The Car Thread ... !

[0388631]

Honda and Toyota have been all time ranking stolen for reasons mentioned.

In total numbers, yes, you are correct. However, the 2007 NICB report states the top stolen Accords and Camrys were from 1989-1991 and the 1995 Civic. Obviously the cars made to the tune of nearly half a million a year for 20+ years will top the lists. The data of year specific thefts also refutes your claim of lesser anti-theft devices then when you look at those year specific thefts. Total thefts for the top two are for very old cars. Top three year specific thefts for 2012 were the Altima, Impala and Malibu. The only Japanese year specific car other than the Altima was the 2012 Camry at 660~ thefts.
[doublepost=1521974297][/doublepost]

I’m also tuning into the New York Auto show debuting soon. I really do have hope for the Rav 4. To me, I’m not sure why Toyota decided with their interior choices with hard plastics and its a very dated design both exterior and interior. But I think that’s where it needs the most work is interior wise, hopefully with a nice refresh on the outside. Also, Now that the 2019 Corolla hatchback has CarPlay, I’m also hoping they implement that into the RAV4 when it launches, which is very nice to have. But the Rav-4 has significant ground to catch the CRV.

Because the current Rav4 debuted in 2012. The current CR-V debuted 2017. From 2012 to 2017 there's been a considerable shift in what consumers want in vehicles in that price range. Compare the previous generation Camry to the current one. More soft touch materials, better materials quality and sound proofing. That's been an industry shift. The quality of interiors in previous gen domestics and current ones is large. Just compare the 2010 Taurus to the 2013 facelift's interior. The difference is also noticeable in the SHO, from 2010 to 2013. The current Taurus and SHO (based on the Taurus) interior is from 2013. Different times.

Toyota needs to stick to a traditional transmission. Their partner, Aisin, makes quality transmissions. Honda's biggest mistake was attaching a CVT. Until long term reports pour in, it's a sticky situation. Honda does upstage Toyota with AA/CarPlay available. Meanwhile, Toyota is barely moving towards either one, and on a specific model that's expensive enough to make someone consider a Lexus ES.

Comparing the interior quality of these two vehicles is akin to me comparing my GL to the X5, in a way. It's a strange comparison.

 

[D.T.]

My aunt just bought a new MDX to replace her old MDX. Honestly I’m not a huge fan of Acura right now. The quality and features doesn’t seem quite as good as others, but I suppose they’re a better value compared to Lexus or the Germans. Acura’s are nice, but the level of refinement seems a step below the competition. And this is kind of a weird opinion but I have found I don’t really like the smell of Hondas and Acuras.

I don’t know if it fits your needs quite right but the Highlander is a pretty nice car (though the pricing seems a bit high). Or what about the VW Atlas? It’s too bad the Lexus RX/RX-L has such polarizing styling- I feel like most people think it’s over the top. I like the XC90 a lot, though I assume that’s not your speed. If you really want to spend money, the LR Discovery 5 is pretty nice.

I wish Lexus would update the GX. Honestly I’d probably buy one aside from the fact the tech in them is 10+ years old. You can get autonomous safety features but it’s a $5000 special order on the top trim, making the cost close to $70k which is simply not worth it.

There is a high rate of repeat MDX owners, so I'm sure the overall ownership for most folks is decent, but if you don't go with the SH, it's sort of a dud (even if it that gives it some tow capacity).

Highlander is OK, heck, you option it to a nice spec, it's pushing $50K, which seems wrong for the class vehicle.

I looked at the LRD 5, configured with my "spec" safety options, 3rd row, etc., pushes it over $60K, and no local dealer (though they are at least only 30-35 minutes away and not through town).

I read a couple of reviews of the Atlas, it wasn't even on my radar, it does a lot of things right: design is decent, has that traditional SUV styling we like, a little bland - tons of space (6-7 passengers, option for 2nd row captains chairs), the engine options are a little weak, even the top of the line V6 is very dated (not that we need a lot of performance, but it needs to be very capable with loads).

It's fun configured with this color + wheel option:

We went _back_to the Explorer Sport after I kind of forgot its actually a 3-row (that's the only model I'd consider), obviously it has solid performance with TT V6, the 6-speed seems a little dated, I suspect by MY19/20 it'll get the 10-speed (or it should), mileage/range isn't great (so-so mileage + 18.x gallon tank), that's not a huge issue, but I like the idea of one tank of gas getting us down to our place in The Keys with gas to spare. It gets pretty average-to-below ratings at various car sources.

