Time to tell Apple where they can stick Yosemite?-and it's where the sun don't shine.

[Dubdrifter]

Thanks for all the valid points made on here - contrary to popular belief, I have taken a lot of it on board - I didn't write "I agree" after each one because it is discouraged here and I wanted to try to move the thread along with general comments about Apple's relationship with it's users and the fact it is giving us less "options" for the professional these days in certain Apps.

I know people have come to this thread at different times and are still commenting on the initial post - sometimes adding something new - which is always welcome. However, some points being made may be clarified by later additions to the thread so please trawl through the lot first before posting (onerous as that might be!) - it saves people labouring the same point and keeps the idea exchange fresh ……

……. having said that ….. thanks due to "grahamperrin" (post 136) for links which showed this topic is far from fresh and has already been discussed in some detail on this forum and some months ago elsewhere on the Internet and in magazines etc - and by people very experienced and knowledgeable in the computing industry.

Some comments here worth catching:
http://mjtsai.com/blog/2014/10/11/apples-software-quality-decline/

That age old mantra, "if it ain't broke, don't …. smash it to pieces" surely applies to the current situation.

We all understand there are "growing pains" of a new OS and the complexity of Yosemite trying to integrate with iOS and iCloud will inevitably cause additional issues that the average OS upgrade hasn't had to contend with. So maybe we are going to have to be more patient than usual for the wheels to be put back on the bus.

Meanwhile I'll stick to my smooth running 10.6.8 MBP and give iCloud a miss - hate the way Apple hoovers up people's personal data, videos and music through iPhone - even stuff which wasn't purchased through iTunes and then has the cheek to charge them for access.

….. And with all the big computer companies in talks with shadow government/secret services a few years back who knows what grubby deals have been brokered under the guise of "hunting for terrorists" which will definitely mean your data won't be free from prying eyes. Once they get people's personal data they can control the political landscape through blackmail for the foreseeable future.

But I digress …. that is a topic for another day and another thread.

I hope some of the comments made have been relevant and entertaining - I've tried to move the debate forward from my initial post which some people have appreciated

P.S. Gawd, don't people moan a lot about moaners on here! …… I thought forums were meant to be a platform for moaners with problems/issues/beefs looking for solutions - and of course "general" moans like this one ….. as well as stuff about news/new releases/articles etc?
Please don't marginalise moaners on here - if it wasn't for moaners NOTHING would improve!

 

[cjmillsnun]

Please don't marginalise moaners on here - if it wasn't for moaners NOTHING would improve!

Wrong.

Moaning and ranting solves nothing. Constructive criticism on the other hand...

 

[Dubdrifter]

I didn't say moaners solve anything - you have to highlight the problem before you solve it!

 

[SaxnFlutman]

I didn't say moaners solve anything - you have to highlight the problem before you solve it!

Quite true, and to deny Apple is just not as on top of things as they used to, is to deny reality.
As for bashing "moaners", especially by comparing Apple software to Windows, ... really?

If you believe someone's complaints are unfounded, just move on, that's far more preferable, & constructive than saying "well mine works fine", "love it or leave it", or "Windows is worse"...

 

[leman]

Quite true, and to deny Apple is just not as on top of things as they used to, is to deny reality.

What exactly do you mean by that? Every single product released by Apple has had its share of major or minor problems. Where do you see a decline in 'being on top of things' compared, say, to 6 years ago?

 

[SaxnFlutman]

What exactly do you mean by that? Every single product released by Apple has had its share of major or minor problems. Where do you see a decline in 'being on top of things' compared, say, to 6 years ago?

I've been using Apple products for almost 20 years, and I've never seen so many users, especially long-time ones & developers howl so loudly, and in such numbers as the past several years. I don't think things were so great 6 years ago, but this has been a downward roll.

What drives me crazy, is that I constantly get the feeling that many of the changes, especially to the most used software (Mail, iTunes, Safari, etc), are just changes for the sake of changes, NOT to improve performance, doing things better or more quickly, in fact, sometimes it's the quite opposite, they are backward steps (in the direction of Windows territory)... I don't want to have to re-learn all over again, how to use a workhorse like iTunes, just to store & play my music, when it was doing so just fine before the "improvements", same with things as simple as autofill, which used to just work, then it was "improved" to where you have to now take at least two extra steps, to do what used to be automatic, and that's nuts, arbitrary, and directly lessens my user experience, not benefits it.

