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Cryates

macrumors 68040
Nov 19, 2013
3,341
5,283
Two weeks with the Fold 5, and still feeling forever indebted to the folding life moving forward. The outside screen feels .... Normal size to me by now. I struggle a bit with typing on it but I've never been great with touchscreen keyboard anyway.

My wife's Pixel 7 screen feels way wider than it did to me before I got the Fold. Weird how the brain can change and adjust to things like that.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Nehalem
Dec 15, 2010
30,980
20,169
UK
Let’s do this
d2e7b77ddd0f2f25b664ec91817a3ab4.jpg

ef09db01bb1952831b9048e35ed47723.jpg
 

Cryates

macrumors 68040
Nov 19, 2013
3,341
5,283
Meh, the best thing about the current Fold form factor imo is the inner screen's dimensions. I love the ability for me to use a full keyboard comfortably, without having to compromise and use a split or floating keyboard. Even just a little bit wider and that would be an issue.
 
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Bkdodger

macrumors 68040
Jun 6, 2019
3,624
6,055
Meh, the best thing about the current Fold form factor imo is the inner screen's dimensions. I love the ability for me to use a full keyboard comfortably, without having to compromise and use a split or floating keyboard. Even just a little bit wider and that would be an issue.
It's good to have options...I love the split keyboard and use it exclusively on PF unfolded ..Gboard is the go to keyboard on all my phones ..but all preference
 
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DeepIn2U

macrumors G5
May 30, 2002
13,051
6,984
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
I was able to export all my ios Keychain passwords to 1 password only thing I had to setup again was all my 2FA codes.
As I stated you cannot do this ON device with ios or iPados alone in bulk. There is a prompt when using keychain to add to 1Password but it's 1 at a time. I felt no need to pay for 1Password without official assurances to migrate in bulk in 1 step - their support specifically mentioned what I'm saying

1Password in its current form specifically mentions what I'm saying.

Are you saying that ONLY on ios using 1Password you were able to upload ALL your ios icloud keychain passwords in 1 simple step? Not using a Mac? Apple's support site also mentions macos is needed to export icloud keychain passwords- the ones located on ios settings, Passwords. Also what about hidemy relay account logons?
 

DeepIn2U

macrumors G5
May 30, 2002
13,051
6,984
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
I've bought 3 premium Samsung devices in the last 12 months; Z Fold 4, S23 Ultra & Tab S9 and none of them came with a charger. The last chargers I got were the 15w brick that came with my Tab S7 and the 25w jobbie that came with my Note 10 Plus. So Samsung expect me to use old tech chargers with my newer 45w devices? How long do the cheapasses expect my old 25w brick to last if it's charging multiple devices on a daily basis? I think it's disgusting. Next they'll stop including the USB cables.

I can sorta forgive no chargers in the box for smartphones, but no charger included for the tablet.. that's a horrible customer experience.

If Samsung go down this path... what's stopping them from not providing a charger for their Chromebooks or Galaxy Books.


You better off waiting for 2026 when Apple drop their foldable... I'm not downplaying your issues with foldables, but I think perhaps you value Apple ecosystem which results you seek out the imperfections to force you to stay within the ecosystem.

I could very well be wrong about my observation, but it seems like the case. And if you enjoy familiarity within the Apple ecosystem... there's nothing wrong with that.


Umm. So many gripe about no charger on the box.

Honestly I feel unless a tablet or a smartphone has a specific high threshold for rapid charging 80W plus then yes the manufacturer should ship with it.

Yet without such tech, most are served with existing chargers at home - many already have tablets or laptops that use USB-C of 20-60W already. Furthermore Amazon has great rates for GaN chargers from Anker,etc that have a smaller footprint that what big name manufacturers will ship, meaning better portability that every user would want anyway.

Moreover I think an equally or more important debate should be for manufacturers of smartphones and tablets and laptops should NO longer be using USB-A blocks!! USB-C to USB-C cables only as well pls.
 

Fernandez21

macrumors 601
Jun 16, 2010
4,840
3,183
Umm. So many gripe about no charger on the box.

Honestly I feel unless a tablet or a smartphone has a specific high threshold for rapid charging 80W plus then yes the manufacturer should ship with it.

Yet without such tech, most are served with existing chargers at home - many already have tablets or laptops that use USB-C of 20-60W already. Furthermore Amazon has great rates for GaN chargers from Anker,etc that have a smaller footprint that what big name manufacturers will ship, meaning better portability that every user would want anyway.