Another option came up recently - we really like the Jeep GC, especially with the HA package, does many things right, but no 3rd row option. However, FCA does take what is basically the GC and build it under another make, and that's the Dodge Durango. Reviews like it better vs. the Explorer Sport (everything from the interior to the handling/ride), I saw one review where they stacked it up again the behemoth 3 row-ers (Tahoe, Yukon, Armada, Excursion) and it almost won (came in a very close 2nd to the Excursion), it's fun, sporty (two packages that really push the right buttons, the GT and the R/T), it has a high tow rating, especially with the 5.7L Hemi, seats 6 or 7, how has a captains chairs 2nd row option, it's actually $3K-4K less than the GC (I imagine a chunk of that is the drivetrain, the AWD setup in the GC is next level, but we don't need that much off road prowess). It's funny, people on the Jeep forum talk about how much the 5.7L gains in MPG with higher loads/towing, and many people report a solid 24 on the highway, with a 25 gallon tank, that's over 550 miles range.

 

[0388631]

That's a nice metallic yellow. The Atlas hadn't crossed my mind when I was throwing out suggestions because I was under the impression it was a full size SUV. 2nd row captain's chairs are cool and a must as kids get older. They provide more comfort on long trips than a bench row.

The GC is surprisingly promising and I read into them after you mentioned it in passing. No real problems, too. The design looks nice, too. Still looks like the older ones and not some futuristic looking goliath.

It's a fine balance situation. Gotta hit what you guys want but also be something young DT can feel comfortable in during a long road trip. You described a 6ish hour road trip. That's about 10 hours here with traffic and stops.

 

[D.T.]

That's a nice metallic yellow. The Atlas hadn't crossed my mind when I was throwing out suggestions because I was under the impression it was a full size SUV. 2nd row captain's chairs are cool and a must as kids get older. They provide more comfort on long trips than a bench row.

The GC is surprisingly promising and I read into them after you mentioned it in passing. No real problems, too. The design looks nice, too. Still looks like the older ones and not some futuristic looking goliath.

It's a fine balance situation. Gotta hit what you guys want but also be something young DT can feel comfortable in during a long road trip. You described a 6ish hour road trip. That's about 10 hours here with traffic and stops.

Yeah, that's a +great+ shade of yellow, especially for a vehicle that has acres of it

You know, I started really thinking about the captains chairs after you mentioned it, at first it didn't seem very necessary, but it really does give the 2nd row occupants nice seating (and most of the time, our standard load is just the three of us).

The downsides to the GC: no 3rd row, cost impact of the excessive (for us) AWD drive system (I mean, it's pretty exotic in the context of a street car).

 

[A.Goldberg]

There is a high rate of repeat MDX owners, so I'm sure the overall ownership for most folks is decent, but if you don't go with the SH, it's sort of a dud (even if it that gives it some tow capacity).

Highlander is OK, heck, you option it to a nice spec, it's pushing $50K, which seems wrong for the class vehicle.

I looked at the LRD 5, configured with my "spec" safety options, 3rd row, etc., pushes it over $60K, and no local dealer (though they are at least only 30-35 minutes away and not through town).

I read a couple of reviews of the Atlas, it wasn't even on my radar, it does a lot of things right: design is decent, has that traditional SUV styling we like, a little bland - tons of space (6-7 passengers, option for 2nd row captains chairs), the engine options are a little weak, even the top of the line V6 is very dated (not that we need a lot of performance, but it needs to be very capable with loads).

It's fun configured with this color + wheel option:



View attachment 755572



We went _back_to the Explorer Sport after I kind of forgot its actually a 3-row (that's the only model I'd consider), obviously it has solid performance with TT V6, the 6-speed seems a little dated, I suspect by MY19/20 it'll get the 10-speed (or it should), mileage/range isn't great (so-so mileage + 18.x gallon tank), that's not a huge issue, but I like the idea of one tank of gas getting us down to our place in The Keys with gas to spare. It gets pretty average-to-below ratings at various car sources.

