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nMP 2015: where is it?

MacVidCards said:
Imagine if they just switched to Nvidia chips.

Faster, use less energy, and can natively run a 5K. Each GTX970 has 3 DP ports, seems like a no-brainer.
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No, they are not using less energy. In GPGPU tasks, to get to 4.6 Tflops of performance GTX980 needs 260W of energy. 25W less than R9 290X.

Bios Cap pushes power draw a lot, but also makes it slower and less powerful beecause of clock cap. Imagine what would happen if you would push TDP to levels of Mac Pro. It would make GTX980 less powerful than D700 from current gen of Mac Pro.

I dont understand why people are misunderstanding GPGPU power draw with gaming power draw?

Check out the graphs: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-970-maxwell,3941-12.html

Windforce is OC'ed version without the Bios Cap. Reference is one with it. And reference is way slower than Windforce.

That is from my personal experience. Getting GTX980 to 125W of TDP would make it perform like GTX960.
 
flat five said:
how many mac pros have been sold?
(just out of curiosity.. has that stat been released anywhere?)
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Probably not public information. But incredibly unlikely that it would be a number that would justify spending "billions" on developing a new model. I'm doubtful they'd spend that much on any desktop they sell (or would need to spend that much).

flat five said:
i'm pretty sure this forum is a horrible sampling of the typical mac pro user/buyer.. most people don't think or care about this stuff or certainly not to the degree the forum hypes it up to..
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Seems silly to say that wanting nothing more than the latest components is "hype" but whatever.

they spent a lot of money but the computer is actually badass and will still be in 5 years..
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I'd agree if that actually were the case. But the quad is often outperformed by other (cheaper) mac models. And right now they're shipping a macbook air with SSD that is substantially faster.

point being- if you talk about apple customers, you gotta realize youre not the typical buyer or user.
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If you talk about apple customers, nobody in the market for MP is a typical buyer or user. Doesn't it make sense that a MP user may be more tech savvy than the grandma getting a consumer mac for email and facebook? And the more expensive a machine, the more a potential buyer is going to scrutinize what they're actually getting to see if they're getting their money's worth.

flat five said:
you don't think you guys have emphasized it enough by now?
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Now that this long has passed without an upgrade, it's more deserving of emphasis than ever.
 
milo said:
Seems silly to say that wanting nothing more than the latest components is "hype" but whatever.


Now that this long has passed without an upgrade, it's more deserving of emphasis than ever.
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You can't debate with this guy in a rational way. No way, no how. Save yourself some aggravation.
 
right.. because a rational person sees the importance of sitting around on the internet every day complaining about a product that they have zero control over :rolleyes:
 
flat five said:
right.. because a rational person sees the importance of sitting around on the internet every day complaining about a product that they have zero control over :rolleyes:
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You mean like people do on every other web forum?

Like music forums
Car forums
Craft and arts forums
Movie forums
...

Yeah, people are sure towing the party line on those.
Look, if we bore you, you're free to ignore us just as most of us tends to ignore you.
 
Nosferax said:
You mean like people do on every other web forum?

Like music forums
Car forums
Craft and arts forums
Movie forums
...

Yeah, people are sure towing the party line on those.
Look, if we bore you, you're free to ignore us just as most of us tends to ignore you.
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why, exactly, do you ignore me? seems you're new here and i don't recall ever talking to you before or even being in a thread with you.. what gives?
 
flat five said:
why, exactly, do you ignore me? seems you're new here and i don't recall ever talking to you before or even being in a thread with you.. what gives?
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Eh, I'm going by what I read. Complaining about people posting to complain about stuff they don't have control over when it is the lifeblood of every web forum, is a sure way to get ignored by people or worst.

We have the right to complain about the design decision of Apple, just like we have a right to complain about the latest U2 album or the latest donut flavour at Tim Hortons...
 
Nosferax said:
Eh, I'm going by what I read. Complaining about people posting to complain about stuff they don't have control over when it is the lifeblood of every web forum, is a sure way to get ignored by people or worst.

We have the right to complain about the design decision of Apple, just like we have a right to complain about the latest U2 album or the latest donut flavour at Tim Hortons...
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heh.. thanks for the lesson, chief ##


---
curious about what the or worse part is though?
like-
i don't follow the rulez of the internet so people will surely ignore me.. or worse.. what's the other option?
 
Nosferax said:
Eh, I'm going by what I read. Complaining about people posting to complain about stuff they don't have control over when it is the lifeblood of every web forum, is a sure way to get ignored by people or worst.

