Star Trek: Alpha to Delta Quadrants & Everything In Between

[bradl]

"The Inner Light" where Picard is forced to live an entire lifetime inside a probe. Kind of a mind ****.

I know that is a fan favorite episode, but I never really like it.

Brilliant episode - haunting and genuinely moving and powerful.

The thing about The Inner Light - outside of the wonderful acting the cast perform in this - is that it is supposed to remind all of us of our own mortality. Have we done everything we possibly can to say that if we were to die tomorrow, would we truly be happy with the life that we've lived. While some could easily say yes, they really haven't truly examined their lives and thought about it. If they did, I would venture to say that 98% of the population would say "no".

So the next time you see it, don't watch for the plotline and the story in the episode, watch it and take the hidden social commentary to heart, as that's what's missing. Look at it in a different light.

BL.

 

[Mousse]

I was more into Stargate at the time when Star Trek was most popular I think.
I saw some but didn't get hooked.
The earliest Star Trek I was too young for I guess.
Have something to dive into when time allows in the future.

Love most sci-fi. Star Trek Discovery that's going on now is cool

View attachment 761844

If you like a good story that could be told even in a different genre, then TOS, TNG and DS9 are series to watch. They are the human condition Sci-Fi that I enjoy.

If you just like big honkin' space guns, big explosions and space battles Voyager and the final 2 seasons of DS9 is for you. I can't say anything good about Enterprise...well, the opening credit is good.

From what I've read about Discovery, the of Pew-Pew, Kaboom! stuff takes center stage while plot line and continuity plays second fiddle. They ignore stuff that has become dogma in the Star Trek universe. Star Fleet officers infighting? ("You're Star Fleet officers. Act like it," sayth every Star Fleet officer to infighting lackeys) Target lock on a cloaked vessel? Com' on man. A human performing a Vulcan neck/nerve pinch? It's was already established that Human lack the necessary strength to perform the neck pinch.*

For a hard core Trekkie, it's heresy. If they branded it anything but Star Trek, I might watch. Breaking the Roddenberry Rules breaks the very essence of Star Trek.

*But, but, but Picard nerve pinched Tuvok in TNG: Starship Mine. Actually Picard cut off the flow of blood to the brain by clamping down on the carotid artery, so it's not a nerve pinch. Seven of Nine nerve pinched Tuvok...the real Tuvok in Voyager: The Raven. Well, she's Borg. Borg are physically stronger than Vulcans and Klingons.

 

[S.B.G]

They ignore stuff that has become dogma in the Star Trek universe. Star Fleet officers infighting? ("You're Star Fleet officers. Act like it," sayth every Star Fleet officer to infighting lackeys) Target lock on a cloaked vessel? Com' on man. A human performing a Vulcan neck/nerve pinch? It's was already established that Human lack the necessary strength to perform the neck pinch.*

Having watched Disco, there is a lot more to it than that, and once the viewer learns what is truly happeneing, only then will a true Trek fan realize that it is still the Star Fleet we've come to know over the decades.

I thought and felt the same as you did before I actually took in the entirety of season 1 of Disco.

 

[hvfsl]

Maybe there were; - alone of the ST franchise - I wasn't enthused - at all - and it is possible that I just didn't hang around long enough to find them.

If you haven't already, I would give season 4 a watch. It is actually one of my favourite Star Trek seasons out of all Star Trek (only 1 poor episode IMO).

But I agree, most of the episodes in seasons 1 and 2 were forgettable.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

If you haven't already, I would give season 4 a watch. It is actually one of my favourite Star Trek seasons out of all Star Trek (only 1 poor episode IMO).

But I agree, most of the episodes in seasons 1 and 2 were forgettable.

Oh, I agree; from season three onwards, it found its voice, emerged from the shadow of classic ST, and was confident in its own identity. There were some excellent episodes in seasons four, five, six and seven.

 

[Lioness~]

If you like a good story that could be told even in a different genre, then TOS, TNG and DS9 are series to watch.

Don't know what those shortenings stand for? It might be suggestions, right?
Ok, I subtly hinted that I might check it up, which I probably wont.

I enjoy todays series actually. Past is past to me. Nostalgica isn't for me. Plenty of interesting stuff going on. Timetravel is interesting now.
So no the big guns I can be without. Even if that shows up in almost every tv-show or movie.
I'ts what's behind it, the brains I like. I want it to challenge and open new thoughts.
And except for Steve Jobs that was way ahead of his time, I believe the thinking mostly moves forward.
I watch some Timeless, Agents of shield, The crossing etc....right now.

Sorry if I'm treading on some hardcore toes I just like the new Star Trek Discovery.

