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The ATI HD 5750 in the iMac is a mobility 5850.
- Thread starter TMRaven
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Well, with a decent playing session of starcraft2, it seems as though the hottest my overclocked 4850 got was 67c, and that was during the loading screens (blizzard warned about loading screens causing temps to spike) The average temperature was 64c. This was with the odd fan set at 3400rpm.
The iMac has great cooling and good capabilities for overclocking the gpu, so I can agree with rodus. I'm fairly confident you can overclock the mobility 5850 to a little under desktop 5770 standards, with a core clock of around 800 and memory clock of around 1200. All in all, a pretty good gpu update from Apple. The choice of putting mobility 5850 in the iMacs instead of mobility 5870 means nothing to users, unless they're gaming on osx.
The iMac has great cooling and good capabilities for overclocking the gpu, so I can agree with rodus. I'm fairly confident you can overclock the mobility 5850 to a little under desktop 5770 standards, with a core clock of around 800 and memory clock of around 1200. All in all, a pretty good gpu update from Apple. The choice of putting mobility 5850 in the iMacs instead of mobility 5870 means nothing to users, unless they're gaming on osx.
Thanks to our member dwd3885, who went to an apple store to get a brand new high end iMac, we have good evidence of the advertised 5750 in the new high end iMac as being mobility 5850. This is neither good or bad news-- but could be considered as better news rather than worse news. The current speculation was an underclocked desktop 5750, which would provide same performance as mobility 5850.
dwd3885's system profiler has marked the ati 5750's device id as 0x68a1, and thanks to our member Horus' link, we are able to get a good idea that the 5750 is actually a mobility 5850. Also, due to Hellhammer's great research, this shows the ox68a1 model to be BroadwayPro/LP, which are both mobility 5830 and mobility 5850. Since mobility 5830 can not use GDDR5 memory, the only logical solution would be mobility 5850.
Thanks to our member easepease, we now have image confirmation from gpu-z that the gpu in the new high end iMacs is in fact a default-clocked mobility 5850.
How does the mobility 5850 compare with the mobility 4850 in the older high end iMac? About the same. Notebookcheck has the mobility 5850 with GDDR5 being at a slight edge over mobility 4850. New iMac users do get some added benefits as well. Raw processing power and memory bandwidth performance are virtually the same, however a bigger memory buffer will help games with running higher textures and detail, especially at such a high resolution. The higher memory buffer will also help memory intensive applications.
The mobility 5850 will also consume a good chunk power less than mobility 4850 due to newer technologies and better throttling (39 watts vs 60 watts), so users will experience a cooler iMac. Also considering mobility 5850's relative cool output, it will be quite easy to overclock it closer to mobility 5870 standards, which is basically a slightly higher clocked mobility 5850.
This also probably means the advertised HD 5670s in other iMacs are mobilie 57** cards.
Some food for thought:
Notebook check has the 1gb GDDR5 version of mobility 5850 playing Bad Company 2 at x resolution with ultra settingss rated at 31fps.
Notebook check also has the 512mb GDDR3 version of mobility 4850 (but with 575mhz core clock compared to the 500mz in iMac) at 25fps. If the same core were to be underclocked to 500mhz, we could expect around 20-25fps.
Comparison of two cards' memory bandwidth performances:
mobility 5850: 128bus width/8bytes x 1000mhz sdram clock rate x GDDR5's quad data rate of 4 = 64gbps of memory bandwidth.
mobility 4850: 256bus width/8bytes x 850mhz sdram clock rate x GDDR3's double data rate of 2 = 54gbps of memory bandwidth.
As you can see, with 15% greater memory bandwidth and a more efficient processing core, the mobility 5850 with GDDR5 memory will perform around 10% greater than mobility 4850.
The mobility 5850 is a 10% slower clocked mobility 5870, so users who want the most out of their gpu could safely overclock to mobility 5870 range under windows-- mobility 5870 is 20% more powerful than mobility 4850, according to notebookcheck.
Hey man, hope you don't mind but I made a youtube video about your findings - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhYbg2zTZhk
I also wrote about it on my website www.MriloveMac.com and I gave you credit for your findings.
