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Spindel

macrumors 6502a
Oct 5, 2020
521
655
I will do nothing but enjoy my M1 Mini (that is yet to arrive).

I’m moving from a 2013 iMac, so my track record shows I’m in no hurry to switch, as long as my system works, as long it is supported.

But it will be nice when I get my M1, the performance increase for me will be immense.
 

djlythium

macrumors 65816
Jun 11, 2014
1,170
1,619
Wait for the M16! It’ll be killer! ?

SRSLY, though, my 2016 13” i5 MBP was doing the job with very few issues only in unique circumstances, and I just upgraded to the equivalent of a $3k 16” MBP. This new M1 is so overkill for my workload that I’m presuming it should last me another four years at least before I upgrade again.
 

Realityck

macrumors G4
Nov 9, 2015
11,422
17,214
Silicon Valley, CA
Or maybe you’re holding back from snapping up a machine now, preferring to wait for 2021?

What might influence your decision to upgrade? Faster CPU, dGPU, 32Gb RAM, 14”/16”?

As for me, I’m pretty sure the base Air would do me just fine and I have the urge to pick one up from a non-Apple store this week. However, I also want to hold on until my 16gb Air arrives mid-Dec in case Parallels actually release a stable Win 10 environment that demands it. The former would make me feel better about upgrading to M2 if appropriate. The latter would make me feel like I have a capable enough tool already.

What do you see yourselves doing?
M1 vs M2, we don't even have any information about what more powerful configurations will consist of. For me its what Apple comes forward with to replace a 16" MacBook Pro + discrete GPU, or what Apple comes forward with to replace a 27" iMac. No disrespect to any M1 Air/Mini/13" MacBook Pro fans but that is the lowest rung of Apple Mac line. It phenomenal how they are performing, but that just makes me want more with what I own now against Apple Silicon. :cool:
 

Jpoon

macrumors 6502a
Feb 26, 2008
553
38
I have the M1 MacBook.

I've developed on Apple machines since 2007 and program at the lowest level possible in Metal, in 2007 I was also an Apple employee...
Your application is really sweet, so I'm going to plug it: https://cocoasplit.com I can see myself using this for several things it seems that this was not correct and I was kindly corrected with a post on my profile, lol. That is a little aggressive I think... you could have just direct messaged me. @morelightning
 
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Wolfmore

macrumors regular
Sep 13, 2008
131
44
I will probably sell my M1 on Facebook market place and upgrade to M2. I’m confident resale value will be high and easy to sell. Lots of people waiting to buy preowned M1’s, if not I’ll keep it for longer. Don’t plan to give it away either.
 
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Tomassverak

macrumors newbie
Nov 23, 2020
2
0
I have already preordered the version with 16GB of RAM because I have been waiting for quite long time with my Macbook Pro 13” (early 2015). I might sell the new one once the M2 will arrive as I waited this year for 14” which is something I am really looking for.
 

Digital_Sousaphone

macrumors member
Jun 10, 2019
64
63
Autodesk is pretty lazy these days, so if by “in 3D” you mean Autodesk software, then there’s not much movement there with...anything. Maybe analytics updates! Adobe is almost as bad, for now.

Otherwise there’s a native version of Blender that’s pre-beta, and C4D is mostly ready I thought? ZBrush is not quite there yet last I saw.
Maya isn't much use to me in it's basic form. Zbrush has only said that it's an internal issue and if they release, they release. I won't be able to flip to Windows any time soon for the myriad of other programs that won't even bother to write Mac compatible software. Yeah, it's back to the PC for me it's looking like. :(
 

torncanvas

macrumors regular
Feb 14, 2006
121
73
Maya isn't much use to me in it's basic form. Zbrush has only said that it's an internal issue and if they release, they release. I won't be able to flip to Windows any time soon for the myriad of other programs that won't even bother to write Mac compatible software. Yeah, it's back to the PC for me it's looking like. :(
Yeah I’m in a similar situation, I had to switch due to the utter lack of VR support, and I tried hard to stay, preordering the developer eGPU kit and helping to beta test etc.

But thankfully my mobile computer has more flexibility, so I’ll jump back for that, at least once I lock down Big Sur’s phoning home (grr).
 

Lammers

macrumors 6502
Oct 30, 2013
449
345
macOS support for Intel will be dropped by 2024.
I’d say that’s very unlikely. Macs are officially declared “obsolete” after seven years and my understanding is that’s the point at which new macOS releases stop supporting them. Don’t see any reason why that would be different for Intel Macs.
 