Plus, the onboard Help menus are so sketchy now, they are hardly any help at all. Used to be with every Apple program, you could set up every preference with the help of the Help menu, as it explained things line by line. Now, I have no clue what most of the options are, and sometimes it's not even anywhere on Apple's own knowledge base on their website! So more & more wasted time hunting a simple bit of info, that used to be right there and take seconds to access and then move on....

 

[fisherking]

I've been using Apple products for almost 20 years, and I've never seen so many users, especially long-time ones & developers howl so loudly, and in such numbers as the past several years. I don't think things were so great 6 years ago, but this has been a downward roll.

What drives me crazy, is that I constantly get the feeling that many of the changes, especially to the most used software (Mail, iTunes, Safari, etc), are just changes for the sake of changes, NOT to improve performance, doing things better or more quickly, in fact, sometimes it's the quite opposite, they are backward steps (in the direction of Windows territory)... I don't want to have to re-learn all over again, how to use a workhorse like iTunes, just to store & play my music, when it was doing so just fine before the "improvements", same with things as simple as autofill, which used to just work, then it was "improved" to where you have to now take at least two extra steps, to do what used to be automatic, and that's nuts, arbitrary, and directly lessens my user experience, not benefits it.

Plus, the onboard Help menus are so sketchy now, they are hardly any help at all. Used to be with every Apple program, you could set up every preference with the help of the Help menu, as it explained things line by line. Now, I have no clue what most of the options are, and sometimes it's not even anywhere on Apple's own knowledge base on their website! So more & more wasted time hunting a simple bit of info, that used to be right there and take seconds to access and then move on....

if you're looking back in time, it's also essential to remember that apple users were a much smaller group years ago; i remember when i'd go to the local coffeebar, and there were maybw 2 powerbooks to 8 windows laptops; now it's almost entirely macbooks. the user base is much larger in the present.

i dunno, maybe it's just who we each are. i for one embrace change, and, despite a few bugs, think yosemite is the best step forward in OS X since 10.6.8. my macbook is running fast, stable. perfect? no, but NO version of X has ever been perfect (10.6.8 came close).

anyway, i have no problem with people discussing issues, it's the whining and moaning that have become tiresome; just look at the title of this thread...

 

[SaxnFlutman]

if you're looking back in time, it's also essential to remember that apple users were a much smaller group years ago; i remember when i'd go to the local coffeebar, and there were maybw 2 powerbooks to 8 windows laptops; now it's almost entirely macbooks. the user base is much larger in the present.

i dunno, maybe it's just who we each are. i for one embrace change, and, despite a few bugs, think yosemite is the best step forward in OS X since 10.6.8. my macbook is running fast, stable. perfect? no, but NO version of X has ever been perfect (10.6.8 came close).

anyway, i have no problem with people discussing issues, it's the whining and moaning that have become tiresome; just look at the title of this thread...

Not sure about why more users (and way more $$$ to hire top programmers) in any way justifies more problematic software. And yes, no update was perfect in it's initial release, they were perhaps a little closer than they've been the past number of years. I would not have remained with Snow Leopard as long as I have, if it were otherwise. But it seems as they keep moving with newer OS versions, never quite tightening up completely the one previous to it, its perhaps worked against them putting out newer versions that are less buggy.

I'm no IT expert, one reason I've always dug Macs over Windows machines, more "intuitive", they just work better, etc. But I can read, and when publications across the board report on Yosemite's huge wifi issue, that tells me it's far more than a few whiners and complainers, cause i do know Apple does not like to admit any flaws or bugs, even when they have them. Now come on, a brand new OS and it screws up everyone's Wifi? That's far too sloppy & half-assed for a company like Apple, and IMHO, is symptomatic of a general trend towards lack of thoroughness, and doing things that make sense to their users.

I know of many music & other artistic professionals who have found new updates now won't work with their very expensive pro software, and it not only costs them for new software, but affects their business and income flow. Apple initially grew on the basis of many of my fellow creative professionals flocking to it's smoother application to music & graphic & visual operations. Anyway, perhaps it's the explosion of iPhones & iPads that has taken a lot of their focus off of their foundational OS, but it would be nice if every new OS was not greeted with the great trepidation they now entail. I've waited and waited until I hear enough positive reviews of any new OS, before upgrading, which I would love to do, but am not going to risk falling into computer hell for....