Another option came up recently - we really like the Jeep GC, especially with the HA package, does many things right, but no 3rd row option. However, FCA does take what is basically the GC and build it under another make, and that's the Dodge Durango. Reviews like it better vs. the Explorer Sport (everything from the interior to the handling/ride), I saw one review where they stacked it up again the behemoth 3 row-ers (Tahoe, Yukon, Armada, Excursion) and it almost won (came in a very close 2nd to the Excursion), it's fun, sporty (two packages that really push the right buttons, the GT and the R/T), it has a high tow rating, especially with the 5.7L Hemi, seats 6 or 7, how has a captains chairs 2nd row option, it's actually $3K-4K less than the GC (I imagine a chunk of that is the drivetrain, the AWD setup in the GC is next level, but we don't need that much off road prowess). It's funny, people on the Jeep forum talk about how much the 5.7L gains in MPG with higher loads/towing, and many people report a solid 24 on the highway, with a 25 gallon tank, that's over 550 miles range.

Yeah, I feel like the Disco is too expensive, once you option it up you’re getting into RRS territory. The Disco 5 is also too big IMO.

My dad had a loaner Explorer Limited when his RRS was getting fixed from running over a deer. He said he liked it a lot. I’ve ridden in Explorers a couple times and they seem pretty nice, not quite a premium level of refinement but lightyears above what ford used to sell. It’s probably not a bad car if you can get over the police car stigma. I actually suggested my dad should buy one so people would think he’s a cop and get out of his way on the highway .

I like the JGC a lot. I looked into buying one a couple years ago but was concerned about the Fiat reliability. I’m not sure about Florida but here in New England it’s almost impossible to find a V8 or (at the time) diesel model. It seemed maybe 2 cars out of 100 had the diesel or V8. That said, the revised V6 is decent. Another thing I didn’t like was the cheap bronze interior trim, which I think for 2018 they’ve now improved. They also dumped that dangerous electric gear shifter. The other problem is if you want certain options they push you into higher trim packs, and then the car just becomes too expensive for what it is. I still kind of wish I bought that Touareg TDI...

It’s intetesting, I barely see the Durango here in New England. When I was visiting Colorado they were almost as prevalent as the JGC. It bewilders me how Jeep has failed to produce a 3 row SUV in recent times. It seems like a huge lost market. I supppse they had the Commander years back, but I’d consider that era a low point for Jeep. While the Durango is basically the LWB JGC, I’m not sure I could tolerate the stigma of owning a Dodge.

Cars have just become so expensive in general. I agree $50k+ for a high trim Highlander is crazy. At least it will have good reliability and likely very good resale.

 

[SactoGuy18]

One thing I really hope Toyota addresses with the new RAV4 is the quality of the eight-speed Aisin automatic. On the 2018 Camry, people complain the transmission does not "downshift" smoothly. As for the VW Atlas, I expect a number of changes coming about this time next year. The instrument panel may get something very similar to what VW did with the new version of the Touareg that was just recently announced for their high-end models--a large digital instrument panel and a large center display.

 

[0388631]

Eco mode is the problem. While I was out, a new white Atlas drove by me. Very underwhelming in white. It didn't look too big either. I figured it was an Atlas given its size and the new dealer plates on them.

 

[bunnspecial]

I had a fun afternoon of playing with MGs.

Someone on the MG forum in Lexington reported that his 1970 was backfiring like crazy and basically undrivable. I offered to come over, and after talking to him on the phone had a good idea of what the problem was.

He'd forwarned me that it had a Weber carb, so I was silently hoping that it wasn't a carb problem as I'm a fish out of water on those.

I got there and found an interesting conglomeration of parts-before he even popped the hood he told me that it had an engine out of a '75, or so he'd been told. I saw 18V on the block and some tell-tale markers of it being a CAM1106 head, so that made sense. It also had electric fans and an expansion tank from a later MG-he reported that he'd fitted the expansion tank himself because it was boiling over in the summer. I suspect that the boil-over was from him running a 5lb cap and that it would probably resolve itself if fitted with a 10lb(spec for that year) but in any case the electric fans are a nice and logical upgrade. The carb was a Weber DGV 32/36, which is a common drop-on for MGs, but fortunately it seemed to be in good shape(I'd have cried if it was a DCOE).

