The next MacBook Pro redesign (merged)

[6749974]

Sounds good to me SA.

All I ever wanted was a retina screen in my 2011 air anyway lol.

Exactly. A Pro in an Air form and feel will have insane demand. Insane.
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@SAdProZ Just wondering your opinion on the alleged leaked photos of the bottom chassis of the new 13" rMBP and there being exclusively USB-C/TB3 ports, albeit 4 of them? No MagSafe. Assuming they are legitimate, do you still think the 15" will retain its current port configuration, or something similar?

Haven't seen those photos. Do you have a link? (I will Google)

If I had to guess, having 4 USB-C doesn't make sense given were still in transition to USB-C cables. But I'll wait to see the photos.

Edit: saw photos. Thought about what 4 USB-C means. I'm for it. Would pressure and drive adoption with peripheral manufacturers. And to buy a USB-3 to USB-C adaptor is cheap, what, $10? One would permanently live on my external HD and in the future all would be USB-C, so having four ports vs the only 2 USB-3 means we're getting more.

 

[HellasLEAF]

I hate the removal of magsafe personally. I love magsafe. That's a real bummer if true.

Couldn't care less about going exclusively to USB-C though. Again, this is happening whether we like it or not. It allows for them to make lighter and slimmer laptops. Another thing I like. The groaning over the use of an extension for periphs about the dumbest thing I read on these boards. Again, the idea behind a laptop is portability. That means you will need the odd cable to do the odd thing. So that cable is connected to another cable. Wow. Literally makes no difference to me personally.

If that is such an issue, than by all means stick with current or older rMBP which are still fantastic machines (I own one, I should know)!

 

[monstruo]

Most of us properly can learn to live with the changes (usb, hdmi, DP adaptors, magsafe, etc.).
The only thing I'm definitely not looking forward is the removal of the physical function keys.

I'm sure there are many people who use the F-keys for their applications shortcuts, etc.
Definitely going to be a daunting learning curve.

 

[eviljack]

I will probably be jumping ship back to Windows as my primary OS if any of these changes turn out to be true. I don't want to deal with USB-C dongles and adapters when none of the mice, keyboards, headsets and external drives I have use that connector. Just more weight to carry, lose and break.

The whole touch bar is probably going to end up like the whole Lenovo Carbon one which was terrible to say the least, plus I like the function keys. When touch typing I can adjust the volume and brightness as I see fit without looking down. Never mind the fact the keyboard will have no travel.

This is probably a good sign as I've been eying a 17 inch laptop as it is anyway.

 

[SuprUsrStan]

I will probably be jumping ship back to Windows as my primary OS if any of these changes turn out to be true. I don't want to deal with USB-C dongles and adapters when none of the mice, keyboards, headsets and external drives I have use that connector. Just more weight to carry, lose and break.

I don't see them going exclusively to USB-C. Just like how they currently have two Thunderbolt ports on the MBP, they'll probably remove the current thunderbolt ports and replacement them with USB-C thunderbolt 3.0. So you'll end up with 2 USB-C TB 3.0 ports and 3 USB-A 3.1 ports.

Best of both worlds!

Just grab some Thunderbolt 3.0 to 2.0 cables if TB compatibility is a concern.

 

[6749974]

I'm sure there are many people who use the F-keys for their applications shortcuts, etc.

You might be right, but a point has been made by others that is hard to argue:

Using FN keys is generational, and the millennial generation and younger do not use the FN key habitually, if at all. This is the iPad and iPhone generation now. So a screen that changes button contexts much like an iPhone UI is no fixed set of buttons, but if in fact fluid, is a benefit that could possibly be brought to a laptop.

(Are FN keys born in the Pre-GUI BIOS days?)

I'm excited to see if it's truly functional or will feel gimmicky.