We have the right to complain about the design decision of Apple, just like we have a right to complain about the latest U2 album or the latest donut flavour at Tim Hortons...
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Pity you miss the great irony. There were months of vociferous proselytizing on behalf of nMP, including heated debates and some name calling. Those of us who couldn't see the fine points of it's design were accused of being, in effect, blind to good design.

But after all of that, when the moment of truth came at the Apple store, when the Credit Card came out, he actually said "Give me an iMac please."

So, brilliant design, incredible engineering, best computer ever, but just not for him. Yet still here trying to sing the praises of a computer that wasn't good enough for him to buy.

I bought one. And I still think it has gone WAY to far into "form over function". But I get to say that, it's sitting on my table. Was on my desk but once I got a 5K display I had to use a cMP as the nMP traded away it's ability to keep up with modern tech. So it's stuck with a 2 year old 4K display in the dining room.
 
MacVidCards said:
Those of us who couldn't see the fine points of it's design were accused of being, in effect, blind to good design.
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to a lesser extent than the tone you've said it in.. yeah, i think that.

But after all of that, when the moment of truth came at the Apple store, when the Credit Card came out, he actually said "Give me an iMac please."
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cash..and the new mac pro isn't fully utilizing its design yet.. it's going to be another 2 versions or so..
i don't have software to take advantage of the dual gpus right now.. i don't have money to buy 12 cores.. if i wait a couple of years then my software which would be able to use 12 cores now will then run much faster on two gpus at a price i'm willing to pay.
does that make sense to you?


the imac is sweet bytheway.

So, brilliant design, incredible engineering, best computer ever, but just not for him. Yet still here trying to sing the praises of a computer that wasn't good enough for him to buy.
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nah.. i'll get one.. i just don't want to get two within a couple of versions of each other.

for someone who loves to talk about people getting ripped off etc, you sure seem to get upset over me making smart buying decisions.

I bought one. And I still think it has gone WAY to far into "form over function". But I get to say that, it's sitting on my table. Was on my desk but once I got a 5K display I had to use a cMP as the nMP traded away it's ability to keep up with modern tech. So it's stuck with a 2 year old 4K display in the dining room.
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fainting.jpg
 
VirtualRain said:
Talk to your contacts there... for all we know, it's Nvidia that doesn't want to play.
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Course it is. They have said in the past they won't do the deals AMD will such as the ones that got them all three consoles. They aren't going to sell 970 GPUs to Apple to brand them as Quadro K5200s for $200 a piece. They don't need to either, they dominate the market and the Mac Pro sales don't help them like the branding helps AMD. Can hardly blame them.
 
Umbongo said:
Course it is. They have said in the past they won't do the deals AMD will such as the ones that got them all three consoles. They aren't going to sell 970 GPUs to Apple to brand them as Quadro K5200s for $200 a piece. They don't need to either, they dominate the market and the Mac Pro sales don't help them like the branding helps AMD. Can hardly blame them.
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I understand and agree. I missed adding a smiley on the post you quoted... About the worst mistake a guy can make in these over-charged discussions. :)

Anyway, while everyone would love to see Nvidia in a Mac Pro refresh, there's really no point discussing it, because as you point out, Nvidia probably wants nothing to do with it. So we're all just going to have to wait for AMDs next-gen to see anything interesting for nMP GPUs, which may be awhile based on the FAB situation these days.
 
flat five said:
to a lesser extent than the tone you've said it in.. yeah, i think that.


cash..and the new mac pro isn't fully utilizing its design yet.. it's going to be another 2 versions or so..
i don't have software to take advantage of the dual gpus right now.. i don't have money to buy 12 cores.. if i wait a couple of years then my software which would be able to use 12 cores now will then run much faster on two gpus at a price i'm willing to pay.
does that make sense to you?


the imac is sweet bytheway.



nah.. i'll get one.. i just don't want to get two within a couple of versions of each other.

for someone who loves to talk about people getting ripped off etc, you sure seem to get upset over me making smart buying decisions.



Image
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What do you mean by: isn't fully utilizing its design yet???

Beside it's form factor it is a run of the mill xeon based PC with dual gpus, just like the other run of the mill xeon based PC with dual gpus. It doesn't do anything that any other workstation is able to do and it doesn't do it any better. In fact due to its power restriction and old gpus it does it more slowly.
 
flat five said:
right.. because a rational person sees the importance of sitting around on the internet every day complaining about a product that they have zero control over
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Is it any more rational to sit around on the internet every day defending a product that you have zero control over?

