Who has or is planning to get an electric car / EV Talk

[JT2002TJ]

@wonderings im going to throw something in here since you don’t have home charging and you live in a cold climate: winter will make a difference. I am only going to posts here and in other forums, I have no personal experience as I’m in California and done have to deal with extreme cold… but maybe @JT2002TJ can provide some more info…

Yes. I gave the 30%, but secretly it was my winter usage (NYC area). I actually use about 25% in the summer for my commute. In the summer, since I have cabin overheat protection mode on, I use more than I would if I had it off. So maybe it would be closer to 20%.

But, to be honest, the heat pump versions are better for winter (my TM3 does not have a heat pump, my TMY does). The TM3 is my wife's car (it used to be mine), she only uses about 10%-20% per day.

We have 1 L2 40 Amp charger at home. I get home, charge her car, about an hour later I move the cable to mine and leave it charging overnight (about 2.5 hrs of charging).

Also, I precondition in the with my TMY plugged into the charger, so in the winter it warms up my car using the home electricity, not battery. So, this will not be the same experience without a l2 home charger (L1 is not enough power to do it).

 

[skottichan]

You mean the Ultiums? I’d be surprised if we see them before 2026 tbh
I’ve had my EUV since Nov 22 and love it

I freely admit, my frustration is that I just want the newest and shiniest tech. So far (just shy of 3 months) our EUV has been a blast, and we have zero regrets.

 

[wonderings]

@wonderings im going to throw something in here since you don’t have home charging and you live in a cold climate: winter will make a difference. I am only going to posts here and in other forums, I have no personal experience as I’m in California and done have to deal with extreme cold… but maybe @JT2002TJ can provide some more info…

Thanks, and I do understand winter has an effect on batteries and range. My driving while a little further then JT's has almost little traffic and never bumper to bumper traffic. Basically all back country roads. My thought is everyday I am in the office I just plug the car in and let it charge till I am heading home again. General days are 10 hours so I imagine every day when I leave work I would be at 80% charge as it was recommended to do this rather than a full charge.

 

[JT2002TJ]

Thanks, and I do understand winter has an effect on batteries and range. My driving while a little further then JT's has almost little traffic and never bumper to bumper traffic. Basically all back country roads. My thought is everyday I am in the office I just plug the car in and let it charge till I am heading home again. General days are 10 hours so I imagine every day when I leave work I would be at 80% charge as it was recommended to do this rather than a full charge.

Also note, that with an EV, you use more energy the faster you go. So, driving 30 miles at 70 mph will use significantly more energy than driving 30 miles at 30 mph, assuming the same trip.

 

[hobowankenobi]

Also they eat through bushes, eat tyres with the geometry setup, and driveshaft vibrations are crazy. Every single time I test drove one the vibrations were there.

95K on my 2018 Tesla Model 3. None of those issues. Not sure if I am just lucky, or others abuse their cars...or what.

Even the the tire this is a head scratcher. I got more than 50K on the first set of tires. No drifting or burn outs though, fairly boring.

 

[Eric5h5]

Also note, that with an EV, you use more energy the faster you go. So, driving 30 miles at 70 mph will use significantly more energy than driving 30 miles at 30 mph, assuming the same trip.

That's just how physics works, it's not unique to EVs. Pushing all that air out of the way requires energy.

 

[JT2002TJ]

That's just how physics works, it's not unique to EVs. Pushing all that air out of the way requires energy.

Yes, but… With EVs the range is way more affected by speed than ICE. People typically don’t think about slowing down from 60 mph or 50 mph in a car for range, it is something that regularly comes up in EVs if you are on a trip between chargers.

There are a lot more options to fuel up in an ICE, so it is less of a concern.

 

[JT2002TJ]

95K on my 2018 Tesla Model 3. None of those issues. Not sure if I am just lucky, or others abuse their cars...or what.

Even the the tire this is a head scrather. I got more than 50K on the first set of tires. No drifting or burn outs though, fairly boring.

My 2019 TM3 and 2021 TMY are on the original tires, I bought them used with 20k miles. My TMY is 35k now, my TM3 is at 31k.

I make sure I am already moving before I get on it hard (less likely to slip), and try to make sure my tires are gradually warmed up.

 

[I7guy]

Also note, that with an EV, you use more energy the faster you go. So, driving 30 miles at 70 mph will use significantly more energy than driving 30 miles at 30 mph, assuming the same trip.

Same with an ice vehicle. With petrol you pay for it at the pump. With evs you notice due to efficiency. Harder to tell ice although there are plenty of studies that have information related to drag.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

I don’t know how the roads are where you are nor how people drive, but me being on the east coast of the US do not know any Tesla owners where tires are eaten through or there is a drivetrain vibration. If you flog any car hard enough it will ear through tires - you know those people who treat their cars as if they had two speeds, on or off.

TMX Very common situation.

And those people whose cars can do that type of acceleration, the tires are just as expensive as EV tires. My son just had the tires on his civic replace and the total cost was a bit under $250 a tire. The tires on my TM3 are $350 installed.