Personally, I rarely use that button row (except for volume) because I've assigned Expose actions to hot corners. Being able to control that row with custom button actions excites me. Imagine the Final Cut X and Logic Pro X shortcuts, and so on.
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I don't see them going exclusively to USB-C. Just like how they currently have two Thunderbolt ports on the MBP, they'll probably remove the current thunderbolt ports and replacement them with USB-C thunderbolt 3.0. So you'll end up with 2 USB-C TB 3.0 ports and 3 USB-A 3.1 ports.

Best of both worlds!

Just grab some Thunderbolt 3.0 to 2.0 cables if TB compatibility is a concern.

I agree. Your thinking makes sense for transition sake.

The thing is Apple likes to fab a laptop design and not change it for 3-5 years. I think the current retina design is from 2012, right? It hasn't changed yet.

So if Apple envisions a USB-C world, they may pull the band aid off with the quickness.

We may say Ow! But the pain will be quick.

 

[eviljack]

Just grab some Thunderbolt 3.0 to 2.0 cables if TB compatibility is a concern.

Lets hope you are right about the USB ports but somehow I'm not liking my chances. As for Thunderbolt it's pretty much DOA for me. I only use it for ethernet and a third monitor when at my desk. No point in buying a dock as they are all expensive for what you get.

My main gripe with the Macbook Pro's is the performance and lack of upgradeability. To be honest I could live with the changes (keyboard, touch bar, USB) for the sake of change but I can't live with the lack of performance that even the top of the range models have. Being stuck with a mid range GPU and 16Gb of RAM is driving me nuts.

 

[Roller]

Using FN keys is generational, and the millennial generation and younger do not use the FN key habitually, if at all. This is the iPad and iPhone generation now. So a screen that changes button contexts much like an iPhone UI is no fixed set of buttons, but if ok fact fluid, is a benefit that could possibly be brought to a laptop.

(Are FN keys born in the Pre-GUI BIOS days?)

I'm excited to see if it's truly functional or will feel gimmicky.

Personally, I rarely use that button row (except for volume) because I've assigned Expose actions to hot corners. Being able to control that row with custom button actions excites me. Imagine the Final Cut X and Logic Pro X shortcuts, and so on.

I use the function keys on my Apple keyboards frequently. Some actions, like Expose, can be initiated by hot corners as you say, but it's very convenient to do other things (setting brightness and volume) from the keyboard. I'm also interested to see how Apple implements programmable shortcuts with virtual OLED keys. Done well it could be good, so I'm reserving judgment.

 

[mayuka]

I hate the removal of magsafe personally. I love magsafe. That's a real bummer if true.

The truth is that Apple sees their customers using their notebooks on battery all the time because a single charge is supposed to last a whole working day. As a result, you do not need a Magsafe anymore. While this is more or less true for light workloads, in reality for most pro users it is not. But it's their current philosophy and they are constantly pushing their customers towards accepting the philosophy. It does make sense from their side and also from a certain technical side (current Li-ion have to "work", that is charged and uncharged on a constant basis).

Just look a few years back to the first rMBP. The same thing is repeating itself. People complained a lot, after one year most of them settled down. I will miss Magsafe, though.

But don't worry, while the classic MBP will vanish, the current rMBP will be kept in store for 1-2 years.

 

[MyopicPaideia]

I don't see them going exclusively to USB-C. Just like how they currently have two Thunderbolt ports on the MBP, they'll probably remove the current thunderbolt ports and replacement them with USB-C thunderbolt 3.0. So you'll end up with 2 USB-C TB 3.0 ports and 3 USB-A 3.1 ports.

Best of both worlds!

Just grab some Thunderbolt 3.0 to 2.0 cables if TB compatibility is a concern.

You've seen the leaked photos right? Pretty certain they are legitimate. Apple is going all in like they have done in the past. Like I said before, if they are trying to champion a new standard, the very last thing they are going to do is give people a cop out not to adopt it. If there are multiple USB-C ports, which all evidence points to, there will be zero legacy ports, with the exception of the headphone jack.

 

[MDull]

People who think "actual laptop work" is editing photos or video is worst people.

Well it's more like actual work than many other things. Were you thinking more like Facebook.