Moreover I think an equally or more important debate should be for manufacturers of smartphones and tablets and laptops should NO longer be using USB-A blocks!! USB-C to USB-C cables only as well pls.
They should just include a voucher I the box for a free charger. Those that want the charger can go ahead and get it, and those that don't need it and either the give the voucher to some one or simply not use it.
 

DeepIn2U

macrumors G5
May 30, 2002
13,051
6,984
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
It's the companies who win here, not the environment. Scamsville.
Sorry but I disagree.

Yes companies win by not manufacturing as many chargers or keeping them out to sell after sales. They'll win in reduced freight weight when shipping (a few grams per box ads up over 500K-3million boxes when shipping over distances).

Yet I'll wager the huge mistake the EU has imposed:

1 how many usbc chargers have been sold after sales by manufacturers? How many per specific model?
- I'll bet ONLY those with 80-240W charging capabilites have approached 1:1 device to extra charger sold.
- I'll bet that even Anker and others that sell GaN chargers and other accessories ONLY have seen reduction in sales and revenue IF only focusing on chargers as the years continue.
FYI personal anecdote: I purchased 2 GaN chargers just 2yrs ago and I don't need any others unless my suspicions of the 60W dual usbc unit isn't charging properly, then I'll get 1 more on sale.

Removable batteries by EU mandate!
This is a governmental tax move for profits or increased tax revenue. Nothing more.

Anyone recall the number if batteries you'd see in every computing and cell phone retail store by Nokia alone back in their heyday?! I recall Rogers Wireless stores in Toronto had half a long wall dedicated just to Nokia batteries and chargers!!

After a year on shelf Nokia did NOT buy them back at full price - so retailers like Rogers, Bell, Telus, T-Mobile USA etc would have to sell them back at a huge discount OR include them as a bundle when selling phones as a "sale" incentive!

How many of those ended up in landfill?!! This was an era where common recycling of anything was STILL very new concept in our lives.

Quick question:
How many of you in your city know of specific consumer available and accessible battery recycling locations?!
Another question how many of you KNOW of Tesla co-founder JB Straubel is currently in the battery recycling business with his company Redwood Materials, which recycles old batteries to create lithium-ion batteries for cars & received a 5-billion funding round! All while delving into cathode and anode processing.

Many of the batteries he gets are super low cost or free from landfill sites before they wake up and start asking for money!

That should've been the incentive by the EU: make computer and cell phone manufacturers responsible for battery recycling offering consumers 1/3 of the battery price paid to the consumers to invoke and foster incentive for recycling for the environment NOT sell us the ba lie that forcing replaceable batteries Ina smartphone or tablet is wanted by consumers. NO co sumer really wants to replace their own battery in theie phones snd tablets every year at a Cost to them!

Let's return to larger devices,
That have issues where contacts wear out in 2yrs of battery replacements & researing the battery to um you know fix an issue of software lol, and enjoy more landfills filled eoth batteries cause THAT never came into the minds of those that govern what they shouldn't. Let's hold back advancements in technology and consumer experience.
 

sunking101

macrumors 604
Sep 19, 2013
7,423
2,659
Sorry but I disagree.

Yes companies win by not manufacturing as many chargers or keeping them out to sell after sales. They'll win in reduced freight weight when shipping (a few grams per box ads up over 500K-3million boxes when shipping over distances).

Yet I'll wager the huge mistake the EU has imposed:

1 how many usbc chargers have been sold after sales by manufacturers? How many per specific model?
- I'll bet ONLY those with 80-240W charging capabilites have approached 1:1 device to extra charger sold.
- I'll bet that even Anker and others that sell GaN chargers and other accessories ONLY have seen reduction in sales and revenue IF only focusing on chargers as the years continue.
FYI personal anecdote: I purchased 2 GaN chargers just 2yrs ago and I don't need any others unless my suspicions of the 60W dual usbc unit isn't charging properly, then I'll get 1 more on sale.

Removable batteries by EU mandate!
This is a governmental tax move for profits or increased tax revenue. Nothing more.

Anyone recall the number if batteries you'd see in every computing and cell phone retail store by Nokia alone back in their heyday?! I recall Rogers Wireless stores in Toronto had half a long wall dedicated just to Nokia batteries and chargers!!

After a year on shelf Nokia did NOT buy them back at full price - so retailers like Rogers, Bell, Telus, T-Mobile USA etc would have to sell them back at a huge discount OR include them as a bundle when selling phones as a "sale" incentive!

How many of those ended up in landfill?!! This was an era where common recycling of anything was STILL very new concept in our lives.