 

[fisherking]

Not sure about why more users (and way more $$$ to hire top programmers) in any way justifies more problematic software. And yes, no update was perfect in it's initial release, they were perhaps a little closer than they've been the past number of years. I would not have remained with Snow Leopard as long as I have, if it were otherwise. But it seems as they keep moving with newer OS versions, never quite tightening up completely the one previous to it, its perhaps worked against them putting out newer versions that are less buggy.

I'm no IT expert, one reason I've always dug Macs over Windows machines, more "intuitive", they just work better, etc. But I can read, and when publications across the board report on Yosemite's huge wifi issue, that tells me it's far more than a few whiners and complainers, cause i do know Apple does not like to admit any flaws or bugs, even when they have them. Now come on, a brand new OS and it screws up everyone's Wifi? That's far too sloppy & half-assed for a company like Apple, and IMHO, is symptomatic of a general trend towards lack of thoroughness, and doing things that make sense to their users.

I know of many music & other artistic professionals who have found new updates now won't work with their very expensive pro software, and it not only costs them for new software, but affects their business and income flow. Apple initially grew on the basis of many of my fellow creative professionals flocking to it's smoother application to music & graphic & visual operations. Anyway, perhaps it's the explosion of iPhones & iPads that has taken a lot of their focus off of their foundational OS, but it would be nice if every new OS was not greeted with the great trepidation they now entail. I've waited and waited until I hear enough positive reviews of any new OS, before upgrading, which I would love to do, but am not going to risk falling into computer hell for....

didn't screw up EVERYONE's wifi (not mine, at any rate). and i live by my music software (logic X, and lots of third-party plugins), and THAT experience is the best it's EVER been.

asking for help, pointing out issues, is a logical thing to do on a forum like this. whining and moaning (and making 'absolute' statements, like "yosemite sucks" or "wifi broken in 10.10.1"...etc), is just a waste of everyone's time.

 

[simonsi]

but am not going to risk falling into computer hell for....

So just take a backup, upgrade, if you don't like it, downgrade.

Its as easy as that. If you don't do that you are always at "risk of computer hell..."

I've upgraded 4 machines (1x MBP, 2x iMac, 1x MBA), only issue was enabling FV2 on the MBP (it hung while "optimising"), necessitating a wipe and restore - so not necessarily Yosemite-related. On none of the machines have I had any of the issues so prevalent in the forums.

To paraphrase the film Contagion: "To even possibly be affected by any Yosemite issue, you actually have to install it. To become scared you just have to read the internet".

Backup, install, be prepared to downgrade. You might be surprised.

 

[leman]

I've been using Apple products for almost 20 years, and I've never seen so many users, especially long-time ones & developers howl so loudly, and in such numbers as the past several years. I don't think things were so great 6 years ago, but this has been a downward roll.

I am quite sure that fisherking provides a very reasonable answer to this. The userbase has increased dramatically, and so has the visibility of the criticism. The funny thing is — despite all that rage about WiFi issues on Yosemite, I have never actually met a person that would suffer from those issues. And I work as an IT-administrator of a med-size research department that mostly uses Macs. Our of curiosity, I have also asked people I know over at the university's IT helpdesk and deployment. They've only had singular requests with WiFi problems under Yosemite and they definitely did not register any increase in such problems since 10.10 has been released. BTW, we are talking about a university that exclusively uses Mac Minis for lecture hall machines (several hundreds of them in total). I am sure that if the problems were that widespread as some suggest, our IT would have noticed.

A sidenote: I personally have had some major problems with WiFi under Mavericks. Yosemite fixed all of them.

What drives me crazy, is that I constantly get the feeling that many of the changes, especially to the most used software (Mail, iTunes, Safari, etc), are just changes for the sake of changes, NOT to improve performance, doing things better or more quickly, in fact, sometimes it's the quite opposite, they are backward steps (in the direction of Windows territory)...

Maybe it is you its only your feeling Safari and Mail was borderline unusable for me earlier. In days of Leopard/Snow Leopard, Safari used to crash every 20 minutes, forcing me to use Firefox. I can use it again since 10.9. Similar with Mail, that only now starts properly supporting google mail. Auto-fill on Safari, in combination with keychain credit card data work better than ever before and Safari is the most responsive browser I have ever used.