 

[Aquamite]

Well it's more like actual work than many other things. Were you thinking more like Facebook.

No. I was thinking more like CAD, computing calculations for rendering atomic molecules, or 3D models out of the processing of a bunch of images, training algorithms for machine learning for recognizing patterns, computer vision or many other things some of us do instead of being an ******* who thinks that because of they edit their unboxing, wedding and MTB videos in 4K they are cutting edge of computing and the rest of people who demand a dGPU want it only for posting "lol" on Facebook.

 

[jerryk]

I can't wait for the systems to be all USB C with TB-3/USB3.1. It will be nice to see peripheral manufactures move over to USB C/TB-3. Then TB can finally become mainstream and the ability to daisy chain devices common. Need a more external storage? Just plug a new storage module into the last one. Need a second external monitor? Plug it in to the other one.

Good of Apple, Dell, and HP to drag us forward by only doing USB C with Thunderbolt.

 

[6749974]

Like I said before, if they are trying to champion a new standard, the very last thing they are going to do is give people a cop out not to adopt it. If there are multiple USB-C ports, which all evidence points to, there will be zero legacy ports, with the exception of the headphone jack.

Well said. I support this thinking on the grounds that Apple supposedly lead the USB Implementors Forum* on USB-C to simplify everyone's needs and its complexity and form no longer be a constraint.

It's been closing on 2 years since published.

Everybody in that forum wants a USB-C world, and I think (other than initial adapter annoyance) consumers would too. It's time. Bring on the adapters!

*It was formed in 1995 by the group of companies that developed USB. Notable members include Apple Inc., Hewlett-Packard, NEC, Microsoft, Intel, and Agere Systems.

Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_Implementers_Forum​

 

[MDull]

It's you that is out of the norm, not Apple and the other manufacturers. Apple's laptops, at least, already have 'good enough' battery life for the vast majority of use cases. 8-10 hours means the average person can be away from their desk all day and not need to charge. Going from 8 to 16 hours of battery life isn't going to materially change how the device is used by those people. Volume and weight matter a lot though, and the difference between a device like the current 13" MBP and a MacBook Air or the rMB is huge in how it is carried daily. If you don't notice that I'm going to go out on a (very short) limb and guess you are a guy who carries around a pretty bulky bag most of the time, so you don't care. But for many people, having a device that is about 2lbs and thinner than a single subject paper notebook fundamentally changes how they carry the device. Women can tuck them in their normal purse and barely notice it, meaning they can carry it everywhere without having to think about it or carry another bag. It can be used in the small footprint of a table on an airplane or on a train. These are differences that people will appreciate every time they use the device, which is why Apple is looking to make all of their devices as thin and light as possible.

I'm with Lamppost- you on the other hand are from MBA or MB camp and apparently that is all you need or you wouldn't be saying what you said. You can do spread sheets all day on a MB without recharging so if that's all your doing (office work) you don't even need a MBP. And if you carry a purse and want to stick your comp in it you are not any kind of a power user and again I say just get a MB.
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Whether something has 10-hours vs 11-hours doesn't matter to 99% of people because there is a hump you have to get over, probably 24-hours battery, before someone DOESN'T need to charge their laptop overnight. Until then, I think a focus on consumer facing benefits such as portability and the emotional aspect (loving your device!) is the right move. Isn't that why we're on the forum? We love our macs? I never loved my Dell.
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Exactly. Apple is aware of the consequences. For the other poster to keep saying "inconsequential" is not respectful of all the employees and the overall design of the product that balances all the consequences to create a product we don't just find some utility in, we love.

You and Dave are on the wrong thread this is for MBPs emphasis on the P not MB or MBA
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You might be right, but a point has been made by others that is hard to argue:

Using FN keys is generational, and the millennial generation and younger do not use the FN key habitually, if at all. This is the iPad and iPhone generation now. So a screen that changes button contexts much like an iPhone UI is no fixed set of buttons, but if in fact fluid, is a benefit that could possibly be brought to a laptop.

