose of separating my 'work' from 'play' computing, but I haven't created a dual-boot Mac yet. With Snow Leopard, it's been fine running work and play in the same boot. Lion and Mountain Lion make me really nervous, however.

Any opinions or suggestions for running a SL/ML dual-boot?

 

[akm3]

That's a tough call in some ways. The MacBook lines may be getting a new name... does that count? The Mac Pro would be first, but who knows how long it would really take.

The problem with Apple discontinuing the Mac Pro is they don't just lose the Mac Pro sales. What they could lose include:

• Laptop sales to the people who used to use Pros.
• iMac sales to people who used to use pros
• Laptop and iMac sales to family members of those who used to use Mac Pros
• Laptop and iMac sales to friends of people who no longer use those Mac Pros.
• iPad sales to those using Win 8 (instead of Macs) on Intel and get Win 8 tablets.

In my opinion, not updating the Mac Pros is probably impacting Mac sales already and would impact those even more if Apple stops selling Mac Pros.

By impacting Mac sales do you mean 'growing more than the market and shipping in record numbers" ? I'm not sure what Apple's incentive to change is f your hypothesis is correct.

 

[GoCubsGo]

The use of Expose or lack thereof does not make a machine any more or less pro. That's just stupid.

 

[Bear]

By impacting Mac sales do you mean 'growing more than the market and shipping in record numbers" ? I'm not sure what Apple's incentive to change is f your hypothesis is correct.

My point is that dropping the Mac Pro would have a negative impact on growth. In other words, I think there would've been more growth if the Mac Pro had been updated recently. And I think dropping the Mac Pro would cause the growth to be not as fast as it could be. Although if Mac sales stop growing so much by the time the Mac Pro is dropped, yes there could be a sales shrinkage in Macs.

Does it make sense now?

 

[jasonvp]

Any opinions or suggestions for running a SL/ML dual-boot?

While I've never done it, I'd guess it would be easy to set up initially. Either use 2 different drives, or 2 GUID partitions on a single drive. The challenge is remembering to hold the Option key when the machine boots so that you get the choice of which OS, otherwise it's going to boot the version of OS X on the first partition.

I'm guessing there's some sort of third-party boot manager that'll work on a Mac? Like Linux's GRUB, et al? If so, perhaps that could be the way to choose.

The challenge you may run into is: where will your applications live? Or will you install them twice? Having them in some other place besides /Applications is a PITA (I've tried it. It is.) Also, a lot of apps, for better, for worse, sprinkle crud into other parts of the OS.

jas

 

[wonderspark]

While I've never done it, I'd guess it would be easy to set up initially. Either use 2 different drives, or 2 GUID partitions on a single drive. The challenge is remembering to hold the Option key when the machine boots so that you get the choice of which OS, otherwise it's going to boot the version of OS X on the first partition.

I'm guessing there's some sort of third-party boot manager that'll work on a Mac? Like Linux's GRUB, et al? If so, perhaps that could be the way to choose.

The challenge you may run into is: where will your applications live? Or will you install them twice? Having them in some other place besides /Applications is a PITA (I've tried it. It is.) Also, a lot of apps, for better, for worse, sprinkle crud into other parts of the OS.

jas

I'd most likely set up a completely new HDD or SSD for Mountain Lion and reinstall my work apps on it, in an attempt to keep things as clean and separate as possible. I'm fine with holding the Option key during boot when booting the the 'work' drive. It's the "crud sprinkle" that I'm wondering about. Two physical disks should prevent that, right? If so, I can safely give 10.8 a try as my 'play' system, and if it turns out to be safe, move back to a single boot.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

Is it possible to upgrade the 2007 MP's to run ML?

 

[ashman70]

Is it possible to upgrade the 2007 MP's to run ML?

They aren't on the 'officially supported' list so the short answer is, no.
But who knows what people may be able to pull off when it comes out, my gut says, no, never, but hey, what do I know?

 

[minifridge1138]

I have a dual-boot PC for the purpose of separating my 'work' from 'play' computing, but I haven't created a dual-boot Mac yet. With Snow Leopard, it's been fine running work and play in the same boot. Lion and Mountain Lion make me really nervous, however.