Quick question:
How many of you in your city know of specific consumer available and accessible battery recycling locations?!
Another question how many of you KNOW of Tesla co-founder JB Straubel is currently in the battery recycling business with his company Redwood Materials, which recycles old batteries to create lithium-ion batteries for cars & received a 5-billion funding round! All while delving into cathode and anode processing.

Many of the batteries he gets are super low cost or free from landfill sites before they wake up and start asking for money!

That should've been the incentive by the EU: make computer and cell phone manufacturers responsible for battery recycling offering consumers 1/3 of the battery price paid to the consumers to invoke and foster incentive for recycling for the environment NOT sell us the ba lie that forcing replaceable batteries Ina smartphone or tablet is wanted by consumers. NO co sumer really wants to replace their own battery in theie phones snd tablets every year at a Cost to them!

Let's return to larger devices,
That have issues where contacts wear out in 2yrs of battery replacements & researing the battery to um you know fix an issue of software lol, and enjoy more landfills filled eoth batteries cause THAT never came into the minds of those that govern what they shouldn't. Let's hold back advancements in technology and consumer experience.
The EU replaceable battery mandate is superb. Once it comes in I'll buy a folding phone again and use it as my only device. At the moment I spread the load between my S23U and two tablets. The only thing making me do this is the captive battery situation! As a heavy user I would be recharging my one device three times a day and that would see the battery ruined in record time.

I have always been against these built-in batteries. Just look at the number of anxiety-ridden saps who limit their batteries to a 25-85% cycle because they're scared to death of declining battery health. These batteries cost around $15 and yet they're making $1500 perfectly good devices obsolete way before their time. Bring on the EU mandate I say! It will be the first thing they've got right!
 
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noobinator

macrumors 604
Jun 19, 2009
7,335
6,998
Los Angeles, CA
Flip 5 owners; any of you battling finding the power button? I pick my phone up and so many times I can't naturally find the power button with my finger. Don't know if it's just me or what but I'm constantly hunting for it. Obviously I can look down and see but when I grab it and go to hit it by feel, I'm not good. At all.
 
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Bkdodger

macrumors 68040
Jun 6, 2019
3,624
6,055
Flip 5 owners; any of you battling finding the power button? I pick my phone up and so many times I can't naturally find the power button with my finger. Don't know if it's just me or what but I'm constantly hunting for it. Obviously I can look down and see but when I grab it and go to hit it by feel, I'm not good. At all.
I'm definitely struggling with it ...it doesn't help that my cases have not arrived so going naked with it there's no feel for it ...
 

DeepIn2U

macrumors G5
May 30, 2002
13,051
6,984
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Bruv,

Youre making me want to return my S23 and wait 1-2 wks withiut a phone juat to get my original want for a Galaxy ... this Z Flip 5!

The refinement makes it the perfect successor to the iPhone 12/13 mini in terms of physical deminsions, and a UI that leads to not inviting you to continue to drop down into the deep well of social media hell.


Yeah, so far that's my biggest gripe. I have registered, re-registered, registered same fingers multiple times, but I just can't get it to work consistently.

Dawn mentioned this in his review for the Flip 5 and I cannot recall whom else. Have you registered your prints while it was closed, or only open?

I'm curious if you were to re-register all prints while both open and closed would it help? Furthermore any oily prints may mess woth recognition (either oily hands or onto the sensor itself) I recall having to clean my hands (I need cream due to dry skin) pr clean the TouchId sensor on the 5S, SE OG, 6/6S, 7 and 8 every few weeks or few days. Unsure if that would affect or be needed by you though just a possible suggestion that could help??

I noticed the hinge is much improved... folding has a smoother feel... I'm really liking this Flip.
Awesome.

I always love when he throws dirt on it and really messes with it..starts around the 5 min mark if you want to see the dirt and hinge dirt action ...did well including bend test
Pooh you dirty bird you! U just love to get dirty dont you?! /jk 😆
 
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DeepIn2U

macrumors G5
May 30, 2002
13,051
6,984
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
The EU replaceable battery mandate is superb. Once it comes in I'll buy a folding phone again and use it as my only device. At the moment I spread the load between my S23U and two tablets. The only thing making me do this is the captive battery situation! As a heavy user I would be recharging my one device three times a day and that would see the battery ruined in record time.

I have always been against these built-in batteries. Just look at the number of anxiety-ridden saps who limit their batteries to a 25-85% cycle because they're scared to death of declining battery health. These batteries cost around $15 and yet they're making $1500 perfectly good devices obsolete way before their time. Bring on the EU mandate I say! It will be the first thing they've got right!