(Are FN keys born in the Pre-GUI BIOS days?)

I'm excited to see if it's truly functional or will feel gimmicky.

Personally, I rarely use that button row (except for volume) because I've assigned Expose actions to hot corners. Being able to control that row with custom button actions excites me. Imagine the Final Cut X and Logic Pro X shortcuts, and so on.
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I agree. Your thinking makes sense for transition sake.

The thing is Apple likes to fab a laptop design and not change it for 3-5 years. I think the current retina design is from 2012, right? It hasn't changed yet.

So if Apple envisions a USB-C world, they may pull the band aid off with the quickness.

We may say Ow! But the pain will be quick.

Yea and since you brought up millennials and and touch screens, this is exactly why they are all staring at there phones when they are driving, and walking or doing anything else. Recently saw a show on TV where they were starting to sue if they run into something while walking and staring at their phones.

 

[6749974]

You and Dave are on the wrong thread this is for MBPs emphasis on the P not MB or MBA

Oh! You got me! Naw, I've bought and owned 15" MacBook Pro's since 2005 amigo. Bow before my opinions for they are from the heavens.
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Recently saw a show on TV where they were starting to sue if they run into something while walking and staring at their phones.

Wait, but how else are they supposed to draw an income?! In this economy?

 

[6749974]

Someone posted a mockup of the new keyboard design with touch-screen at the top:

Left: Mockup

 

[MyopicPaideia]

@MDull, what do you use your MBP for, if that is okay to ask? What apps are typically part of your simultaneous load? What year and model MBP are you currently using? How many hours of battery do you typically get out of it? Where do you conduct your work that you currently need to be away from a stationary charge longer than this?

It's all well and good to be able to generalize, belittle, and dismiss other's use cases for the sake of championing one's own views, but it doesn't further the discussion one bit if you don't bring your own to the table.

There does appear to be two general use cases for Apple's laptops, and Apple makes models that cater to both of these, although more and more of the models they sell are moving towards zeroing in on one use case over the other.

Currently, there only seems to be one model, the 15" rMBP, that seeks to serve the "mobile desktop workstation" use case, i.e. a laptop that generally is stationary, and powerful enough to replace a desktop workstation in all respects, but can also be mobile in a pinch.

Every other laptop in Apple's line-up is geared towards truly convenient mobility, in every sense. They got rid of the 17" MBP completely, they are focusing on providing the same computing experience in smaller and lighter form factors (12" rMB with a smaller footprint than the 11" MBA and lighter as well, for example).

If you could have your 15" dGPU rMBP that provided 8-10 hours of battery life under your use case's continuous load, would your opinion change at all?

 

[nj-morris]

Someone posted a mockup of the new keyboard design with touch-screen at the top:

Left: Mockup

Blown away by the extreme neatness.

 

[SuprUsrStan]

You've seen the leaked photos right? Pretty certain they are legitimate. Apple is going all in like they have done in the past. Like I said before, if they are trying to champion a new standard, the very last thing they are going to do is give people a cop out not to adopt it. If there are multiple USB-C ports, which all evidence points to, there will be zero legacy ports, with the exception of the headphone jack.

What "leaked" photos are you talking about? I'm not aware of any actual leaked photos indicating 100% thunderbolt or USB-C connections on the 15" Macbook Pros.

You must be talking about the 13" MBP.

EDIT: Also, the case appears to be still in manufacturing. There are no SD card slots or USB-A slots and the USB-C seems to be offset. In the top image, you've got the headphone jack but in the bottom image, why wouldn't the USB-C jacks further to the left? It looks unfinished and there's a big gap where the original Magsafe would have been. There's still a chance the'll have a couple USB-A.

It looks like they've got the Thunderbolt 3.0 ports cut but not the others yet.

 

[MyopicPaideia]

What "leaked" photos are you talking about? I'm not aware of any actual leaked photos indicating 100% thunderbolt or USB-C connections on the 15" Macbook Pros.

You must be talking about the 13" MBP.