Absolutely, no argument from me against that.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

In the US, taxes are not included in advertised prices. One reason is that the tax rate, which ranges from about 0 - 10%, various across many localities. Each state has different tax rates and then individual cites can levy their own additional taxes. It would be complicated to get the prices right if you included taxes.

I know I'm familiar with how the US works, the other poster doesn't seem to be familiar how the rest of the world works though. Nor that when you are comparing in the same jurisdiction the same included price it is relatively the same. That was just odd as it is basic maths.

Now on the other point, taxes aren't the same in each EU country either, yet we manage to list prices including tax. It really doesn't have to be complicated, or about complication, it is more about habit and that the consumer knows exactly what they pay.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

I'm not sure how many folks realize that OE EV tires tend to not have the same tread depth as the off the shelf version.

I did not know that. Anything to collaborate on that?

Tire pricing IIRC is basically a wash, as far as OE vs Non-OE is concerned. Now tire sizes and types matter a lot. Tesla's use fairly expensive tires, most econo-boxes do not. I'd say Teslas are closer to BMW or Mercedes on tire choices and pricing than Honda or Toyota.

I never like skimping on what helps you stay on the road. Ultimately, more powerful vehicle require better tyres. And better tyres are pricier.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

I don't mean to interrupt the current conversation, but a a new EV owner (Bolt EUV), what trip planners do you guys use? The onboard ones or a third party?

Could depend on your car. The onboard system of AAOS (Android Automotive Operating System) as seen on many electric cars, Google Maps does an excellent job. Done a round trip of about 4,000Km across Europe using just that.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

95K on my 2018 Tesla Model 3. None of those issues. Not sure if I am just lucky, or others abuse their cars...or what.

Even the the tire this is a head scratcher. I got more than 50K on the first set of tires. No drifting or burn outs though, fairly boring.

Sorry TMX that is. Very well documented.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Tesla busy price stunting again to get rid of stock. RWD Models are now below the subsidy barrier, get reduced lease rates, and get free supercharging (for 20K miles) in my region.

I'm always critical, but there is no denying it is incredible value for money.

 

[diamond.g]

Same with an ice vehicle. With petrol you pay for it at the pump. With evs you notice due to efficiency. Harder to tell ice although there are plenty of studies that have information related to drag.

Yeah ICE also have multiple gear ratios. (It is how Tacans get awesome range as well)

I did not know that. Anything to collaborate on that?

Tire Rack will show the tread depth if you look at the specs for the tire. It is easiest to see with the Pilot Sport 4S where the Tesla OE version as 9/32 tread depth vs the 9.5/32 of the non Tesla tire. Yes in this case it isn't a huge amount. I think the Honda MXM4 has a 10/32 TD vs 8/32 of the Tesla version.

 

[diamond.g]

Most EVs are 400V architecture so won't take in more than 150kW.

My Ford EV (400V) at Tesla Superchargers will max out around 120 kW.

View attachment 2385956
Next EV will look at getting an 800V battery car like the Porsche Taycan....

Does Ford show the Wattage and Amperage when DC Fast charging? Your Ford should be seeing ~200kW if it accepts the full 500A.

 

[4sallypat]

Does Ford show the Wattage and Amperage when DC Fast charging? Your Ford should be seeing ~200kW if it accepts the full 500A.

No, Fords only show the kWh rate.
Ford F150 Lightnings have been seen to max out around 150kWh rate for a short period.

I do notice that Tesla's Superchargers are much quicker to charge than the CCS1 DCFC of other brands.

Maybe it's because of the shorter, thinner, liquid cooled cables of Tesla chargers ???

Even Rivians have joined in the Tesla party!

 

[HSVBamaBob]

I am SOOOOO ready to get an EV.
And while I looked at others, it is very hard to beat a Tesla.
Just the "gimmicks" alone are a attractive (and I am not a gimmick guy).
It is so UN-like a car.

I am not going in blind, Engineering Explained has great critical videos on his experience with EV's.
He does a good job of a neutral review of the basic, and is critical of somethings, but so far not enough salt to discount a Tesla.

In past I was considering a Leaf and a Volt (and other plug-in). Ironically Prius Plugin is not on lots in Texas, dealer does not say why.
And I do not go to country like I used to, so almost all in a (very big) city.

What you fine folks think?

Before you buy a Tesla, take a look at the Ford Mustang Mach E GT

We have had ours since last November and absolutely love this car. It’s the best car I have ever owned!

 

[I7guy]

Yeah ICE also have multiple gear ratios. (It is how Tacans get awesome range as well)

Tire Rack will show the tread depth if you look at the specs for the tire. It is easiest to see with the Pilot Sport 4S where the Tesla OE version as 9/32 tread depth vs the 9.5/32 of the non Tesla tire. Yes in this case it isn't a huge amount. I think the Honda MXM4 has a 10/32 TD vs 8/32 of the Tesla version.

I think I read somewhere that dual motor Teslas (probably other evs as well) can turn off ( or at least vary the liad)the front motors when cruising to save battery. Of course with instant torque when you need the power it’s there.

