iPad There's no reason to buy an iPad anymore

[fuchsdh]

In my opinion, the 10th generation iPad is a product without a clear customer.

It is not because the product is technically bad. It is because the product is confused on who it serves.

The detachable keyboard and kickstand is really targeting the education market. In my opinion, largely the primary and secondary segments of the education market (PreK-12). Logitech sells many keyboard+case solutions like this new accessory to schools and parents. This tends to be a price conscious customer. Schools need the most units for the money spent. Parents usually have little interest in making up-market purchases for a user likely to break the product somehow anyway. The device is too expensive. The keyboard is too expensive.

What is the point of this product?

Apple doesn't care about selling the cheapest accessories and covering all markets, they care about making money off the products they do sell. Logitech has its crayon and they'll have their cheaper case and schools will buy that up; I don't think Apple will care because they will still make money on the fewer cases they sell and the base iPads themselves.

I agree at the current price the iPad lineup is a bit muddled, but it's frankly been that way for years with the staggered product refreshes and the existence of the Air and mini. It hasn't been a simple coherent lineup for arguably the biggest chunk of its existence at this point.

 

[turbineseaplane]

It doesn’t really matter what Apple does, how convoluted and confused their product lineups get or how egregious their gouging gets..

There will always be people defending them and/or “explaining their reasoning”

It’s amazing

 

[rgwebb]

Apple doesn't care about selling the cheapest accessories and covering all markets, they care about making money off the products they do sell. Logitech has its crayon and they'll have their cheaper case and schools will buy that up; I don't think Apple will care because they will still make money on the fewer cases they sell and the base iPads themselves.

I agree at the current price the iPad lineup is a bit muddled, but it's frankly been that way for years with the staggered product refreshes and the existence of the Air and mini. It hasn't been a simple coherent lineup for arguably the biggest chunk of its existence at this point.

Right but I think that the type of buyer who wants what this product is offering as differentiation wants the 299/329 device price point on the 9th gen and the 160 dollar keyboard (Logitech Combo Touch). Furthermore, the combo touch is a bulkier, more protective case. Apple has been pursuing this market. They already have an offering that is HIGHLY competitive in the space. Remember the 9th gen iPad was 299/329 BEFORE the press release this week.

The 10th generation iPad is in a dead spot in the market in my opinion. The iPad Air is a better buy for almost everyone considering the 10th gen iPad.

 

[fuchsdh]

Right but I think that the type of buyer who wants what this product is offering as differentiation wants the 299/329 device price point on the 9th gen and the 160 dollar keyboard (Logitech Combo Touch). Furthermore, the combo touch is a bulkier, more protective case. Apple has been pursuing this market. They already have an offering that is HIGHLY competitive in the space. Remember the 9th gen iPad was 299/329 BEFORE the press release this week.

The 10th generation iPad is in a dead spot in the market in my opinion. The iPad Air is a better buy for almost everyone considering the 10th gen iPad.

Again, you could say that for the MacBook Air or many of Apple's other products, but it ignores price. There are people who absolutely will buy this just because it's $100 cheaper than the Air, just as there are people who will buy the $329 iPad because it's the cheapest model. These people aren't sweating the tiny details of specs. Apple didn't get to where it was by not understanding its customers.

 

[rgwebb]

Again, you could say that for the MacBook Air or many of Apple's other products, but it ignores price. There are people who absolutely will buy this just because it's $100 cheaper than the Air, just as there are people who will buy the $329 iPad because it's the cheapest model. These people aren't sweating the tiny details of specs. Apple didn't get to where it was by not understanding its customers.

Sure, but I don't think the market is big for this one. I don't think this product release has anything to do with market research, this is just being forced out to market to garner some ROI on R&D effort given despite inflationary trends making it impossible to replace the 9th gen at the same price point.

Essentially the same thing that happened with the M2 MBA. They didn't want to release that at 1199 but here we are...it sorta undercuts the MBA value proposition.

