New Mac clone maker, Quo Computer

[KeriJane]

Wow!

That's some debate you have going. Can I try too?

LTD made a very good point...

The IT profession has turned into a goldmine for people that can keep poor, pathetic, broken Microsoft Windows going.
IT people would be the big losers if businesses everywhere got smart and pulled the plug on Windows in favor of well, practically anything.
Linux, OSX, even DOS couldn't possibly foul up the workplace more than Windows 3.1 through 7.

I have a little experience here.
At work, over the last 10 years we went from efficient but user unfriendly DOS type systems to Win98 to XP. Each stage slowed us down a LOT and now we use TONS more paper and toner instead of dot-matrix / multi-forms. Also, the IT guy is always around fixing something.
And the stupid people who don't care about their job find ways around the site-blockers and waste time browsing all day... wasn't possible with the DOS system. That one only communicated with National HQ.

If we could figure out an ancient Command Line interface, we can certainly learn something, ANYTHING else other than Windows.
I'd even vote for Punchcards over Windows.

What used to take seconds at the command line or on dedicated equipment now takes us many minutes.... IF we don't have to reboot!

Not having to deal with Windows at home is a joy.

Have Fun,
Keri

PS. Apple computers are an absolute BARGAIN! Not overpriced at all. Not even the Pro.
As a bonus, they allow us to escape from Microsoft at least until tomorrow morning....

 

[DoFoT9]

PS. Apple computers are an absolute BARGAIN! Not overpriced at all. Not even the Pro.
As a bonus, they allow us to escape from Microsoft at least until tomorrow morning....

i agree, the initial investment pays off overtime. however, talk to most osx admins - they wont agree.

 

[roadbloc]

PS. Apple computers are an absolute BARGAIN! Not overpriced at all. Not even the Pro.

1. I fail to see how Apple's computers are bargains.
2. Have you even used Windows 7?

 

[DoFoT9]

1. I fail to see how Apple's computers are bargains.

there are a number of tiers of arguments to this - what would you like to begin with? i guess the first thing to state is that i still have my 1999 iMac working for internet/word processing/classic OS9 games.

2. Have you even used Windows 7?

again, multilayered.

registry. MMU. etc.

 

[sushi]

1. I fail to see how Apple's computers are bargains.

Macs seem to have a better ROI.

2. Have you even used Windows 7?

Yes.

In fact, I like Windows -- especially when running on a Mac via Parallels or VMware Fusion.

FWIW, I'm still partial to Windows XP. It's grown on me over the years.

 

[*LTD*]

(i

And what exactly does that tell? Apple's year over year growth is quite average

http://www.isuppli.com/Home-and-Con...an-OEMs-Surge-as-Acer-Closes-Gap-with-HP.aspx

The price of entry is also $1000+ (unless you're getting a barebones Mini and live in the States.)

NOW look at the growth.

 

[KeriJane]

1. I fail to see how Apple's computers are bargains.
2. Have you even used Windows 7?

Hi roadbloc.

1- Apple computers are a bargain because of something called "Value".

If you fall in the trap of comparing things "on paper" Macs appear to be a very poor value. They're not. Please let me try to explain:

The entire PC business including Microsoft has become expert at "making things look good on paper". This is like when Intel made CPUs with an unusually high clock rate, but they weren't really very fast. Why? so Intel could have bragging rights to higher numbers and say things like "our 3.0ghz CPU is faster than anyone else!" when as a whole, the P4s of the time were slower and less stable than other companies products at much lower "speeds". Or when monitor companies boast of impossibly low response time like, oh say, 2ms only to find out that they measure "change of shade" instead of "change of color".
Some call this Marketing, I call it Lying and Fraud.

Apple doesn't usually exaggerate performance. So, if you compare oh, say, a Mac Pro or maybe a Cinema Display with HONEST performance ratings,
it's going to look bad compared to Brand "D", "H", "e", "S", "T" or whatever with the usual FRAUDULENT ratings.

Also, there's the construction quality. While all of the major manufacturers put out a (mostly) decent product, corners are cut everywhere they think they can get away with it. Inferior TN displays, cheap plastic construction, shoddy components, etc.

On the other hand, Apple makes nearly all of their systems out of metal. Made of metal with fanatical attention to detail, fantastic fit and finish, high quality components like IPS panels, stuff that works without fuss like Firewire instead of eSATA, a minimum of useless complexities, etc... This plus excellent support, their very own stable and secure OS, Geniuses at the Apple Store.... this all takes a lot of money. How they keep the prices as low as they are while making a very decent profit is amazing.

On top of providing the best products in the computing world, Apple generally TRUSTS their customers to not pirate their softwares or OS. They don't have a single annoying "Activation" scheme that I'm aware of and few Apple brand softwares even have a serial number.
This alone won me over.

