Unionized Maryland Apple Store Workers Request 10% Raise and Option to Accept Customer Tips

[paulvee]

I too believe that tipping - mainly due to electronic payment methods - has gotten out of hand. Tipping for food staff in this country, historically, is due to restaurants being able to pay SUB minimum wages. We're talking two bucks an hour. Essentially, commission-based service. Now that you hit an iPad or other payment screen for any purchase, it would be easy enough to program out the tip screen, but retailers keep it as a way to subsidize their low wages. And companies like WalMart use Medicaid to subsidize THEIR low wages. Unfettered capitalism leads to unfettered greed.

THAT BEING SAID, the blanket condemnations of tipping and unions here is disgusting and indicates people who have never had to work low-wage jobs and led lives of privilege. Unions have given us dignity, the five day workweek, vacations and a living wage. The conservative efforts to break unions goes back well more than 100 years and includes a lot of violence, such is the threat they posted to the less than 1 percent who control the majority of the money. Don't get me wrong, I am not against some form of capitalism, but our current system, with the moneyed interests gaming the regulatory and tax systems to their extreme advantage, must end and it won't end well at this rate. Read up on the history of the labor movement, the Wobblies, the Great Depression and that great "traitor to his class," FDR.

I don't agree with many of the demands from the union representing this Apple store, but it's a negotiation and this is their opening salvo.

 

[Sebosz]

They do not deserve gratuity for standing in place of of a vending machine that could just as easily accept my credit card and spit out an iPhone.

That's literally not how it works. Your words are offensive to every Apple Retail worker. They undergo a lot of training every month to meet Apple's high standards. You don't notice it until something's off. Please don't speak on topics you don't have the faintest idea about and don't call people "vending machines".

 

[icanhazmac]

That's literally not how it works. Your words are offensive to every Apple Retail worker. They undergo a lot of training every month to meet Apple's high standards. You don't notice it until something's off. Please don't speak on topics you don't have the faintest idea about and don't call people "vending machines".

Call it offensive all you want but this is what happens when you artificially drive up labor costs for positions that require little to no skills. Apple retail folks should be a cut above the rest (and compensated accordingly) but at the end of the day some of them literally just check you in on an iPad, proving the point made by @BrownyQ, careful what you wish for because Apple can just replace that human with a sign in kiosk.

Why do you think McDonald's now have kiosk ordering? Because the cost of having a human being take orders is too high. A busy McD's used to have 3-6 people working registers now there is generally one (inside) and at least 2 kiosks. Job well done for the one worker getting $15/hr.

You cannot artificially drive up labor costs without consequences and those consequences are that when you cost more than you are worth (from a labor standpoint) can, and will, be replaced by a tablet.

 

[monstermash]

THAT BEING SAID, the blanket condemnations of tipping and unions here is disgusting and indicates people who have never had to work low-wage jobs and led lives of privilege.

I've had more food service and crap jobs than I can count, for a whopping $3.35/hr. I worked my way out of those sucky jobs. Parents didn't do squat for me. Moved out of their house when I was 18 and never looked back. No privilege here! I graduated from college with $100K in student loans. Still have $33K outstanding. Totally against tipping and unions.

So much for your stereotype, eh?

 

[Mike_Trivisonno]

lol This is the stupidest thing I have ever read. They wanted to unionize for what? For this?

Black lung disease, asbestosis, severed limbs, inhuman working conditions. These are some of the reasons why unions formed. Not because your cat died and you need 45 days to mourn.

The 21st Century is a total bust so far. We're living in the Age of Stupid.

 

[bsbeamer]

Seriously, tips? This will increase purchases fulfilled by FedEx style delivery, or they'll turn to Amazon.

Half the time it's a hassle just walking into an Apple store. Takes 5-10 minutes to get someone who's "available to assist" and then 10-15 more for them to find in back and bring to the front. Why even bother if it can all be done direct from Apple without going to a physical store.

I'd be more inclined to tip a tech who does an amazing repair to a screen or similar, but you're not allowed to even see those worker's faces.

 

[monstermash]

That's literally not how it works. Your words are offensive to every Apple Retail worker. They undergo a lot of training every month to meet Apple's high standards. You don't notice it until something's off. Please don't speak on topics you don't have the faintest idea about and don't call people "vending machines".

Apple could TOTALLY install phone and iPad vending machines and most people would be pleased with that.

 

[BrownyQ]

That's literally not how it works. Your words are offensive to every Apple Retail worker. They undergo a lot of training every month to meet Apple's high standards. You don't notice it until something's off. Please don't speak on topics you don't have the faintest idea about and don't call people "vending machines".

Actually, that is how it works. The retail employee fills all the same functions as a vending machine, kiosk, or Apple's own Store app or website: that is to be told verbally what it is I want to buy, and then fetch it for me from storage.

