Steve Jobs was wrong about big phones. Was he wrong about stylus, too?

[MaloCS]

IDK. I came over two years ago to my iPhone 5 from an HTC Touch Pro.

The TP registered touch mainly if you used your fingernail or the stylus.

I can honestly say I don't miss the stylus because the touch screen on an iPhone properly registers my finger and not just the nail.

I won't get in to how much pressure you had to use with a stylus when you had a screen protector on the phone and how scratched to hell the damn thing was after 3.5 years of using a stylus. No, I won't even mention the one nasty little groove that stylus carved out like the Marianas Trench across my TP's screen.

What camp do you reside in? Are you an average user that sees a stylus as a redundant piece of hardware or are you a creative professional or note taker that sees a stylus as a required piece of tech that makes their day to day activities more efficient? The answer to the above question probably dictates your opinion of having and using a stylus.

What I don't understand is why the average user completely refuses to see the benefit of a stylus for specific activities and goes out of their way to squash any discussion concerning styli and their benefits. Does it really matter to you if Apple implements hardware and software to make use of a stylus? I can see if Apple changed their paradigm to ONLY use a stylus for general input but having the ability to natively use a high quality stylus for certain apps just doesn't seem like a paradigm shift to me.

I just don't see why any Apple user would complain about the ability to use a stylus if the basic paradigm of using one's finger is retained and the stylus is relegated to specific apps.

 

[AxoNeuron]

"No one is going to buy a big phone." - Steve Jobs

He was wrong. Tens, hundreds of millions of people are going to buy big iPhones.

"Nobody wants a stylus."
"If you see a stylus, they blew it."
"As soon as you have a stylus, you're dead."

Well, a few days ago I tried Note 4 in Best Buy. It just blew me away. Using a true fountain pen-like stylus, with digital ink instantly flowing and with thousands of pressure levels, on a big, bright, ultra-res screen felt like the future, NOW. I instantly felt that I'm holding not just a consumption device, but real PRODUCTIVITY device, a mini computer that can inspire to create. I don't have this feeling when I'm using my iPhone or iPad. They feel dead, merely viewports into the world of premade content.

I almost always carry my trusted Moleskine with me because of this, I feel that only it gives me the opportunity to pour my thoughts and ideas, be creative. Typing on a touch keyboard or drawing with a finger does not give me that feeling. And using Note 4 I had this feeling of fresh air. I think it can replace my Moleskine.

So, Steve/Apple... I used a stylus, and I'm not dead. I feel way more alive with a stylus than with you dumb finger devices. You're dead wrong. At least somebody does want a stylus out there. I proved you wrong, Steve!

Can't wait to get my Note 4... My iDevices are going to serve as occasional consumption-only dumb terminals.

I lost all of my faith in .

I have never met a Galaxy Note user that actually uses the stylus after trying it a few times. For the vast majority of users it seems to be a gimmick, like most of its "features". Some people use it, but they are no where near the majority.

The iphone is far faster than the Galaxy Note, has a better CPU, it is thinner, has a far superior fit and finish build quality, and doesn't have a thousand gimmicky features that almost no one actually uses.

 

[NT1440]

"No one is going to buy a big phone." - Steve Jobs

He was wrong. Tens, hundreds of millions of people are going to buy big iPhones.

"Nobody wants a stylus."
"If you see a stylus, they blew it."
"As soon as you have a stylus, you're dead."

Well, a few days ago I tried Note 4 in Best Buy. It just blew me away. Using a true fountain pen-like stylus, with digital ink instantly flowing and with thousands of pressure levels, on a big, bright, ultra-res screen felt like the future, NOW. I instantly felt that I'm holding not just a consumption device, but real PRODUCTIVITY device, a mini computer that can inspire to create. I don't have this feeling when I'm using my iPhone or iPad. They feel dead, merely viewports into the world of premade content.

I almost always carry my trusted Moleskine with me because of this, I feel that only it gives me the opportunity to pour my thoughts and ideas, be creative. Typing on a touch keyboard or drawing with a finger does not give me that feeling. And using Note 4 I had this feeling of fresh air. I think it can replace my Moleskine.

