The "I'm waiting for an iMac refresh" thread

[Sweet Lou]

The Voice Of Reason!

The difference 3 or 4 years from now of a 21.5-inch iMac having one processor or a slightly faster one should be invisibly minor, especially considering it today, years in advance.

I think all this waiting gets quite insane… No one knows what is coming or when, it most likely won't really affect what most people will do with it (web, email, occasional photo stuff, even casual video editing). If I were suffering with a Dell and Vista, I'd switch yesterday, and the prospect of maybe having to wait months agonizing over when the refresh will come would be completely depressing.

And I wouldn't even pay attention to when they do get refreshed, which will always happen and is completely irrelevant to one's satisfaction with a product. It's just irrational regret that undermines enjoyment of an awesome product. It's nuts…

Thanks, I think I just needed to hear someone say it! However how would you feel if you bought a Mac Mini two months ago before the refresh? Especially becuase a Mac is very expensive . Regardless, I doubt that a total refresh is going to happen and I any upgrades will be small.

 

[iRoel]

Is a redesign possible? I mean, the latest was 3 years ago... August 7th 2007 was the latest redesign, the cycle says that a new redesign is coming around 2 or 3 years.

 

[OCalcutta]

The difference 3 or 4 years from now of a 21.5-inch iMac having one processor or a slightly faster one should be invisibly minor, especially considering it today, years in advance.

I think all this waiting gets quite insane… No one knows what is coming or when, it most likely won't really affect what most people will do with it (web, email, occasional photo stuff, even casual video editing). If I were suffering with a Dell and Vista, I'd switch yesterday, and the prospect of maybe having to wait months agonizing over when the refresh will come would be completely depressing.

And I wouldn't even pay attention to when they do get refreshed, which will always happen and is completely irrelevant to one's satisfaction with a product. It's just irrational regret that undermines enjoyment of an awesome product. It's nuts…

Actually, I was quite 'sane' and was ready to pull the trigger on the 21.5 until I decided to do some research and happened on this website and after reading all these views, I got totally confused. You are right. It is nuts to be agonizing. Makes no difference in my case. I'm getting it.

 

[SUPERMAJO]

Waiting pays - but it is a individual decision

Anyway, there are perhaps some reasons to run in an apple store and buy the aim of your desire.

There are some reasons why waiting may pay. For me there are several disadvantages concerning the actual version of an iMac:

- no USB 3 support
- no hdmi output (i have a home cinema equipment so dolby output is important for me)
- processors and graphics are good - but actually not state of the art
- blu ray support
- "the one big thing" nobody expects is part of the new version ;o)
- and, be honest, almost one year market presence is very long for a computer!

So, as I wrote even there are indications against it, I hope that waiting won't last long. And even if a few of the points mentioned will improve in the new imac version:

waiting will pay!

 

[slicecom]

Is a redesign possible? I mean, the latest was 3 years ago... August 7th 2007 was the latest redesign, the cycle says that a new redesign is coming around 2 or 3 years.

The latest redesign was late 2009. A redesign will most likely not happen for another 2 years or so.

 

[deconstruct60]

I'm sure there will be lower clocked versions too, 3.1GHz as starting clock sounds a bit high.

But intel isn't going to pull the Clarkdale stuff out of its line up. The Core i3 Clarkdale stops at 3.2 . More intuitive if the Sandy Bridge stuff starts around 3.2 and moves up. They are both 32nm. The latter is suppose to be a higher value offering. It certainly is going to initial come at a higher price. Besides the higher clock typically leads to higher GPU clock.... and that is there major marketing pain point. For numerous systems these Clarkdales are sold with discrete chips also on board because the IGP tends not to shine on the mid-high end graphics workload. Plus the iMac needs to do dual monitor... again not going to shine.

The problem with Sandy Bridge is that would need a new motherboard. The upper end iMacs just got one. Apple could move that one "down" to the lower half of the iMac line up and put a newer one in the upper half. They can play a bigger volume game though if use the previous gen across the line. However, that would push Sandy Bridge tech adoption out till probably 2nd half next year.