 

[S.B.G]

Don't know what those shortenings stand for? It might be suggestions, right?

TOS = The Original Series 1960s
TAS = The Animated Series 1970s
TNG = The Next Generation 1980s
DS9 = Deep Space 9 1990s
VOY = Yoyager 1990s - 2000s
ENT = Enterprise 2000s
Disco = Discovery

 

[Mousse]

Don't know what those shortenings stand for? It might be suggestions, right?
Ok, I subtle hinted that I might check it up, which I probably wont.

Sorry. Old habit thinking everyone was a Trekkie. TOS = The Original Series, TNG = The Next Generation, DS9 = Deep Space Nine.

I enjoy todays series actually. Past is past to me. Nostalgica isn't for me. Plenty of interesting stuff going on. Timetravel is interesting now.
So no the big guns I can be without. Even if that shows up in almost every tv-show or movie.
I'ts what's behind it, the brains I like. I want it to challenge and open new thoughts.
And except for Steve Jobs that was way ahead of his time, I believe the thinking mostly moves forward.
I watch some Timeless, Agents of shield, The crossing etc....right now.

Sorry if I'm treading on some hardcore toes I just like the new Star Trek Discovery.

You'll enjoy TNG...er the Next Generation and Deep Space Nine then. Don't both with Voyager or Enterprise. Well, a few Voyager episodes are good. The make up and special effects of The Original Series would have most modern viewers laughing at how primitive everything looks.

The JJ Abram remakes were enjoyable as a sci-fi movie, but really grinds my gear as a Star Trek movie. Everything you know in universe gets thrown out the window. 5 hours to get from Earth to Q'onos (the Klingon homeworld)? For non-Trekkie, it's a minor point. But for a long time Trekkie, that's like saying New York is next to California; or eating your gazpacho soup piping hot. Those remakes were anything but Star Trek. Enjoyable, maybe (I hated them, but I'm bias). But it would have been better not being branded as Star Trek movies.

 

[S.B.G]

For anyone who hasn't seen or known about the Star Trek wiki and wants to get into the weeds about everything ST, visit Memory Alpha.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

For anyone who hasn't seen or known about the Star Trek wiki and wants to get into the weeds about everything ST, visit Memory Alpha.

Excellent recommendation; I have spent more time than I care to divulge here perusing that site.

 

[Glideslope]

I'm not too far from the Star Trek Museum in Ticonderoga, NY. Shatner was just here. $1,500 at ticket and a Q&A with him.

 

[ucfgrad93]

I know that is a fan favorite episode, but I never really like it.

Oh man, that is one of my all time favorite episodes of any tv series.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Oh man, that is one of my all time favorite episodes of any tv series.

And it is an episode that actually improves upon repeated viewing - it is better by far - for script, story, intelligence, the sheer epic narrative arc of the tale told, the serious matters covered during the story, and the superlative acting, not least the performance of Patrick Stewart - than each and every - in fact, all of the movies of the ST franchise.

If you have story to tell, a good script and a formidable cast, you don't really need to waste your money in special effects or CGI. One of the things I liked about STNG (and indeed DS9) was that special effects served to support the story, and give emphasis to some features of that tale, rather than being in themselves, what the story was about.

 

[IronWaffle]

Watching an episode tonight, this scene stuck to my brain.

 

[Mac'nCheese]

"The Inner Light" where Picard is forced to live an entire lifetime inside a probe. Kind of a mind ****.

I know that is a fan favorite episode, but I never really like it.

Brilliant episode - haunting and genuinely moving and powerful.

The thing about The Inner Light - outside of the wonderful acting the cast perform in this - is that it is supposed to remind all of us of our own mortality. Have we done everything we possibly can to say that if we were to die tomorrow, would we truly be happy with the life that we've lived. While some could easily say yes, they really haven't truly examined their lives and thought about it. If they did, I would venture to say that 98% of the population would say "no".

So the next time you see it, don't watch for the plotline and the story in the episode, watch it and take the hidden social commentary to heart, as that's what's missing. Look at it in a different light.

BL.

Its my favorite episode of any tv show ever. IIRC, no nominations for writing or acting. Just a brilliant story which does exactly what great sci-fi and great drama should do, IMHO.

 

[IronWaffle]

YouTube’s recommendation algorithms are a funny thing.

 

[mobilehaathi]

YouTube’s recommendation algorithms are a funny thing.

I do really like that scene, although the clip doesn’t put it into full context. Picard is negotiating for extra time to evacuate some stubborn and quite arrogant humans from a planet that another species was given in a treaty long ago. It was surprising to find humans there anyway as the environment was inherently hostile to human life.