Huh?(in Dave Chappelle voice when talking to the Mormon comedy) Your choice to use a smartphone and a tablet and calling it captive battery choice is purely on you!

Name me 2 products in 2 different product segments or categories that shared the exact same battery between that was available for retail sale both online and in stores anywhere in the world- EVER.

Go ahead I'll wait.
If you're going to say the Nokia N800, bare in mind there was no other products that were NOT discontinued (but for sale though on clearance) using the same battery - N95/E62/N80/E72.

With more components - either IN the battery case or in the product to facilitate charging, securing the connection and managing initial to constant charging will take up space and reduce battery capacities.

Another challenge: present to me a smartphone with removable batteries that ships in volume, globally with an easily accessible consumer support and global warranty support channel, and said batteries that mache 4200-6000mAh.
How many smartphones and tablets that are in production and supported that support this stance?!

I've never reduced the charging range on ANY smartphone, feature phone I've used since the Nokia 6600 debut, or thr limited iPad Pro 11" 2nd generations I've owned or the short time I had the iPad Mini 6 for 3 months. Not once b3cauee I believe Lithium ion polymer batteries do not need it with current charging technology. I do believe Apple's MagSafe Qi charging kills their iPhone batteries far too quickly.

I think you and the EU have a different meaning of what Obselence is. A battery can be swapped if internally not one product has it soldered - although Apple's insistence of heavy glue used on the MacBook i3 Intel that was discontinued or the 3rd generation iPad Air cones very close they've started using pull tabs in mobile devices to remove batteries.

Every manufacturer has a battery replacement program should internal batteries fail. Being internal does NOT increase battery capacity failure in any way at all. Does it remove consumer accessibility Yes it does.

I'd rather the manufacturer whom chosen the batteries and made the assembly or contracted out for the specific product should ALSO be held accountable for replacement and recycling at a very minimal cost to the consumer or at a payment - if internal and under the same level of extended software support or say 5yrs.

My reasoning for that 5yr mark is based on experience and watching the industry evolve:

PDA's:
Palm pilot and Microsft CE devices (hP Jornada, Casio Casseiopia, Compaq iPaq (before HP purchased) never lasted as useful longer than 3 yrs beyond theie initial software design. Newer products could do a lot more and faster.
- Sony Clies brought in MemorySticks,Color screens, WiFi when the Palm Pilot III was king in its 2nd year! I owned it.
- Compaq iPaq debut their expansion paq's 1yr later and was great extending life of that product but the next model had better DPad, slider lighter design, faster Bluetooth and wifi with camera adapter which was incompatible with the older model. Oh and a much higher resolution an brighter screen.

Nokia 9000i
Non color screen very minimal apps that had a closed system no new development was replaced with the 9200 and 9300 each faster mobile data speeds, colour screens wifi and yes removable batteries but the market chose blackberries due to email infrastructure.

We all know those got best out but lighter product with impeccably better screen better UI better user control and ease of use woth better music capability and was called the iPhone. Internal battery too.
You could do more. See more kn the screen EVEN if the first 2 generations were so limited in features. It grew and expanded those features.

Mobile networks changed early last year which made my iPhone 4S obsolete.
I cannot use it for its 2 primary funcriisn: phone and mobile network communications.
Apple recently invoked a software obsolescence where I cannot sign into it using my icloud to sync what it CAN do via software: sync contacts, calendar, notes and Safari bookmarks.

Guess what?
The battery STILL WORKS and has 90% health of its original capacity.
 

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sunking101

macrumors 604
Sep 19, 2013
7,423
2,659
Huh?(in Dave Chappelle voice when talking to the Mormon comedy) Your choice to use a smartphone and a tablet and calling it captive battery choice is purely on you!

Name me 2 products in 2 different product segments or categories that shared the exact same battery between that was available for retail sale both online and in stores anywhere in the world- EVER.

Go ahead I'll wait.
If you're going to say the Nokia N800, bare in mind there was no other products that were NOT discontinued (but for sale though on clearance) using the same battery - N95/E62/N80/E72.

With more components - either IN the battery case or in the product to facilitate charging, securing the connection and managing initial to constant charging will take up space and reduce battery capacities.

Another challenge: present to me a smartphone with removable batteries that ships in volume, globally with an easily accessible consumer support and global warranty support channel, and said batteries that mache 4200-6000mAh.
How many smartphones and tablets that are in production and supported that support this stance?!

