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The new Mac mini is almost certainly coming

sublunar said:
I think one thing we recognise at the moment is the fact that if you were to spec up 16Gb RAM and 512Gb storage on the M2 MacBook Pro you're effectively in the hinterlands of the base M1 Pro 14" (binned version but still higher performing in most multicore workloads) MacBook Pro which is often discounted on third party retailers.

For the same reason I would say that reviewers will suggest that base models of the M2 MBA and MBP 13" are increasingly not worth upgrading because of the proximity to the base MBP 14.

Classic Apple upsell I guess.

For the same reason, you look at the M1 Max Studio 32Gb RAM, 512Gb SSD and consider that your price slot which would have to include an extra $400 for the upgrade from 16 to 32Gb RAM to make it like for like could see an upper SKU mini rise from $1099 to $1499 and then you add the (unknown) uplift from M1 to M1 Pro (which I have estimated at $200). This leaves you with an M1 Pro mini which is upgraded to $1699 to match the M1 Max Studio. The extra $300 gets you the M1 Mac CPU and a better cooling solution for sure and potentially more IO.

The standard M1 Pro Mini could start at $1299 (16Gb RAM, 512Gb SSD)
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That's what so great about a mid-end M2 Mac mini. It'd get the 24 GB option for an extra $200. But then I'd worry about the port situation. But if it were a mid-end model, I'd hope it'd get extra ports.

An M2 Pro Mac mini would be so much less attractive for so many people if they were forced to upgrade from 16 GB to 32 GB instead of to 24 GB.

At this performance and price point, a lot of people might want more than 16 GB but not necessarily 32 GB at a price 31% premium. 24 GB at a 15% price premium is much more palatable. That's evidence by the fact that so many MacRumors M2 MacBook Air customers are getting 24 GB RAM.
 
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EugW said:
That's what so great about a mid-end M2 Mac mini. It'd get the 24 GB option for an extra $200. But then I'd worry about the port situation. But if it were a mid-end model, I'd hope it'd get extra ports.

An M2 Pro Mac mini would be so much less attractive for so many people if they were forced to upgrade from 16 GB to 32 GB instead of to 24 GB.

At this performance and price point, a lot of people might want more than 16 GB but not necessarily 32 GB at a price 31% premium. 24 GB at a 15% price premium is much more palatable. That's evidence by the fact that so many MacRumors M2 MacBook Air customers are getting 24 GB RAM.
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Thing is, M2 wouldn't get any more ports than the M1.

And 24Gb RAM is an extra $400 over 8Gb on an M2 machine. A fictional M2 Mini with 24Gb RAM/256Gb storage might cost $1099, but then you'd have to upgrade the storage to 512Gb to escape the likely cost cut SSD speed with 256Gb sizes that has been so controversial with the M2 13" MacBook Pro.

If you then reach $1299 with M2 Mac mini 24Gb/512Gb storage scenario - you still have just 2 USB4 ports (thunderbolt 3). And if you're in the UK/Europe you're likely having a further price increase because the exchange rate has changed.

I think people might sign up more if the CPU was in fact an M1 Pro, even if there was a $200 uplift to take it on. If the $200 option was made available as an extra 8Gb of RAM how many more people would take an interest in souping up an M2 Mini rig over having just more outright multicore performance and better graphics?

With the M1 Pro 14" MacBook Pro available at roughly the same price as a 24/512 M2 MBP 13. Why wouldn't you then go with a 16/512 MacBook Pro 14 (M1 Pro) and have more IO (probably 3 Thunderbolt 4), better screen, webcam, and performance?
 
bearcatrp said:
Apple should just kill off the regular mini and use the studio mini as the new mini plus. Being larger, apple can add more stuff into it.
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If ya'll have need for the grunt of a Mac Studio, get thee one. If the 'umble Mac Mini provides ample sufficiency, rest assured the new Mac Mini is almost certainly coming.
 
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grouch said:
Absolutely not, one of the biggest reasons people enjoy the mac mini is the form factor.
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They should bring back a combination of ports like they were on the 2012/2014/2018 Mac mini:
  • 4 USB-C ports
  • 2 USB A ports,
  • an SD-Card reader,
  • an ethernet port and
  • audio jack.

Oh and maybe ad 2 USB A ports (or 1 USB A and 1 USB C) on front. The SD-Card reader could also be added on the front if not on the back.

It is doable, but Apple for different reasons wont do it...
 