 

[4sallypat]

Before you buy a Tesla, take a look at the Ford Mustang Mach E GT

We have had ours since last November and absolutely love this car. It’s the best car I have ever owned!

Agree - we test drove a '23 Tesla and could not find a way to drive it 2PD.

Tesla only allows 1PD driving.

That's why we went with a Mustang Mach E - can drive it 1PD or 2PD as it should be.

 

[JT2002TJ]

I think I read somewhere that dual motor Teslas (probably other evs as well) can turn off ( or at least vary the liad)the front motors when cruising to save battery. Of course with instant torque when you need the power it’s there.

You are correct. Dual motor TM3/Ys are RWD until the computer decides the front is needed.

 

[JT2002TJ]

I know I'm familiar with how the US works, the other poster doesn't seem to be familiar how the rest of the world works though. Nor that when you are comparing in the same jurisdiction the same included price it is relatively the same. That was just odd as it is basic maths.

Now on the other point, taxes aren't the same in each EU country either, yet we manage to list prices including tax. It really doesn't have to be complicated, or about complication, it is more about habit and that the consumer knows exactly what they pay.

I absolutely understand how the rest of the world works. I didn’t grow up in the US. I am not advocating for or against including taxes in the LISTED price. But, what I AM saying is, you cannot include taxes in describing the cost of the vehicle to people outside of your local tax zone because of the differences in import fees, duties and local taxes. An item has a MSRP of a specific amount. This is what needs to be discussed across tax/countries. The example I gave is of Singapore which I grew up regularly going to. They have excessive taxes on vehicles, and rules limiting the number of vehicles in the country. This requires the removal of a vehicle to bring in a new vehicle. If I was to spend time arguing that TMYs are $300,000 USD because I lived in Singapore, it would mean nothing to people in the UK or the US.

A vehicle has a value that the manufacturer sells it at (MSRP). This is increased by whatever your locale adds onto it. In order to have an apples to apples conversation. A vehicle should be held to the standard of the MSRP during international discussions.

So… I stand by my point. The value of a TMS Plaid is now $90k USD. If you have to pay more, because of taxes, it is not all of a sudden a vehicle that has the interior of a $150k car, it is still a $90k car with taxes that unfortunately price it to $150k.

 

[JT2002TJ]

Agree - we test drove a '23 Tesla and could not find a way to drive it 2PD.

Tesla only allows 1PD driving.

That's why we went with a Mustang Mach E - can drive it 1PD or 2PD as it should be.

There is no way to shut off regen with Tesla‘s. You can buy S3XY buttons (an aftermarket set of wireless buttons) to adjust the regen settings that Tesla took away (you used to be able to set it to low). I think it is like how ICE vehicles are starting to make it more difficult to shut of auto stop/start as they are trying to ensure they meet the efficiency ratings.

I have a feeling that once you get used to 1PD in your Mach E (if you give it an honest chance), you may not want to go back to 2PD. Most people I know with EVs find it hard to go back.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

I absolutely understand how the rest of the world works. I didn’t grow up in the US. I am not advocating for or against including taxes in the LISTED price. But, what I AM saying is, you cannot include taxes in describing the cost of the vehicle to people outside of your local tax zone because of the differences in import fees, duties and local taxes. An item has a MSRP of a specific amount. This is what needs to be discussed across tax/countries. The example I gave is of Singapore which I grew up regularly going to. They have excessive taxes on vehicles, and rules limiting the number of vehicles in the country. This requires the removal of a vehicle to bring in a new vehicle. If I was to spend time arguing that TMYs are $300,000 USD because I lived in Singapore, it would mean nothing to people in the UK or the US.

A vehicle has a value that the manufacturer sells it at (MSRP). This is increased by whatever your locale adds onto it. In order to have an apples to apples conversation. A vehicle should be held to the standard of the MSRP during international discussions.

So… I stand by my point. The value of a TMS Plaid is now $90k USD. If you have to pay more, because of taxes, it is not all of a sudden a vehicle that has the interior of a $150k car, it is still a $90k car with taxes that unfortunately price it to $150k.

I wasn’t comparing internationally using two different prices. You are just shifting the goal posts to try and make it stick whilst what you reacted to made no sense. And you are still missing the point that relatively that doesn’t matter. Yes Singapore is an expensive car country, although due to different pressures then a UK, and different again then a Netherlands. And as is a Germany which is in the EU next to the Netherlands. Australia is similar, but the origin of the car has a role to play as well. And you can’t buy the car without tax. Only USA presents cars without tax, but even then that doesn’t represent the true global value that represents the price they are willing to sell in your market. As such that has no bearing on what you are suggesting and provides no comparison. That price is determined based on all sorts of other factors.

Conparing internationally just doesn’t work. Comparing against what else is available on one’s own market does work. And that is exactly what I did.

Besides you state yourself that never buy new. You don’t even buy in that segment. Yet you seem to know everything about it when it comes down to Tesla 🤷‍♂️🤣