NVMe with ST-NGFF2013-C; Vega Internal GPU; Mac Pro 2013 (6,1)

[krakman]

thanks to everyone adding information to this tread.

Slightly off topic when my mac pro died a few months ago and I could not find the service manual for it online, I would like to know what the little LEDS signify when you press the little button on the PCB on the back of the main interface board....even though my nMP would not boot some of the LEDs would still light up which must mean something?

 

[CodeJingle]

It’s been really interesting to read. Thanks.

The next goal is the pinout for the two graphics flex cables. Mac Pro 2013 Riser Card should arrive on Thursday. The thread should pick up its third wind next weekend. I'm glad to bring together the community and also be a source of entertainment.
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what the little LEDS signify when you press the little button on the PCB on the back of the main interface board

I DM'd you about it.

 

[yellowbunny]

"I'm glad to bring together the community and also be a source of entertainment."

Your drive name entained me when I watched you video last night

 

[CodeJingle]

Just got the boards haven't started depopulating or filing.

 

[Selsk]

"popcorn eating emoji"

 

[CodeJingle]

I depopulated the CPU riser card last night. Been running errands all day, just got a chance to come back to this. About to start filing it down. I realized yesterday Euro Tools makes scratch brushes in flavors of nylon, brass, and steel, not just fiberglass. I ordered brass and steel brushes along with refill packs. I should be fine without them, but they'll make it easier for next time.

http://eurotool.com/catalog/scratch_brushes-38-1.html

The video out is pass-thru to the I/O Board so I may not be done even after mapping the pinout to the two graphics flex cables (if I succeed). I'll probably file down the I/O board next. I don't have a spare I/O flex cable I'll have to file that down as well I should pick one up.

 

[CodeJingle]

I surfaced the outermost layer of the top and bottom without using a metal file since that usually causes the most damage. It took a whole day. I ran through most of the refill box for the fiberglass scratch brush.

I want to continue not using a metal file and am currently waiting on the brass and steel euro tool scratch brushes, and another fiberglass refill box.

I pulled some trace off for maybe three pads but that is still better than the job I did for the top layers of the logic board.

 

[CodeJingle]

I need a better way to document the layers. There is already too much information from the process I used to document the logic board. To have any chance of success for determining connector pinouts I need the riser card layers documentation to be impossibly simple. A single image per layer (possibly also a single image between each pair of adjacent layers to document flow of VIAs).

The smartphone camera is not good enough in this case. DSLR or flatbed scanner seem like the only options. I ordered a Epson Perfection Photo Scanner V39 certified refurbished for 55 USD. 4800 DPI x 4800 DPI optical resolution. 4.2 stars on Amazon. The scanner should arrive today. The board fits well within the scannable area of 8.5 × 11.7 (inches).

https://epson.com/Clearance-Center/...tion-V39-Scanner---Refurbished/p/B11B232201-N

The brass scratch brush and brass refills came yesterday (I tested it works well). The fiberglass refills are coming today. Steel scratch brush and refills coming tomorrow.

 

[CodeJingle]

I have the rest of the equipment. I took scans of the top layers of the board so can now sand down to the next layer. It is a little blurry in places if you zoom all the way in, and the scan chunks don't line up completely in places, but it is still good enough for why I wanted it which was so I don't need to take like 10 pictures of each layer. One center shot with the phone camera and one scan of each layer should be good enough.

It wouldn't let me scan at 4800 dpi but that is fine anyway. The unaltered 2400 dpi scans are very large even as jpeg here are the links (the thumbnail is just a preview follow the link for full size):

outermost layer top of board
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xst4yut8u9w8h8d/top01.jpg?dl=0


outermost layer bottom of board
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tfl1l6i0bnx1lzw/bottom01.jpg?dl=0


glass, brass, and steel scratch brushes


epson perfection v39 scanner


extra board dell xeon e5 v2 with two pcie x 16 slots and a slot extender to make probing easier

 

[Celeste.ch]

I have the rest of the equipment. I took scans of the top layers of the board so can now sand down to the next layer. It is a little blurry in places if you zoom all the way in, and the scan chunks don't line up completely in places, but it is still good enough for why I wanted it which was so I don't need to take like 10 pictures of each layer. One center shot with the phone camera and one scan of each layer should be good enough.