In any case, I went straight to where I thought the problem was and yanked out the distributor-a not so easy task since whatever nimrod fitted the late engine had routed the oil cooler hose right in front of the distributor and not below it as it should be. In any case, it came out with some gymnastics.

I dropped in a new set of points and gapped them-I explained what I was doing while the owner watched in amazement as he said that he was terrified of the distributor. It didn't strictly NEED new points, but the ones in it were the lower quality ones of what's available and I felt better leaving him with a better quality set. He also got one of the good red plastic ignition rotors, not the junk black plastic ones.

With the distributor back in, it coughed a bit and fired up. I set the timing(a couple of very reputable mechanics I know are adamant about 32º BTDC at full mechanical advance, vac disconnected), again with the owner watching in amazement as shined a strobe light down on the front of the engine and twiddled the dial on the back of it while also turning the distributor.

With the distributor snugged back down, we went for a drive and he said it ran better than it had in the 3 1/2 years he'd owned the car. It's just a shame it doesn't have the original engine, as pre-73 engines are higher compression and a lot "peppier."

In any case, I left feeling good about how it was running. Unfortunately, he still needs a new alternator. I was also really concerned about the brakes, as they were a lot softer and "spongier" than any MG I've ever driven(the pedal should feel rock hard).

 

[44267547]

One thing I really hope Toyota addresses with the new RAV4 is the quality of the eight-speed Aisin automatic. On the 2018 Camry, people complain the transmission does not "downshift" smoothly.

Eco-Mode isn’t the problem, which is less
minimally invasive through inhibiting throttle input, control transmission shift points are subtle and climate control systems to maximize the fuel rating by default on the SE/LE. I would also question which mode the driver is specifically using they are experiencing the downshifting hesitation in (Seems Some these complaints are when driving manually as well). It seems Toyota’s in House programming is resulting in the hesitation with the 8 speed. Albeit if the driver wants a more spirited response would be to change the driving mode in manual mode. The 2018 Camry I-4 8-speed is reportedly sluggish from a stop and if cruising at a lower RPM and through the 4th gear. Toyota previously has had acceleration hesitation issues when you press the pedal when they implemented drive-by-wire throttle. Depending on the mode AND if the paddle shifters are mitigating factors, The Camry is very sluggish and slow from a complete stop. (Unless you’re in Sport mode.) As mentioned, the transmission is programmed to use four gears most of the time, which may also have something to contribute to its Response time. I believe Camrys have been known in the past for lackluster transmission shift changes. That all said, most of what I Have read is the 2018 Camry is a fun driving experience. If I had a choice between the Accord and Camry, I would choose the Camry. Although I’m not sure how I feel about the new Camry grill.

Decent review from Car & Driver:

https://www.caranddriver.com/review...ving-impressions-review-car-and-driver-page-4

 

[elf69]

@elf69 You'd be hard pressed to find many fans of the Tiburon in this thread. It's one of the most stolen and expensive vehicles to insure (for that reason) in America. Though from a style point of view, I thought the last generation was better looking, and the Genesis Coupe "sports tourer" was the newer Tiburon.

In the coupe (UK/europe name for tibby) clubs international section has about a 40-50% USA member base.
and the KDM club almost all them are usa.

In UK they are not stolen much as they are not worth anything, they are stupidly cheap. e.g. 2.7L V6 model on a 2004 registration £250-500

In uk the coupe/tibby has quite a following.
One of most common mods is fit tibby badges as it messes with the UK public.
An S3 model with the winged T badges, has some thinking it's an aston martin/porsche/etc.

Sadly UK never got the genesis, we where given the velosoter to replace them.

Personally I'm a huge fan of the early RD models 1996-2001.

I like reading this thread, it mostly about new cars and interesting read as none of them over here so interesting to see what you guys got over there.

 

[2298754]

As for the VW Atlas, I expect a number of changes coming about this time next year. The instrument panel may get something very similar to what VW did with the new version of the Touareg that was just recently announced for their high-end models--a large digital instrument panel and a large center display.

Atlas already has virtual cockpit. It won't adapt the T4's new infotainment because it's a lower end product. MQB vs MLB Evo

Expect to see a 2.5T from the Chinese Teramont eventually. The 3.6 needs to be killed off.

 

[D.T.]

As for the VW Atlas, I expect a number of changes coming about this time next year. The instrument panel may get something very similar to what VW did with the new version of the Touareg that was just recently announced for their high-end models--a large digital instrument panel and a large center display.

