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lowendlinux

macrumors 603
Sep 24, 2014
5,459
6,786
Germany
We've been taking month-long vacations in odd numbered years for a while. I think our 2015 trip and 2017 trip are in this thread already.

The 2019 trip will be from mid Feb to mid Mar. This time we're going to Hong Kong, Thailand, Cambodia, and Vietnam.

Have you considered a southern Africa trip?

Maybe
Egypt, Kenya, Tanzania, Madagascar, South Africa, Botswana, Angola, Nigeria.

That should give a bit of everything from surfing and great scenery to tourist beaches
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
I am forced to go to Switzerland every year. It is terrible! Daughter lives there and her prime time for research is July/Aug when countrywide, "European vacation" shuts down all daycare for a month. Therefore, I go and spoil the grandchild for two weeks, and the other grandparents who are Swiss pick up the other two weeks.

While obviously we do a lot during those two weeks, I spend three weeks with the extra week somewhere which has included Great Britian last year, and previously, Vienna, Barcelona, Madrid, Venice, Canary Islands, etc, It is a rough job, but somebody has to do it.
That’s a place I wanted to go on a 1 month, hang out vacation. :)
[doublepost=1535721186][/doublepost]
We've been taking month-long vacations in odd numbered years for a while. I think our 2015 trip and 2017 trip are in this thread already.

The 2019 trip will be from mid Feb to mid Mar. This time we're going to Hong Kong, Thailand, Cambodia, and Vietnam.

SEAsia+2019+04_002.jpg
We were considering a 2week Viking River Cruise in Asia, but it looks like too much bus time, and not enough river cruising time.
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
This coming week we are planning a 7 day visit to France south of Paris, Normandy area, with a side trip to Luxumborg. This is contrary to the last couple of “guided” ship cruises (river and ocean), will be more what we have typically done on touring vacations, make up an agenda in advance and wing it. Two known stops will be Versailles and the WWII memorials at Normandy. My wife has always wanted to visit Luxumborg, and we bypassed an opportunity about 20 years ago driving right by it, so better late than never. :)

Any suggestions, tips, or warnings or gotchas? :)

After my trip driving tour to Italy, I am reminded of their “no foreigner drive zones” or was it “no rental car driving zones” set up so they can mainly fleece tourists with tickets that arrive after the fact, in my case 9 months later. :(

Also I have a dedicated GPS that needs a Europe map as it seems Garmin does not offer anything smaller than the UK/Ireland, or Europe mainland maps. Need to download one of those, butmtheynare not cheap as far as maps go $99, practically the price of a nes GPS. But time is relatively short so will probably go that route.

I also want to look into possible,options that don’t cost an arm and a leg for using my phone in France for calls (to hotels) and or GPS, (the Waze app) that uses phone data. I’m going to call my carrier T-Mobile and ask them. Now we have a European Motorola flip phone that is only 20 years old, but appears functional (it took a charge last night) that we used to charge with minutes, when we visited our son in the UK. I am guessing this phone most likely is obsolete.
 

Apple fanboy

macrumors Ivy Bridge
Feb 21, 2012
56,901
55,839
Behind the Lens, UK
This coming week we are planning a 7 day visit to France south of Paris, Normandy area, with a side trip to Luxumborg. This is contrary to the last couple of “guided” ship cruises (river and ocean), will be more what we have typically done on touring vacations, make up an agenda in advance and wing it. Two known stops will be Versailles and the WWII memorials at Normandy. My wife has always wanted to visit Luxumborg, and we bypassed an opportunity about 20 years ago driving right by it, so better late than never. :)

Any suggestions, tips, or warnings or gotchas? :)

After my trip driving tour to Italy, I am reminded of their “no foreigner drive zones” or was it “no rental car driving zones” set up so they can mainly fleece tourists with tickets that arrive after the fact, in my case 9 months later. :(

Also I have a dedicated GPS that needs a Europe map as it seems Garmin does not offer anything smaller than the UK/Ireland, or Europe mainland maps. Need to download one of those, butmtheynare not cheap as far as maps go $99, practically the price of a nes GPS. But time is relatively short so will probably go that route.