So, Steve/Apple... I used a stylus, and I'm not dead. I feel way more alive with a stylus than with you dumb finger devices. You're dead wrong. At least somebody does want a stylus out there. I proved you wrong, Steve!

Can't wait to get my Note 4... My iDevices are going to serve as occasional consumption-only dumb terminals.

I lost all of my faith in .

Apple has been working on a stylus since at least 2009:

http://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/patents-smart-pens/

There has been significant updates to many of these patents in the last two years.

 

[MaloCS]

I have never met a Galaxy Note user that actually uses the stylus after trying it a few times. For the vast majority of users it seems to be a gimmick, like most of its "features". Some people use it, but they are no where near the majority.

The iphone is far faster than the Galaxy Note, has a better CPU, it is thinner, has a far superior fit and finish build quality, and doesn't have a thousand gimmicky features that almost no one actually uses.

So because the average user doesn't use a stylus that means a creative professional or a student note taker can't use one? Why can't these devices offer the ability to do both? Is this issue really black and white without any shades of grey?

Again, the question is, "What is Apple's focus? Are they designing products for the lowest common denominator or are they designing products for the creative professional or student?". The answer to this question will determine if Apple ever decides to implement stylus technology into their iDevices. As of right now, it's painfully obvious that they are designing products for the lowest common denominator. Apple's current line of iDevices are toys and not tools. Sure, one can jump through hoops to make their iDevice more of a tool than a toy but this approach leaves a lot to be desired.

 

[greytmom]

I don't understand this post. If you need a stylus, buy one. It doesn't really matter if Steve would agree with you or not. He doesn't know you and never will - he's gone.

If you don't need one, don't buy one.

By the way, my daughter is an artist. She uses a stylus on some of her projects on her iPad. She's ok with not knowing what Steve's opinion would be today.

 

[jlake02]

I'd never use it.

 

[cmChimera]

1. I love the fact that people are acting like you can't go get a stylus for your iDevice. You can. If you want one, go get one.

2. How the hell does writing with a pen seem like the future? People have been writing with pens for forever. Not at all futuristic.

 

[Wiesenlooser]

First of all - the technology space is moving so fast. You cant be right forever, if you dont change your opinions from time to time.

Even if steve jobs was right at that time, it doesnt mean he would be right forever. Unfortunately, he didnt get the change to reiterate his opinion.

Second - people tend to get his opinions wrong. He said that if you would shipped your Product with a stylus, you blew it. That means, if your device is dependend on a stylus. I still believe he is right on that. Touchscreen interfaces need to be operable with a finger.

That does not mean, that from time to time a stylus wouldnt make sense. He never truly sad that. He was just against styli as a primary interface input device and he thought that writing was a much slower and ineffective way for text input compared to a keyboard. I think he is right on that one.

 

[Surf Monkey]

Yeah. Well and fully covered. If you draw, sketch or paint in the digital realm then go get a stylus. Otherwise running the interface and entering text with one is a total pain in the butt for most people.

 

[bmt134]

An iPhone doesn't need a stylus, until Apples tells everyone it does.

 

[AppleP59]

No one is bound to one product or products from one company, i don't understand why so many people rant about "walled garden" or "iPhones is too small" or this or that, thats why their are so many companies creating different products for different lifestyles and usabilities.

Should I get mad that my coffee machine doesn't also make espresso?

Ok, so Apple doesn't make the product that you want the way you want it, but someone else does, ok, go buy that product and use it the way you want to use it.

It really irks me that Starbucks doesn't make fruit smoothies, I really enjoy smoothies and I really like Starbucks and I don't like going to Jamba juice, so I am going to complain on a message board until Starbucks decides to start selling smoothies. That'll show 'em.

You make a good point, until you mention starbucks. How can you "really like starbucks"? What is it that they have that makes you "really like" them?

 

[pat park]

"No one is going to buy a big phone." - Steve Jobs


I lost all of my faith in .