This species considers humans no more significant than ants and would readily eradicate them all, except for the extraordinarily lengthy, detailed, and comprehensive treaty.

The aliens are brutally dismissive of all of Picard’s attempts to negotiate by simply repeating verbatim sections of the treaty that outline their authority in the matter—when they answer calls at all.

That scene is a culmination of an extraordinarily trying and frustrating series of communications with an utterly and completely intransigent and uncaring adversary.

Actually I like the other story line too, where Data is sent to negotiate with arrogant and intransigent humans who initially refuse to leave their colony. What’s interesting here is the way in which both parties handle their negotiations and the ways by which they came to a resolution.

The irony, and I think brilliance of the episode, is that at the outset we are lead to expect that the only way of dealing with the aliens is with violence and to expect the humans to be quite reasonable. However the solutions are reversed from expectation: Picard found a diplomatic solution deep within an arcane document, while Data must resort to physically destroying the settlement’s infrastructure in order to force the humans to leave.

Anyway, good thing Picard studied a bit of anthropology (exo-anthropology?) and remembered the Grizelle were in their hibernation season...

 

[IronWaffle]

I do really like that scene, although the clip doesn’t put it into full context. Picard is negotiating for extra time to evacuate some stubborn and quite arrogant humans from a planet that another species was given in a treaty long ago. It was surprising to find humans there anyway as the environment was inherently hostile to human life.

This species considers humans no more significant than ants and would readily eradicate them all, except for the extraordinarily lengthy, detailed, and comprehensive treaty.

The aliens are brutally dismissive of all of Picard’s attempts to negotiate by simply repeating verbatim sections of the treaty that outline their authority in the matter—when they answer calls at all.

That scene is a culmination of an extraordinarily trying and frustrating series of communications with an utterly and completely intransigent and uncaring adversary.

Actually I like the other story line too, where Data is sent to negotiate with arrogant and intransigent humans who initially refuse to leave their colony. What’s interesting here is the way in which both parties handle their negotiations and the ways by which they came to a resolution.

The irony, and I think brilliance of the episode, is that at the outset we are lead to expect that the only way of dealing with the aliens is with violence and to expect the humans to be quite reasonable. However the solutions are reversed from expectation: Picard found a diplomatic solution deep within an arcane document, while Data must resort to physically destroying the settlement’s infrastructure in order to force the humans to leave.

Anyway, good thing Picard studied a bit of anthropology (exo-anthropology?) and remembered the Grizelle were in their hibernation season...

Phenomenal summary and analysis. As you put it, they really pulled together a harmonious A and B plot to round out a thoughtful morality play (not an easy trick or one they could pull off consistently). The various inversions of who is violent, who is righteous, etc. is a rich vein to mine. The android who wants to be human confronting humans not in our best light; the fastidiously diplomatic captain finding a way to adhere to the letter of the rules and force the intransigent but “contractually within their rights” alien race to compromise using their own terms. Best of all, it presents intertwining stories where protagonists and antagonists have competing desires that, with wisdom and fortitude, can perhaps be worked out rather than fought out or by resorting to simple vilification. Fiction is neat that way. Such aspiration seems somehow and sadly out-of-fashion lately both in our storytelling and our culture at large.

I wonder how much/little of that resonated with me when it first aired. Now, like the clip taken out-of-context, I’m reminded how the best of shows like this exist both in as artifacts and harbingers (I can’t find the right word so that’ll have to do). Then again, we silly little bipeds are cyclical nutters spending half of our lives learning how to repeat then reject only to inadvertently repeat despite attempts to reject. The spiraling folly of humankind.

I’m slowly rewatching DS9 (in semi-tandem with two “IRL” friends. It’s a series I’ve revisited a few times in the last five years. TNG reruns were so emblazoned in my, uh, neural pathways back in the 90s that despite having supported/purchased the (beautiful) Blu-ray restorations now ubiquitously available on streaming, I have avoided watching again. Time to cherry pick exceptions like this episode. I’m also way overdue watching the lengthy bonus round tables, like one with the members of the writers room. Been saving them for a rainy day... it’s been a torrentially rainy week so maybe that’s what the doctor ordered.

I suspect the clip was recommended because lately I’ve been indulging in Trek-related YouTube ephemera as well as Seth Meyers’ A Closer Look and similarly timely fare. Can’t guess why else but such things are not my bailiwick. I’m but a humble caveman wondering if the Grizelle are noisy as cicadas when they wake.