I also want to look into possible,options that don’t cost an arm and a leg for using my phone in France for calls (to hotels) and or GPS, (the Waze app) that uses phone data. I’m going to call my carrier T-Mobile and ask them. Now we have a European Motorola flip phone that is only 20 years old, but appears functional (it took a charge last night) that we used to charge with minutes, when we visited our son in the UK. I am guessing this phone most likely is obsolete.
Watch out for the yellow jackets!
 

Falhófnir

macrumors 603
Aug 19, 2017
6,146
7,001
This coming week we are planning a 7 day visit to France south of Paris, Normandy area, with a side trip to Luxumborg. This is contrary to the last couple of “guided” ship cruises (river and ocean), will be more what we have typically done on touring vacations, make up an agenda in advance and wing it. Two known stops will be Versailles and the WWII memorials at Normandy. My wife has always wanted to visit Luxumborg, and we bypassed an opportunity about 20 years ago driving right by it, so better late than never. :)

Any suggestions, tips, or warnings or gotchas? :)

After my trip driving tour to Italy, I am reminded of their “no foreigner drive zones” or was it “no rental car driving zones” set up so they can mainly fleece tourists with tickets that arrive after the fact, in my case 9 months later. :(

Also I have a dedicated GPS that needs a Europe map as it seems Garmin does not offer anything smaller than the UK/Ireland, or Europe mainland maps. Need to download one of those, butmtheynare not cheap as far as maps go $99, practically the price of a nes GPS. But time is relatively short so will probably go that route.

I also want to look into possible,options that don’t cost an arm and a leg for using my phone in France for calls (to hotels) and or GPS, (the Waze app) that uses phone data. I’m going to call my carrier T-Mobile and ask them. Now we have a European Motorola flip phone that is only 20 years old, but appears functional (it took a charge last night) that we used to charge with minutes, when we visited our son in the UK. I am guessing this phone most likely is obsolete.
Buying a local PAYG sim and loading it with as much as you want to spend would be one way of avoiding a nasty surprise when you get home - a lot come with ‘free’ data for topping up a certain amount which is valid for a month after that date. As long as your phone supports GSM bands (I think all iPhones do?) and isn’t carrier locked you should be ok?
 

tizeye

macrumors 68040
Jul 17, 2013
3,228
35,727
Orlando, FL
This coming week we are planning a 7 day visit to France south of Paris, Normandy area, with a side trip to Luxumborg. This is contrary to the last couple of “guided” ship cruises (river and ocean), will be more what we have typically done on touring vacations, make up an agenda in advance and wing it.

I also want to look into possible,options that don’t cost an arm and a leg for using my phone in France for calls (to hotels) and or GPS, (the Waze app) that uses phone data. I’m going to call my carrier T-Mobile and ask them. Now we have a European Motorola flip phone that is only 20 years old, but appears functional (it took a charge last night) that we used to charge with minutes, when we visited our son in the UK. I am guessing this phone most likely is obsolete.

Have to agree with you on the ship thing. Venice and Barcelona are overwhelmed with ships holding 7000+ passenger disembarking for a 4 hour shore excursion. Local are very upset and it is a major issue. While I am not a local to either, when there, I stayed in hotels and the mass of ships flooding the streets with people on a time constrant having to "do" everything, but actually "do" nothing is insane and detracted from my experience. Locally in Orlando? We know to keep out of I-Drive in the tourist corridor and has been decades since I have gone to the big 3 attractions. While it may be a good thing, sadly, people who come here think they have seen Florida with the visit while in reality, Disney and others seek to entrap them in their system to spend all their money there. Thinking of writing a book with the theme 'beyond Disney'.

In terms of phone, while not certain of their specific plans in every country, if you live in the USA, T-Mobile blows away ATT and Verizon on worldwide international (as opposed to regional international covering Mexico and Canada) and the sole reason I have T-Mobile. While the don't have a relationship with all country's carriers (Finland for example) it is an extensive list covering most countries, so you have to check. Basically, your wifi will reflect the local county carrier, with free wifi and text to your plan limits - unlimited in my case. Reduced rate on voice calls...but I never use it. Change my voice mail to require people to either text number they just dialed or email. Don't check voicemail as that counts as a phone call. People who know me know not to call, and review of calls not answered, 99% of those calls were telemarketer spam an I definitely don't want to pay international rates. If voicecall is necessary, I use Facetime or Skype which the only time that occurred was a Skype landline (non-video) to the airline adjusting my plane ticket.
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
I found my sim card with my 2012 Europe data on it, but sigh, I don't need issues so I'll cough up the $100 for a new map, almost the price of a new (dedicated )GPS, but over here they don't usually come with European maps on them.