 

[Lioness~]

Yes, no reason at all to buy an iPad, yet I got my new iPad Mini today 😁
Even smaller than last one, with thinner bezels.
If I had liked big phones, I wouldn’t need an iPad, maybe. But I don't. I like smallest possible iPhone.

But I certainly do agree to a point, I don't have any important use for an iPad. My Macs are of much more value to me.
But you don't bring a Mac with you in a pocket if you're going somewhere. Bigger iPads I have no interest in either. So the iPad Mini is like an in between device that has its use for me.

 

[usagora]

It doesn’t really matter what Apple does, how convoluted and confused their product lineups get or how egregious their gouging gets..

There will always be people defending them and/or “explaining their reasoning”

It’s amazing

Or maybe many of us aren't confused by their product lineup and understand that sometimes prices go up. And for the record, "I don't think it's worth that price" does not mean Apple is participating in "gouging" 🙄 Gouging is when businesses jack up prices to take advantage of high demand with things that will actually hurt people not to have, such as food, water, shelter, travel fare, medicine, etc.

Look, there's not a single person here that wouldn't rather all Apple's products be cheaper (along with everything else in the world). But that doesn't mean Apple is in the wrong for not making them cheaper. They price their products (as best they can) to match the current market conditions in order to maximize their profit. They're a for-profit business, not a charity. So that's why people like I will defend not only Apple, but any other company for pricing their products the way they see fit. If they thought they'd make more money by pricing them lower, they would have.

 

[GMShadow]

It doesn’t really matter what Apple does, how convoluted and confused their product lineups get or how egregious their gouging gets..

There will always be people defending them and/or “explaining their reasoning”

It’s amazing

It doesn't matter what Apple does, there will always be people outraged about something that doesn't justify the outrage.

 

[okkibs]

The issue with suggesting a Macbook or an Android tablet as a better replacement is that some people rely on iPadOS, or the touch screen, or the pencil or other features you can only get with the more expensive iPads. There simply is no usable substitute for an iPad with a laminated display if you want to draw with the Apple Pencil. So the iPad Airs and Pros will keep selling very well when used for this purpose.

Many people buying iPads already own a laptop and a smartphone and simply want that third device - for consuming content on the couch or bringing it on your next flight the new base model iPad is still cheaper than any Macbook.

Also I am never buying a Samsung product with Android ever again, my experience with their phones and their UI and early support end was bad enough. I still prefer the iPad even with its limited iPadOS over Android tablets because there just aren't any really good ones. I might be interested in the upcoming Pixel tablet, but then I'd rather go directly to a full desktop OS on a tablet and get a Surface tablet instead. That's also 10x better than "DeX mode"...

 

[Sheepish-Lord]

Would be nice to stop giving these “cheaper” iPads a pass under the guise of education. The iPad 9th gen still exists so this 10th gen won’t find its way into schools for sometime if at all. Additionally, do people genuinely think EVERY school in the US let alone the world uses iPads and if so for how long? A school where children use iPads is a privileged school and probably makes up a tiny fraction of Apple’s user base. Stop justifying terrible design choices and prices around an edu mentality. No school board was waiting for this announcement to refresh their lineup. iPad 10th gen is a bad product for everyone and now it’s locked into its own hardware system with dongles and folios.

 

[Isamilis]

If no reason to buy, probably few better reasons to subscribe device rental plan.

 

[lordhamster]

The issue with suggesting a Macbook or an Android tablet as a better replacement is that some people rely on iPadOS, or the touch screen, or the pencil or other features you can only get with the more expensive iPads. There simply is no usable substitute for an iPad with a laminated display if you want to draw with the Apple Pencil. So the iPad Airs and Pros will keep selling very well when used for this purpose.

Many people buying iPads already own a laptop and a smartphone and simply want that third device - for consuming content on the couch or bringing it on your next flight the new base model iPad is still cheaper than any Macbook.

Also I am never buying a Samsung product with Android ever again, my experience with their phones and their UI and early support end was bad enough. I still prefer the iPad even with its limited iPadOS over Android tablets because there just aren't any really good ones. I might be interested in the upcoming Pixel tablet, but then I'd rather go directly to a full desktop OS on a tablet and get a Surface tablet instead. That's also 10x better than "DeX mode"...