Any opinions or suggestions for running a SL/ML dual-boot?

I am running a dual-boot SL/Lion setup right now.

Initially, i wanted the dual boot because I got Lion the first day it was available and am always hesitant with version 1.0 of any software. I had a spare disk, so figured I'd keep SL just incase.

I seldom boot to SL anymore. I have 1 program that I need for work that will not work in Lion. I don't use it often, but when I need it, i NEED IT!!!

From what I've seen of Mountain Lion, I have no problem updating my Lion partition to ML. But I'm not getting rid of the Snow Leopard install.

 

[wonderspark]

I am running a dual-boot SL/Lion setup right now.

Initially, i wanted the dual boot because I got Lion the first day it was available and am always hesitant with version 1.0 of any software. I had a spare disk, so figured I'd keep SL just incase.

I seldom boot to SL anymore. I have 1 program that I need for work that will not work in Lion. I don't use it often, but when I need it, i NEED IT!!!

From what I've seen of Mountain Lion, I have no problem updating my Lion partition to ML. But I'm not getting rid of the Snow Leopard install.

Do you have the same programs on both boots, and if so, how does it handle that? I'm most concerned about Adobe Premiere and After Effects CS5.

 

[ActionableMango]

Well, adding iOS features to OSX does certainly "screw" OSX as a professional workstation system.

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Exactly. This is one of many examples...

Your example of removing features from an application does not explain how adding features to OS X screws OS X.

Somehow people interpret Mountain Lion as some sort of bastard hybrid of OS X and iOS. When I look at it, it simply appears to be Lion plus the following:
iCloud
iMessage
Notification Center
Game Center
Airplay Mirroring
Gatekeeper
Share Sheets
Twitter
Notes
Reminders

I don't see anything in that list that will "screw" OS X or Mac Pro. If you don't like any of those apps, don't use them.

OTOH, maybe some of those might be useful to pros. For example, Airplay Mirroring would allow you to demo the video you just created on any ATV on the network.

I think Snow Leopard to Lion was the upgrade that screwed many users, by dumping Rosetta and replacing Spaces with Mission Control. The Lion to ML upgrade doesn't seem bad at all, at least not from what little information we have so far.

I guess you have your opinion and that's fine, I just don't understand it.

 

[minifridge1138]

Do you have the same programs on both boots, and if so, how does it handle that? I'm most concerned about Adobe Premiere and After Effects CS5.

I can usually launch programs from the Snow Leopard partition from within Lion.
It also works the other way, assuming the program isn't Lion Exclusive.

I don't have any programs that rely on License Keys such as PhotoShop, so I can't say how that would work.

Performance would suck, but you could always buy Lion and install it on a USB hard drive (or thumb drive) and take it for a test drive.

I installed Lion onto a thumbdrive just to see how my MacBook would handle it. It doesn't support gestures (it's a 2007 mac book without multi-touch or whatever it's called) but I was very surprised how smoothly it ran for being on a thumb drive. I ultimately decided i preferred Snow Leopard for the MacBook.

 

[MacOG728893]

\complaining about some bundled applications is a waste of time. just because OS X gets some iOS ports and iCloud integration doesn't make it less powerful than it was before.

But that's YOUR opinion. I'm a professional, as it turns out (definition of professional: gets paid for work). I use Lion on a daily basis and it works perfectly for me. It's no less or more "professional" than SL is. An OS isn't "professional", like it or not. It may have features and functionality that make it difficult for some people to accomplish what they do on a daily basis. It doesn't mean it's "unprofessional".

jas

I completely agree with you two.

Honestly, I don't get what the fuss is about. Yes more and more people that I never imagined would buy a Mac are now buying a Mac because of the direction it is headed in and are now more comfortable switching from Windows.

Yes, this means more consumers will use OSX, but that doesn't mean that for professionals (I get paid to do video work) we are getting anything less. I am quite satisfied with Lion except for some small things, but it does not affect the performance or get in the way of my daily routine. But overall, I can kind understand why some people are running to the hills, but I simply disagree.