Samsung is waiting for you with open arms. And gaps in the Note 4 display. And no ecosystem. And, no original ideas.

 

[MaloCS]

I don't understand this post. If you need a stylus, buy one. It doesn't really matter if Steve would agree with you or not. He doesn't know you and never will - he's gone.

If you don't need one, don't buy one.

By the way, my daughter is an artist. She uses a stylus on some of her projects on her iPad. She's ok with not knowing what Steve's opinion would be today.

Since you're not an artist and I would wager you have no experience with Wacom styli and creative applications that take advantage of it's technology. I would also wager that you think the clumsy, large tipped styli that are on the market today are more than adequate which couldn't be further from the truth. A true stylus needs pressure sensitivity and a precise/fine tip (much like a ball point pen).

Again, why does having the ability of using a precise stylus for very specific applications offend you. Like you said, if I need it I would buy it and conversely if you didn't need it you wouldn't have to buy it. I just don't get why the average user is so adamant about including advanced stylus technology into any of the iDevices. After all, I don't see Apple making a paradigm shift from using a finger for the primary input device.

 

[AttilaTheHun]

An iPhone doesn't need a stylus, until Apples tells everyone it does.

Yes we do need stylus and yes he was wrong on the size too.
at list to my opinion
and selling locks iPhone was a wrong one too

 

[dljeffery]

I get the impression that most people are arguing different perspectives concerning the stylus. When Steve Jobs made the statement about styli I believe he was referring to using a stylus to navigate the operating system. From this perspective I absolutely agree with Steve Jobs that a stylus should not be required for basic operating system usage. However, for a creative professional a stylus is a requirement and a valuable asset for all aspects of my work.

Absolutely correct. Unfortunately, that gets misquoted/misused/misunderstand all the time (and often, I think, deliberately).

We were coming from a history of PDAs and PDA phones that were unusable without a stylus because nearly all of the UI controls were way too tiny to be used with a fingernail. The original iPhone finally changed that trend.

 

[kdarling]

"Nobody wants a stylus."
"If you see a stylus, they blew it."

Jobs was a salesman. He dissed whatever his products did not have, right up until they did. Then that feature was suddenly magic.

In other words, pay no attention to anything he claimed when he was in sales mode.

IDK. I came over two years ago to my iPhone 5 from an HTC Touch Pro.

The TP registered touch mainly if you used your fingernail or the stylus.

Not that kind of stylus.

Am I missing something? Whats the big deal about the Stylus? Aren't there many aftermarket ones out there(wacom, adonit etc)? I have a cheap one I use with my iPad. Is there something else to the other styli?

A stylus is a dumb stick, especially the ones for older resistive touchscreens. The aftermarket versions for capacitive screens are even worse, since they replicate a big meaty finger stub and are inaccurate.

What the OP is talking about is called an active pen. It works independently from the capacitive screen used for detecting finger touches. It uses an antenna grid behind the screen to accurately determine where the pen point is, and how hard you're pushing.

The difference is night and day if you're trying to take notes or draw fine lines.

There are even better solutions out there that have not hit the market yet. For example, there's a resistive touch screen that is pressure and multi-touch sensitive, to the point that it can detect individual bristles on a paint brush. Imagine that in the hands of an artist.

 

[TruckdriverSean]

No.

/thread

Sorry couldn't resist. #

While styluses are nice for a few use-cases, most people will not use them.

Even of the three people I know with Notes, I've litteraly watched only ONE of those people use the stylus ONE time, and that was while singing the praises of the phone. I'm not sure if that even counts as a use.


.

 

[MaloCS]

Yeah. Well and fully covered. If you draw, sketch or paint in the digital realm then go get a stylus. Otherwise running the interface and entering text with one is a total pain in the butt for most people.

What kind of stylus should I buy? Should I buy the large tipped one or the other large tipped one? How about the styli that use clever but clumsy tricks to mimic a fine tipped stylus?

No thank you. I want a true stylus that offers a precise tip and thousands of levels of pressure sensitivity. Again, I don't see how this is a bad thing when it's obvious that Apple will never shift away from their current paradigm of using the finger as the primary input device. I see it as a quality addition to an already quality product.