EDIT: Also, the case appears to be still in manufacturing. There are no SD card slots or USB-A slots and the USB-C seems to be offset. In the top image, you've got the headphone jack but in the bottom image, why wouldn't the USB-C jacks further to the left? It looks unfinished and there's a big gap where the original Magsafe would have been. There's still a chance the'll have a couple USB-A.

It looks like they've got the Thunderbolt 3.0 ports cut but not the others yet.

First of all, my bad, I totally missed that you guys were referring specifically to the 15" rMBP, apologies!

You raise some interesting discussion points, though, and thanks for taking the time to post pictures as well.

My thoughts are that the motherboard is most likely going to be shrunk down dramatically, taking a que from the rMB (Not that hard core, but dramatic in comparison to the current models). The space is probably going to be filled up as much as possible by battery and redesigned cooling systems.

Also, as has been noted already by others, the chassis itself appears to be the same thickness as the rMB at its thickest point. You'll note that there is barely a hair's breadth of room for the 3.5mm headphone jack. The only other port it seems like they could fit there besides USB-C/TB3 would be Lightning or SDXC, and to put it one way, there's as much chance of Lightning being there as SDXC...i.e. none at all.

Finally, I'm not completely up to speed on the current process, but are not these unibody chassis molded/pressed/cut in a one step process? I think it is safe to say that is a finished part. Now whether or not it is the final production version of the part is definitely debatable.

 

[SuprUsrStan]

Indeed it seems the new case seems to be almost the exact same height as the 3.5mm headphone jack. That would make the USB-A a little too big and maybe even an HDMI jack too big. I'm still leaning towards it's unfinished or a prototype case because that gap on the left just seems way too big. I was under the impression that the unibody case was CNC milled from a block of aluminum and then anodized. Indeed, it could be a situation that it is just unfinished.

 

[mafaky]

I would much prefer the MagSafe to be retained (on the left), although this might necessitate maybe 1.5mm additional thickness to the sample/prototype case shown above. A single USB-C port should remain on the left and those who may need additional ports can get an external USB-C port adapter (same or similar to Hypershop's one on the sale for the 12 rMB). The 3.5 mm earphone jack (and the mike inputs) seem to be carried to the right side. Two more USB-C ports should be adequate at that side. Note that if you attempt to use that Hypershop's USB-C adapter port, it will obliterate one of the USB-C ports...

 

[zhenya]

What "leaked" photos are you talking about? I'm not aware of any actual leaked photos indicating 100% thunderbolt or USB-C connections on the 15" Macbook Pros.

You must be talking about the 13" MBP.

EDIT: Also, the case appears to be still in manufacturing. There are no SD card slots or USB-A slots and the USB-C seems to be offset. In the top image, you've got the headphone jack but in the bottom image, why wouldn't the USB-C jacks further to the left? It looks unfinished and there's a big gap where the original Magsafe would have been. There's still a chance the'll have a couple USB-A.

It looks like they've got the Thunderbolt 3.0 ports cut but not the others yet.

Highly unlikely that they'd go through the trouble of machining some of the ports but not all of them.

Much more likely is that the ports are offset because that's what required after positioning the Alpine Ridge controller board. There is virtually no flexibility in moving the ports any distance away from the card.

 

[VHY]

I think the Macbook Pro 15 inch will get the same ports as the MPB 13 inch. The current MBP's don't differ in that aspect, so why would Apple suddenly take a different approach on that aspect. Personally, I don't see what all the fuss is about. USB-C is new, but there are plenty of cheap adapters on the market that will overcome these temporary limits. I'd rather have a nice future-proof MBP instead of an old fashioned one that gets easily outdated in the next two years.

I'm only disappointed in the fact that the new MBP won't have a (new) Magsafe, but it's not like a deal breaker for me. With my current MBA it didn't occur that much (like only two times in four years) that someone stumbled over the cable. Oh well, we'll see I guess. I hope Apple will reveal the MBP 2016 on WWDC... I really want/need a new Macbook!