And I'm glad someone pointed out that you're not even running a nMP, that definitely puts your opinion into context.

For the record I'm running a 2009 mac pro, at some point I'll be moving to a nMP but at this point I'd like to wait for the next update.

Nosferax said:
Beside it's form factor it is a run of the mill xeon based PC with dual gpus, just like the other run of the mill xeon based PC with dual gpus. It doesn't do anything that any other workstation is able to do and it doesn't do it any better. In fact due to its power restriction and old gpus it does it more slowly.
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And with a workstation PC, there are dual CPU options available. Not to mention other benefits like more ram slots.
 
Nosferax said:
Beside it's form factor it is a run of the mill xeon based PC with dual gpus, just like the other run of the mill xeon based PC with dual gpus.
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That's because it is a computer with xeon processor and dual gpus.

Nosferax said:
It doesn't do anything that any other workstation is able to do and it doesn't do it any better.
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Who ever said it did? A small few seem to want it to be the bestest in every way. I think it is the bestest at making the least amount of noise.

Nosferax said:
In fact due to its power restriction and old gpus it does it more slowly.
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Compared to what? A faster computer. :rolleyes:
 
milo said:
Probably not public information. But incredibly unlikely that it would be a number that would justify spending "billions" on developing a new model. I'm doubtful they'd spend that much on any desktop they sell (or would need to spend that much).
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An IDC analyst made mention last September in an interview that 1.2M MacPros had been sold worldwide total since it's inception, but they've been accused of undercounting Apple shipments in the past.
 
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Nosferax said:
What do you mean by: isn't fully utilizing its design yet???
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look at what i was responding to and keep reading what i wrote after.. i already elaborated on what i meant by that.


milo said:
Is it any more rational to sit around on the internet every day defending a product that you have zero control over?
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probably not..
i'm not here every day but have been the last few days.. and yes, every time i post something here i'm wasting time that could be better spent on other things.

And with a workstation PC, there are dual CPU options available. Not to mention other benefits like more ram slots.
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so what.. they're way too expensive for the expected performance improvements.. the vast majority of the time i'm sitting at a computer, i need a fast single core plus a few extras which can handle other tasks while not bogging down the main threads.
i'm not going to pay 2x money for a computer to be twice as fast when i'm not even sitting there working.. my current workflow is one that has me designing while at the computer then setting up work for the computer to do after i'm done.. nothing about my workflow would change if i doubled the speed of multicore operations.. a render may finish at 2am instead of 6am with more cores but either way, i'm still doing the same amount of work and the projects complete in the same amount of time.. more cores is a waste of money for me because nothing changes.

if i can get 20x speed increases for twice the money then it's a different story.. the way i work will actually change.. when my software becomes tuned to the nmp, i'll be faced with this much better dollar to performance ratio.. it's not the computer which is lagging right now.. it's the software.
 
flat five said:
look at what i was responding to and keep reading what i wrote after.. i already elaborated on what i meant by that.




probably not..
i'm not here every day but have been the last few days.. and yes, every time i post something here i'm wasting time that could be better spent on other things.


so what.. they're way too expensive for the expected performance improvements.. the vast majority of the time i'm sitting at a computer, i need a fast single core plus a few extras which can handle other tasks while not bogging down the main threads.
i'm not going to pay 2x money for a computer to be twice as fast when i'm not even sitting there working.. my current workflow is one that has me designing while at the computer then setting up work for the computer to do after i'm done.. nothing about my workflow would change if i doubled the speed of multicore operations.. a render may finish at 2am instead of 6am with more cores but either way, i'm still doing the same amount of work and the projects complete in the same amount of time.. more cores is a waste of money for me because nothing changes.

if i can get 20x speed increases for twice the money then it's a different story.. the way i work will actually change.. when my software becomes tuned to the nmp, i'll be faced with this much better dollar to performance ratio.. it's not the computer which is lagging right now.. it's the software.
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Then you don't even need a workstation class machine. Why are you here again?

Oh hell, go play with MacProCard in my ignore list. I'm too tired for this nonsense.
 
Too funny. Ignore me because you're ranting about the nMP hardware. And how you don't like it. Nothing anyone says besides negative comments are good enough for you. --Too expensive, old technology, not upgradable enough blah blah blah.

Some of us bought it and like it. Must be too hard for you to understand? Enjoy the rest of your utility company work day. Try not to post my check to the wrong account. :D
 
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