Official "Waiting for Santa Rosa" thread.

[SHowHawk]

Is there any reason for them not to update both at the same time?
...
I bet that would be to update the MBPs and MBs with a somewhat big announcement (which is seemingly different than usual; I get the impression they quietly release a lot of the updates) to compete with other popular brands like HP and Dell because the back to school market is going to kick into high gear between June-August. Some people have said that they will wait until late July, August or even wait until Leopard is released, but I think that's pretty ridiculous since many colleges start in August. IMO, that would be a stupid mistake to make, especially with so many first year college students who are open to buying a Mac.
...
Perhaps I'm wrong, but I've been silently watching these forums, the rumor sites, the buying guides, blah blah blah and after reading so many opinions, it sounds like the updates are coming in 4-6 weeks.

I agree! I very much expect (hope... take your pick) updates to both the MBs and MBPs before mid-July. Both units haven't been updated since September-October of last year, and both are "competing" in the most active segment of the market. Both lines are also prime sellers for college students and others looking for a computer at the end of one school year and the beginning of the next. Other than a transition to Santa Rosa, I don't, however, see big changes or major new real features (like Robson FLASH cache, LED backlights, Blu-Ray/HD-DVD drives, or the rumored mini-MacBook Pro) until perhaps the fall and the release of Leopard right before the Holiday shopping season.

Where I seem to differ from others is my little prediction that we will see an update to the consumer MacBook before WWDC and thus also before updates to the MacBook Pros. I don't think that updating the 13" MBs just a few weeks before the 15"-17" MBPs will hurt sales of MBPs at all. If you are in the market for a 15+" Pro starting at $2000, you probably aren't looking at a $1000 13" MB, and vice versa.

That's just my two cents worth.

 

[kajitox]

I very much expect (hope... take your pick) updates to both the MBs and MBPs before mid-July. Both units haven't been updated since September-October of last year, and both are "competing" in the most active segment of the market. Both lines are also prime sellers for college students and others looking for a computer at the end of one school year and the beginning of the next. Other than a transition to Santa Rosa, I don't, however, see big changes or major new real features (like Robson FLASH cache, LED backlights, Blu-Ray/HD-DVD drives, or the rumored mini-MacBook Pro) until perhaps the fall and the release of Leopard right before the Holiday shopping season.

Yeah, I don't see them updating anything more than what is predicted by Santa Rosa, except for maybe the slight possibility of the LED backlights, but I'm not counting on that at all; They just need to keep up with the competition.

 

[doctajay]

I'll be going to medical school in August, so I guess by that time, the Santa Rosa Chips will be in the MBPs, but I've read that the Leopard OS won't be coming out until October. So will I be able to just do a simple upgrade to Leopard (when it comes out) on my Santa Rosa MBP?

 

[daveL]

I would really think that Pro users would benefit more from a fully 64-bit system. There are arguments to go either way. We shall see what Apple does.

I'm not sure what you're saying. All Mac models have been using 64-bit processors, except the mini, for months. If you have a C2D or Xeon Mac, you have 64-bit hardware.

 

[robby818]

I'll be going to medical school in August, so I guess by that time, the Santa Rosa Chips will be in the MBPs, but I've read that the Leopard OS won't be coming out until October. So will I be able to just do a simple upgrade to Leopard (when it comes out) on my Santa Rosa MBP?

Congrats on med. school!

You will be able to do an upgrade, but a clean install is usually recommended esp. if there are substantial changes in the OS code. Leopard is probably going to be a pretty big update, so I'd recommend a clean install.

In the past if you bought a system after a new version of OSX was announced, you would get free update discs. But if you bought your system before the OS was announced, then you would need to pay for retail versions of OSX and iLife.

I believe that it is the day that the OS is announced that is important for (free) upgrade purposes, not the release date.

 

[sthpark7791]

I was planning to wait but I broke down way back in December. Doesnt matter much since I don't really need the power

 

[aussie.damo]

That's really silly. I completely agree with the guy above that the MB is more likely to be upgraded before the MBP.

The MB is the best selling Mac, and Apple will want to have it up-to-date for the education buying season who are probably their biggest market for MBs.

Also the MBP will see little to no benefit with SR, whereas the MB will see a big difference in it's integrated graphics. Apple will probably wait until there are new, better DX10 GPUs to put in the MBP and that may not be a while.

I just refuse to believe that Apple will purposely hold back on updating the MB when it makes no sense to do so. Why would a SR MacBook eat into sales of MBP's? It will still have a crippled GPU in comparison, just slightly less gimped.

I think the MBP will see a significant difference. The support for (at least) 4GB RAM will be great for people like me who run multiple VM's and need all the RAM we can get. Also, they absoultely have to update the GPU (no point having a GPU that doesn't support DX10). My tip is they'll use the ATI Mobility Radeon X2600. This would make a new MBP a compelling purchase and this doesn't even include the possibility of LED screens, user replaceable HDD and solid state disks.

If I was in the market for an MBP and the MB was updated first, I wouldn't run out and grab an MB. I'd think "Well, the MB has been updated, no point to buy a very soon to be obsolete machine". I think a lot of other people would agree.