All in all, Yosemite offers more power-user features than any OS X ever before. And while there seems to be some sort of ideology conflict at Apple right now (which is expected IMO during transition times, hope they will sort it out for 10.11), I see Apple improving the tools they deliver to make them easier to use and more convenient. Its certainly not just cosmetic changes. Its small, subtle improvements. E.g. the OS-wide universal plugins or the calendar entry recognition (the later has saved me a lot of time btw!).

I know of many music & other artistic professionals who have found new updates now won't work with their very expensive pro software, and it not only costs them for new software, but affects their business and income flow.

As I have written earlier, its mostly the case of latent bugs in the software. Has very little to do with Apple as such but rather with the impudence of the companies that produce professional software. I don't see why Apple should be made responsible for bugs in third-party apps. And also — if you rely on expensive software for your living, you are supposed to TEST if it will run with the new OS anyway.

 

[Dubdrifter]

..... anyway, i have no problem with people discussing issues, it's the whining and moaning that have become tiresome; just look at the title of this thread...

Hey …. Don't knock the title ….. I thought it was inspired!

Besides …… you have to chuck a GREAT BIG unsubtle brick in a BIG BIG pond like this to get noticed on the Internet these days.

Must admit, as my staunchest critic on here, you've done more moaning on here about the moaners than I moaned about Apple! And that's really saying something.
And you've stuck around for 7 pages of comments after saying you were bored on Page 1 with all the whiners on here - Mmmmm.

One more thing before I go ….. before I posted ……. I read on the forum rules about :

Advertising/soliciting/self-promotion
Your purpose in joining MacRumors or posting should not be to promote, advertise, or otherwise call attention to your site, blog, product, or business. See*this page*if you want to advertise at MacRumors.

Self-promotion is not fair to our paid advertisers. Forum posts should be free of ads and promotions that benefit the poster.

You have been stating repeatedly that you and many others don't have a problem with Yosemite besides a few bugs which are normal for the average OS upgrade - fair enough - but quite a number of user's devices have gone completely "tits up" on Yosemite (can I use that word on here Forum Invigilator?) ….. and you recommended using a specialist in some situations. You keep stating you are very happy with Yosemite and that must be sending out a message to the wary it is relatively OK to so called 'upgrade'

….. Now I'm not a cynical person ….. but there are a few on here it's rumoured

On your Post 105 you stated:

quote " i'm a freelance mac support person in nyc, since 2002. many of my clients are on mavericks, and some are now on yosemite"

Now I'm not suggesting for a minute this might be good for business ….. but ......

…… and personally, seriously, I think a lot of your advice has been spot on ….. except the bit about moaners and Yosemite.

 

[fisherking]

Hey …. Don't knock the title ….. I thought it was inspired!

Besides …… you have to chuck a GREAT BIG unsubtle brick in a BIG BIG pond like this to get noticed on the Internet these days.

Must admit, as my staunchest critic on here, you've done more moaning on here about the moaners than I moaned about Apple!! And that's really saying something!
And you've stuck around for 7 pages of comments after saying you were bored on Page 1 with all the whiners on here - Mmmmm ….. guess your other work must have been really boring!

One more thing before I go ….. before I posted ……. I read on the forum rules about :

Advertising/soliciting/self-promotion
Your purpose in joining MacRumors or posting should not be to promote, advertise, or otherwise call attention to your site, blog, product, or business. See*this page*if you want to advertise at MacRumors.

Self-promotion is not fair to our paid advertisers. Forum posts should be free of ads and promotions that benefit the poster.

You have been stating repeatedly that you and many others don't have a problem with Yosemite besides a few bugs which are normal for the average OS upgrade - fair enough - but quite a number of user's devices have gone completely "tits up" on Yosemite (can I use that word on here Forum Invigilator?) ….. and you recommended using a specialist in some situations. You keep stating you are very happy with Yosemite and that must be sending out a message to the wary it is relatively OK to so called 'upgrade'

….. Now I'm not a cynical person ….. but there are a few on here it's rumoured

On your Post 105 you stated:

quote " i'm a freelance mac support person in nyc, since 2002. many of my clients are on mavericks, and some are now on yosemite"

Now I'm not suggesting for a minute this might be good for business ….. but others on here ….. who knows?