Something like a i3-550 (with perhaps a $200 optional i5-670 for the single core app, max GHz fanclub if Apple still likes the additional CTO complexity. That will turbo all the way up to 3.73 Ghz. Or a $100 option for a i5-650 just to get turbo at same base speed.). There are the bumped specs i5-760 and price cut i7-870 that are probably coming in Aug.

The key question is what price points will the Sandy Bridge come in at and whether they make sense for the upper end iMac configurations. If price points fit and Apple waits till around the 12 month mark then the release will be longer. These less than 1 year product cycles make less and less sense as Intel settles into a 12 month update cycle. Sandy Bridge is going to arrive about 12 months after Lynnfield did.

If Sandy Bridge parts are too expensive (for Apple's targeted price points and margins) then August makes sense if don't want to release "half" the line up again this time at launch. "Waiting for product line to start up" is a good excuse for releasing "half" now and half later. "Waiting for price cut".... not so much.

Besides they have several significant glitches to fix on the upper end iMacs (jumbo ethernet , etc. ) some more time won't hurt.

 

[314631]

My bet is on a refresh in October to start capturing the Christmas shopping buzz. People were telling me to wait 6 weeks ago, I'm glad I took the plunge and got my iMac. 12gb RAM, Core i5 runs everything like a dream including a usable VMware Windows 7 install.

I'm sure Apple will make some exciting announcements. But given people are still very happy with their 24" iMacs from a couple years ago, I don't think I'm going to feel obsolete anytime soon.

The other point I would stress. When Apple does release the new iMacs, I would NOT rush out an buy immediately. Almost all Mac refreshes in recent times have had serious production issues. From click, beep freeze on MacBook Pros and Mac Minis, to the defective screens, noisy hard drives and yellow tint on iMacs. The lesson I have learned is wait 1-2 months for production issues to get ironed out before taking the plunge and buying a new Apple product. You'll probably save yourself a whole lot of stress, disappointment and support calls.

 

[brogueboy]

What will the prices of the current models look like post-refresh?

Take the current the base 27" model:

2.66GHz Intel Core i5
4GB memory
1TB hard drive
ATI Radeon HD 4850 graphics with 512MB

It is currently selling for $1999 at the Apple store.

Once the refreshes come along, will the $1999 price tag on the above model drop a lot to make it worth waiting for the refresh?

I probably will go with the base i5 model and then upgrade the memory and hard drive as I go along, but I am afraid to pull the trigger and spend 2k now if it will drop say $500 once the newer models come along.

 

[itryanditry]

The latest redesign was late 2009. A redesign will most likely not happen for another 2 years or so.

That was more of a beef-up than a redesign if you ask me.

Still nice, and much anticipated. But not a redesign.

 

[deconstruct60]

The base 27" one is a 3.02 C2D at $1699.

Once the refreshes come along, will the $1999 price tag on the above model drop a lot to make it worth waiting for the refresh?

No. iMac prices have been relatively stable last 3-4 years. The are not likely going to change now.

May end up with something with an i5 label (but 2 core ) on it in the lower offerings but the current i5 Quad will probably get speed bumped the price remain exactly the same. In fact, might see a bump on lowest model if have to put a discrete graphics chip in it and can't offset cost with drop in CPU package costs from C2D.

Anyone who's plan is "I'll just wait 1 (2 , or 3 ) years and Apple will cut there prices on the same exact submodel I'm looking at" is probably in for a long wait. Apple will stuff more version over version enhancements into the box before dropping price (e.g., perhaps bigger jump in graphics , graphics memory speed increase, etc. ).

P.S. remote chance they could try to squeeze it into a 21.5 iMac but not sure going to have enough thermal room (and fans) to do that as an option. Hence probably more of a duo core i5 option for the smaller screen. Pricewise it would work as a component at the $1,499 price point.
The i5 2.66 QUAD is slightly cheaper because it runs hot (relative to what is usually targeted at smaller iMacs).

 

[bprice]

Take the current the base 27" model:

2.66GHz Intel Core i5
4GB memory
1TB hard drive
ATI Radeon HD 4850 graphics with 512MB

It is currently selling for $1999 at the Apple store.

Once the refreshes come along, will the $1999 price tag on the above model drop a lot to make it worth waiting for the refresh?

