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The Car Thread ... !
- Thread starter D.T.
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Have you tried checking a dealer's website, where they list their current new car inventory? Might be a bit more accurate than some people on a forum.
Yes, I did. In fact, I got a price quote via email for a new 2014 with only one mile on that car. Then someone from that dealership called me. I asked about the new 2014 Toyota camrys. She said that they only had used 2014 camrys. Then she tried to talkme into the 2015. I'll just try another dealership. I told my father about what happened. Said that they pulled a bait and switched on me.
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The only issue with Cadillac is being under GM's reign of corner-cutting. If they were split off into their own brand or given more freedom (which has been improving recently), they would definitively have some of the finest cars on the road.
As much as I love the CTS, I do wish the CTS-V was an entirely separate car. Having all of that power under the hood and making it look similar to a standard CTS is a waste of potential. Cadillac should have their own distinct super-high-end model.
As much as I love the CTS, I do wish the CTS-V was an entirely separate car. Having all of that power under the hood and making it look similar to a standard CTS is a waste of potential. Cadillac should have their own distinct super-high-end model.
Yeah, you know, there was talk for a long time (years ago) about moving Corvette under the Cadillac brand and really isolating them from corporate and trying to create a better owner experience.
It works well for BMW, Mercedes, GM, even Ford. I think with Caddy it has to be cost effective, and a bespoke platform would be price itself way out of the viable marketplace.
This has already happened.
As much as I wish this was the problem, it's not. Cadillac needs a model that sells well. Everything about Cadillac sales are pretty sluggish.
Maybe the CT6 will excite people. I doubt it.
This. Building a competitive car is not their problem. People still can't/don't/won't grasp the concept that today more than ever, it's all about brand equity and brand loyalty.
To be honest, it really is disappointing. You have this huge marketing campaign where you say you're this and that, while the Germans are not but you have nothing to show for it. The old Cadillac that everyone said were old barges sold 30-35k. The new refreshed Cadillac sells the same amount. That says it all right there.
Good luck trying to sell the ATS-V when it's priced right there with the M3/M4 and C63 AMG. If you couldn't sell the ATS where the opportunity is far greater and a lot easier to attain, forget trying to sell a relatively niche vehicle at that price point and where there are far less buyers.
It's been an issue discussed a few times in this thread.
The product are not the problem. The ATS and CTS are great vehicles. But in the luxury market, that is about 20% of the formula. Cadillac still sucks at the other 80%. Marketing, dealer experience, prestige/image Cadillac has no clue how to handle or build.
There is a lot of talk on GM forums how Cadillac needs a CLA/1 series/A3 fighter. I disagree. Cadillac can't enter the race to the bottom until they build up image. The reason those vehicles work is because Mercedes/BMW/Audi have clout and people will accept buying these bargain basement vehicles for the badge. Cadillac can't do that yet. They lack the image.
As for the price of the ATS-V, I agree. But you can't have it be so much cheaper than the M3/M4, C63, etc or people wonder why it is so much cheaper. It's got to tow a fine line. The mid-size class is easier for this line( for which I think the CTS is priced appropriately). The compact class is harder considering there is Acura, Lincoln, etc right below the top-tier brands. Price the ATS too cheap, Cadillac gets associated with Lincoln, Acura, etc which is a bad thing.
We had talked a bit about Acura earlier, and I feel that Cadillac and Acura have the exact opposite problems. Cadillac just doesn't have that big seller anymore (the pushed the CTS too far upmarket), whereas Acura has the big seller (TLX, RDX, MDX) but lacks the car that gets people in the door.
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Where would the CTS go?
GM had a problem with no good solutions( a problem they created). Should the ATS been the 3rd gen CTS and bring back the STS? Then 2nd gen owners would bitch about how the size of the CTS shrunk and GM spend money to rebuilding the STS's reputation. Or do what they end up doing which was CTS goes up to properly compete against the 5 series and create the ATS. Considering the CTS was already getting comparisons to the 5 series more than the 3 series, I agree with the direction they went. Either way the 2nd gen owners would be pissed and most likely look elsewhere.
And as the article I posted earlier, Cadillac isn't losing customers to other luxury marques, but to mainstream brands like Chevy, Ford, Toyota, etc. Which isn't a good thing.
