ssd swap - high usage of Terabytes Written

[Maximara]

There is no equation as such. Please read and try to understand the explanation. Read the Wiki pages. It is complicated but the explanation you are looking for is there.

Please watch Apple M1 SSDs: Do We Have a PROBLEM? and especially pay attention to 10:12 and and 10:38 - linear equations.

As for wikipedia even they state their own articles don't meet their reliable criteria. Heck the very name of the policy page is Wikipedia is not a reliable source. So your only counter argument is a source that itself says its articles are not reliable enough to be used in its own articles! Brilliance, absolute utter brilliance /s

 

[Maximara]

Just another factor and well documented. These guys worked at it, presented logical points. Apple is far from perfect fixes SW issues as and when it's expedient, although not always in a timely manner. Switching to a new architecture is no easy task by any means, personally I'm impressed it all comes together as well as it does.

In an earlier video, (Apple M1 SSDs: Do We Have a PROBLEM?), they have actual equations (10:12 and and 10:38) which are ... linear equations.

For those who, for some silly reason, want to point to wikipedia read Wikipedia is not a reliable source: "Because it can be edited by anyone at any time, any information it contains at a particular time could be vandalism, a work in progress, or just plain wrong. (...) Wikipedia is a volunteer-run project, it cannot constantly monitor every contribution. There are many errors that remain unnoticed for hours, days, weeks, months, or even years. Therefore, Wikipedia should not be considered a definitive source in and of itself"

That is why I have avoided using wikipedia and instead used the 2014 test, which since it was published in a recognized reliable source would overrule wikipedia per their Reliable sources guidelines - yes the youtube would not qualify but they don't use wikepdia either because... Wikipedia is not a reliable source.

In fact, Apple M1 SSDs: Do We Have a PROBLEM? specifically refers back to that test clearly using the linear results of that test for their formulas - Introducing the SSD Endurance Experiment and related pages.

 

[satcomer]

I always get my Mac speed tests at Accelerate Your Macintosh and BareFeets.com!

 

[pshufd]

My swap usage has been 0 since updating to 11.5.2. This is unusual for me as there's usually 100 - 200 MB of SWAP.

 

[daverdfw]

so this is interesting. I was running Monterey beta, and wanted to downgrade. Stuff wasn't acting right so I did the DFU mode restore for my Mini. Since being back on 11.5.2 kernel_task doesn't even show up in the activity monitor now. The IO is very minimal since its been booted. Its only been a few hours but I will keep an eye on it this week.

 

[jdb8167]

so this is interesting. I was running Monterey beta, and wanted to downgrade. Stuff wasn't acting right so I did the DFU mode restore for my Mini. Since being back on 11.5.2 kernel_task doesn't even show up in the activity monitor now. The IO is very minimal since its been booted. Its only been a few hours but I will keep an eye on it this week.

Make sure you have set the view in Activity Monitor to show All Processes. If you only have it set to My Processes you won't see kernel_task.

 

[daverdfw]

Make sure you have set the view in Activity Monitor to show All Processes. If you only have it set to My Processes you won't see kernel_task.

good catch. It was set to My Processes. it is pretty low still only 3 hours up but 10Gb read and 8Gb written is pretty low from what I used to see.

 

[kubilaydem]

Hi!

Using brave browser for a while. But i wanna try something different.

Is there other optins with cache disable + tab suspender?

Opera, vivaldi or others with great performance with m1?

 

[TheSynchronizer]

Hi!

Using brave browser for a while. But i wanna try something different.

Is there other optins with cache disable + tab suspender?

Opera, vivaldi or others with great performance with m1?

Microsoft Edge works pretty well too with the cache folders set to Read-Only and the built in tab sleeping feature. I made a comment about the process of setting the folders to read only somewhere a while back, so I’ll try to find it and quote it to you

EDIT: Found it, “If using Edge, go to ~/Library/Caches/Microsoft Edge/Default/ , click on the Cache folder and Get Info, and set the Sharing & Permissions of it to Read Only, and tick the Locked checkbox.”

Set all the cache folders to read only other than the Code Cache to turn off browser caching

 

[kubilaydem]

Microsoft Edge works pretty well too with the cache folders set to Read-Only and the built in tab sleeping feature. I made a comment about the process of setting the folders to read only somewhere a while back, so I’ll try to find it and quote it to you

EDIT: Found it, “If using Edge, go to ~/Library/Caches/Microsoft Edge/Default/ , click on the Cache folder and Get Info, and set the Sharing & Permissions of it to Read Only, and tick the Locked checkbox.”