I think machines will be available around July / August. I've heard rumors that HP will be releasing their equivalent series around that time.

Damo

 

[kellah]

I'm not sure what you're saying. All Mac models have been using 64-bit processors, except the mini, for months. If you have a C2D or Xeon Mac, you have 64-bit hardware.

Yes the iMac, Mac mini, and notebooks have 64-bit capable processors, however as far as I know the current chipsets are still 32-bit (thus not being able to address more than 3gb of ram).

 

[MaddieBrad]

The MBP already has Firewire 800.[/QUOTE

I guess I sahould have been m,ore clear... I was meaning... do you think that they will keep it? It doesn't seem to have much of a use for anything. I have only seen a few peripherals that use it.

 

[tristan]

will SR have Robson cache?

Yes, but unfortunately I've heard that its a Wade Robson cache, and is thus only useful for choreography or sleeping with Michael Jackson. Actually, the new name is Turbo Memory now. Named after Turbo from American Gladiators, of course.

Well, the Santa Rosa laptop reviewed on CNET didn't have Turbo memory. However, the leaked Lenovo specs did. I still don't exactly understand how putting 512 meg of flash RAM in your computer will really help performance. Wouldn't you rather have more of RAM? I guess flash is a little cheaper.

Here's an Intel page on Robson for you. They say it improves boot and resume times.
http://www.intel.com/technology/magazine/computing/robson-1206.htm

FYI I also agree that it is not bloody likely that Apple would update the consumer notebook line before the pro. Never happened before and never will. I actually was very surprised that Apple put C2Ds in the MacBook, I thought they'd be stuck with Yonah until the end of '06.

 

[zioxide]

Yes the iMac, Mac mini, and notebooks have 64-bit capable processors, however as far as I know the current chipsets are still 32-bit (thus not being able to address more than 3gb of ram).

You're correct. The max ram the Napa platform can address is like 3.3GB. Crestline/Santa Rosa will probably have a maximum of 8GB.

 

[toke lahti]

do you think that they will keep it? It doesn't seem to have much of a use for anything. I have only seen a few peripherals that use it.

What they _should_ do is replace fw400 with eSata, keep fw800 and bundle fw800->fw400 adapter.

Which brrings the question:
is eSata port embedded in SR?

If it isn't, they would need additional chip, which would raise the costs and therefore might not happen...

 

[Pressure]

Also, they absoultely have to update the GPU (no point having a GPU that doesn't support DX10).

You should be focusing more on OpenGL 2.1 support rather than Windows Vista-only DirectX 10 support. Besides, we primarily run Mac OS X (with OpenGL) and not Windows.

 

[linny14]

stupid question

pardon if my question seems silly. i want to buy a MBP. i don't think the upgrades would have a significant impact on my experience and i don't need to be cutting edge for my needs. its my first MAC since the late 80s (my first computer) and now i want to go back after working in a PC environment for almost 20 years, i quit my job and want to have fun and i will have enough just getting acclimated to the new system.
so for someone like me - is the main advantage of waiting - price. would their be a price drop for the current systems before the new release? would it be significant enough to make a difference if i am willing to pay $3000 now?

kind regards

 

[Tadros]

pardon if my question seems silly. i want to buy a MBP. i don't think the upgrades would have a significant impact on my experience and i don't need to be cutting edge for my needs. its my first MAC since the late 80s (my first computer) and now i want to go back after working in a PC environment for almost 20 years, i quit my job and want to have fun and i will have enough just getting acclimated to the new system.
so for someone like me - is the main advantage of waiting - price. would their be a price drop for the current systems before the new release? would it be significant enough to make a difference if i am willing to pay $3000 now?

kind regards

You'd be able to get the current version as a refurb and save some money.

 

[linny14]

clarification?

You'd be able to get the current version as a refurb and save some money.

can please clarify for me: are you saying that i if i wait for the new version to come out then i can get the refurb less money? or are you recommended to look for refurb now?
thanks

 

[Tadros]

I'm not too sure. . .

can please clarify for me: are you saying that i if i wait for the new version to come out then i can get the refurb less money? or are you recommended to look for refurb now?
thanks

I think the way the refurbs work is, if someone sends in an older computer you can purchase it. The current versions. . . I am not sure if you can get those refurbished. But if you could most likely you would be getting it cheaper when the new MBPs and MBs comes out. I think that's the way it works. . . anyone want to help out here???

 

[thegrandmaster]

Prediction time....

(Sorry if someone already said this, I skipped to the end )

MBPs with SR at WWDC, they will be well over average update time (according to Macrumors anyways) with LED backlights ( since Steve just announced everything will get it eventually - and the MBPs seem to get stuff first).

The MBP is also a 'Pro' orientated laptop, so WWDC would make sense, moreso than introducing a new Mac Mini for example.

If you're thinking about 'Back To School' shopping, most students are unlikely to get an MBP so we'll see SR MB updates about time for back to school.

Anyone think likewise?