Cadillac I thought was making a come back but like a lot of luxury brands right now they seem to be in a slump. They seem like decent cars but they don't seem to be getting the attraction they need. Was the old XLR roadster a Corvette underneath?
If you look at the luxury department right now, there seems to be a few stagnant companies...
1. Acura- Aside from the MDX and RDX I hardly see any new Acuras on the road. ILX, TLX, and RLX don't seem prevalent. The 1st and 2nd generation TL's were everywhere, and the TSX was pretty popular. The last generation TL seemed like a flop, though its placement was convoluted with the TSX.
2. Chrysler- I'm don't consider them a real luxury brand but a few years ago they made a big comeback with the 300 and their Eminem Super Bowl marketing a few years ago. Once again, their products don't seem to be evolving. I'm not sure if Fiat isn't giving them the proper attention. I've never liked their marketing campaign of being the blue collar success symbol.
3. Lincoln- Are they dead yet?
4. Infiniti- They don't seem to have the success they once had with the G35/37. I've seen a couple Q50's but thats it. Their SUV's seem few are far between and their larger sedans have never really done that well.
If you look at the luxury department right now, there seems to be a few stagnant companies...
1. Acura- Aside from the MDX and RDX I hardly see any new Acuras on the road. ILX, TLX, and RLX don't seem prevalent. The 1st and 2nd generation TL's were everywhere, and the TSX was pretty popular. The last generation TL seemed like a flop, though its placement was convoluted with the TSX.
2. Chrysler- I'm don't consider them a real luxury brand but a few years ago they made a big comeback with the 300 and their Eminem Super Bowl marketing a few years ago. Once again, their products don't seem to be evolving. I'm not sure if Fiat isn't giving them the proper attention. I've never liked their marketing campaign of being the blue collar success symbol.
3. Lincoln- Are they dead yet?
4. Infiniti- They don't seem to have the success they once had with the G35/37. I've seen a couple Q50's but thats it. Their SUV's seem few are far between and their larger sedans have never really done that well.
But unlike Acura, Cadillac actually makes exciting, enthusiast-oriented cars.
Such a gorgeous car. I've been looking for a CPO 640xi Gran Coupé for almost a year now. Impossible to find. It's a tad overpriced at almost $90k for a new one. I went with an Audi S7 instead, but if I find a CPO 640xi (with the options I want), I'd trade in my BMW tomorrow.
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Doubtful. That segment is tough. Unless it's an S Class, it's irrelevant. I love the Audi S8, but Mercedes owns this segment. Everyone else is struggling.
What they need is more SUVs/crossovers. The Germans (and Lexus) have SUV-heavy lineups. That's where volume and profit seems to be these days. They have no answer for various cars like the Audi Q5, BMW X5, etc.
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Valid point, but that doesn't mean anything in the real world. Sales have been flat. The cars drive super well, but the overall package is just terrible, compared to the likes of the equivalent BMW/Audi/Mercedes/Lexus.
Perfect example is the ATS. It drives superbly and handles great, but my money would go to an Audi S4. Why? Because it does everything else well too. The infotainment system isn't trash (CUE is a mess), the ride is good, interior is quality, and it doesn't feel cramped. Same with the 3 series.
Same issue with the CTS. It drives so well, yet when I look at the VSport model, why would I spend almost $70k on that, when I can get an Audi S6 or BMW 5? The Audi/BMW are better overall cars. It pisses me off that the VSport is RWD only, and the CTS only has the 8AT in some models. Why is that? BMW and Audi offer AWD up and down their entire lineup and every model has the 8AT (or DCT.) They're half-assing key things. High performance AWD BMW/MB/Audis are dime a dozen in Boston. I never see a CTS, unless it's a livery or rental.
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Small world. I'm in Brookline too!
XLR was a Corvette, yes. Cadillac is barely making a come-back. Concentrating on being the "old BMW" is not working... at all.
Acura is a flop. The MDX and RDX are the only new Acuras you see around here. I haven't seen an RLX here.
Acura sedans don't offer a damn thing that would make me give up a German brand to go buy them.
Dig a little deeper and buy a 650. 445 hp, goes like a rocket.
Here's one with 10,000 miles for $71,000.