"High standards" of customer service is subjective. I'd consider being polite and having the answer to every one of my questions to be a bare minimum for service, but even that can be a tall order nowadays, and to suggest otherwise is apparently "bootlicking" for the companies. Fortunately for me, if I want answers to my questions that an Apple employee cannot provide, their own website and documentation provides. Without fail.

Also: I did not call them vending machines. I said they stood in place of one. And I'm pretty sure said vending machine could take my payment and drop my iPhone into my hand faster than the employee.

 

[monstermash]

Actually, that is how it works. The retail employee fills all the same functions as a vending machine, kiosk, or Apple's own Store app or website: that is to be told verbally what it is I want to buy, and then fetch it for me from storage.

"High standards" of customer service is subjective. I'd consider being polite and having the answer to every one of my questions to be a bare minimum for service, but even that can be a tall order nowadays, and to suggest otherwise is apparently "bootlicking" for the companies. Fortunately for me, if I want answers to my questions that an Apple employee cannot provide, their own website and documentation provides. Without fail.

Also: I did not call them vending machines. I said they stood in place of one. And I'm pretty sure said vending machine could take my payment and drop my iPhone into my hand faster than the employee.

How about this store:

1. Vending machines for people who just want to pick something up - whether it is an in stock item or "delivered to store".
2. A consulting desk for people too dumb to know what they want to buy. Pay the consultants $30/hr with benefits. Customers pay a $50 fee for the first 30 minutes and $25 for every 30 minutes or portion thereafter. Customers ending the appt wanting to buy are given a QR code to use at the vending machine.
3. A consulting desk for people with "problems". Pay the consultants $50/hr with benefits. Customers pay a $100 fee for the first 30 minutes and $50 for every 30 minutes or portion thereafter. If it turns out their problem is an issue covered under warranty, then the fee is refunded.

No tipping. Employees are fairly paid (and then some), and also have a career path of sorts. Customers pay for the service they require. Equity for all! Hooray!!

 

[seek3r]

FDR...second worst President ever. Not exactly someone we should use as a model form society.

Ok, whatever you say bud . He wasnt perfect, particularly around how the new deal, which has brought about an enourmous amount of good in general over the past century, left out minorities, and he certainly made some other mistakes (including huge ones like Japanese internment, and though there’s an argument to be made that he was forced into that by the right wing in congress that’s still not an excuse really), but overall there’s a reason he’s known as one of the best presidents in US history, usually only ranking behind Lincoln and Washington. There’s a reason he was elected 4 times.

His reforms brought about a lot of rights we take for granted today, and a lot of both direct infrastructure and the precursors of it that benefitted the US throughout the 20th century into today - and his leadership was crucial to WW2.

Hell, on the right at the time there was a plot to attempt to move to literal Mussolini style fascism - George Bush Sr.’s father was one of the ringleaders. They literally wanted to remove FDR and install a dictator. It came very close to succeeding. Is that the alternative you wish we’d had? A fascist government friendly to Mussolini’s Italy and Nazi Germany?

As to FDR’s policies you can certainly argue that the war and US factory production brought about the end of the great depression in the US, not the new deal, which is one major critique of his, but the advantages of the new deal have been consistently shown to hold up again and again over the past century regardless.

My grandparents were all significantly to the *left* of FDR, and had many critiques from that direction, but all of them overall liked him - and they all either grew up or were young adults in that era, and all of them poor immigrant families.

I don’t want to go back to an America where growing old meant purely dying in poverty in this country. I don’t want to go back to an era without child labor laws. I don’t want to go back to the gilded age. I very much am glad the right wasn’t successful in bringing hardcore fascism to the US in the ‘30s. Every republican president since Nixon has tried to move the needle back that way, and every time it’s created hardship.

 

[MacLawyer]

Yeah all for worker rights, but tips, thats a HARD NO, sorry folks you had me till you wanted tips. Raises sure, leave you bet, tips.... come one even going there just makes your ask look bad....

"sorry folks you had me till you wanted tips." This X 1000

 

[monstermash]

... usually only ranking behind Lincoln....

I agree he ranks just behind Lincoln. FDR is second worst, with Lincoln being the worst.

I particularly like how FDR rounded up U.S. Citizens, dispossessed them, and then jailed them for existing. No crime, no trial, no conviction...just lock them up like the racist he was.

 

[CarAnalogy]

FDR...second worst President ever. Not exactly someone we should use as a model form society.

I’m certainly no FDR worshipper but I’m having a hard time finding fault with the quoted statement about businesses that depend on paying their workers less than a living wage not having a right to exist. If your business model depends on burning through people because they can’t afford food and housing, that’s not a legit business model. Sadly that does in fact seem to be the business model of all major American corporations today.