I've never reduced the charging range on ANY smartphone, feature phone I've used since the Nokia 6600 debut, or thr limited iPad Pro 11" 2nd generations I've owned or the short time I had the iPad Mini 6 for 3 months. Not once b3cauee I believe Lithium ion polymer batteries do not need it with current charging technology. I do believe Apple's MagSafe Qi charging kills their iPhone batteries far too quickly.

I think you and the EU have a different meaning of what Obselence is. A battery can be swapped if internally not one product has it soldered - although Apple's insistence of heavy glue used on the MacBook i3 Intel that was discontinued or the 3rd generation iPad Air cones very close they've started using pull tabs in mobile devices to remove batteries.

Every manufacturer has a battery replacement program should internal batteries fail. Being internal does NOT increase battery capacity failure in any way at all. Does it remove consumer accessibility Yes it does.

I'd rather the manufacturer whom chosen the batteries and made the assembly or contracted out for the specific product should ALSO be held accountable for replacement and recycling at a very minimal cost to the consumer or at a payment - if internal and under the same level of extended software support or say 5yrs.

My reasoning for that 5yr mark is based on experience and watching the industry evolve:

PDA's:
Palm pilot and Microsft CE devices (hP Jornada, Casio Casseiopia, Compaq iPaq (before HP purchased) never lasted as useful longer than 3 yrs beyond theie initial software design. Newer products could do a lot more and faster.
- Sony Clies brought in MemorySticks,Color screens, WiFi when the Palm Pilot III was king in its 2nd year! I owned it.
- Compaq iPaq debut their expansion paq's 1yr later and was great extending life of that product but the next model had better DPad, slider lighter design, faster Bluetooth and wifi with camera adapter which was incompatible with the older model. Oh and a much higher resolution an brighter screen.

Nokia 9000i
Non color screen very minimal apps that had a closed system no new development was replaced with the 9200 and 9300 each faster mobile data speeds, colour screens wifi and yes removable batteries but the market chose blackberries due to email infrastructure.

We all know those got best out but lighter product with impeccably better screen better UI better user control and ease of use woth better music capability and was called the iPhone. Internal battery too.
You could do more. See more kn the screen EVEN if the first 2 generations were so limited in features. It grew and expanded those features.

Mobile networks changed early last year which made my iPhone 4S obsolete.
I cannot use it for its 2 primary funcriisn: phone and mobile network communications.
Apple recently invoked a software obsolescence where I cannot sign into it using my icloud to sync what it CAN do via software: sync contacts, calendar, notes and Safari bookmarks.

Guess what?
The battery STILL WORKS and has 90% health of its original capacity.
Not sure what you're getting at here in relation to my message?😦
I just want a phone with an easily removable battery so that I can pop a fresh one in every 8 months-or-so. I don't want to have to prise my device apart and literally destroy it whilst trying to get to the battery which is a very small thing to ask considering how expensive these things are.

If the manufacturers were genuinely serious about 'green' issues then they would not want perfectly good devices sent to landfill purely because the $15 battery inside had reached the end of its useful life. People bang on about how it's impossible due to waterproofing lol when they manage to put a seal on SIM card trays. In the 80s I had a genuinely waterproof camera, the Nikonos V, which was waterproof to 50m ie properly waterproof and it had a battery compartment that I went into after each & every dive. You also had to open it to get the film in and out which was a 30 second task so don't tell me that Apple and Samsung etc can't manufacture a slide-in battery system with a rubber seal on the door.

They do what they do now to help with their built-in obsolescence programs. Everything is designed to get you out of that device and into a new one as quickly as possible. They'll slow it down with updates, slowly kill the battery life with updates all the while knowing that the little $15 glued-in battery is going to come to their rescue if all their other methods fail. Not many people will stick around for the full 5 years of updates because their device will be a slow POS by that point with the battery life of a handheld car vac. Yet folk still think that them not putting a charger in the box is helping the environment.🙄
 

rhinosrcool

macrumors 68000
Sep 5, 2009
1,761
695
MN
Flip 5 owners; any of you battling finding the power button? I pick my phone up and so many times I can't naturally find the power button with my finger. Don't know if it's just me or what but I'm constantly hunting for it. Obviously I can look down and see but when I grab it and go to hit it by feel, I'm not good. At all.
Well, I have to say I'm not having problems with my Flip 5 power button. Almost always, I use my thumb. It works well. Also, I use the Rinke Slim case. For both of my foldables (flip 5 and fold 4), the fingerprint sensor is excellent. So, I don't know what's wrong with yours?
 
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