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...[BMW[650IGCXD[]][]]&listingId=393098259&Log=0
The S-Class is killing it. The Audi, BMW, and Jaguar seem decades behind. I think whatever territory the S-Class hasn't taken over the Tesla been encroaching upon. The 7-Series seems ancient these days, the Jaguar never really had much of the market, and the A8 just isn't on the same level- though it usually has trailed the BMW and MB, though that's reflected in price (though the SWB A8 version is my favorite aesthetically out of the bunch).
Audi does great with their SUV's but they've always had gaps in their lineup. The Q5 is very small and very car like- which is great for what it is. The Q7 is too big and IMO looks too much like a minivan/station wagon. I'd like to see them make something inbetween, like the size of the Touareg (aka shorter Q7). The Touareg once to offered a lot of luxury and off-road features (rear diff lock, low range, functional air suspension), but it has been greatly watered down in terms of options (yet $50k and it now comes standard with pleather). That said, VW has changed their image though since the 1st gen Touareg. Although highly unlikely, I think a truck-like SUV by Audi would be interesting- something to compete with Range Rover/Sport, Mercedes G-Class (though cheaper), Lexus GX, Grand Cherokee etc. ...Something a little more rugged.
I've always been a sucker for the Allroad styling. I'd like to see the A6 Allroad come back to the US. The A4 Allroad is nice but it's really anything but an A4 advant with plastic wheel flares. The original Allroad had air suspension (up to 8.2" of ground clearance!), available low range, and could complete a Land Rover off-road test course.
It's interesting regarding the Germans vs. the Japanese in the entry level luxury segment. From what I see, it's seems like people are ignoring the reliability issues and are picking up the German vehicles. Not that long ago it was quite the opposite. Lexus is the exception and I think you're right with the SUV market. Their sedans do alright and the ES offers something the Germans don't- FWD (good mpg) and a decent sized car for a good value. Back in CT every other soccer mom had an RX, GX, or LX. I am sure the new NX will be very successful. They're not particularly exciting or soulful cars, but they're comfortable, reliable, have fantastic resale, and carry some prestige.
My mother just traded in her 2009 Lexus ES350 with 130,000 miles- not a single repair was made other than general maintenance. Personally, I hated that car. It was boring to drive, too soft, and just not attractive- not necessarily unattractive, just dull. It also lacked AWD which is a problem when you live on a mountain. She picked up a 2015 Volvo XC70 T6 AWD which is pretty nice. She previously owned a 2005 *XC90 2.5T AWD which she liked a lot but it got totaled and at the time she wanted something with better gas mileage and reliability- therefore switching to the Lexus. And there is another failing luxury brand- Volvo. They're in their own little niche though and have a loyal following.
Hey neighbor! I moved to Brookline a little over a year ago and I love it here. Before that I was in Back Bay since 2009. Brookline has so much to do without the craziness of downtown. I work in the Longwood Medical Area three days a week and in Belmont twice a week so it's really a great place to be. As much as I generally prefer driving, a 10-15 min zip down to Longwood on the D-line is far more tolerable than sitting in traffic.
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Link doesn't work. But no to the 650. I already have a twin turbo V8 in my S7 that is far more faster than the 650i. I've driven both the V8 and I6 models of the 6GC, and the lighter engine of the 640xi makes it a better handler and it seems to ride better.
If I buy a 650xi GC, I'd basically have two of the same cars. This and the S7
I'd say the A8 was the best-in-class car... until the W222 came out. The next gen 7 series is months away from launch. I'd love to see what BMW does with that.
I love the look of the current S8. Looks menacing on the highway.
Jag is irrelevant and will stay like that. They don't have the brand image to compete with the Germans. If Jag can't do it, Cadillac, sure as hell, can't!
Yeah, they're finally filling in the lineup. I love the Q5, even though it is getting a little old. They are everywhere in Boston. So popular.
I've owned a Q7 and it was a huge beast of a thing. Thought it was a tad too big though, which is why I downsized into an X5. The next-gen Q7 was recently shown off and going by the dimensions, it should be a little smaller and more compact. Of course, if you want a smaller Q7, VAG also sells the more luxurious Cayenne.
The T3 never had any of these cool options in the US. VW used to offer all the off-road tech on the T1 and T2, but watered the whole thing down with the T3 launch. Honestly, I like the Touareg, but it makes zero sense out there. Why would I buy a VW SUV, when I can get a BMW X5 or Mercedes ML for a little bit more.
Probably never happening. The Cayenne competes better with the RR/RRS due to the increased luxury and the availability of off-road tech.