I've never used an Android tablet, though I must say the Samsung Tab8 Ultra looks nice. However, like you I've sworn off Samsung Devices. If I ever go back to Android (I used to switch back and forth often) it will be to a Pixel due to timely software updates.

On Samsungs:

• They finally extended software support, albeit still not as long as apple devices
• When they do roll out updates, it is at a snail's pace. When a new version of Android comes out... it takes AGES before it hits samsung devices.
• Samsung phones are riddled with bloatware much of which can't be removed without jumping through hoops. Half the apps are crappy knockoffs of Google's much better versions. The other half are sponsored content, which i don't want if I'm paying for a premium device.
• Samsung allows their devices to be crippled by carriers. For example the inability for many US Samsung phones to dual-sim because reasons, even though the hardware is capable.

I will say...having just had to sign a bunch of documents for a financial transaction, I do love the built-in s-pen concept.

 

[robbietop]

So today the 10th gen vanilla iPad was revealed, killing the headphone jack once and for all in the iPad lineup (which still makes no sense) but also FINALLY bringing USB-C to the vanilla iPad! 🥳

Additionally, the vanilla iPad finally gets a Magic Keyboard of it's own, and it no longer has the home button. It's glorious...well it would be if it wasn't for two factors: Price, AND IT'S STILL USING THE 1ST GEN APPLE PENCIL

$449 for 64 gbs. The 9th Gen iPad is 256 gb for only $20 more. Or hell the Galaxy S6 Lite gets you 128gb for $329, AND THAT COMES WITH A STYLUS.

But hey, it has it's own Magic Keyboard now...for $250. So to that, I'd like to do a little comparison. A 10th Gen iPad with 256 gb and a Magic Keyboard, is $850.

View attachment 2097164

Well that's fine and dandy...but there's another thing that is the same price as that with better specs: The M1 Macbook Air


View attachment 2097165

For the price of a 256 gb vanilla iPad and the keyboard, you can just get a much better Macbook Air, and not just refurbished, as Amazon is selling brand new M1 Macbook Airs for $800 now. I've said this regarding the M1 iPad Air/Pro that you're better off just getting an M1 Macbook Air instead of this, and now this also applies with the vanilla iPad.

Hell I can't even recommend the 9th gen iPad anymore, as the Galaxy S6 Lite is the same price as it and it has more storage than base spec iPad at the same price, and it comes with a stylus, as well as having a desktop mode with DeX mode. Not to mention not being bogged down by iPadOS and having features it doesn't, like being able to install software without an app store, AND ACTUALLY HAVING MULTIPLE USER ACCOUNTS ON THE SAME DEVICE WHY DO WE NOT HAVE THIS C'MON.

So with today's update, there's no reason at all to buy an iPad anymore. The S6 Lite is just a better tablet on the value proposition and featureset, and if you need to go higher just get a Macbook. And I'm not alone in this sentiment as the Mac has been outselling the iPad lineup for two years now since the Apple Silicon transition happened.

God...this makes me sad as the iPad used to be my favorite Apple thing since the iPad 2. Now, the Mac's my new fave, as my Macbook Pro has pretty much taken over all of my iPad's previous functions. Steve Jobs is rolling in his grave at what his most important creation has become.

I will continue saying this until y'all get a lick of sense: THE IPAD IS NOT A LAPTOP. IF YOU WANT A LAPTOP, BUY A LAPTOP.


Also, headphone jack being gone seems to only bother people buying wired headsets. The rest of us got wireless years ago.

Lastly, the only people still in love with the Home Button are troglodytes who harbor some sort of Old Man syndrome where TECHNOLOGY SHOULD NOT CHANGE WE SHOULD STILL BE USING THE LPT PORT!

 

[sparksd]

I will continue saying this until y'all get a lick of sense: THE IPAD IS NOT A LAPTOP. IF YOU WANT A LAPTOP, BUY A LAPTOP.


Also, headphone jack being gone seems to only bother people buying wired headsets. The rest of us got wireless years ago.