Yep, I suspect a new engine in the very immediate future - that would solve two major complaints: 1) underpowered (as a 7 person hauler), 2) they could revise the transmission so it's not having to overcome the power issue.

Expect to see a 2.5T from the Chinese Teramont eventually. The 3.6 needs to be killed off.

Ahh yeah, look at that, specs for the Teramont:

The 330TSI comes with a 2.0 turbo with 190hp and 320nm. The 380TSI with a 2.0 turbo with 220hp and 350nm. The big daddy is the 530TSI which is powered by a brand new and rather special 2.5 liter VR6 (!) turbocharged engine, good for 299 horses and 500nm. The Teramont is 4WD only.

299 HP, better, maybe ~305 for the US Market

500nm = ~367 lb/ft .... holy smokes, now we're talking

 

[2298754]

Ahh yeah, look at that, specs for the Teramont:

299 HP, better, maybe ~305 for the US Market

500nm = ~367 lb/ft .... holy smokes, now we're talking

Yup, the 2.5T sounds like a great engine on paper. If you look into the Teramont, it's actually nicer than the NA Atlas.

It has full LED taillights (sequential like Audis), a Dynaudio sound system, and a HUD.

 

[0388631]

T4 = Turbo 4?
Teramount (China) = Atlas
2.5T coming soon?

Why did VW not launch it with a new engine?

Edit: I wonder if GM will ever produce a turbo six or eight for the Suburban.

 

[D.T.]

T4 = Turbo 4?
Teramount (China) = Atlas
2.5T coming soon?

Why did VW not launch it with a new engine?

Edit: I wonder if GM will ever produce a turbo six or eight for the Suburban.

Isn't it the same V6 used in other products like the Touareg? I guess they had the motor for the US market, they were trying to enter a specific price point - I'm sure it was very motivated by accounting

 

[0388631]

Isn't it the same V6 used in other products like the Touareg? I guess they had the motor for the US market, they were trying to enter a specific price point - I'm sure it was very motivated by accounting

Good question. I have no idea. What I do know is China taxes on liters. Specifically, anything more than 4 incurs a 20% tax hike. Though I would not be surprised if they tax on large engines under the tax hike. In other words, each units tax is less with a 2.5 turbo than a 3.6 unit.

I think it's inevitable we'll see more turbo units from manufacturers. Or supercharged depending on the application. I don't think we'll see anything change much for our market given the EPA recently made a statement on relaxing some rules due to them placing a strain on manufacturers, domestic or not. We'll probably see better designed engines with safeguards to minimize or "eliminate" any lag or issues such as cool-down which have largely been remedied by now. Though I can still see some cars reserving an NA engine because they're performance vehicles, but they'll become more niche than they are now.

Though what I'm saying may transpire in the next fifteen years. For all we know the world could implode a month. As I said yesterday, I saw an Atlas while I was out and it's a fairly big car but not too big. It does stand out and it looks pretty nice. It was in white.

I did make out what looked like a small tag on the right rear when it passed by. Red and black or red and silver. Might be one of those dealer emblems but I haven't seen those before except online.


Edit: Looks like I misunderstood you. Are you talking about them turbocharging their V6? I can see that happening, but the V6 is an outdated engine, isn't it? It would make more sense for them to use a new engine and turbo it. I can absolutely see them using a version of whatever the Q5 is running, and save money down the line.
[doublepost=1522118006][/doublepost]Oh, @D.T., I don't think it was brought up, but what about the Chevy Traverse? Nice interior, third row, second row captain's chairs available, 5,000 lb towing capacity and has that "bland" SUV styling you guys like. Which I understand, some SUVs look like they came out of a video game nowadays. There's also the Tahoe, which is big, but not Suburban big.

 

[SactoGuy18]

The Atlas may get something like the Touareg's new instrument panel probably in a higher-end model. And we could see it on the US-market Passat, too.

 

[quagmire]

I don't think it was brought up, but what about the Chevy Traverse? Nice interior, third row, second row captain's chairs available, 5,000 lb towing capacity and has that "bland" SUV styling you guys like. Which I understand, some SUVs look like they came out of a video game nowadays. There's also the Tahoe, which is big, but not Suburban big.