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machinesworking

macrumors member
Jan 11, 2015
99
57
I've been saving this year for a new laptop, but I need the high end Macbook Pro, so I held off and bought a new iphone 12 max pro to replace my 6s+, and my first iPad Air. I pretty much need at least a 2TB SSD, and I'm hoping for 8 to 12 performance cores, not four. It's obvious to me that the 16" when it's released will easily last me the 8 years this 2012 has.
 

Ironman226

macrumors member
Oct 4, 2013
37
17
If you’ve already snapped up an M1, do you see yourself selling it on and upgrading to a 2nd gen device?

Are you purposely buying just the base model now so you feel ‘less’ invested for the above scenario? Or do you think the base will be enough to fend off the lure of M2 power?

Are you planning to keep your current M1 longer, and either expecting the base model to see you through or going 16gb for increased future-proofing?

Or maybe you’re holding back from snapping up a machine now, preferring to wait for 2021?

What might influence your decision to upgrade? Faster CPU, dGPU, 32Gb RAM, 14”/16”?

As for me, I’m pretty sure the base Air would do me just fine and I have the urge to pick one up from a non-Apple store this week. However, I also want to hold on until my 16gb Air arrives mid-Dec in case Parallels actually release a stable Win 10 environment that demands it. The former would make me feel better about upgrading to M2 if appropriate. The latter would make me feel like I have a capable enough tool already.

What do you see yourselves doing?
As a iOS developer, I want the M1 MacBook Air with 512 GB and 16GB of RAM to have a machine which I want now to test iOS app downloading and using under macOS. Maybe I will find a new ideas for new apps this way :)
 
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MacSSD

macrumors newbie
Oct 14, 2019
16
12
Nothing. My MBA M1 is too awesome to give up so soon. But I will upgrade in 3 years to whatever Apple is offering at that time.
 

Schizoid

macrumors 65816
May 29, 2008
1,074
1,352
UK
Do you think it’ll be something like M1 (MBA, MBP 13 & Mini) P1 (MBP 16 & iMac) and X1 (Mac Pro)?
then they all get bumped the following year?
If so, I’ll wait for P3...
 

MayaTlab

macrumors 6502
Dec 12, 2007
320
302
I'll buy an 8gb MBA or MBP (depending on the actual display quality) and then patiently wait until Apple releases mini-LED displays notebooks with an extensive redesign and the inevitable first gen problems are ironed out.
 

rajador

macrumors member
Mar 23, 2010
44
30
I will pass m1 since I am a desktop computer guy. If apple renews the design of the 2021 Imac and allows video input to use the imac screen with my windows work laptop, I am in. Otherwise, i will invest my cash in a ryzen9+navi2 machine to get real performance and will keep a partition with bigsur to release the stress of using windows ?
 

richinaus

macrumors 68020
Oct 26, 2014
2,432
2,186
10% off here at present makes the M1 very tempting........ just for playing with really.
My intentions were to hold off to the M2 or whatever it is called for a 14” MBP. That hits the sweet spot for my intended mac use moving forward [all pro work is PC based now].
 

LiE_

macrumors 68000
Mar 23, 2013
1,717
5,570
UK
I think a redesign is more likely to make people upgrade than an arbitrary spec bump. Unless your M1 isn’t meeting your needs today.
 

Marshall73

macrumors 68030
Apr 20, 2015
2,713
2,837
I got the M1 because it fits my use requirements perfectly. I had been using a late 2016 MacBook Pro and iPad Pro 2018 12.9 as my primary machines for about a year now. I no longer needed windows apps so got rid of VMware fusion. I keep a windows machine in the office which I can access via VPN and Remote Desktop if I need to test things or create user guides which require screenshots of windows apps or settings.

I had been looking to downsize to an Air but was put off by the thermal issues with the latest intel processors. The Air has a small enough form factor and allows me to do everything I need to on a daily basis.

so, I bought an M1 Air with 512GB storage and will use it until it dies, at which point I will get the latest Air or similar to replace it. I will certainly follow the new chip releases as I am a fan of tech and hope Apple pushes the industry forward with their higher powered desktop chips but I have no need or intention to buy them ?
 