Cheers for the info man.
So is it possible to extract the proper files from the iMac 2010 update and install the updated drivers in a 2009 iMac with the 4850? It is quite tempting to try it....but no guts.
~Bob
27" iMac i5, 2009
Why would they update the drivers for the old 4850s?I think Apple will be quite happy for these benchmark numbers old vs new to exist for as long as possible. We have seen how they are marketing this refresh after all. Hilarious that it's mostly all software-based performance driven gains.
It doesn't bother me because I'm not a gamer. But I hope gamers have the opportunity to get drivers outside of Apple. Otherwise expect to be shafted.
I agree that it's a chance. That's why it's important the people know that a driver upgrade will make a difference, so the public can put pressure on Apple. In fact, I tipped Kotaku to barefeat's test and suggested they reproduce it for exactly that reason.
Interesting! Love to hear how the experiment goes...
i will try it if im given the files! i7 2009 iMac here. TM will save me
That's so good!
i will try it if im given the files! i7 2009 iMac here. TM will save me
Haha. I'd like to, but I personally game under windows anyways, so I'm going to avoid the trouble and wait until apple updates its drivers.
i will try it if im given the files! i7 2009 iMac here. TM will save me
I'll repost what i have from another forum:
Alright - here is a guide for the 2009 iMacs to install the new kexts (drivers) from the 2010.
WARNING: THIS IS FOR SNOW LEOPARD 10.6.4 AND ATI CHIPSETS ONLY! BE CAREFUL, YOU CAN SERIOUSLY SCREW UP SOMETHING
Tools -
Kext Helper b7
NOTE:If you use any other Kext Utility program, you will screw up your installation!!
This utilities are for hackintoshes ONLY.
Kext helper will work with both hackintoshes and real Macs.
1. Download the supplied ATI kexts from the 2010 update Here
2. Run Kext Utility b7 from any location. You will see a display like so:
3. To be safe, I updated all ATI video kexts and included them. Drag all the kexts to the Kext Utility window so it looks like this:
4. Put in your administrator password here and click EASY INSTALL like so:
5. It will say that the kext files are installed, cross your fingers and reboot. You can reboot then and the new drivers will be installed to the proper locations, and the old drivers will be placed in the /Backup Extensions folder. You now have the same driver that the new iMacs have!
Remember, be careful, if you update ANY other kext then the video kext, you might make your system inoperable.
Awesome, thanks for the kext instructions! Will doing this cause any problem with future system updates, or will they simply overwrite the "unofficial" kexts?
You did this on a Hackintosh computer, and installed these files extracted from the MacOSXUpd10.6.4foriMacMid2010.pkg ?: If so will it work on a late 2009 i7 imac too.
ATI1300Controller.kext
ATI1600Controller.kext
ATI1900Controller.kext
ATI2400Controller.kext
ATI2600Controller.kext
ATI3800Controller.kext
ATI4600Controller.kext
ATI4800Controller.kext
ATI5000Controller.kext
ATIFramebuffer.kext
ATIRadeonX1000.kext
ATIRadeonX1000GA.plugin
ATIRadeonX1000GLDriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX1000VADriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX2000.kext
ATIRadeonX2000GA.plugin
ATIRadeonX2000GLDriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX2000VADriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX3000.kext
ATIRadeonX3000GA.plugin
ATIRadeonX3000GLDriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX3000VADriver.bundle
ATISupport.kext
ATI1300Controller.kext
ATI1600Controller.kext
ATI1900Controller.kext
ATI2400Controller.kext
ATI2600Controller.kext
ATI3800Controller.kext
ATI4600Controller.kext
ATI4800Controller.kext
ATI5000Controller.kext
ATIFramebuffer.kext
ATIRadeonX1000.kext
ATIRadeonX1000GA.plugin
ATIRadeonX1000GLDriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX1000VADriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX2000.kext
ATIRadeonX2000GA.plugin
ATIRadeonX2000GLDriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX2000VADriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX3000.kext
ATIRadeonX3000GA.plugin
ATIRadeonX3000GLDriver.bundle
ATIRadeonX3000VADriver.bundle
ATISupport.kext
I have an iMac 27 inch i7 with the 4850.