Buying a local PAYG sim and loading it with as much as you want to spend would be one way of avoiding a nasty surprise when you get home - a lot come with ‘free’ data for topping up a certain amount which is valid for a month after that date. As long as your phone supports GSM bands (I think all iPhones do?) and isn’t carrier locked you should be ok?

I plan on talking to T-Mobile this weekend, first of the week to see what they can do for me. I'll also consider buying a cheap pay as you go phone over there.

Have to agree with you on the ship thing. Venice and Barcelona are overwhelmed with ships holding 7000+ passenger disembarking for a 4 hour shore excursion. Local are very upset and it is a major issue. While I am not a local to either, when there, I stayed in hotels and the mass of ships flooding the streets with people on a time constrant having to "do" everything, but actually "do" nothing is insane and detracted from my experience. Locally in Orlando? We know to keep out of I-Drive in the tourist corridor and has been decades since I have gone to the big 3 attractions. While it may be a good thing, sadly, people who come here think they have seen Florida with the visit while in reality, Disney and others seek to entrap them in their system to spend all their money there. Thinking of writing a book with the theme 'beyond Disney'.

In terms of phone, while not certain of their specific plans in every country, if you live in the USA, T-Mobile blows away ATT and Verizon on worldwide international (as opposed to regional international covering Mexico and Canada) and the sole reason I have T-Mobile. While the don't have a relationship with all country's carriers (Finland for example) it is an extensive list covering most countries, so you have to check. Basically, your wifi will reflect the local county carrier, with free wifi and text to your plan limits - unlimited in my case. Reduced rate on voice calls...but I never use it. Change my voice mail to require people to either text number they just dialed or email. Don't check voicemail as that counts as a phone call. People who know me know not to call, and review of calls not answered, 99% of those calls were telemarketer spam an I definitely don't want to pay international rates. If voicecall is necessary, I use Facetime or Skype which the only time that occurred was a Skype landline (non-video) to the airline adjusting my plane ticket.

Mostly I want a phone just for local communications. I especially want to be able to easily talk to my Airline, when it comes closer to heading home.

I'll also ask about the Motorola (prepaid ) phone we used 20 years ago, to see if it is still usable for such purposes.
[doublepost=1547933174][/doublepost]@tizeye, thanks for the T-Mobile info. One call solved the issue.

Phone Update:
I just got off the phone with T-Mobile (My carrier) and I am surprised!
With my iPhone XR, in France I have:
  • unlimited data
  • unlimited text
  • Calls are $.25 a minute.
  • Turn on digital roaming before I leave, dial #766#.
  • Turn off digital roaming after I get back, dial #763#.
  • Country code for France +33 which if I understand it correctly I have to dial before any local number because my phone is based in the States.
  • And they gave me a toll free Customer Support number for use while there.: 15059983793.
I might just call them back again, because this is better than I imagined. I did not even have to buy the GPS map, but I will still bring it, just in case. I looked at my Waze App (gps) and it says it works all over the world. It's the no data charges that make this doable. I remember when data used to cost a bunch! :D
 
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tizeye

macrumors 68040
Jul 17, 2013
3,228
35,727
Orlando, FL
Phone Update:
I just got off the phone with T-Mobile (My carrier) and I am surprised!
With my iPhone XR I have in France:
  • unlimited data
  • unlimited text
  • Calls are $.25 a minute.
  • Turn on digital roaming before I leave, dial #766#.
  • Turn off digital roaming after I get back, dial #763#.
  • Country code for France +33 which if I understand it correctly I have to dial before any local number because my phone is based in the States.
  • And they gave me a toll free Customer Support number for use while there.: 15059983793.
I might just call them back again, because this is better than I imagined. I did not even have to buy the GPS map, but I will still bring it, just in case. I looked at my Waze App (gps) and it says it works all over the world. It's the no data charges that make this doable. I remember when data used to cost a bunch! :D