 

[seek3r]

You can tell these people don't have much working experience.

And I'm all for workers rights. We should treat our employees with respect and compensate them appropriately.

But all they're going to get is less hours to keep them under the premium pay. What is First Aid Certified and why does that call for an extra $1/hour? How many incidents are happening at a Walmart? And do they lay out what's considered a close friend?

To be fair as volley EMS over the past decade I have responded to a rather large number of calls at Apple stores. I would suspect the high traffic volume compared to the size of the stores is part of the reason, it’s a denser location than many places so more people, so more incidents. Walmart I think actually has dedicated folks on staff to respond to incidents, I think Apple does too, and this is who they’re talking about - they give some folks first aid training. I would bet, thought I don’t know, but based on what I’ve seen I assume that it involves basic treatment interventions like bandaging minor scrapes and performing lay person CPR until EMS shows up. Dealing with emergencies is definitely stressful (*especially* if it involves CPR, anyone who’s done CPR knows it’s messy, tiring, and for anyone who doesnt deal with it regularly can be traumatizing). Paying the folks who are expected to be the initial point people for it a touch more kinda makes sense.

 

[RogueWarrior65]

I can't come into work for a month because my goldfish died.
The facepalm is strong with this one.

 

[seek3r]

I agree he ranks just behind Lincoln. FDR is second worst, with Lincoln being the worst.

I particularly like how FDR rounded up U.S. Citizens, dispossessed them, and then jailed them for existing. No crime, no trial, no conviction...just lock them up like the racist he was.

You think lincoln was the worst president in US history…? Are you trolling?

 

[GizmoDVD]

FDR...second worst President ever. Not exactly someone we should use as a model form society.

Reddit users love spouting that FDR line from 100 years ago like it matters now.

 

[monstermash]

You think lincoln was the worst president in US history…? Are you trolling?

No. Are you?

But I don't think we're supposed to talk about politics in here - I guess it offends some people.

 

[ender78]

If American and Canadian and Mexican companies and restaurants paid a proper wage, tipping would not be a thing.

So do you propose that everyone should be paid the same wage? A clerk in a store should make the same as the engineer who developed the product? If these mall jobs paid $60,000 or $70,000 per year, plus all the benefits and time off they are looking for, then you would need a second job to be able to afford your iPhone!

We all make different contributions to society. That said, there should be a baseline, that everyone makes. If out society was not so profit driven, especially with publicly traded companies, more of a companies profit go to one of its most important stakeholders, their employees. Minimum wage was intended to provide enough to live on, not just to survive on.

 

[monstermash]

We all make different contributions to society. That said, there should be a baseline, that everyone makes. If out society was not so profit driven, especially with publicly traded companies, more of a companies profit go to one of its most important stakeholders, their employees. Minimum wage was intended to provide enough to live on, not just to survive on.

Look a non-profit-driven countries throughout history and report back on how most people lived.

 

[rippley5150]

I believe Mr. Pink said it best:
I don't tip because society says I have to. All right, if someone deserves a tip, if they really put forth an effort, I'll give them something a little something extra. But this tipping automatically, it's for the birds. As far as I'm concerned, they're just doing their job.

 

[willzyx]

10% salary increase - absolutely. With record profits, Apple can and should absolutely increase pay for all employees, especially with this inflation.

Tips - F OFF. How long until they'll tell people to tip for parking meters? Enough with this stupid tipping culture.

 

[CarAnalogy]

I believe Mr. Pink said it best:
I don't tip because society says I have to. All right, if someone deserves a tip, if they really put forth an effort, I'll give them something a little something extra. But this tipping automatically, it's for the birds. As far as I'm concerned, they're just doing their job.

Immediately followed by him throwing in for the tip anyway because even the other hardened criminals thought that was a bit too far.

 

[CarAnalogy]

Look a non-profit-driven countries throughout history and report back on how most people lived.

This is why economics is complicated. The best combination we've found is a free market economy WITH government regulations. Too much in either direction doesn't work. The tendency under both systems is for all the wealth to accumulate at the top. Raw capitalism results in just as much poverty for the average person as does a totally centralized economy. It's all a matter of incentives.

Not sure universal basic income would work because we essentially tried that during covid and the theory was proven correct that it doesn't work because inflation simply catches up to income. But on the other hand just letting companies pay people slave wages because there's always more pawns to burn through isn't good for society either.

 

[monstermash]

I believe Mr. Pink said it best:
I don't tip because society says I have to. All right, if someone deserves a tip, if they really put forth an effort, I'll give them something a little something extra. But this tipping automatically, it's for the birds. As far as I'm concerned, they're just doing their job.

I was going to post that video of the best movie scene of any movie ever (possible exception "do I amuse you" scene from Good Fellas) earlier - but you know....