Hexley

Suspended
Jun 10, 2009
1,641
505
I’d say that’s very unlikely. Macs are officially declared “obsolete” after seven years and my understanding is that’s the point at which new macOS releases stop supporting them. Don’t see any reason why that would be different for Intel Macs.
Antecedent

Jun 2005 - WWDC 2005 keynote declares transition from PowerPC to Intel.
Aug 2009 - Mac OS X v10.6 "Snow Leopard" released as Intel-only, removing support for the PowerPC architecture.

Likely future

Jun 2020 - WWDC 2020 keynote declares transition from Intel to Apple Silicon.
??? 2024 - macOS 11.4 released as Apple Silicon-only, removing support for the Intel architecture.

Bye bye Hackintosh...

By 2024 will AMD/Intel be relevant?

A less than 15W TDP M1 mobile chip can outperform a 125W TDP chip like a Core i9 desktop chip with a 225W TDP Radeon Pro 5700 XT.

I would not be surprised to see a 125W TDP Apple Silicon chip to match or exceed Threadripper 3900-Series and RTX 30-Series

When Apple labels a product as "obsolete" it means they do not have parts on hand to service it. So my 16" can still be repaired up to 2027.

Don’t see any reason why that would be different for Intel Macs.
 
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jambon

macrumors regular
Jul 15, 2010
191
224
London
Sell me M1 Mini and get the rumoured 14 inch MBP when it materialises, which is hopefully in Spring 2021 with the M2/M1X or whatever it will be called. Mini has been great to experience M1 but think I'll want some portability long term.
 

Yebubbleman

macrumors 603
May 20, 2010
6,024
2,617
Los Angeles, CA
Staying on a Mac forums, will do that to you. Windows too has its fair share of update doomsday, its just u will never hear of it unless u go to pc websites.

...which I do frequently. Not only that, but I check the "Known Issues" page on each Windows 10 release before installing said release. Most of the issues don't apply to me (nor do they apply to the vast majority of users). It's honestly not bad. I started using Windows 10 with the Anniversary Update (v1607), which came out in July of 2016 - the tail end of El Capitan's run as the latest OS X/macOS release. There's only been one problem free version of macOS since then. I've used every Windows 10 release since 1607 and have only really disliked one (1709). They did have to pull 1809, but the revised version was pretty good after the first month. When Apple releases suck, they tend to stay that way for their entirety.

You mean because Microsoft's QC is currently and historically unimpeachable?

Why so black-and-white? There's a difference between "unimpeachable" and "better than Apple's". Historically, Microsoft's QC was worse. Now, they don't make sweeping changes to their OS that disrupt everything under the hood every Windows 10 release the way Apple does every year. Microsoft's QC isn't unimpeachable, but it IS better than Apple's right now and I direct you to both Catalina and High Sierra as recent evidence of that.


This is Apple's biggest problem, their current software QA standards.

When M2 comes out, I will evaluate Apple's macOS QA track record.

Their declining macOS QA has kept me running Mojave on my Mac mini 2018 despite the fact that TWO major releases have arrived.

I still periodically install the latest and greatest on a "disposable" external SSD to evaluate the software. Within an hour or so, I always switch back to my Mojave boot drive.

For sure, I will never run Crapalina on my Mac. It was a POS from the start and after the minor improvements it received over a year, it will no longer get any better.

My guess is that I will upgrade to Big Sur sometime in Q2 2021.

Windows 10 is no walk in the park. Version 1903 was a freakin' train wreck and 2004 (a.k.a. May 2020) had a poor reputation. I installed 2004 a couple of months ago and upgraded to 20H2 (a.k.a. October 2020) just recently. My primary Wintel PC (a gaming system) never ran 2004.

It feels like with every two Windows 10 bugs that are quashed, Microsoft introduces three new ones. Their software QA has also gone down the toilet. They should really stick to one feature release per year instead of two.

I only had a couple of issues with 1903/1909; and they were entirely RDP/Hyper-V related. On systems that I wasn't using those functions with, I had no issues with either version. Similarly, my run on 2004 has been pretty uneventful and seamless. I've never had a Windows 10 release that gave me the kind of headaches that Catalina and High Sierra did. I'll agree that Microsoft could stand to do one release per year instead of two, though I'm happy that it's seeming like the cadence is such that the fall release is the refinement release (fitting in with Windows 10 Enterprise's fall releases having an extra year of support) that's basically a service pack to the spring release. If the cadence is increased, the number of changes needs to go down.

The difference being that they run a rolling release, and force you update, whereas Mac users can uncheck a single box and camp on a single version of MacOS.