———

To make up for all my blather, let me recommend the Memory Alpha (Trek Wiki) page dedicated to this episode, Ensigns of s link skips the summary and goes straight to the other stuff... http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/The_Ensigns_of_Command_(episode)#Background_information

Some highlights:

Melinda Snodgrass commented, "I wanted to take Data one step further in his development as a Human being. I wanted to stress him and have him face a situation where logic isn't enough, to show that in order to command you have to have charisma. You have to learn how to wave your dick and hope your dick is bigger than the other guy's." (Captains' Logs: The Unauthorized Complete Trek Voyages, p. 186)

According to a line cut from the episode, Tau Cygna V held sufficient amounts of an elusive sub-atomic particle called teremi-thoron, which interfered with transporter signals.

The title of this episode is from the poem "The Wants of Man" by John Quincy Adams. In the context of this poem, the term "ensign" means a flag or symbol, not the Starfleet rank.

I want the seals of power and place,
The ensigns of command,
Charged by the people's unbought grace,
To rule my native land.
Nor crown nor sceptre would I ask,
But from my country's will,
By day, by night, to ply the task
Her cup of bliss to fill.

Melinda Snodgrass's original version of the teleplay had some noticeable differences from the finished episode. In particular, the Sheliak were named the "Hrathan," Kentor was named "Noe" and had a much smaller role in the story (as did Haritath), Gosheven and Ard'rian were implied to be in a relationship, and the hyperonic radiation did not affect phasers or tricorders, with Data simply not wishing to resort to violence to resolve the situation, rather than being unable to use his phaser. [2]

Despite Snodgrass's own name being used on both the earlier draft and the finished episode, the final draft teleplay credits "H. B. Savage" as the writer. [3]

During filming, the entourage of the 14th Dalai Lama visited the sets and had pictures taken with Brent Spiner. (Star Trek: The Next Generation Companion 2nd ed., p. 101) One of these pictures appeared on the original UK VHS release of this episode. While the Dalai Lama had been touring the western US, his schedule precluded him visiting the set in person.[4]

According to director Cliff Bole, US$200,000 was cut from the episode "at the last minute". The most prominent result of this was that more romantic overtones between Data and Ard'rian McKenzie were removed. (Star Trek: The Next Generation Companion 2nd ed., p. 101)

 

[mobilehaathi]

Phenomenal summary and analysis. As you put it, they really pulled together a harmonious A and B plot to round out a thoughtful morality play (not an easy trick or one they could pull off consistently). The various inversions of who is violent, who is righteous, etc. is a rich vein to mine. The android who wants to be human confronting humans not in our best light; the fastidiously diplomatic captain finding a way to adhere to the letter of the rules and force the intransigent but “contractually within their rights” alien race to compromise using their own terms. Best of all, it presents intertwining stories where protagonists and antagonists have competing desires that, with wisdom and fortitude, can perhaps be worked out rather than fought out or by resorting to simple vilification. Fiction is neat that way. Such aspiration seems somehow and sadly out-of-fashion lately both in our storytelling and our culture at large.

I wonder how much/little of that resonated with me when it first aired. Now, like the clip taken out-of-context, I’m reminded how the best of shows like this exist both in as artifacts and harbingers (I can’t find the right word so that’ll have to do). Then again, we silly little bipeds are cyclical nutters spending half of our lives learning how to repeat then reject only to inadvertently repeat despite attempts to reject. The spiraling folly of humankind.

I’m slowly rewatching DS9 (in semi-tandem with two “IRL” friends. It’s a series I’ve revisited a few times in the last five years. TNG reruns were so emblazoned in my, uh, neural pathways back in the 90s that despite having supported/purchased the (beautiful) Blu-ray restorations now ubiquitously available on streaming, I have avoided watching again. Time to cherry pick exceptions like this episode. I’m also way overdue watching the lengthy bonus round tables, like one with the members of the writers room. Been saving them for a rainy day... it’s been a torrentially rainy week so maybe that’s what the doctor ordered.

I suspect the clip was recommended because lately I’ve been indulging in Trek-related YouTube ephemera as well as Seth Meyers’ A Closer Look and similarly timely fare. Can’t guess why else but such things are not my bailiwick. I’m but a humble caveman wondering if the Grizelle are noisy as cicadas when they wake.

———

To make up for all my blather, let me recommend the Memory Alpha (Trek Wiki) page dedicated to this episode, Ensigns of s link skips the summary and goes straight to the other stuff... http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/The_Ensigns_of_Command_(episode)#Background_information

Honestly, this is storytelling at its finest: concise, thoughtful, dramatic, humorous, interconnected, unexpected, satisfying.

I don’t mind serialized stories per se, but I do miss episodic series with tight well-written scripts.

