Surface Pro 3

[zhenya]

Still not buying that, because the Air is a lot more powerful and has similar size and weight and is cheaper!

The 11" MBA has a terrible low resolution screen, and is still 2.4lbs to the 2lbs of this machine. The 13" Air has a slightly better screen that is still heavily outclassed by the 12" MacBook and is a full pound heavier.

That's 30% heavier. Not at all what I'd call similar!

 

[spinedoc77]

That's the full multi-function adapter.

This is the straight usb-c to usb adapter http://store.apple.com/us/product/MJ1M2AM/A/usb-c-to-usb-adapter?fnode=51

But who carries a wired mouse with a laptop like this?

In the end, the type-c connector will open up the accessory market for the MacBook like it has never been before with Apple's patented MagSafe. There will be every adapter imaginable. The most common ones will become small enough to stay permanently attached to the charge cable. Because there is nothing proprietary about the charging cable or brick, you'll see replacements that have the entire hub built into the brick itself. You'll see every iteration imaginable of docking hubs/docking stations, a category in which the MacBook line has always been sorely lacking.

Who said anything about a wired mouse? Most decent ones have a USB dongle. Bluetooth mice suck IMO.

I'm not saying USBc is a bad thing, no it's great. But omitting the regular USB connector was a bit short sighted, or better termed too much long sighted. No amount of dongles, 3rd party accessories, bricks with USB hubs built in, etc will ever replace a simple USB port.

 

[apolloa]

People was saying that exactly same thing when the MacBook Air first came out.

The new MacBook isn't for people like you today, but it will be. Just like the MacBook Air wasn't, and now is.

I would never buy a MacBook. It's far too restrictive for it's price point, I would buy a Surface Pro personally for me if I wanted a device in that class.

The 11" MBA has a terrible low resolution screen, and is still 2.4lbs to the 2lbs of this machine. The 13" Air has a slightly better screen that is still heavily outclassed by the 12" MacBook and is a full pound heavier.

That's 30% heavier. Not at all what I'd call similar!

It's hardly that much difference, plus you get a hell of a lot more bang for your buck. The only thing the MacBook has going for it is the screen, but once the MB Air goes 'retina' then that advantage has gone too.

In fact, you can buy a 13" MacBook Pro for the same price! And that has ALL the features of the new MacBook plus all the ports you need. And it is way more powerful.

 

[maflynn]

An awful lot of computing can be done on a machine like this. A lot of people - even students and business travelers, can do all of their work between a web browser and Office or a few other light-duty programs. It's been a while since these kind of users were CPU bound in their workflows. This kind of machine is perfect for them, and a lot more practical than an iPad (which by the time you add a keyboard is pretty much the same size and weight).

Perhaps, but think its personal preference and the design, options, power of the SP3 make it a better machine. The keyboard/trackboard is vastly superior in the MB, no question but I think the touchscreen with the pen, and the ability to use it like a tablet is what makes the SP3 a better machine.

 

[zhenya]

Who said anything about a wired mouse? Most decent ones have a USB dongle. Bluetooth mice suck IMO.

I'm not saying USBc is a bad thing, no it's great. But omitting the regular USB connector was a bit short sighted, or better termed too much long sighted. No amount of dongles, 3rd party accessories, bricks with USB hubs built in, etc will ever replace a simple USB port.

My Microsoft Bluetooth mouse works flawlessly with my Surface, and my Bluetooth Apple mouse works perfectly with my iMac. I've literally never had a single connection issue with either one of them. But yes - I did not consider the adapter issue - I use one for my Logitech mouse at work. Still not really a concern for a superlight computer like this, IMO.

It's hardly that much difference, plus you get a hell of a lot more bang for your buck. The only thing the MacBook has going for it is the screen, but once the MB Air goes 'retina' then that advantage has gone too.

In fact, you can buy a 13" MacBook Pro for the same price! And that has ALL the features of the new MacBook plus all the ports you need. And it is way more powerful.

3lbs to 2lbs is a huge difference! THAT'S the feature you don't get with the MacBook Air.

Perhaps, but think its personal preference and the design, options, power of the SP3 make it a better machine. The keyboard/trackboard is vastly superior in the MB, no question but I think the touchscreen with the pen, and the ability to use it like a tablet is what makes the SP3 a better machine.

Oh, I agree - you either want a tablet or you don't. The majority of the market still doesn't seem to want one as their primary computer. That's why I think Apple is going to sell a ton of these MacBooks. Once they are in stores and people can get their hands on them, the difference that weight reduction makes will become readily apparent.

 

[maflynn]

Oh, I agree - you either want a tablet or you don't. The majority of the market still doesn't seem to want one as their primary computer. That's why I think Apple is going to sell a ton of these MacBooks. Once they are in stores and people can get their hands on them, the difference that weight reduction makes will become readily apparent.