The Traverse is similar in size to the Tahoe yet is a lot more practical. You have a third row and usable cargo space with it up. Only reason you would get the Tahoe over traverse is if A) You need the towing capacity or B) Ego needs a V8 to feel like a man.

 

[D.T.]

Oh,D.T., I don't think it was brought up, but what about the Chevy Traverse? Nice interior, third row, second row captain's chairs available, 5,000 lb towing capacity and has that "bland" SUV styling you guys like. Which I understand, some SUVs look like they came out of a video game nowadays. There's also the Tahoe, which is big, but not Suburban big.

I couldn't figure out the bold, we don't like bland, but do like the more traditional general design.

Then I re-read my post above ... i.e., this part:

I read a couple of reviews of the Atlas, it wasn't even on my radar, it does a lot of things right: design is decent, has that traditional SUV styling we like, a little bland

Hahaha, that was kind of a run on series of thoughts, minor edit to the bolded for better clarity:

... design is decent, has that traditional SUV styling we like in general, however, it's a little bland.

 

[2298754]

Isn't it the same V6 used in other products like the Touareg? I guess they had the motor for the US market, they were trying to enter a specific price point - I'm sure it was very motivated by accounting

Yup, that 3.6 has been used in the last-gen Passat, CC, Touareg 3, OG Q7, and even the last-gen Cayenne.

Should be bulletproof by now.

 

[D.T.]

I don't think it was brought up, but what about the Chevy Traverse?

I think one of the things with the traverse was [stupid] Chevy packaging/configuration, like features we want only available in a certain trim level that forces certain design choices and actually loses some design options!

 

[44267547]

The Traverse is similar in size to the Tahoe yet is a lot more practical. You have a third row and usable cargo space with it up. Only reason you would get the Tahoe over traverse is if A) You need the towing capacity or B) Ego needs a V8 to feel like a man.

The Pursuit rated Tahoe for heavy as it is (Even with the weight including full P.P. Package/Transport Cage), it’s acceleration is really impressive from a stand still.

As for the Traverse, GM finally changed the body on the 2018 model where it doesn’t look like a minivan anymore. It actually has a much more aggressive front end, but slightly Durango-ish from the back. But overall, much better looking than its predecessor. But the cabin space for Traverse is more than adequate.

 

[BarracksSi]

We've had to jumpstart my wife's '17 CR-V twice now, both times after it's been sitting for a couple weeks. Strange, really; I wonder if there's some sort of power drain among all the tech gadgets it has.

If it acts up again, she may want to move back to Toyota. Their new CH-R compact SUV has been catching her eye. She should try it out sometime just to see what it's like (and, honestly, I think the CR-V is bigger than she's comfortable with driving). However, I think she actually likes the Honda's smooth, stepless CVT (yeah yeah), and as long as the Toyota doesn't have CarPlay, it'll be a hard sell indeed.

 

[0388631]

I think one of the things with the traverse was [stupid] Chevy packaging/configuration, like features we want only available in a certain trim level that forces certain design choices and actually loses some design options!

Got it. And, yeah, Chevy does that along with other companies. I suppose it's easier than having multiple options or a la carte like Porsche, though their situation is very different than most companies.
[doublepost=1522184092][/doublepost]

I couldn't figure out the bold, we don't like bland, but do like the more traditional general design.

Then I re-read my post above ... i.e., this part:



Hahaha, that was kind of a run on series of thoughts, minor edit to the bolded for better clarity:

... design is decent, has that traditional SUV styling we like in general, however, it's a little bland.

I did go with your words. But, I absolutely understand what you mean. I like the bland and sedated designs, too. Which is why I really like the Lincoln Navigator, even if its introductory price is way too high for what it is. That said, only a few SUVs should ever have soft curves or bulbous design, and those are fast SUVs.

Speaking of which, I remember Ford announcing an Explorer ST due by 2020. If that tickles your fancy.
[doublepost=1522184365][/doublepost]

We've had to jumpstart my wife's '17 CR-V twice now, both times after it's been sitting for a couple weeks. Strange, really; I wonder if there's some sort of power drain among all the tech gadgets it has.