Yes, they have the best deal going. My daughter's wedding in the Canary Islands (Spain had 2 carriers - Orange and Metro???) and our American friends were jealous what I could do vs their ATT and Verizon. Occasionally I will pick up the French signal across Lake Geneva while in Switzerland, but if close to the border, Swiss Telecom and Spain's Orange will seamlessly swap. A couple of notes: speed may be throttled down to 3G but is adequate. Mark your hotel or other landmark and can easily navigate the city on foot, etc - although in Madrid at the Royal residence which you can tour, by the map looked like a park/garden area to the rear which we walked around to. Stopped by the Sentry from entering as apparently the Royal hunting grounds. OOPS! If renting a car, get one with GPS...don't rely on always having a cellular signal. Essential...get a battery pack for re-charging the phone while on the go. If you have round trip tickets on your phone and the phone is dead, you have a problem, and the economy airline EasyJet doesn't have USB connections in seat for charging during flight. (I buy train, bus and ship tickets on the swiss train app). Finally, anyone going overseas, get Mobile Passport app and on your return to the States you will breeze through customs with a special line.
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
Yes, they have the best deal going. My daughter's wedding in the Canary Islands (Spain had 2 carriers - Orange and Metro???) and our American friends were jealous what I could do vs their ATT and Verizon. Occasionally I will pick up the French signal across Lake Geneva while in Switzerland, but if close to the border, Swiss Telecom and Spain's Orange will seamlessly swap. A couple of notes: speed may be throttled down to 3G but is adequate. Mark your hotel or other landmark and can easily navigate the city on foot, etc - although in Madrid at the Royal residence which you can tour, by the map looked like a park/garden area to the rear which we walked around to. Stopped by the Sentry from entering as apparently the Royal hunting grounds. OOPS! If renting a car, get one with GPS...don't rely on always having a cellular signal. Essential...get a battery pack for re-charging the phone while on the go. If you have round trip tickets on your phone and the phone is dead, you have a problem, and the economy airline EasyJet doesn't have USB connections in seat for charging during flight. (I buy train, bus and ship tickets on the swiss train app). Finally, anyone going overseas, get Mobile Passport app and on your return to the States you will breeze through customs with a special line.
I’m curious, what do you use on your phone to mark your hotel? Apple or Google map? I do have a phone battery pack. I have a portable Garmin, I’m bringing. I’m going to install the updated map today and then put the hotel address in it. I’ve wondered for a rental car how hard it it to switch the language to English?

Mobile Passport app has a special line in customs? Currently I use Global Entry. It’s been a while, but I think that is a special line too.
 

tizeye

macrumors 68040
Jul 17, 2013
3,228
35,727
Orlando, FL
I’m curious, what do you use on your phone to mark your hotel? Apple or Google map? I do have a phone battery pack. I have a portable Garmin, I’m bringing. I’m going to install the updated map today and then put the hotel address in it. I’ve wondered for a rental car how hard it it to switch the language to English?

Mobile Passport app has a special line in customs? Currently I use Global Entry. It’s been a while, but I think that is a special line too.
Primarily use Apple Maps as easier to mark a point, such as hotel, although I think Google maps are more intuitive. While haven't tried City Mapper, in Venice and other 'destination' cities rather than random 'day-trip' cities have used the Ulmon City Guide series that also gives suggested walking tours which help plan the day. Will have to review City Mapper to see how it compared. Next year looking at spending a week in Portugal. Still researching, but probably not Lisbon, but one of the smaller, less congested towns which may rule out the various City Guides and make Apple Maps primary.

Can't remember when came in through Newark or DC, but coming into Orlando, they merge the Global Entry and Mobile Passport line so you get the same abbreviated path. The difference? Global Entry has a bottleneck at the end as you have to wait for the machine to take your picture before proceeding, while Mobile Passport you take a selfie on the initial set-up. Also, not certain about cost for Global Entry registration, but Mobile Passport is free. The first time I used it, was courteous waiting in line behind the 5 Global Entry people waiting for the computer terminal to be available, before I figured I could just walk around them. Also, the 'approval' is good for 40 minutes so don't upload for approval before the flight. I answer the 4 question of anything to declaire (No) and upload as pulling up to the gate and they allow turning cell phones back on. One time had to wait until out the plane for a decent signal.