The SP3 seems to be popular in its own right. I can' speak of majority or anything but the SP3 has been a good product for MS.

 

[zhenya]

The SP3 seems to be popular in its own right. I can' speak of majority or anything but the SP3 has been a good product for MS.

It has. But it's a drop in the proverbial bucket compared to the market as a whole.

 

[Charliebird]

It has. But it's a drop in the proverbial bucket compared to the market as a whole.

Agreed but it's making some in-roads into the market. Microsoft is actually showing a little influence on hardware designing. Nothing like Apple of course.

 

[spinedoc77]

My Microsoft Bluetooth mouse works flawlessly with my Surface, and my Bluetooth Apple mouse works perfectly with my iMac. I've literally never had a single connection issue with either one of them. But yes - I did not consider the adapter issue - I use one for my Logitech mouse at work. Still not really a concern for a superlight computer like this, IMO.



3lbs to 2lbs is a huge difference! THAT'S the feature you don't get with the MacBook Air.



Oh, I agree - you either want a tablet or you don't. The majority of the market still doesn't seem to want one as their primary computer. That's why I think Apple is going to sell a ton of these MacBooks. Once they are in stores and people can get their hands on them, the difference that weight reduction makes will become readily apparent.

I've tried many Bluetooth mice over the years, they've all sucked in some form or another. Slow tracking, long time to connect after resuming sleep, etc. That;s only one example though of the continued need for a physical USB connector, just another reason I appreciate my SP3.

 

[Even Longer]

Finally got mine SP3 after several attempts to switch back to the dark side.

Everyhing positive mentioned about that thing is absolutely correct!

The best thing that has literarily blown me away is SP3's handling of 4K Resolution:

SP3 sits here in its docking station and a 4K Monitor (Dell UP2414Q) is set to extend the Surface's desktop in full resolution and 60Hz AND absolutely no noticeable UI lag whatsoever! Just shocking amazing.

I say that because I came from 15" MBP (End 2013, Nvidia GT750M) and it was impossible to accomplish a similar setup with that machine and scaled resolutions on it and on the monitor, - the UI was way too sluggish on Yosemite. So, the only solution was to use the MBP in the clamshell mode, and working solely on the Monitor (scaled as 2560x1440, which is the second highest setting for that Display).

And now that tiny tablet is actually outperforming that huge machine in everyday tasks by far.

My setup with SP3 is:

SP3: running 2160x1440, 60 Hz
Dell UP2414Q: set to extend the Surface's screen. Running 3840x2160, 60Hz.
UI Lag: not present.

I am officially impressed.

 

[gotluck]

I would buy one if I could justify the purchase.

Sadly, I cannot - my other machines still work great

cheers

 

[Cnasty]

I would buy one if I could justify the purchase.

Sadly, I cannot - my other machines still work great

Same here. My '14 MBA 11inch works amazing for what I need battery life, work wise, and processing power.

BUT the tech ADD in me always wishes I had the SP3 to test out and see which works better in everyday use.

 

[Frisco]

Finally got mine SP3 after several attempts to switch back to the dark side.

Everyhing positive mentioned about that thing is absolutely correct!

The best thing that has literarily blown me away is SP3's handling of 4K Resolution:

SP3 sits here in its docking station and a 4K Monitor (Dell UP2414Q) is set to extend the Surface's desktop in full resolution and 60Hz AND absolutely no noticeable UI lag whatsoever! Just shocking amazing.

I say that because I came from 15" MBP (End 2013, Nvidia GT750M) and it was impossible to accomplish a similar setup with that machine and scaled resolutions on it and on the monitor, - the UI was way too sluggish on Yosemite. So, the only solution was to use the MBP in the clamshell mode, and working solely on the Monitor (scaled as 2560x1440, which is the second highest setting for that Display).

And now that tiny tablet is actually outperforming that huge machine in everyday tasks by far.

My setup with SP3 is:

SP3: running 2160x1440, 60 Hz
Dell UP2414Q: set to extend the Surface's screen. Running 3840x2160, 60Hz.
UI Lag: not present.

I am officially impressed.

Congrats! What specs SP3 did you get? Did you get a docking station? I am most likely going to get one too after Apple's disappointing event this week.

 

[Even Longer]

Congrats! What specs SP3 did you get? Did you get a docking station? I am most likely going to get one too after Apple's disappointing event this week.

Hi, I got second to top one. (i7/256) with docking station and keyboard cover. It was a nice bundle offer for business here in Germany. I have to say, that after my frustration with Apple products lately, I would buy that thing even to a regular price.

Bottom line: while not perfect, but after 10 years of Apple only
Surface tends to be the first non Apple product, that I really love. Stylus is a dream to use and MS has added even more pressure curves lately, so that it would fit any artist's preference now.

I hope it helps.