Lastly, the only people still in love with the Home Button are troglodytes who harbor some sort of Old Man syndrome where TECHNOLOGY SHOULD NOT CHANGE WE SHOULD STILL BE USING THE LPT PORT!

Hard to make a point by insulting people.

 

[robbietop]

Hard to make a point by insulting people.

I tried the simple route of being nice and the only response I ever got was "You just don't understand! I need Stage Manager because I wanted an iPad but I also just plug it into a monitor. I know I could have bought a Mac mini, Mac Studio, MacBook Air, or MacBook Pro, but I am difficult and complicated and that makes me unique. I apparently can't handle a basic Bitmap iPad Home Screen and need something extremely over engineered and complicated that resembles the laptop I should have bought but isn't as good, has a bad filing app that should probably be worked on, and can't do any Pro apps like the laptop I probably should have just bought in the first place and costs the same amount of money at this point but I like to be complicated, difficult, and obnoxious and go against what is effectively the more logical choice."

But no, please focus on the annoyance and frustration of having to wait for years for Apple to bring Pro apps to the iPad and fixing iCloud Drive but having to wait for them to first bring THE WEATHER APP we sorely needed and a CALCULATOR that apparently some people are too lazy to find in the App Store.

I have had to wait since the iPad Pro 10.5 that Brought Files app to the world for a better iCloud Drive experience where my 2 GB video file I watched on my iPad last night has now decided to auto-download to my MacBook Pro without my consent. But no, that can't be fixed right now. A small slice of very loud, annoying and vocal iPad users who obviously bought a tablet by mistake and not a laptop demanded a 1980s Desktop UX on a tablet. So, we get Stage Manager, which sucks and doesn't solve the multitasking issue on the iPad but shuts up and distracts the very vocal people who mistakenly bought a tablet.

So, now, Apple will just take their middling criticisms and SLIGHTLY update Stage Manager every year to keep them distracted and focused away from their poor product choice decisions so that Apple can focus on more important things like iCloud Drive users fleeing to OneDrive, Pro Users becoming fed up with NOT A SINGLE Pro app on a product labeled Pro, and a Silicon strategy that will essentially bankrupt Intel and strangle Android chipmakers struggling to push out more performance per watt despite Android having a never ending problem with memory management.

Pro Users are twiddling our thumbs wondering when I won't have to lug around a MacBook Pro anymore for on the go editing in Final Cut/Premiere/etc. We wait patiently for years as people who OBVIOUSLY want a laptop buy a tablet and demand laptop features on a tablet WHEN THEY COULD HAVE BOUGHT A LAPTOP.

It's like some people wanted tea, but bought coffee and demanded the coffee makers engineer coffee to taste more like tea, when they could have just BOUGHT TEA.

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

Also, headphone jack being gone seems to only bother people buying wired headsets. The rest of us got wireless years ago.

Good for you. I'll stick to wired thank you. Would rather have a solid stable connection and power delivery through the jack so I don't have to worry about my headphones ever dying while getting better quality sound.

 

[chikorita157]

Good for you. I'll stick to wired thank you. Would rather have a solid stable connection and power delivery through the jack so I don't have to worry about my headphones ever dying while getting better quality sound.

I use wired headphones too, but the built-in headphones ports on iPads when they had them have crappy DACs to begin with that can't power most audiophile headphones, so removal of them wouldn't matter too much since one would use an external one anyway.

 

[eeek5127]

Thank god for this post. Can you tell me the type of bike, washing machine, or car you feel I should buy?

 

[polaris20]

Recommending Android Tablets? Stop trying to make Android Tablets happen, they have been dead for a long time, unless you like running blown up Android apps.

Besides iPad and maybe Windows tablets, Android tablets are pointless as there are hardly any optimized tablet apps compared to the iPad and maybe Windows UWP apps.

That said, the new regular iPad is a bad value when for a little bit more, you can get an iPad Air with more features or buy a used iPad Pro M1 or 2018/2020 model.

Yeah, if I weren't going iPadOS, I'd just go for a Surface. At least it's a very usable OS.