…… and personally, seriously, I think a lot of your advice has been spot on ….. except the bit about moaners and Yosemite. (No, be fair …. he did write about other stuff as well) Come on fellas - cut the guy some slack!

dude, really...am not promoting services, just pointing out where i get my information from. and i stand by everything i've said: asking for help, discussing issues is a great thing; whining and moaning is tiresome. but now, as promised...am gone from this thread. will vanish...like a bad wifi connection!

 

[technosix]

I have two systems running Yosemite, it's not my favorite rev of OS X but I'm not surprised since Apple has been shipping fairly buggy software in recent times.

Some bugs are to be expected, yet Yosemite is a long ways from Apple's best work. They're capable of much better, yet they've cleverly identified how much the public will put up with and make no effort to do better.

The incentive is the money they save by pushing it out asap. Apple is the world's best at generating fat profits.

 

[skottichan]

So it's user error that my Finder lags when I scroll through it on a 2014 retina Mac? Or that Mission Control does that too after a few hours?

Please. Yosemite sucks.

Sounds like you may have a buggy machine or install. My 2014 15" rMBP has no Finder lag.

The only bug I've run across is a Cintiq driver issue that got fixed by Wacom in early January.


Like I've said in other threads, sometimes I wish I could have the OS X and iOS bugs people have, just so I can feel like part of the crowd.

 

[ABC5S]

Sounds like you may have a buggy machine or install. My 2014 15" rMBP has no Finder lag.

The only bug I've run across is a Cintiq driver issue that got fixed by Wacom in early January.


Like I've said in other threads, sometimes I wish I could have the OS X and iOS bugs people have, just so I can feel like part of the crowd.

Ditto...No issues with mine either. Unknown why those that complain have issues. Perhaps buggy stuff on the system, how they installed the OS, etc.

 

[quackers82]

Let me repeat - PEOPLE'S LIVES AND BUSINESSES DEPEND ON THESE DEVICES.

Which is why businesses don't deploy OS upgrades until tested. Like where i manage, we refuse to deploy Yosemite yet because of 1 big bug, if its domain joined and you do a hard reset it freezes on boot. We have not tested on 10.10.2 yet but we are in no rush, we have 10.9.5 deployed to over 100 devices.

If its that bad why not just format the Mac and put 10.9 back on?

Whilst I'm still on the fence with the UI, on my personal Macs i like Yosemite now, and the UI is slowly growing on me but i still have a soft spot for the 3D Glossy look of 10.5 to 10.9.

 

[Taz Mangus]

Just a quick reply to a few points:

1)Firstly, can I say how encouraged I am so many people are having a relatively seamless experience with Yosemite - a welcome surprise as I based my post on MANY accounts on MacRumours and other music/photography forums where people have been having a torrid time with the new OS.

2) I was hoping to get representative feedback - got a lot of "I'm all right Jack - must be user error" comments ….. but maybe the people with problems have wi-fi issues and other stuff going on and can't connect to the Internet to voice their opinions here. Interesting that "dav1dd" tried to upgrade on the weekend and it broke his wi-fi ….. an issue many have had and we are 6 months since launch …… is that normal? …. or should that bug have been fixed by now? Oh, sorry, must be user error? The experts on here, who incidentally do a great job correcting user error and trying to help us cope with Apple's new OS incompatibilities must be well hardened to accepting this is normal. And it's important to remember that for every poster with a problem there may be hundreds/possibly thousands more with the same issue - waiting for a solution.

3)To those who comment "You don't have to upgrade, we test thoroughly before upgrading" Nice to have the luxury of multiple devices and time and resources and expertise to beta test. But good to hear the business world isn't crippled by this upgrade. For others it's more of a Catch22 situation …… you never know until you download if you are going to be a new statistic on the ever burgeoning mental health register of the World within the next 48 hours!

4)Apple never seem to inform us in advance what the OS is NOT compatible with.
"Scared poet" says developers were well primed in advance with Yosemite for beta testing - more so than any previous release. Then why do people still have so many problems? Did the initial core concept of the new OS present unique difficulties? You get info on which issues have been resolved with the new update but not what is still causing major problems. Makes it difficult to know when to upgrade. Experienced users (twice bitten thrice shy) seem to delay quite a while.Trouble is you now only get 6 months of relatively trouble-free use before you are confronted with another "New Whizzo Must Have OS" that will have you running to the doctors for a new sedative prescription.