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opeter said:
They should bring back a combination of ports like they were on the 2012/2014/2018 Mac mini:
  • 4 USB-C ports
  • 2 USB A ports,
  • an SD-Card reader,
  • an ethernet port and
  • audio jack.

Oh and maybe ad 2 USB A ports (or 1 USB A and 1 USB C) on front. The SD-Card reader could also be added on the front if not on the back.

It is doable, but Apple for different reasons wont do it...
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The limited bandwidth of the M1/M2 is the reason behind the relative lack of ports.

If you want the extra ports then the upper SKU Mac mini would need an M1 Pro cpu
 
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bearcatrp said:
Apple should just kill off the regular mini and use the studio mini as the new mini plus.
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For many of us the Studio is serious overkill on both specs and price, and the AS era Mini is a very good basic level machine with more than enough CPU & GPU grunt for our purposes. More ports and RAM, and price drops, are always welcome. But otherwise the regular Mini works nicely.
 
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EugW said:
Put on a separate controller for USB. Even 2 USB-C and 4 USB-A would be fine. They won’t do that but that would be good for a lot of people.
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I assume it wouldn't be in the budget for obvious reasons - not least for getting people to upgrade to the (in even shorter supply) Mac Studio. The exchange rate starting to go south and supply issues might be a reason for Apple holding off on updating the mini and iMac 24 for the moment.
 
Maximara said:
Perhaps it is early but you would have thought somebody else would have talked about the M2 going past the 100 degree mark but either google's algorithm is off or there isn't anyone else - which is weird.
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Icavedave did a video covering this and it turns out Mac tech was having the M2 doing things it wasn't designed for and when somebody else tried to duplicate this they couldn't (they got a much saner 48 degrees) so it seems to be something with that particular file codec combo.
 
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EugW said:
Maybe the best solution is just to offer an M2 Pro Mac mini with 24 GB option. That would be awesome. I don't see them doing that either though.
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An M2 Pro would implicitly mean a 32Gb option is on the table, and Apple wouldn't offer it before the 14" and 16" MacBook Pro got it, which is why I have mooted the possibility of an M1 Pro in the mini.

The 24Gb option in the M2 does suggest that Apple could use the full 10 core GPU variant of the M2 as a decent upper SKU mini, with anyone not liking only 2 USB4 ports or relative lack of threads pointed towards the Mac Studio.
 
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I (over)think there's a lot of overthinking going on. I'd suspect that surprisingly little of Apple's decisions of when to bring a product to market has to do with this sort of cross-product chess game, given the length of the lead time, and most of it has to do with R&D, logistics, and manufacturing capacity at scale.

Even Apple's capacity to shepherd parallel products to market isn't infinite. Maybe resources were diverted to the unleashing of the Studio and away from specifically an M1 Pro mini.
 
tubular said:
I (over)think there's a lot of overthinking going on. I'd suspect that surprisingly little of Apple's decisions of when to bring a product to market has to do with this sort of cross-product chess game, given the length of the lead time, and most of it has to do with R&D, logistics, and manufacturing capacity at scale.

Even Apple's capacity to shepherd parallel products to market isn't infinite. Maybe resources were diverted to the unleashing of the Studio and away from specifically an M1 Pro mini.
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Yes, it's possible that engineering resources were busy but you'd think that the iMac and perhaps even the Mini would need only a light touch if the form factor remains the same. The MacBook Pro update was so light touch it appears that even some of the boxes were re-used (with an M2 spec sticker over the top of the M1 by accounts from some Youtube Videos.

If there's a marketing/engineering reason for delaying an M2 Mac mini/iMac then a delay until October might be reasonable.

A delay until 2023 (missing the Xmas market) might suggest supply chain issues - we will see just how bad the queues for the M2 MBA/MBP look by September.

As for the form factor itself, the recent videos suggesting some SSD/CPU performance issues from the M2 MacBook Pro are somewhat concerning - the existing Mac mini power supply and cooling solution should be able to deal with it (if allowed) at the cost of potentially running the fans more than they are at the moment (very rare by accounts).

The fix would appear to be to only offer the Mac mini with at least 512Gb SSD storage (2x 256Gb NAND sticks), and unlock the fans and power draw so the CPU can run unthrottled.

The current M1 sells with 8/256 and 8/512 SKUs for up to $899, and Apple still sell a $1099 upper SKU Intel Mini.

An 8 core 10 GPU M2 Mini with 8Gb RAM and 512Gb SSD might retail for the same $899 so Apple would need to find something else to hit the $1099 price - the obvious thing to do there would be to offer it with 16Gb of RAM as standard - there would remain a 24Gb RAM option for an extra $200 of course.