Set all the cache folders to read only other than the Code Cache to turn off browser caching

Thank you !

I dont see Microsoft Edge under Caches folder. Looked both System > Library and Library.

Opera looks good for me but i dont know how to disable cache.

 

[kubilaydem]

I saw a video to disable caching for Safari Browser. And also there is a tab suspender extension on Safari too.

Is it safe to use Safari now?

Here is the video :

 

[osplo]

Is it safe to use Safari now?

I've been using Safari almost exclusively since day one, no problem at all. I don't even use tab suspenders or anything.

But I don't have 500+ open tabs either, as some users here.

What I have noticed is that simply closing and reopening Safari can free a fair amount of RAM if the app has been up for a while (which is usually my case, as I seldom reboot the MBA).

 

[EuroChilli]

I saw a video to disable caching for Safari Browser. And also there is a tab suspender extension on Safari too.

Is it safe to use Safari now?

Here is the video :

I didn't know it wasn't safe to use Safari, except maybe in an OS that's no longer supported, such as Mac OS X High Sierra, or earlier.

Disabling caching will only serve to slow things down, so why would I want to do that? Just close tabs and apps you're not using, it's that simple, really. If that doesn't work for you, then you might want to consider a bigger computer. A MacBook Air with 8GB RAM is not really suitable for editing feature length 4k res movies while browsing the internet with 3 browsers and over 100 tabs open in each one. Seriously, who does that?

The only time I re-boot is when a software update forces me to, otherwise Safari is the one app that's always open. No complaints from me.

 

[pshufd]

I didn't know it wasn't safe to use Safari, except maybe in an OS that's no longer supported, such as Mac OS X High Sierra, or earlier.

Disabling caching will only serve to slow things down, so why would I want to do that? Just close tabs and apps you're not using, it's that simple, really. If that doesn't work for you, then you might want to consider a bigger computer. A MacBook Air with 8GB RAM is not really suitable for editing feature length 4k res movies while browsing the internet with 3 browsers and over 100 tabs open in each one. Seriously, who does that?

The only time I re-boot is when a software update forces me to, otherwise Safari is the one app that's always open. No complaints from me.

Modern Browsers save information in closed tabs in case you want to reopen them. I do not know if there's a setting to limit the number of closed tabs that are saved.

Restarting Firefox usually gets me back about 2 GB of RAM. The real solution is to get a system with more RAM or get more than one system. Unfortunately Apple limits you to 16 GB of RAM on their M1 systems. I have been thinking of getting a second M1 mini to spread the RAM usage out. Kind of a virtual M1X.

 

[EuroChilli]

Modern Browsers save information in closed tabs in case you want to reopen them. I do not know if there's a setting to limit the number of closed tabs that are saved.

Restarting Firefox usually gets me back about 2 GB of RAM. The real solution is to get a system with more RAM or get more than one system. Unfortunately Apple limits you to 16 GB of RAM on their M1 systems. I have been thinking of getting a second M1 mini to spread the RAM usage out. Kind of a virtual M1X.

You have the right idea. As good as these M1's are, even with 16GB RAM, they still have their limitations. Perhaps folks who use these things should familiarise themselves better with such limitations, much like when driving various kinds of cars. There is a big difference between what a Prius, and a V12 Corvette can do. You generally don't drag race with a Prius ;-)

 

[pshufd]

You have the right idea. As good as these M1's are, even with 16GB RAM, they still have their limitations. Perhaps folks who use these things should familiarise themselves better with such limitations, much like when driving various kinds of cars. There is a big difference between what a Prius, and a V12 Corvette can do. You generally don't drag race with a Prius ;-)

My Windows desktop has 128 GB of RAM so I can run as many browser tabs as I want to. I just prefer macOS. I was considering a 2020 iMac 27 or a Mac Pro and then the M1s came along and I will have to say that I like the CPU performance and how cool it runs. So I use my Windows system and my M1 Mac mini. I was expecting systems with more RAM at WWDC but it didn't happen and the dates keep getting pushed out. So just using Windows and macOS until Apple comes out with bigger desktops.

 

[badsimian]

Just thought I would check and mine has gone from 5TB at the beginning of July to 23TB as of today. I am using Firefox with caches disabled and Edge with tab suspension. I haven't been using Safari. Most of my work is in browsers and VSCode and terminal. I plan on replacing this base M1 MBA with a 32GB 14" MBP when they arrive. It was only ever a holdover machine to get me though to new MBPs as I know I need more than 8GB really. Still feels like a high number though.