Or am I just so desperate to get a MBP in June that I'm going crazy?!

 

[Tadros]

(Sorry if someone already said this, I skipped to the end )

MBPs with SR at WWDC, they will be well over average update time (according to Macrumors anyways) with LED backlights ( since Steve just announced everything will get it eventually - and the MBPs seem to get stuff first).

The MBP is also a 'Pro' orientated laptop, so WWDC would make sense, moreso than introducing a new Mac Mini for example.

If you're thinking about 'Back To School' shopping, most students are unlikely to get an MBP so we'll see SR MB updates about time for back to school.

Anyone think likewise?

Or am I just so desperate to get a MBP in June that I'm going crazy?!

I agree, but the LEDs might be wishful thinking

 

[maxp1]

(Sorry if someone already said this, I skipped to the end )

MBPs with SR at WWDC, they will be well over average update time (according to Macrumors anyways) with LED backlights ( since Steve just announced everything will get it eventually - and the MBPs seem to get stuff first).

The MBP is also a 'Pro' orientated laptop, so WWDC would make sense, moreso than introducing a new Mac Mini for example.

If you're thinking about 'Back To School' shopping, most students are unlikely to get an MBP so we'll see SR MB updates about time for back to school.

Anyone think likewise?

Or am I just so desperate to get a MBP in June that I'm going crazy?!

Also, Apple won't release a SR consumer model before the pro model. How would it make sense to have a higher performing consumer model than pro model?

There's also the profit factor. I'm pretty sure the MBP is a higher profit computer than the MB. They wouldn't want to have people buying a lower profit consumer model becasue it was newer than their higher profit model.

They'll wait a few months to get the pent up demand for a new model down before releasing the SR MBs.

 

[thegrandmaster]

Quick replies guys and I agree completely. It wouldn't make sense to have a faster consumer than a pro model, good point!

LEDs might be a bit wishful, but its not top of my wishlist of stuff to have in a new MBP, just a DX10 Graphics Card and general improvements.

It'll be the newest MacTop in the house since the now year old iBook, really hope it gets announced at the WWDC.

I'll be the first in line, my birthday is 28th of June, and I'll have finished all my exams too, it'd just be th icing on the cake!

 

[kajitox]

pardon if my question seems silly. i want to buy a MBP. i don't think the upgrades would have a significant impact on my experience and i don't need to be cutting edge for my needs. its my first MAC since the late 80s (my first computer) and now i want to go back after working in a PC environment for almost 20 years, i quit my job and want to have fun and i will have enough just getting acclimated to the new system.
so for someone like me - is the main advantage of waiting - price. would their be a price drop for the current systems before the new release? would it be significant enough to make a difference if i am willing to pay $3000 now?

kind regards

If the only thing you are worried about is price, definitely go for the refurb. I haven't heard anything bad about them yet...

But if you're not looking for a refurb, I do not think they will lower prices on anything after the updates (or before, for that matter).

 

[linny14]

If the only thing you are worried about is price, definitely go for the refurb. I haven't heard anything bad about them yet...

But if you're not looking for a refurb, I do not think they will lower prices on anything after the updates (or before, for that matter).

maybe i will clarify my question. i want to buy a MBP now, and i would pay for a new system. i don't need whatever upgrades there will be so that is not why i would wait- but i wondered if it would be foolish to pay for the current system only to have the price cut once a new system is available. i thought that the current MBP that is available now , would still be available when there is an updated MBP. i don't know if i am being clear.
but i appreciate everyone who did respond.

 

[warfa]

maybe i will clarify my question. i want to buy a MBP now, and i would pay for a new system. i don't need whatever upgrades there will be so that is not why i would wait- but i wondered if it would be foolish to pay for the current system only to have the price cut once a new system is available. i thought that the current MBP that is available now , would still be available when there is an updated MBP. i don't know if i am being clear.
but i appreciate everyone who did respond.

If the only thing that's stoping you is the chance that the price might bereduced on the up coming systems, then you should definetly buy the current systems because I seriously doubt that the price will go down; it might even go up a hundred or so.. Also, once the new systems get released, you won't be able to purchase the current once from apple because they will be replaced! The only way is if you buy it from other sellers I think. Hope that helps
I am waiting for a new MBP myself!

 

[ready2switch]

maybe i will clarify my question. i want to buy a MBP now, and i would pay for a new system. i don't need whatever upgrades there will be so that is not why i would wait- but i wondered if it would be foolish to pay for the current system only to have the price cut once a new system is available. i thought that the current MBP that is available now , would still be available when there is an updated MBP. i don't know if i am being clear.
but i appreciate everyone who did respond.

The current system would only be offered through the refurb store once the updates are available. These refurbs would see a price reduction once the updates are seen in the refurb store also, which could be anywhere from 6-8 weeks after the updates are available brand new. Apple historically doesn't offer "new" previous generation products at a reduced price and will instead funnel them into the refurb store.

Sometimes they do have "clearance" items (there is a clearance link from the refurb store page), but I don't recall seeing computers in there. It's usually the discontinued airport or something of that nature. I may have just missed them, however.