If it acts up again, she may want to move back to Toyota. Their new CH-R compact SUV has been catching her eye. She should try it out sometime just to see what it's like (and, honestly, I think the CR-V is bigger than she's comfortable with driving). However, I think she actually likes the Honda's smooth, stepless CVT (yeah yeah), and as long as the Toyota doesn't have CarPlay, it'll be a hard sell indeed.

Where do you live? Could be weather affecting battery. For what it's worth, while battery drain has been all but limited in new cars that sit still for weeks, it's still an issue. You could take it in so a tech could look at it.
[doublepost=1522184821][/doublepost]

The Traverse is similar in size to the Tahoe yet is a lot more practical. You have a third row and usable cargo space with it up. Only reason you would get the Tahoe over traverse is if A) You need the towing capacity or B) Ego needs a V8 to feel like a man.

Exactly. The new one like RP pointed out looks much nicer. And the interior looks nice as well. Plus, that sweet saddle leather. While I am a massive fan of the Tahoe and Suburban HVAC systems, and generally like both cars, the only one I'd get if I really had to would be the Suburban. This is assuming we have a couple more kids or just find the actual need for that much space. The current Tahoe isn't exactly a big deal once you throw in some packages. It's almost as if Chevy is trying to entice people with the Suburban.

 

[0388631]

I recently had a chance to test drive a 2018 Honda Accord EX sedan with the 1.5-liter 195 bhp (145 kW) engine and CVT automatic. It's actually a surprisingly fun car to drive, with really good handling and a reasonably peppy engine (0-60 mph is about 7.1 seconds). Would actually consider one if the price wasn't around US$29,000 "out the door."

^^Yeah, it's really not surprising Honda is struggling to sell them. The Accord is a great car but it's getting outrageously expensive.

It's a shame they're struggling to sell them because the Accord sounds like a fantastic car on paper. The styling isn't that nice, but when has that ever stopped people from buying Hondas?

To be honest, Honda (and Toyota) have earned the right to charge more for their products. The Korean and Nissan competitiors are sub-standard.

Remembered these posts as I was reading the following article:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/honda-to-trim-production-of-its-flagship-sedan-1522188502

Workers assembling Honda Motor Co.’s HMC 0.27% Accord will take off a total of two weeks from building the sedan over the next several months as the auto maker works to adjust bloated inventories.

Unlike Detroit auto makers that have either eliminated entire sedan lines or slowed down sedan production over the past year, Japanese, German and Korean auto makers haven't taken their foot off the pedal.

Just this year through February, Honda, Toyota Motor Corp. and Nissan Motor Corp. have collectively sold about double the amount of sedans in the U.S. compared with the Big 3 Detroit auto makers, according to Autodata Corp.

A Honda spokesman said its Marysville, Ohio, plant will stop production a total of 11 days through July, which includes two days a month April through June and then an additional five days following the typical summer shutdown at the beginning of July.

The plant’s 4,200 employees have the option of taking vacation days, unpaid days or coming into work to do other tasks.

The spokesman said the reason for stopping production is to “focus on aligning production to current market conditions.”

Honda’s dealer inventory of the Accord was over 100 days’ supply in February, much higher than what’s considered healthy for the industry, according to data from WardsAuto.com.

The Japanese auto maker’s Ohio plant began producing the redesigned 2018 Accord in September, and the auto maker invested a total of $267 million and added 300 new jobs to support Accord production at the vehicle assembly plant and at its engine plant in Ohio.

The Marysville plant, located about 30 miles northwest of Columbus, also produces the auto maker’s luxury brand Acura TLX and ILX sedans.

Honda’s big bet on sedans comes at a time when consumer preference is rapidly shifting to trucks and SUVs amid low gasoline prices. The Accord launched around the same time as its biggest rival, Toyota’s Camry family sedan, was also redesigned.

Year to date through February, sales of the Accord are down 12.9% to 37,430 units sold. Toyota, meanwhile, has seen a 2.3% increase in Camry sales through February to 48,929 vehicles.

Nissan will also slow production at its plant in Tennessee, which produces a number of vehicles including the Altima and Maxima sedans, along with the Rogue crossover, among others. Dan Mohnke, Nissan’s head of sales in North America, said in an interview last week that the auto maker will slow the speed of its lines to reduce inventories by about 15% through June.

“We’re taking some pressure out of the business,” Mr. Mohnke said. “Getting our inventory right is a key step to be able to focus on sustainable, natural growth from there.”