How easy to change GPS to English? Ask the staff at the rental agency to change it. I unfortunately had to do that in England, not for GPS (obviously) but where the gear shift lever was so I could actually leave the parking lot. It was the steal/upgrade of the century. Initially reserved a Ford Escort manual transmission (huge premium for automatic all over Europe so get a stick if can drive it), but through a series of poor communication at Gatwick North Terminal, the closed Hertz desk didn't direct me to the primary in the South Terminal, but across the parking lot which turned out to be a hotel based office with limited inventory. Agent strongly encouraged me not to use phone GPS, and upgraded me...for the price of GPS only...to a Mercedes E Class which had GPS standard. Discovered their controls are weird. Later, about drove into a dealership to ask, but found a YouTube video on how to adjust the seats. In retrospect, wish they had given me the BMW 3 series also on their lot as their controls are virtually identical to my BMW owned/built Mini Countryman, which ironically, they don't have Mini's as part of any rental agency's fleet in Britain.
 
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Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
Primarily use Apple Maps as easier to mark a point, such as hotel, although I think Google maps are more intuitive. While haven't tried City Mapper, in Venice and other 'destination' cities rather than random 'day-trip' cities have used the Ulmon City Guide series that also gives suggested walking tours which help plan the day. Will have to review City Mapper to see how it compared. Next year looking at spending a week in Portugal. Still researching, but probably not Lisbon, but one of the smaller, less congested towns which may rule out the various City Guides and make Apple Maps primary.

Can't remember when came in through Newark or DC, but coming into Orlando, they merge the Global Entry and Mobile Passport line so you get the same abbreviated path. The difference? Global Entry has a bottleneck at the end as you have to wait for the machine to take your picture before proceeding, while Mobile Passport you take a selfie on the initial set-up. Also, not certain about cost for Global Entry registration, but Mobile Passport is free. The first time I used it, was courteous waiting in line behind the 5 Global Entry people waiting for the computer terminal to be available, before I figured I could just walk around them. Also, the 'approval' is good for 40 minutes so don't upload for approval before the flight. I answer the 4 question of anything to declaire (No) and upload as pulling up to the gate and they allow turning cell phones back on. One time had to wait until out the plane for a decent signal.

How easy to change GPS to English? Ask the staff at the rental agency to change it. I unfortunately had to do that in England, not for GPS (obviously) but where the gear shift lever was so I could actually leave the parking lot. It was the steal/upgrade of the century. Initially reserved a Ford Escort manual transmission (huge premium for automatic all over Europe so get a stick if can drive it), but through a series of poor communication at Gatwick North Terminal, the closed Hertz desk didn't direct me to the primary in the South Terminal, but across the parking lot which turned out to be a hotel based office with limited inventory. Agent strongly encouraged me not to use phone GPS, and upgraded me...for the price of GPS only...to a Mercedes E Class which had GPS standard. Discovered their controls are weird. Later, about drove into a dealership to ask, but found a YouTube video on how to adjust the seats. In retrospect, wish they had given me the BMW 3 series also on their lot as their controls are virtually identical to my BMW owned/built Mini Countryman, which ironically, they don't have Mini's as part of any rental agency's fleet in Britain.
I downloaded Mobile Passport today and am setting it up for my wife and I.

I also downloaded iTranslate Converse, a translation program from the App Store. I don't know how many translations programs do this, but this is pretty amazing. It has 2 way translation where the speaker talks to the phone and it reads the translation back so both parties can hear. It has a 7 day free trial then costs $4.99 a month, cancel at any time. Well worth $5 for this trip if the need arises. Once over a decade ago, we were in Switzerland trying to check in, and the lady at the desk spoke only French. There we relied on a German guest who spoke both English and French.

I need to buy some hydrogen peroxide.
J'ai besoin d'acheter du peroxyde d'hydrogène. :D
 

Apple fanboy

macrumors Ivy Bridge
Feb 21, 2012
56,901
55,839
Behind the Lens, UK
As English speakers we always get by.