It wouldn't let me scan at 4800 dpi but that is fine anyway. The unaltered 2400 dpi scans are very large even as jpeg here are the links (the thumbnail is just a preview follow the link for full size):

outermost layer top of board
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xst4yut8u9w8h8d/top01.jpg?dl=0
View attachment 749723

outermost layer bottom of board
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tfl1l6i0bnx1lzw/bottom01.jpg?dl=0
View attachment 749724

glass, brass, and steel scratch brushes
View attachment 749720

epson perfection v39 scanner
View attachment 749721

extra board dell xeon e5 v2 with two pcie x 16 slots and a slot extender to make probing easier
View attachment 749722

Thanks for all your hard work! Really interesting to read. I keep my fingers crossed that you succeed.

 

[CodeJingle]

I excavated the second layer on the bottom side. Doing it by hand and purposefully not using a metal file it took about 16 hours over the course of 4 days. The trace layer appears undamaged. I wasn't expecting it to take that long for just one layer on one side. Like using a toothbrush to dig up dinosaur bones.

The brass and steel scratch brushes don't seem to work as well as the fiberglass. The metal fibers limp before they break off, versus the glass fibers which are continually snapping off into glass dust while the remaining fibers stay taut. I should look up scratch brush documentation on EURO TOOL website.

It took about one sheet of 60 grit sandpaper and 2.5 refill packs of the fiberglass scratch brush (60 refills). I used tiny slivers of sandpaper to break through the copper before finishing it off with the fiberglass scratch pen. At this rate, it will take a month to bore through the rest of the board and about 18 more fiberglass refill packs (250 USD). Even with an N95 respirator, it is gross to fill a room with glass dust.

I'm going to need a better system. A more efficient process. I might be able to hook up something like a rotary if I can lower the RPM. I have a variable AC transformer (or variac), I can plug a rotary into it and reduce the voltage to lower the RPM. I'm just not sure what the resulting torque is. Maybe I can use a smaller bit if the torque is low. An electric drill has higher torque but the drill unit as a whole is too large for precision work.

Looking around some more, I guess I was wrong. There is a handheld rotary for precision work with more torque than a drill. They coin it 'flexible shaft' ... sounds dirty. It even has the equivalent of a built-in variac. It goes down to near zero RPM.

http://eurotool.com/products/FLEXIBLE_SHAFT_MACHINE_1_4HP-2615-0.html

http://facetjewelry.com/metal-wire/resources/2017/03/how-to-use-a-flex-shaft---part-1-of-7

Might do the trick. Trying to pick one up this weekend.

second layer bottom of board (the thumbnail is just a preview follow the link for full size)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qu4wyrx0ztyq5f0/bottom02.jpg?dl=0

 

[CodeJingle]

I forgot I had a Dremel lying around, which I hooked it up to variable AC transformer. Borrowed some rotary bits from my ex-wife. I'll give it a try later today. I am on the second layer on the bottom side I'll try the Dremel for the top. If it doesn't work, then I will get the flexible shaft. For final cleanup of the next layer, I would still prefer fiberglass scratch brush.

 

[CodeJingle]

I like the steel brush bit. But the torque is laughable with the Dremel at low RPM. Here is some video evidence. Now I remember why I never used it. So I'll try the 'flexible shaft' next.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/im5clpgj5jllfvt/20180208_171945.mp4?dl=0

 

[Flint Ironstag]

I like the pictures.

 

[CodeJingle]

There was no way to get a flex shaft shipped same day or overnight. I got this shipped for about $80 for one week delivery. All the flex shaft brands are no-name except for Foredom and I can’t afford Foredom (except for the handpiece) so it doesn’t really matter which no-name brand I run with.

I like the pictures.

Well yeah I sure hope the board pics look nice at > 100 MB each.

 

[Flint Ironstag]

I chuckled at the "warranty void if removed" sticker. Truly an epic thread.

 

[andy89]

To the folks that are using an NVME SSD in their Mac Pro: how's it going? Was a fix found for the slow boot time?

 

[Kris Kelvin]

To the folks that are using an NVME SSD in their Mac Pro: how's it going? Was a fix found for the slow boot time?

Samsung 960 PRO 2TB working perfectly in my MacPro6,1 (except for the D300 freezes, which shouldn't have anything to do with that). Boot time is about 2 minutes though...