5)Technology moves fast these days - Maybe someone can write a bit explaining why we have to develop OS systems that have such painful birthing process - that get aborted prematurely just when they are maturing nicely. Was Yosemite so radically new - cleaner, leaner and so much faster - that they had to throw away a lot of really good stable code?

Footnote: Truly have no problem people copy/paste - as long as they don't then charge others to read or quote out of context. Yes, I did post on Cnet - but there was a glitch on 'Submit' so posted here.(Surely inaccurate to accuse me of "ranting" all over forums "satcomer" - total of 3 posts on here, none on other sites on this issue)

Have you attempted to report the problems you are having to Apple? You do get free phone support for Yosemite. When I first clean installed 10.10.2 I found what looks like a small issue with the OS. Even though my 2011 iMac is now out of warranty I called Apple for a free support call and the bug I found. It turns out the the small bug seem to fix itself (kind of strange).

If I had as many problems as you seem to have with Yosemite I would be on the phone opening a case for each and every problem with Apple.

 

[Dubdrifter]

Yosemite, iOS and jailbreaking

Taz Mangus - see Post 77
Right on the nail SaxnFlutman (Posts 156+158) ……

Apple found the Holy Grail in computing by developing hardware and an OS that gave developers, professionals and the public ….. ease of use, flexibility and professional sophistication ….. and this has boosted the brand into the stratosphere.

But now it seems Apple don't want to share the 'honey' that has been generated and have almost declared 'war' on some of it's users and developers who want to push these devices to a new level.

Yosemite and iOS combined are working hard to try and stop users from 'jail breaking' their phones and accessing apps that give them more flexibility and features.

Despite threats of ex communication from Apple Support and software 'castration' if you stray into the 'dark side' ….. people still think it is worth it - because they want to push their devices as far as the hardware will let them.

Although it looks like I am undermining my point by the following link ….
http://www.macworld.com/article/2686008/with-ios-8-and-yosemite-this-jailbreaker-is-done.html

…… if you read the comments below the piece ….. many still find Apple 'lagging behind' markedly in giving them what they want from a smart phone iOS.
It's strange Apple seem threatened by apps that outshine their 'in house' products - deliberately mutating (or is that 'mutilating') OS upgrades so some rival products are no longer compatible.

It's a shame that short-sightedness in the Apple economic model doesn't always see these satellite programmes as enhancing the brand for the professional user, making it more flexible and user friendly, encouraging choice, sophistication and innovation - and thus increasing the number of devices Apple sells in the public/ professional domain - surely a good thing you would think that guarantees the longterm relevance of the Brand?

Let's hope that Apple gets it's Mojo back, stops listening to the accountants and business types with a Luddite mentality and Big Brother 'protectionism' policies that increasingly give us less and less free/low cost options. We deserve more options with the premium we paid - we get good basic ones - but nice to get the options Window users enjoy (without the hassle obviously!)

 

[Dubdrifter]

Just thought I would quickly gauge a rough estimate of problems generated by Yosemite, Mavericks and earlier OS by totting up the number of pages of threads each has thrown up on the OS section of the MacRumours to date. Yosemite 105, Mavericks 112, Mountain Lion 6, Lion 5, and in the archive Panther 39 pages.

OK, not every thread points to a problem with each OS and it is too time consuming to tot up all the other threads in all the other sections of the forum relating to problems with Yosemite - but as a rough idea what problems this OS has generated in relation to other OS - on average I think this stat has some validity and indicates something more fundamentally wrong with the last two OS updates.

I'm not sure if MacRumours Admin might have deleted a lot of older threads to earlier OS from the forum - which is a shame if true, as this would give a wider view of this rough stat in Apples' history .... however it may be that they reorganised the forum .... and the threads to earlier OS are lost somewhat in the mix? - maybe an Admin guy could tell me.

Deleting older OS threads might not be a good idea in retrospect as many users are so jaded with the performance of Mavericks and Yosemite that they will soon be happily jumping back to earlier OS to restore their faith in the brand - and may still need comprehensive info on the foibles of that earlier OS!

 

[satcomer]

I didn't say moaners solve anything - you have to highlight the problem before you solve it!

I highly suggest if you "upgraded" then use the simple free program EtreCheck it will point out any incompatible extensions, etc that slow your "upgrade" down. It then will be up to you to manually delete those incompatible flex, then reboot when finished deleteing.