I probably will go with the base i5 model and then upgrade the memory and hard drive as I go along, but I am afraid to pull the trigger and spend 2k now if it will drop say $500 once the newer models come along.

hmmm... really.Has a Mac ever dropped $500(thats 25%!) on a refresh..?

I just got a refurbed i7 for $1850.I'm with the majority here.I don't think there is going to be a major upgrade especially on the upper end (i5 ,i7).now is a great time to buy IMO
BP

 

[johnnymg]

snip.................
The other point I would stress. When Apple does release the new iMacs, I would NOT rush out an buy immediately. Almost all Mac refreshes in recent times have had serious production issues. From click, beep freeze on MacBook Pros and Mac Minis, to the defective screens, noisy hard drives and yellow tint on iMacs. The lesson I have learned is wait 1-2 months for production issues to get ironed out before taking the plunge and buying a new Apple product. You'll probably save yourself a whole lot of stress, disappointment and support calls.

Oh contrare............. Ordered my 13" MBP the day it was announced. It's a wonderful product right from day one!

cheers
johnG

 

[brogueboy]

hmmm... really.Has a Mac ever dropped $500(thats 25%!) on a refresh..?

I just got a refurbed i7 for $1850.I'm with the majority here.I don't think there is going to be a major upgrade especially on the upper end (i5 ,i7).now is a great time to buy IMO
BP

Good point. I saw that one listed, and am very tempted to just pull the trigger on that one. Buyer's remorse with computers is always something I struggle with as they are immediately out of date upon purchasing.

But, having Aperture open a picture for editing in 0.87s instead of having a new, refreshed iMac open it in 0.85s is probably something I can live with.

 

[e5volcano]

any chance of apple announcing new iMacs this Friday's conference of addressing iphones?

 

[MadMitch89]

any chance of apple announcing new iMacs this Friday's conference of addressing iphones?

I'd say definitely not, I doubt they want to sugar coat the bad news of the iPhone with new iMacs. I'd say either next Tuesday or in August.

 

[tomricci]

I'd put $200 on it being the 20th this month. A store my friend works at emailed me this morning telling me that iMacs were officially constraint and the last 3 times this happened with products they were updated. Mac mini last month, MacBook, MacBook Pro etc.

He said this before Tuesday this week but they still were able to get some stock, now it's all signs pointing to the 20th.

 

[ManOfTheHour]

I'd put $200 on it being the 20th this month. A store my friend works at emailed me this morning telling me that iMacs were officially constraint and the last 3 times this happened with products they were updated. Mac mini last month, MacBook, MacBook Pro etc.

He said this before Tuesday this week but they still were able to get some stock, now it's all signs pointing to the 20th.

Is there some place I can take this bet? Haha I dunno this does sound promising... but you never know.

 

[gto55]

Wednesday, July 14, 2010

Apple may get Intel's Sandy Bridge CPUs sooner than expected

By Daniel Eran Dilger
Published: 05:30 PM EST

Volume production of the next new generation of Intel's desktop and notebook CPUs will begin earlier than originally anticipated in response to enthusiasm from chip buyers like Apple who have sampled the new parts.

Speaking in the company's Q2 conference call, Intel's president and chief executive Paul Otellini commented that Intel began sampling the Sandy Bridge chips to vendors over the last quarter Strong positive feedback has induced the company accelerate production. Sandy Bridge chips are expected to go on sale late this year, making it likely that they've find their way into Macs by early 2011.

"I am more excited by Sandy Bridge than I have been in any product that the company has launched in a number of years," Otellini said. "Due to the very strong reception of Sandy Bridge, we have accelerated our 32-nanometer factory ramp and have raised our capex guidance to enable us to meet the anticipated demand."

Apple's use of Intel CPUs

The upcoming new Sandy Bridge family of chips will replace Intel's Nehalem micro-architecture currently being used in Apple's Core i5 and i7-equipped iMacs and MacBook Pros (mobile i5 and i7 chips are referred to as Arrandale). Apple's entry level Macs, including the Mac mini and MacBook, continue to use Intel's earlier Core 2 Duo generation of chips.