 

[Thistle41]

Just thought I would check and mine has gone from 5TB at the beginning of July to 23TB as of today. I am using Firefox with caches disabled and Edge with tab suspension. I haven't been using Safari. Most of my work is in browsers and VSCode and terminal. I plan on replacing this base M1 MBA with a 32GB 14" MBP when they arrive. It was only ever a holdover machine to get me though to new MBPs as I know I need more than 8GB really. Still feels like a high number though.

I replied on Constant Geekery Youtube channel with this to someone who had a similar high TBW experience.

What I can offer that works for me anyway and for the record, I am at 59.9TBW and 3% Used after some runaway events (I know not what) is this: Make sure OS is at the very latest release (11.5.2) as of this date, when walking off, log off, don't just go into 'Sleep' mode. It takes less than a minute to get back to where you were when logging back in. Powering down and up again consumes quite a lot of SSD writes so I avoid doing that. If you leave it on the charger, then going into sleep mode will not consume as many SSD writes. Don't ask why, I have no idea. Simply Logging off definitely helps in my case. For example, just shutting the lid overnight I was getting 2TBW sometimes! The next update will probably keep this state of affairs and I am happy to continue to use it this way. The next thing to ask ourselves is the likely lifetime warranted figures for total writes. Some suggest 200TBW which would be fine if I continue at this rate which is 21TBW/yr.

 

[pshufd]

I've moved most of my web browsing and all of my spreadsheets from my M1 mini (16 GB RAM) to my Windows desktop (128 GB RAM). I never had the SSD write issue but I like to avoid SWAP. I generally leave my system on for very long periods of time, basically not rebooting it unless something needs it or there's a macOS update. The lack of updates on this thread kind of implies that this problem isn't seen for many people these days.

 

[MrGunny94]

Honestly are you guys getting more than 5-10GB a day of swap? I work 8 hours on my M1 Air base model and I'm only able to reach 5GB max... Either way I'm putting most of my workflow on the Citrix VDI so I don't have to use any apps non-native Apple Silicon

 

[pshufd]

Honestly are you guys getting more than 5-10GB a day of swap? I work 8 hours on my M1 Air base model and I'm only able to reach 5GB max... Either way I'm putting most of my workflow on the Citrix VDI so I don't have to use any apps non-native Apple Silicon

I doubt I'm using much but my general goal on systems is zero swap. I could do that with another M1 but I'm waiting to see the M1X. I might pair an M1X mini with 32 GB of RAM with the M1 mini for a total of 48 GB of RAM.

 

[JamSandwich]

Interestingly, I stopped monitoring this issue in mid-July after seeing total writes of about 1TBW from early May.

From July to today, that figure spiked from 1.39TBW to 23.5 😬

Hard to know exactly what the culprit is. No intensive usage, mainly just a browsing PC with some light work in Affinity's creative programs. Rarely shut off, so maybe something in sleep, or possibly some behind-the-scenes autoplay in some browser tab or something. I hadn't done anything special with regard to managing writes, so anything that's happened has been a part of "default" behaviour of the system.

EDIT: The only reason I checked is because I had to hard power-down my system. Monitor had been turned off and something had been knocked on top of the keyboard, so the login screen had about a million characters in the password entry and would beachball when I tried to hit enter or cancel. Ha, who knows, maybe that's the culprit! But figured a fresh restart was a perfect time to check.

Unfortunate, because I probably could have seen more information from Activity Monitor if I didn't have to end that session

 

[MrGunny94]

So, the reality is that even if you get the 16GB version you still get high swap by design right?

 

[pshufd]

So, the reality is that even if you get the 16GB version you still get high swap by design right?

It depends on what you do. I have 16 GB and my Swap Used is currently 16.0 MB. It will go up to 200 MB but I haven't seen it go above 50 since the last Big Sur update. It's generally safer to just get 16 GB for the peace of mind. I do wish that they came in 24 or 32 GB.

 

[MrGunny94]

It depends on what you do. I have 16 GB and my Swap Used is currently 16.0 MB. It will go up to 200 MB but I haven't seen it go above 50 since the last Big Sur update. It's generally safer to just get 16 GB for the peace of mind. I do wish that they came in 24 or 32 GB.

Mine sits at 8-10GB a day usually but it's normal since my workloads usually require 16.. I got the base model as a temporary replacement until the new Pros would come out as I still need 2 display hooked up via thunderbolt dock...