I liked DS9 too, and it has plenty of good episodes. But I’m only lukewarm on the whole dominion war story line, and the Sisko-as-Jesus line just struck me more as strange than anything else. Oh, and I could do without all the Vegas lounge singing—no offense, Vic.

I still think, overall, TNG is the epitome of Trek storytelling, they really did some truly fantastic episodes.

 

[IronWaffle]

Honestly, this is storytelling at its finest: concise, thoughtful, dramatic, humorous, interconnected, unexpected, satisfying.

I don’t mind serialized stories per se, but I do miss episodic series with tight well-written scripts.

I liked DS9 too, and it has plenty of good episodes. But I’m only lukewarm on the whole dominion war story line, and the Sisko-as-Jesus line just struck me more as strange than anything else. Oh, and I could do without all the Vegas lounge singing—no offense, Vic.

I still think, overall, TNG is the epitome of Trek storytelling, they really did some truly fantastic episodes.

I agree on all your points.

I tend to prefer standalone episodes when it comes to the pre-Sopranos/Lost/etc. era, particularly with X-Files. Mixed bag DS9 is, it simply isn’t jammed that deeply into my brain and while the serialization is hit-and-miss, I like that there is a sense of consequence (even if it goes a bit off the rails). I also can’t get enough of Odo and Quark. Those two actors need to do their own Stewart/McKellan revival of Godot!

Segueing back to TNG, I’m amused to see (future blue collar “chief”) O’Brien tuning up his cello before playing in a string quartet with Data. I wonder how he’d explain THAT to Dr. Bashir.

More excitingly, looking at the episode menu I’d forgotten what a great little run of that early season: Ensigns, Survivors, Who Watches the Watchers. Three of my favorites. Gonna be a fun night.

 

[bradl]

YouTube’s recommendation algorithms are a funny thing.

I do really like that scene, although the clip doesn’t put it into full context. Picard is negotiating for extra time to evacuate some stubborn and quite arrogant humans from a planet that another species was given in a treaty long ago. It was surprising to find humans there anyway as the environment was inherently hostile to human life.

This species considers humans no more significant than ants and would readily eradicate them all, except for the extraordinarily lengthy, detailed, and comprehensive treaty.

The aliens are brutally dismissive of all of Picard’s attempts to negotiate by simply repeating verbatim sections of the treaty that outline their authority in the matter—when they answer calls at all.

That scene is a culmination of an extraordinarily trying and frustrating series of communications with an utterly and completely intransigent and uncaring adversary.

Actually I like the other story line too, where Data is sent to negotiate with arrogant and intransigent humans who initially refuse to leave their colony. What’s interesting here is the way in which both parties handle their negotiations and the ways by which they came to a resolution.

The irony, and I think brilliance of the episode, is that at the outset we are lead to expect that the only way of dealing with the aliens is with violence and to expect the humans to be quite reasonable. However the solutions are reversed from expectation: Picard found a diplomatic solution deep within an arcane document, while Data must resort to physically destroying the settlement’s infrastructure in order to force the humans to leave.

Anyway, good thing Picard studied a bit of anthropology (exo-anthropology?) and remembered the Grizelle were in their hibernation season...

I would have thought that you two would have liked his diplomatic tactics used in Menage a Troi over this. I mean, name me any diplomat that quotes Shakespeare before giving a 10 second countdown before blowing up your ship.

BL.

 

[IronWaffle]

I would have thought that you two would have liked his diplomatic tactics used in Menage a Troi over this. I mean, name me any diplomat that quotes Shakespeare before giving a 10 second countdown before blowing up your ship.

BL.

Love it!

One must wonder how the folks on the lower decks might have taken such a strange twist on "cowboy diplomacy"! Awesome in fiction with a great actor, not so much when in Singapore the other day.

 

[T'hain Esh Kelch]

Sigh. Now I have to watch all 7 seasons for the third time. TNG is just the best thing ever, after vanilla and bacon - And the good thing about TNG, is that you can enjoy it together with both things.

 

[IronWaffle]

Sigh. Now I have to watch all 7 seasons for the third time. TNG is just the best thing ever, after vanilla and bacon - And the good thing about TNG, is that you can enjoy it together with both things.

Great now I have to hit Amazon to "subscribe and save" to a year's supply of "Bacon 'Bean vanilla ice cream" to fuel a rewatch.

 

[mobilehaathi]

Love it!

One must wonder how the folks on the lower decks might have taken such a strange twist on "cowboy diplomacy"! Awesome in fiction with a great actor, not so much when in Singapore the other day.

Hehe, pure comedy.