While Apple was the first PC maker to release a Nehalem-based system (the Xeon Mac Pro in March of 2009), the company seemed almost reluctant to move its notebooks to Nehalem, as the new design prevented the Mac maker from continuing to build "two-chip" notebooks that paired Intel's CPU with a hybrid GPU-chipset integrated component from NVIDIA.

The Nehalem design forced PC makers like Apple to use Intel's own supporting chipset (which works with the CPU to handle functions such as its I/O access and its memory controller) rather than continuing to use competing chipsets such as the part introduced by NVIDIA. In its Arrandale mobile chips, Intel's "HD Graphics" chip is integrated into the CPU die itself.

Because Intel is weaker than NVIDIA in the area of graphics processing, Apple has to use both Intel's chipset and a separate NVIDIA graphics chip to achieve acceptable video performance in its i5 and i7-based Macs. That has prompted Applet to continue using Intel's previous Core 2 Duo paired with the NVIDIA chip in all but its highest-end products, where a three-chip solution is more acceptable in terms of cost and efficiency.




What's new in Sandy Bridge

Intel's new Sandy Bridge design (which originally had a Hebrew name until Intel realized "Gesher" or bridge was also the name of an Israeli political party) pushes integration even further. Rather than demanding the use of an external Intel-designed chipset, Sandy Bridge integrates the memory controller, graphics, and standard chipset features directly into the CPU die, resulting in a "System on a Chip" design similar to the tightly integrated Application Processor components used in mobile devices (such as Apple's custom A4 inside the iPad and iPhone 4).

While not clocked dramatically faster than existing Nehalem chips (2.8 to 3.8GHz), Sandy Bridge should deliver faster performance thanks to a minimum of four cores (with 6-8 core versions available later), improvements to the internal data bus, and enhanced "Advanced Vector Extensions" which build upon SSE to provide better floating point performance.

In addition to being incrementally faster, Sandy Bridge chips are designed to run cooler and more energy efficient, targeting the shift toward more mobile notebook systems. Whether Apple will aggressively move toward Sandy Bridge across the board and unify its Mac architectures under one design remains to be seen; the company may choose to migrate to Sandy Bridge on the high end and continue using the cheaper Core 2 Duo parts on lower end Macs, given the relatively moderate jump in performance Intel is promising.

http://www.appleinsider.com/article...s_sandy_bridge_cpus_sooner_than_expected.html

 

[Commenter]

Thanks, I think I just needed to hear someone say it! However how would you feel if you bought a Mac Mini two months ago before the refresh? Especially becuase a Mac is very expensive . Regardless, I doubt that a total refresh is going to happen and I any upgrades will be small.

I wouldn't have gotten a mini two months ago because it was a terrible value, in itself, at the time (2.26GHz proc, 2GB memory, 160GB hard drive, no display, mouse, or keyboard for $600). I still think the new mini is not a very good deal unless you already have a good display, mouse, and keyboard or you will be using it as a media center or something specialized.

And I think the base and high-end iMacs are a great deal even today. And what's important is one's satisfaction with a product, not "perfectly and thoroughly optimizing" what one gets, which doesn't even make sense with categories of products for which all information is available, much less for Macs, which no one knows what or when they'll come. If you'll feel bad when they refresh a product you bought, maybe you should wait, but the thing is that that feeling bad is irrational and the fact that it detracts from enjoying a product that is awesome in itself is a shame. Consider what achievement of engineering the iMac is in itself, or compared to the equivalent iMac ten years ago*. To not enjoy that but instead suffer for the mirage of a marginal improvement is nuts.

When they'll refresh Apple hardware and even software is unknown, and though there are some weak patterns you can be months and months off. It's a lottery whether you'll get a recently-refreshed product or not, and whether that refresh was significant, and whether it came with new issues, etc. The only sane thing, in my estimation, is to consider if a product is good enough when one needs it, maybe with some margin for the future. Everything else is speculation and anxiety, and one should put those silly feelings of ours in their place with stern anger, instead of letting them ruin the awesome products great companies like Apple provide.

*That's the inflation-adjusted equivalent model of today's base iMac, released exactly ten years before; check out the hard drive, memory, vram, display, mouse, and optical drive

Apple may get Intel's Sandy Bridge CPUs sooner than expected

"…incrementally faster…", "…[Apple] may… …continue using the cheaper Core 2 Duo parts on lower end Macs…", "…moderate jump in performance Intel is promising.".