Think I'm wrong? Well, just see what a 3 year old Mac goes for on eBay.
Then compare that to what a 3 year old anything else of the same general specification goes for.
Resale value is usually a good indicator of Value, period.

These basics apply to most things, not just computers.
Have Fun,

Go Team Apple!
Keri

PS.
#2- Why, yes, I did try "Windows 7" for a while. It should really be called "Windows 6.2" as it's what Vista should have been. Maybe the "Pro" or "Ultimate" version would have been better suited to my needs but I wasn't impressed. Also, they STILL apparently can't trust their customers and continue the onerous "Activation" scheme. Sorry, I'm gone.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtSDlSVDibA&feature=related

 

[roadbloc]

^ You win. But I still like Windows 7 and I'm still in two minds what my next computer will be.

 

[KnightWRX]

Inferior TN displays, cheap plastic construction, shoddy components, etc.

Why are you talking about the Macbook using cheap and shoddy ? Plastic is fine, the components might not be top notch, but they are decent.

this all takes a lot of money. How they keep the prices as low as they are while making a very decent profit is amazing.

So wait, which is it, does Apple spend a lot of money getting their system to you or do they have the highest profit margins in the industry ? You can't have your cake and eat it to.

Either it takes a lot of money and it's amazing that prices are so "low" or they make the highest profit margins and are gouging you on something.

All in all, saying others use FRAUD! while Apple is HONEST! is plainly... how do I put this... fraudulent on your part. Apple is no better than the rest of the industry. They use the same specs everyone else does on their specs page. The truth is as stretched on Apple.com as it is on dell.com. Apple uses the same components everyone else does to. TN panels, plastics, same components the rest of the industry uses (Intel CPU, Fujitsu HDs, Toshiba RAM chips, etc...). Even when they use higher end stuff like IPS panels and justify the outrageous price with them, you can go to others and find the same IPS panels in monitors with more inputs (options and choices are not useless complexity!) for a lower price.

Let's be honest here at least

 

[belvdr]

The IT profession has turned into a goldmine for people that can keep poor, pathetic, broken Microsoft Windows going.
IT people would be the big losers if businesses everywhere got smart and pulled the plug on Windows in favor of well, practically anything.
Linux, OSX, even DOS couldn't possibly foul up the workplace more than Windows 3.1 through 7.

Absolutely wrong. Managing end-user systems is a full-time job. Most of our issues don't come from malware or anything close. It's the applications that are having issues. And, no, I'm not talking about local applications. These are applications running on HP-UX, Linux, and Windows.

OS X is becoming more and more of an automatic disqualification for most businesses anyway. Sure, there will be stragglers in any company, but when I don't have offerings that I can customize more than what Apple offers, they are dropped from consideration.

In fact, Oracle no longer develops their code for OS X. Considering Oracle is in most larger businesses, that makes a very big statement.

I have a little experience here.
At work, over the last 10 years we went from efficient but user unfriendly DOS type systems to Win98 to XP. Each stage slowed us down a LOT and now we use TONS more paper and toner instead of dot-matrix / multi-forms. Also, the IT guy is always around fixing something.
And the stupid people who don't care about their job find ways around the site-blockers and waste time browsing all day... wasn't possible with the DOS system. That one only communicated with National HQ.

If we could figure out an ancient Command Line interface, we can certainly learn something, ANYTHING else other than Windows.
I'd even vote for Punchcards over Windows.

No matter what systems you implement, there will be issues which will require people to fix. Moving from Windows isn't something that's going to eliminate IT and provide some platform that always works.

It's also not some game to create jobs as someone mentioned above.

What used to take seconds at the command line or on dedicated equipment now takes us many minutes.... IF we don't have to reboot!

Not having to deal with Windows at home is a joy.

Sounds like poorly implemented applications or infrastructure. Nothing is taking minutes for us (and we've moved from DOS to WinXP as well), and we're acquiring and integrating new businesses all the time. We've even moved proprietary code from SAP to Oracle. If you do it right, then you eliminate most performance issues.

If things are poorly implemented, there will be performance issues, regardless of platform.

Have Fun,
Keri

PS. Apple computers are an absolute BARGAIN! Not overpriced at all. Not even the Pro.
As a bonus, they allow us to escape from Microsoft at least until tomorrow morning....

Tell that to someone who only has a few hundred to spend on a computer for college.

Also, they STILL apparently can't trust their customers and continue the onerous "Activation" scheme. Sorry, I'm gone.

Maybe that's because more people pirate Windows than OS X. Piracy is big business and there are businesses that operate solely to pirate Windows.

The activation is once and it's over with, so it's a non-issue. People pretend the activation is some really problematic procedure.