Crucially, though, the UK price could end up being approx £1199 based on the new exchange rate used for the M2 MBP. A closer look shows that the UK price just went up by a straight £100 for each model - but BTO option prices haven't risen.

If Apple did that to the top SKU iMac they could just add M2 and bump the price by £100 in the UK too.

But for the mini, a UK price with imaginary 32Gb of RAM (and 512Gb storage) would see people paying £1599 which is already very close to the £1799 (£1999 retail) which you can pick up a refurb Mac Studio for.
 
staypuftforums said:
You can buy a USB hub for way less than $200.
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As I mentioned in this thread elsewhere (and I know this is a very long thread), USB hubs are often problematic. Things that work on native ports consistently don't always behave the same way through various hubs. I'd rather pay $200 for integrated ports than $100 on a hub.
 
Maybe I am kicking in open doors with this one but I have a hard time seeing that the MacMini would get much expansion options such as much larger memory or more ports than what's offered now, sadly.

I would like it to get this but I am thinking that with the introduction of Mac Studio, Apple will point all these needs towards the Studio.

The Mini will essentially become the Air of the desktop,
The Studio the Pro and
Mac Pro on top.

Need more ports or more memory than our basic entry level model? Up sell to Studio.
It's probably overkill for most people but the overlap would be to big otherwise.
But who knows, perhaps overlapping offerings will become the future of Apple, the Macbool Pro M2 and Macbook Air perhaps is the sign of this.
 
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EugW said:
As I mentioned in this thread elsewhere (and I know this is a very long thread), USB hubs are often problematic. Things that work on native ports consistently don't always behave the same way through various hubs. I'd rather pay $200 for integrated ports than $100 on a hub.
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$200 gets you most of the way towards a thunderbolt dock. I have one waiting to be up cycled for a mini which is why I’m relatively relaxed about connectivity.

I don’t have anything specific that requires a direct connected USB but I have heard of peripherals that prefer it. I guess it might have something to do with specific cheap hubs.
 
I have the Dell U2720Q connected to the M1 mini via a short USB-C cable and it works perfectly for the display and with the port hub. I also use the port hub on a U2718Q and that works really well too. I would love to get a Dell U2723Q which has two more USB ports than the U2720Q and also has Ethernet. But I can't justify it at this time.
 
Micky Do said:
If ya'll have need for the grunt of a Mac Studio, get thee one. If the 'umble Mac Mini provides ample sufficiency, rest assured the new Mac Mini is almost certainly coming.
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For me the reality is somewhere in between. Mac Studio is overkill and Mac Mini under. In Finland the Mac Studio costs as much as a MBP 14" base model so it doesn't seem like a sensible purchase. A M2 Pro Mac Mini with 16 GB RAM and a fast SSD somewhere around 1500-1700 euros? Sold.

I'd also like to see HDMI 2.1 on them but unfortunately fully expect that we won't see that until M3.
 
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sublunar said:
$200 gets you most of the way towards a thunderbolt dock. I have one waiting to be up cycled for a mini which is why I’m relatively relaxed about connectivity.

I don’t have anything specific that requires a direct connected USB but I have heard of peripherals that prefer it. I guess it might have something to do with specific cheap hubs.
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Even a Thunderbolt dock will sometimes have compatibility problems, just because they're never OEM Apple. And as you implied, they are quite expensive. Plus they are generally enormous, almost defeating the point of the sleek Mac mini.

To put it simply, I just want a direct Apple Silicon replacement of the Intel Mac mini in terms of ports available. A non-port-starved Mac mini model already exists and it in fact looks otherwise identical to the M1 Mac mini, so it's not as if we're asking Apple to re-invent the wheel. If it requires a M2 Pro and a delayed released date into 2023, then so be it.

However, if Apple were to release such an M2 Pro Mac mini with only 16 GB and 32 GB memory options, I'd buy the 16 GB version. 32 GB is massive overkill for me, and would be too expensive. (See below.) OTOH, if somehow Apple shoehorned extra ports into an M2 Mac mini (with shared USB bandwidth) with 16 and 24 GB RAM options, I'd consider the 24 GB model, just because. M2 Pro with 16 GB and 24 GB options would also be great, and there are no technical reasons to prevent this from being released.

The Intel model still available for sale right now is as follows:

Core i5
16 GB RAM
512 GB SSD
Gigabit Ethernet
$1299

Core i5
32 GB RAM
512 GB SSD
Gigabit Ethernet
$1699
 
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