 

[tgi]

No thanks.

 

[FriednTested]

As a prolific note taker I found using the sylus too cumbersome for note taking when I used my cousins note3 for a couple of months... Over the years I feel I type a lot faster on the virtual keyboard than I can write on the screen...

First up the stylii are too thin to grip comfortably... And secondly there's no space to rest your wrist which is essential to me while writing... Stylii are useful only to people who need to sketch IMO...

 

[matttye]

I don't think Steve foresaw a stylus being used at it is used on the note.

Using a stylus as a general pointing device is not as user friendly as using a finger, but given the advanced user input that a stylus provides on the Note devices there's a clear use case for them.

 

[MaloCS]

Image

No thanks.

You don't get it. The proponents of stylus on iDevices are not advocating their use as a primary input device. They are advocating the use of a stylus for specific tasks and specific apps. Why are you showing a photo of a stylus obviously being used as a primary input device. This has never been the argument and will never be the argument.

 

[greytmom]

Since you're not an artist and I would wager you have no experience with Wacom styli and creative applications that take advantage of it's technology. I would also wager that you think the clumsy, large tipped styli that are on the market today are more than adequate which couldn't be further from the truth. A true stylus needs pressure sensitivity and a precise/fine tip (much like a ball point pen).

Again, why does having the ability of using a precise stylus for very specific applications offend you. Like you said, if I need it I would buy it and conversely if you didn't need it you wouldn't have to buy it. I just don't get why the average user is so adamant about including advanced stylus technology into any of the iDevices. After all, I don't see Apple making a paradigm shift from using a finger for the primary input device.

Actually, you'd lose that bet. My daughter started out with a Wacom tablet and stylus.

You also assume that I am offended by your need for a precise instrument. I'm not. If you need one, get one. My lack of understanding stems from your frustration over what the average user thinks. Who cares what they think?

 

[MaloCS]

As a prolific note taker I found using the sylus too cumbersome for note taking when I used my cousins note3 for a couple of months... Over the years I feel I type a lot faster on the virtual keyboard than I can write on the screen...

First up the stylii are too thin to grip comfortably... And secondly there's no space to rest your wrist which is essential to me while writing... Stylii are useful only to people who need to sketch IMO...

I would agree that the Samsung OEM styli are gimmicky and lack features that could make them more useful. However, you might change your opinion if you could use a true stylus like the models from Wacom. To be fair, most people wouldn't use an analog pen the size of the Samsung Note styli because they are too small and too unwieldy.

 

[appleii.c]

Not that kind of stylus.

A stylus is a dumb stick, especially the ones for older resistive touchscreens. The aftermarket versions for capacitive screens are even worse, since they replicate a big meaty finger stub and are inaccurate.

What the OP is talking about is called an active pen. It works independently from the capacitive screen used for detecting finger touches. It uses an antenna grid behind the screen to accurately determine where the pen point is, and how hard you're pushing.

The difference is night and day if you're trying to take notes or draw fine lines.

There are even better solutions out there that have not hit the market yet. For example, there's a resistive touch screen that is pressure and multi-touch sensitive, to the point that it can detect individual bristles on a paint brush. Imagine that in the hands of an artist.

Thanks for clarifying that a bit. I'm still a little confused though... Why would Apple include it with the iPhone? I could see the use for a stylus if you are using an app like Paper or Art Rage, but that would be something for the App maker to incorporate, no? Then allow the user to purchase an aftermarket stylus that suits their needs. I'm sure to an artist a $100 Wacom stylus would do more and be better quality than a $5 included Apple stylus.

For me (simply being an amateur artist) including a stylus to take notes, or to scribble on a photo seems a bit gimmicky. The true power of a stylus comes, as you mentioned, in artistry, and for that there are many aftermarket items and apps to suit that need, such as a Wacom Bamboo and the Art Rage App.

But again, maybe there is something else that the built in stylus on the other phones can do that I'm missing.