Yeah, they need to bring back the A6 Allroad. I love the look of the current A4 Allroad and they seem to be so popular around here, but it needs a better powertrain. The 2.)T is good, but a diesel would have been better. I guess that's coming next generation.
The Germans are getting much better, but the vast majority of these people lease and move in. Latest Consumer Reports ranks Audi at #5 for reliability, above Acura, etc.
I agree. Lexus does everything well. It fits their demographics perfectly. The Lexus brand is Tier 1. Right up there with the likes of Audi/BMW/Mercedes. Acura isn't even on the same planet as Lexus.
Volvos aren't bad, but the prices they ask for them are ridiculous. Not to mention, they've had historically bad resale and reliability. I've been looking at replacements for my X5 and stumbled upon the new XC90. It looks great. I built a top-spec model online and it was nearly $70k. For that much, why would I buy a Volvo? I'd spend a little bit more and buy a Cayenne at that point.
Very nice. I live by the Brookline/Allston border. Work is split between Cambridge and the South End by BMC/BU Med.
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You need to get on that ASAP. Stock is dwindling down. Toyota always has aggressive year-end incentives that clear out old models by December. The 2015 Camry was out late Fall, so it will be tough to find a 2014, but is possible.
Check cars.com, auto trader.com etc. They all can check dealer inventory.
Come on man. You may not like them, but the TLX is selling quite well.
Value. To get everything you get on a base TLX in an Audi costs almost $6,000 more. This is particularly noticeable as both Audi and Acura are FWD.
Also, the NSX has all the makings of being a better supercar than anything Audi offers.
Doesn't matter. They are predominately a crossover company. The ILX and RLX are still also-rans in the segment.
The TLX is a tweener car. Similar to the last gen CTS.
Comparing the FWD trim of an A4 to the base TLX is a waste of time. The volume A4 trim is the 2.0T Quattro model, not the base CVT 2.0T. The volume TLX trim is FWD model, not the AWD model.
Acura wishes they competed, but they don't. The A4 buyer isn't seeking "value luxury." He/she is willing to pony up for the better badge and better car, not a fancy Accord.
This is a dumb statement and you know it. Why are you comparing the upcoming NSX with the current R8... that's been out since 2007.
We all know the new R8 is around the corner and is based on the new Huracan platform (a proper supercar platform.) Rumor has it that the NSX is based off an Accord derived platform. What a joke. How does that have "all the markings of being a better supercar?"
Now you're just trolling
A rear wheel biased AWD system is nowhere to be found in Audi's lineup, yet the NSX runs on a Sport Hybrid, rear wheel biased AWD system.
And the "Volume" Audi is at least $10,000 more expensive than the Acura equivalent.
You may not perceive value, but the average buyer does. Especially the ones looking to upgrade from the affordable brands.
And the new R8? 570 hp? Almost exactly the same as the NSX, except Honda is notorious for underestimating their engine power.
Do you live under a rock? Quattro has been rear-biased for a long long time now. The only ones that aren't rear-biased are the Haldex-equipped cars, which would be the A3, Q3, and TT.
My Audi S7 is equipped with Torsen and the Sport Diff. It's 40:60, but can go 85% to the rear with its crown-gear center differential.
Hell, even the old elephant of a Q7 with its Borg-Warner Torsen T3 system is rear-biased.
xDrive behaves the same way. MB's 4MATIC is 50:50, but the newer systems finally allow some torque shuffling.
Who is cross-shopping the German brands with Acura? If you're looking at Acura, it's obvious that you don't want to spend the extra money for the higher-end car. Acura knows its market and it's to buyers who like fancy Hondas. That's exactly what they are.
This is hilarious. No one else underrates their engines, except for Honda right?
BMW/Audi/MB are notorious for underrating their engines, moreso than Honda, especially with forced induction. The BMW N55 makes 300hp at the wheels, after factoring in drivetrain loss. At the crank? It's pushing way over that.
Same with the Audi 3.0SC. VW EA888 2.0T in the GTI. I could go on and on.
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Meanwhile, the 1G NSX is still better than any of these models, despite making only 270 hp.
My 2014 Explorer XLT 4WD is attached. I just think these look so nice. The styling is a modern take on the traditional SUV. The redesigned 2016 in Platinum trim is beautiful compared to a lot of the hunchbacked crossovers that everyone seems to be building these days.
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