 

[davrx]

I have everything I need to upgrade my Mac Pro 6,1 except the adapter. The PC Parts 239 is no longer available from Amazon and I ordered the Sintech 10 days ago but the tracking number they sent me indicates they haven't even sent it yet. Are there any adapters available other than these two or is there a reseller of the Sintech in the US that I can get it from faster? Getting this from the source is akin to "slow boat to China".
BTW thanks for allowing me to join, this is my first post and thanks for all the information. I bought a 2TB upgrade from OWC several years ago and have never been happy with it. I'm looking forward to installing my new Samsung 960 PRO 2TB.

 

[Kris Kelvin]

I ordered the Sintech 10 days ago but the tracking number they sent me indicates they haven't even sent it yet.

I had a similar experience. Took almost a month in the end.

Are there any adapters available other than these two

Well, kind of. There's the Amfeltec AngelShark, shipping from Canada. It allows you to install two M.2 SSDs in addition to the Apple one, but costs $520...

 

[CodeJingle]

To the folks that are using an NVME SSD in their Mac Pro: how's it going? Was a fix found for the slow boot time?

No even with the latest beta it still takes forever to do a cold boot with NVMe installed. I'm not actively looking for a way around it though I can live with it. Maybe there is a way to bypass Apple's pre-boot checklist.
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The PC Parts 239 is no longer available from Amazon

The last time they ran out of local warehouse stock it took the backing company several weeks for more stock to reach the warehouse. The part is selling there is no reason for the backing company to discontinue the product. Try checking back in a week there should at least be a tentative restock date.
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There's the Amfeltec AngelShark, shipping from Canada. It allows you to install two M.2 SSDs in addition to the Apple one, but costs $520...

I consider that slightly beyond a pass-thru NVMe adapter. Great for anyone that needs six terabytes of internal storage.

 

[crhendo]

Samsung 960 PRO 2TB working perfectly in my MacPro6,1 (except for the D300 freezes, which shouldn't have anything to do with that). Boot time is about 2 minutes though...

OK, I'm armed with my Sintech adapter, a brand new Samsung 960 Pro 2TB m.2 SSD, some Kapton tape, a used (but fully tested) Intel XEON E5-2690 v2 processor, and a brand new LG 38UC99-W 38" 21:9 monitor. Hopefully by the end of the weekend I will have a reinvigorated Mac Pro 6,1 that will serve me without incident for another 5 years.

Wish me luck!

 

[CodeJingle]

[doublepost=1518795268][/doublepost]Got ‘flexible shaft’ tool last night (cross between rotary and drill). A couple things going on at the time, plus it was late and this thing might be loud, so was unable to try it out. Hopefully today I’ll be able to test it. Maybe upload a video demonstration. Worst case I should be free tonight to drive back to the office to avoid any noise complaints.

Wish me luck!

Good Luck!

 

[davrx]

I have everything I need to upgrade my Mac Pro 6,1 except the adapter. The PC Parts 239 is no longer available from Amazon and I ordered the Sintech 10 days ago but the tracking number they sent me indicates they haven't even sent it yet. Are there any adapters available other than these two or is there a reseller of the Sintech in the US that I can get it from faster? Getting this from the source is akin to "slow boat to China".
BTW thanks for allowing me to join, this is my first post and thanks for all the information. I bought a 2TB upgrade from OWC several years ago and have never been happy with it. I'm looking forward to installing my new Samsung 960 PRO 2TB.

My Sintech finally arrived and I'm going to attempt to install everything this weekend. Does the Sintech adapter need any sanding or filing done to it? I saw this done in the first post of this thread but wasn't sure if it was the Sintech or the PC Parts one.

 

[CodeJingle]

[doublepost=1518849393][/doublepost]The 'flexible shaft' is night and day compared to the Dremel. I only tested removing the masking of a random board but still I could tell the torque behind it this is going to work and isn't so overpowering that it tears through multiple layers at once.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/plnqt9lio1bct28/20180216_214040.mp4?dl=0

Does the Sintech adapter need any sanding or filing done to it?

I don't have the Sintech one but you should be able to eyeball whether or not it needs work. Generally if it slides all the way in and you are able to insert the screw then it probably does not need filing or sanding. But someone who actually has the Sintech adapter should respond too.