 

[Username-already-in-use]

So with today's update, there's no reason at all to buy an iPad anymore.

It’s a logical fallacy to universalise your own subjective experience.

People have evidently bought iPads since last Tuesday and will continue to buy them, each for a particular reason.

Also Macs do not ‘out-sell‘ iPads, they merely generate more revenue. 6 x base iPads need to be sold to match the revenue of 1 MacBook Pro. I can assure you that by units shipped, iPads vastly outnumber Mac computers.

 

[robbietop]

Good for you. I'll stick to wired thank you. Would rather have a solid stable connection and power delivery through the jack so I don't have to worry about my headphones ever dying while getting better quality sound.

My AirPods Pro last 2 hours, I have 3 of them. My AirPods Max last 10 hours. My Bose headset lasts about 15 hours. I think I have enough to cover the time I am listening to music.

Oh no, my 15 hour battery won't be long enough....

 

[Gobeatty]

Got my GF a Galaxy Tab tablet since she is an Android user and the thing just doesn’t work. Sync texts between her phone and tablet? Nope. Keep Wi-Fi connection during a zoom meeting? Nope. Gmail syncing right? Nope.

I’m sure others have better experience with the galaxy tablets but this thing has been a nightmare and the kind of nightmare that I pay apple to spare me from. And for the most part my apple toys all work perfectly together and do what I got them to do with minimum fuss.

Last year I replaced by 2018 iPad, which even the Apple employee admitted ran everything just fine, with the 2021 M1 iPad Pro. Figured being an M it would future-proof me and iPads seem to have insanely long user lifecycles from both a hardware and software/function standpoint. I even plumed for the Magic Keyboard figuring the investment is longish-term - like a new laptop rather than a new phone.

Just my $.02.

 

[Devyn89]

USB-C headphones are also easy to get/replace, so that argument doesn't hold water. And why does a school have to buy new iPads if they already have them? They can continue to use their existing ones for at least a few years for sure.

Again, I'm not on Apple's design team nor privy to their development timeline, so you'll have to ask someone at Apple who knows if you want all the details of why they make this or any other design choice. I can guarantee you, however, there's a logical reason (probably multiple) and it's not "hey, let's make some people angry just for the heck of it."

You literally have two very simple options (dongle or USB-C headphones) to continue to use wired headphones with all the newest generation iPads.

It’s to sell AirPods, pretty obvious to me. Personally I don’t use the headphone jack at all but I still wish it was there and it should be on iPad. It’s a bad decision to remove it imo. Not the biggest of deals as there are alternatives but the alternatives shouldn’t be needed imo.

 

[Devyn89]

Apple doesn't carry USB-C headphones (just 3.5mm and lightning ones), but on Amazon I'm seeing USB-C headphones for just over $10, which is about half what Apple charges for their 3.5mm or Lightning wired headphones. And I'm sure schools would get volume discounts. If the school is doing their due diligence, they already have future plans in place and will budget based on those. It's really no big deal. Not sure why you're making it one. Technology moves on, as always.



Great opportunity to teach your child how to be responsible and introduce consequences for losing things (just like you would even for the dollar store headphones). Also a great opportunity to go reevaluate your budget if buying a $10-12 pair of headphones is going to break the bank.



Dripping sarcasm duly noted, and no one's forcing you to continue to reply. Move on if you wish. I'm good.

You know there’s folks who have to decide whether to feed themselves or their kids, yeah?

 

[usagora]

It’s to sell AirPods, pretty obvious to me. Personally I don’t use the headphone jack at all but I still wish it was there and it should be on iPad. It’s a bad decision to remove it imo. Not the biggest of deals as there are alternatives but the alternatives shouldn’t be needed imo.

Then why does Apple offer both Lightning to 3.5mm and USB-C to 3.5mm adapters if this were about selling AirPods? I don't think people who want to use wired headphones are going to say, "Oh, crap, my new iPad doesn't have a headphone jack. Lemme spend $130-250 on some AirPods rather than $10 on an adapter" 😂