 

[Frisco]

Hi, I got second to top one. (i7/256) with docking station and keyboard cover. It was a nice bundle offer for business here in Germany. I have to say, that after my frustration with Apple products lately, I would buy that thing even to a regular price.

Bottom line: while not perfect, but after 10 years of Apple only
Surface tends to be the first non Apple product, that I really love. Stylus is a dream to use and MS has added even more pressure curves lately, so that it would fit any artist's preference now.

I hope it helps.

Thanks Even Longer! The decision between the SP3 and one of the MacBooks with Bootcamp is a tough call for me.

 

[zhenya]

Hi, I got second to top one. (i7/256) with docking station and keyboard cover. It was a nice bundle offer for business here in Germany. I have to say, that after my frustration with Apple products lately, I would buy that thing even to a regular price.

Bottom line: while not perfect, but after 10 years of Apple only
Surface tends to be the first non Apple product, that I really love. Stylus is a dream to use and MS has added even more pressure curves lately, so that it would fit any artist's preference now.

I hope it helps.

I presume that model screen must use MST if you are at 60hz? To get that working, did you have to manually install the Intel video driver?

I have the Dell p2715q running at 50hz with that setup. Works perfectly fine - and with the docking station you have the potential to run two of these displays - although at this point I am enjoying the move from two 1920x1200 to a single 4k display plus the Surface. Lots more desk space!

 

[Even Longer]

Thanks Even Longer! The decision between the SP3 and one of the MacBooks with Bootcamp is a tough call for me.

You're welcome. Don't hesitate to ask, if you want to know more, because I know how you feel.

I was searching, reading and analyzing tons of information about it.
That decision was not easy for me either: breaking the habits (especially, when it means moving from mac to win after so many years) is always hard.

 

[Even Longer]

I presume that model screen must use MST if you are at 60hz? To get that working, did you have to manually install the Intel video driver?

I have the Dell p2715q running at 50hz with that setup. Works perfectly fine - and with the docking station you have the potential to run two of these displays - although at this point I am enjoying the move from two 1920x1200 to a single 4k display plus the Surface. Lots more desk space!

Exactly.

It is a mini display port (docking station SP3) -> display port (Dell) connection.

I use the latest Intel driver for that, but Microsoft march update finally enables 60Hz MST 4K also on "their" version of display driver as well.
I tried both: you can't go wrong either way.

Only minor annoyances so far:

1. I had to disable automatic refresh rate reduction on battery to 48 Hz in the Intel driver's properties. Because sometimes Dell couldn't recognize the signal in MST mode and was just flickering.

It happens, because Surface sometimes drops the refresh rate to 48 Hz, since it not always being charged in the docking station. As I said, it happened sporadically and always, when Surface woke up from sleep.

It is not a big deal, because this 48Hz reduction doesn't save you any significant amount of power. Display brightness does much more.

2. Sometimes driver seems to "forget" the 4K resolution of the extended desktops on Dell, again after display sleep or just being off. So you have to re-enable it or switch the monitor off and on again. I'm still not sure, what exactly causes this - graphics driver or missing monitor signal.

 

[Frisco]

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Link

Anyone have this issue with SP3? Acccording to this thread (last page) all the units have this problem.

 

[spinedoc77]

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Link

Anyone have this issue with SP3? Acccording to this thread (last page) all the units have this problem.

I don't have that at all. I've been through 4 SP3's and none of them had that.

 

[Even Longer]

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Link

Anyone have this issue with SP3? Acccording to this thread (last page) all the units have this problem.

Mine doesn't have it as well. But I know, what are you talking about, - in the electronic store showroom two displayed SP3 had that haze.

It seems, that MS has addressed that issue on newer batches or we just got a lucky one .

Under the link you provided most of the people seem to detect that yellow line after couple of weeks using their machines.
Should you encounter it as well, you're fully covered by the warranty or you can just return it within 14 days.

 

[JackieInCo]

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Link

Anyone have this issue with SP3? Acccording to this thread (last page) all the units have this problem.

I bought mine back in November and I don't have it.

 

[maflynn]

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Link

Anyone have this issue with SP3? Acccording to this thread (last page) all the units have this problem.

I don't have that issue, I purchased my SP3 back in January, the screen is perfect (knocks on wood).

 

[burgman]

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Link

Anyone have this issue with SP3? Acccording to this thread (last page) all the units have this problem.

My family has four SP3's, at work I see about 20. One of the early ones had the yellow line. Microsoft store locally replaced it on the spot.

 

[xraydoc]

Yellow Hazy Vertical Line Left Side of Screen

Link

Anyone have this issue with SP3? Acccording to this thread (last page) all the units have this problem.

Mine is starting to show it. Bought it about 8-9 months ago in July. i5/256. It's not awful yet, so we'll have to see.

I have the Microsoft Complete with it. I could take it to the Microsoft store in my local mall but it would be such a pain in the ass to reinstall all my apps and documents that I haven't bothered.