 

[SaxnFlutman]

So just take a backup, upgrade, if you don't like it, downgrade.

Its as easy as that. If you don't do that you are always at "risk of computer hell..."

I've upgraded 4 machines (1x MBP, 2x iMac, 1x MBA), only issue was enabling FV2 on the MBP (it hung while "optimising"), necessitating a wipe and restore - so not necessarily Yosemite-related. On none of the machines have I had any of the issues so prevalent in the forums.

To paraphrase the film Contagion: "To even possibly be affected by any Yosemite issue, you actually have to install it. To become scared you just have to read the internet".

Backup, install, be prepared to downgrade. You might be surprised.

You say it's as easy as that, but if I back up everything, then install Yosemite, and it doesn't work well, I can just erase everything, & load it all from my external hard drive? It's not as easy as that, if you aren't sure how to do something so major... When I install Yosemite, do I leave everything in place, once it's backed up? Then just install Yosemite?

 

[dmccloud]

Just thought I would quickly gauge a rough estimate of problems generated by Yosemite, Mavericks and earlier OS by totting up the number of pages of threads each has thrown up on the OS section of the MacRumours to date. Yosemite 105, Mavericks 112, Mountain Lion 6, Lion 5, and in the archive Panther 39 pages.

OK, not every thread points to a problem with each OS and it is too time consuming to tot up all the other threads in all the other sections of the forum relating to problems with Yosemite - but as a rough idea what problems this OS has generated in relation to other OS - on average I think this stat has some validity and indicates something more fundamentally wrong with the last two OS updates.

I'm not sure if MacRumours Admin might have deleted a lot of older threads to earlier OS from the forum - which is a shame if true, as this would give a wider view of this rough stat in Apples' history .... however it may be that they reorganised the forum .... and the threads to earlier OS are lost somewhat in the mix? - maybe an Admin guy could tell me.

Deleting older OS threads might not be a good idea in retrospect as many users are so jaded with the performance of Mavericks and Yosemite that they will soon be happily jumping back to earlier OS to restore their faith in the brand - and may still need comprehensive info on the foibles of that earlier OS!

Your sample is biased towards complaints because it's drawn entirely from these forums. Go look at the overall user satisfaction scores for Yosemite - they paint a far different picture than the "reality" you're trying to paint over and over again here. What few issues I've had with Yosemite were due to the software developers not updating their apps until after widespread release, not because of any failings on Apple's part. At this point, those issues have been resolved in every case but one (and the developer has stopped supporting their applications across the board).

 

[Taz Mangus]

Your sample is biased towards complaints because it's drawn entirely from these forums. Go look at the overall user satisfaction scores for Yosemite - they paint a far different picture than the "reality" you're trying to paint over and over again here. What few issues I've had with Yosemite were due to the software developers not updating their apps until after widespread release, not because of any failings on Apple's part. At this point, those issues have been resolved in every case but one (and the developer has stopped supporting their applications across the board).

You echo my experience with Yosemite. Installed on all 3 of my Macs, none of them have exhibited an issue. Each computer runs better now then when it did when Mavericks was installed. The only issues I have had were with 2 applications. One was a driver and the other was an application. The driver was updated and now runs great. I think each person needs to decide for themselves if Yosemite works for them. It is unfortunate that Duddrifter has taken his approach to attempt to discredit Yosemite.

 

[Taz Mangus]

You say it's as easy as that, but if I back up everything, then install Yosemite, and it doesn't work well, I can just erase everything, & load it all from my external hard drive? It's not as easy as that, if you aren't sure how to do something so major... When I install Yosemite, do I leave everything in place, once it's backed up? Then just install Yosemite?

There are 2 approaches to installing Yosemite. A lot of people install Yosemite on top of an already installed version of OS X such Mavericks 10.9. Others like myself, like to do a clean install of major OS X releases.

When I do a clean install I first make sure that a Time Machine backup has been performed. I boot to a OS X installer I previously created. When the installer runs I launch Disk Utility from the installer menu, select the internal hard drive and then erase it. I exit Disk Utility and proceed with the install. This takes about 15 minutes or so. I then start creating the user accounts. When I restore the user data from the Time Machine backup I manually copy over data from ~/Library/Application Support and ~/Library/Preferences. I also re-install applications from scratch. I like doing the install this way because I get a chance to clean out old data that is no longer needed. This approach does take some extra time.