Wow, everyone wait until "maybe early 2011".

 

[bprice]

I wouldn't have gotten a mini two months ago because it was a terrible value, in itself, at the time (2.26GHz proc, 2GB memory, 160GB hard drive, no display, mouse, or keyboard for $600). I still think the new mini is not a very good deal unless you already have a good display, mouse, and keyboard or you will be using it as a media center or something specialized.

And I think the base and high-end iMacs are a great deal even today. And what's important is one's satisfaction with a product, not "perfectly and thoroughly optimizing" what one gets, which doesn't even make sense with categories of products for which all information is available, much less for Macs, which no one knows what or when they'll come. If you'll feel bad when they refresh a product you bought, maybe you should wait, but the thing is that that feeling bad is irrational and the fact that it detracts from enjoying a product that is awesome in itself is a shame. Consider what achievement of engineering the iMac is in itself, or compared to the equivalent iMac ten years ago*. To not enjoy that but instead suffer for the mirage of a marginal improvement is nuts.

When they'll refresh Apple hardware and even software is unknown, and though there are some weak patterns you can be months and months off. It's a lottery whether you'll get a recently-refreshed product or not, and whether that refresh was significant, and whether it came with new issues, etc. The only sane thing, in my estimation, is to consider if a product is good enough when one needs it, maybe with some margin for the future. Everything else is speculation and anxiety, and one should put those silly feelings of ours in their place with stern anger, instead of letting them ruin the awesome products great companies like Apple provide.

*That's the inflation-adjusted equivalent model of today's base iMac, released exactly ten years before; check out the hard drive, memory, vram, display, mouse, and optical drive





"…incrementally faster…", "…[Apple] may… …continue using the cheaper Core 2 Duo parts on lower end Macs…", "…moderate jump in performance Intel is promising.".

Wow, everyone wait until "maybe early 2011".

good post...

the few things that a refreshed iMac could have I can live without or work around it.There's hardly anything a current MP can do that a iMaci7 can't do as well or almost.

Like what was said a few times.... millesecond to a few seconds faster on most hings I'd do (record) just don't matter much.

My new recording rig will tax it but i bet for the most part it will ....just do!!.. very unlike my Mac Mini(equiv to a Macbook).

Waiting is such a drag.There's a reason everyone says this...get it NOW if you need(hell ...even WANT it NOW!!!

BP

 

[blinkin182]

I'd put $200 on it being the 20th this month. A store my friend works at emailed me this morning telling me that iMacs were officially constraint and the last 3 times this happened with products they were updated. Mac mini last month, MacBook, MacBook Pro etc.

He said this before Tuesday this week but they still were able to get some stock, now it's all signs pointing to the 20th.

I hope your friend is right...

About redesign or no redesign, I'd say I'd rather see a midsize model appear in the line up. 21.5 inch is good size, and the 27 inch is a beauty to behold, but almost too big for my desk. I'd be happy to see a 24 inch model appear or something similar. And hopefully they could still fit in a quad core processor in that size, although I've no idea if that is possible (with size/heat constraints).

The wait continues in any case!

 

[Bodhi395]

any chance of apple announcing new iMacs this Friday's conference of addressing iphones?

No chance... also, when was the last time Apple actually announced a new mac computer at a press conference? Seems like its been awhile, and they now seem to just let new macs come out with little fanfare at all.

 

[gonzo84]

A thought just crossed my mind. Apple probably knew they were holding a Press Conference yesterday or even earlier than that. Is it possible they posponed an iMac refresh so it would Not Be overshadowed by the anouncement of the Press Conference?

 

[blinkin182]

A thought just crossed my mind. Apple probably knew they were holding a Press Conference yesterday or even earlier than that. Is it possible they posponed an iMac refresh so it would Not Be overshadowed by the anouncement of the Press Conference?

Probably wishful thinking... but I'll go on wishing that too!

 

[gto55]

Wow, everyone wait until "maybe early 2011".

+1 Sandybridge platform is a true evolution for Intel, may be it's better to wait for it