I used pacifist extracting them from System/Library/Extensions, It runs a lot smoother with it. This will add updated drivers to any ATI chipset MBP, mac pro, imac, etc. The underlaying drivers for each are all updated.
Just did it myself
installed the all the extracted files with Kext Helper b7.
After installation Kext Helper b7 said everything installed OK.
I had to do a forced restart using the power button, as my Imac did'nt respond to the restart command.
After restart no problems (cross my fingers)
installed the all the extracted files with Kext Helper b7.
After installation Kext Helper b7 said everything installed OK.
I had to do a forced restart using the power button, as my Imac did'nt respond to the restart command.
After restart no problems (cross my fingers)
Its stock settings, but running SC2 has gone from 1280x720 at a locked 60 to 1920x1080 to a 60-50FPS all High settings with 8GB ram on 10.6.4. I haven't tried Source stuff yet though, but imovie rendering is a bit quicker.
I just got a new i5 iMac (5750)
Installed Windows 7 and installed Team Fortress 2 on Steam.
Played on 2560x1440 (native) with all setting on high, Texture to Ultra High, Motion Blur On, 2X AA, on a 32 player server, and the game run pretty smoothly, between 60 fps and 45 fps (in very intense action with lots of players).
Tried in a 1920x1080 window on the same server and it was around 80~100 FPS.
Ok, Source game are well optimized, but that's my gaming experience so far on the new iMac with Radeon 5750.
Installed Windows 7 and installed Team Fortress 2 on Steam.
Played on 2560x1440 (native) with all setting on high, Texture to Ultra High, Motion Blur On, 2X AA, on a 32 player server, and the game run pretty smoothly, between 60 fps and 45 fps (in very intense action with lots of players).
Tried in a 1920x1080 window on the same server and it was around 80~100 FPS.
Ok, Source game are well optimized, but that's my gaming experience so far on the new iMac with Radeon 5750.
So you used Pacifist to extract/install in to your 10.6.4 2009 iMac?
And all is well?
The performance upgrade shown on Barefeats is very tempting and this is so easy to do....
Did you find similar upticks in fps?
Thanks.
~Bob
I just tried it with the above instructions. There is no need for Pacifist since the files needed are linked in the above post as a Zip file. Just use Kext Helper b7 to install them and then restart. As someone wrote above, the software reset seems to malfunction after the install, but after a power off/on everything seems to be running fine. Tested WoW, and there sure is a noticeable difference. Couldn't be happier. Thanx for the info!
Yes.
I did this last night and posting my results with screenshots in the gaming benchmarks thread. GL View showed huge improvements and just flying X-Plane around was a lot smoother.
I did this last night and posting my results with screenshots in the gaming benchmarks thread. GL View showed huge improvements and just flying X-Plane around was a lot smoother.
Ah
I did It works fine.
OpenGL bench performance on Corei7 2.80 ghz iMac with 12 gigs of ram before the change:
OpenGL bench after the change:
Do it. You won't regret it*.
* I can't be responsible if you brick your computer.
I did It works fine.
OpenGL bench performance on Corei7 2.80 ghz iMac with 12 gigs of ram before the change:
OpenGL bench after the change:
Do it. You won't regret it*.
* I can't be responsible if you brick your computer.
I did It works fine.
OpenGL bench performance on Corei7 2.80 ghz iMac with 12 gigs of ram before the change:
OpenGL bench after the change:
Do it. You won't regret it*.
* I can't be responsible if you brick your computer.
Did it and it worked just fine. Restart was also good, no hard restart required.
Everything is a lot happier!!!
Utility never worked properly for me, would not copy all of the extensions to the System/Library/Extensions directory. Now after another pass, it completely deleted that directory and I am having to fresh install.
Granted this is on an older iMac (Core Duo, ATI X1600), but there is obviously an issue with the utility.
Be warned.
Granted this is on an older iMac (Core Duo, ATI X1600), but there is obviously an issue with the utility.
Be warned.