Once in Germany I was in a micro brewery with a couple of work colleagues (one was German) and had many beers.
I got to the stage when I needed to offload some of the liquid!
I asked my German colleague where the loos were and got a turn left at the bar then down the stairs.
As I got down the stairs there was a door on the left with a word and a door on the right with a word. I had no clue!

Then a guy came behind me and said it’s the one on the left mate. He was English and lived about 40 miles from where I did!
 
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tizeye

macrumors 68040
Jul 17, 2013
3,228
35,727
Orlando, FL
As English speakers we always get by.

Once in Germany I was in a micro brewery with a couple of work colleagues (one was German) and had many beers.
I got to the stage when I needed to offload some of the liquid!
I asked my German colleague where the loos were and got a turn left at the bar then down the stairs.
As I got down the stairs there was a door on the left with a word and a door on the right with a word. I had no clue!

Then a guy came behind me and said it’s the one on the left mate. He was English and lived about 40 miles from where I did!
My first time in Germany stopped at a restaurant. As I went to the restroom, my friends (co-worker, supervisor and spouses on business trip) at the table were taking bets if I would go in the wrong room. Is "Herr" "Hers" and "Damen" "Da Men"? I went in the correct room.

Worst was in London, landing at Heathrow. After a long international flight, relieving oneself in the restroom is preferable to on the plane, so you hold it. Looking around and all I saw were these WC signs and thinking they certainly have a lot of wheelchair stations in this airport.
 
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Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
Darn it, I’m late on my time zone adjustment for Western Europe. Normally starting several days before travel, I get up 30 minutes earlier each day, until I’m getting up at 4am. This makes a difference with the degree of fatigue on the other side. We are traveling standby, and the possibility of getting into business class would be the ultimate treat. :)
 

hallux

macrumors 68040
Apr 25, 2012
3,439
1,005
My "vacation location" this year will be a cruise. Embarkation in LA, ports of call in San Francisco (been there before), Victoria, BC and Vancouver, BC. I'll have the afternoon/evening in LA and a day and a half in Vancouver, the ship docks at 11 AM but we don't disembark officially until the following morning, then I have a red-eye home.
 
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Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
Darn it, I’m late on my time zone adjustment for Western Europe. Normally starting several days before travel, I get up 30 minutes earlier each day, until I’m getting up at 4am. This makes a difference with the degree of fatigue on the other side. We are traveling standby, and the possibility of getting into business class would be the ultimate treat. :)
Got up yesterday at 0500, this morning at 0430, 1130 France time (+1), heading to the airport today. :) Hopefully no issues with TSA without pay issue. We are going a bit early.
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,972
27,054
The Misty Mountains
Not sure what these strange historical numbers you are talking about!
I’m sure you meant to say -1ish was a piece of cake compared to -12ish ;)
...except -12 is colder than -1 and if that is F, that is brutal especially if the wind is blowing. :p For C no problem. In the UK as a standard are you using C or F? I thought you guys were stuck in English measurement. In aviation, we use metric often, except still miles. In the US, everyday use- miles and pounds, but more and more we are seeing metric or metric and English.

We ended up leaving at 12:30 am (-5) and arriving at 2pm (+1), light snow although the trend is warming into the 40s (4C) by Friday. Right now cooling our heals in the hotel, pickup our car tomorrow.
 

Apple fanboy

macrumors Ivy Bridge
Feb 21, 2012
56,901
55,839
Behind the Lens, UK
...except -12 is colder than -1 and if that is F, that is brutal especially if the wind is blowing. :p For C no problem. In the UK as a standard are you using C or F? I thought you guys were stuck in English measurement. In aviation, we use metric often, except still miles. In the US, everyday use- miles and pounds, but more and more we are seeing metric or metric and English.

We ended up leaving at 12:30 am (-5) and arriving at 2pm (+1), light snow although the trend is warming into the 40s (4C) by Friday. Right now cooling our heals in the hotel, pickup our car tomorrow.
Only real old people in the UK use F (like my parents). Everyone else is in C.
We use Miles, pints and stone.
But meters, litres and kilos.

We like to keep our hand on the new and old world!
 
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