You're no longer forced until the version you are on hits end of support (1.5 years). Incidentally, Apple only provides two years of support for any given macOS release on top of the year in which it is the current (and sticking with an unsupported macOS release isn't much better than being on an unsupported Windows release). So, sure, you can uncheck that checkbox and be stubborn, but it's REALLY not a good idea.


Currently typing this on a high end 2017 MBP15, and sitting on a significant upgrade budget. If something significantly more powerful (particularly in GPU) than a loaded Intel MBP16 is in the offing or rumored by end of Q1, I might wait for it. But I do use BootCamp and Autodesk and plenty of other not-soon-ported x86 applications, and so I'm leaning towards getting the Last Best Intel MBP and holding on to it for at least 2-3 years until the transition is stabler.

I'd honestly get an Intel Mac, given your use case. Incidentally, I'm in a similar boat. Plus, working in IT, Boot Camp and x86 virtualization are both useful things that definitely won't be coming along for the ride with Apple Silicon.

Windows tends to have it's own issues...

No one is saying it doesn't. However, if you're comparing Windows issues and QC to macOS issues and QC, Apple's record is worse right now. I get that we're all Apple fanboys, but at least own up when your team is playing a crappy season!

Why? The entry level M1 Mac mini is $100 less than the entry level Intel Mac mini it replaced.

That said, you are probably better off saving money for a future purchase than attempting zero-interest financing.

Note that Apple does not take COLA price increases every year. Thus, if the new Mac model ___ costs the same as the equivalent from two years ago, today's model is actually cheaper when adjusted for inflation.

I've had Macs since the Nineties. They were all desktop models back then of course but even a more moderately priced unit was about $2000.

You do realize that we're in the middle of an economy-crippling pandemic, right? I can't afford an entry level Mac mini right now. And when I'm employed, I usually make enough to buy one with a single day's worth of work. Don't finance-shame people in the middle of an economic downturn unless you're buying.

Antecedent

Jun 2005 - WWDC 2005 keynote declares transition from PowerPC to Intel.
Aug 2009 - Mac OS X v10.6 "Snow Leopard" released as Intel-only, removing support for the PowerPC architecture.

Likely future

Jun 2020 - WWDC 2020 keynote declares transition from Intel to Apple Silicon.
??? 2024 - macOS 11.4 released as Apple Silicon-only, removing support for the Intel architecture.

Bye bye Hackintosh...

By 2024 will AMD/Intel be relevant?

A less than 15W TDP M1 mobile chip can outperform a 125W TDP chip like a Core i9 desktop chip.

I would not be surprised to see a 125W TDP Apple Silicon chip to outdo Threadripper 3900-Series and RTX 30-Series

When Apple labels a product as "obsolete" it means they do not have parts on hand to service it. So my 16" can still be repaired up to 2027.

Don’t see any reason why that would be different for Intel Macs.

You do realize that:

(a) Macs during the era of the PowerPC-to-Intel transition (on both ends of the transition) were not rated to last anywhere near as long as they do now (in terms of total time being able to run the latest release of macOS); Apple would support Macs for 5 years; now they're supporting them for 8 years (with them still being usable for two years thereafter with security updates for their final supported macOS release)

(b) The PowerPC-to-Intel transition is not the Intel-to-Apple-Silicon transition. 2005-06 is not 2020-2022. Steve Jobs was able to complete the former transition in a year. Tim Cook (Federighi and Srouji) are going to need all two years to complete the latter transition as evidenced by the fact that the M1 still has limitations preventing it from replacing every Intel Mac.

(c) Four years is not enough time for Intel and AMD to become irrelevant. A TON of things would need to happen in an impossibly short time (the development of an SoC not made by Apple, but still powerful enough to convince PC OEMS and software developers that Windows 10 for ARM64 is a superior platform to develop for when compared to Windows 10 for x86-64 being not least among them).

right?

Also, you only get 7 years of being able to order parts for a product if you're in the state of California or the nation of Turkey. Everywhere else, it's 5 years.

You're correct about this being the end of Hackintoshes; though, that end won't be immediate. Certainly, I'd build a 10th Gen Intel based Hackintosh while the parts still exist...
 
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Andysapple

macrumors member
Nov 18, 2020
67
72
I'll probably keep my M1 MacBook Air for good while. I bought it because my previous Pro 2017 started to behave really weird after dropping it on the floor and the battery was up for service and out of warranty. Hope this lasts longer.
 
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