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Why Macs are better than PC's?

PowerMac G4 MDD said:
How is it false? Have you ever f*cked around with Disk Manager or Windows' entire networking approach? It's horrendous. Even Linux, in all its barbarity, has better system managers than Windows does. I've had plenty of experience dealing with Windows and Windows machines. In fact, my first computer was a Windows PC (utter piece of garbage), and I currently own over a dozen of them.
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That doesn't make it less flexible than what OS X offers though, lol. Sorry bud, but you're not putting up a strong case right now.

It's ok though, because it doesn't matter. You use whatever OS satisfies your needs or wants and so will everyone else. But OS X is still pretty locked down... and only going to get worse with Rootless in El Capitan.
 
bladerunner2000 said:
Processor on that alone costs $310. GPU on that machine is useless, but goes for $100. 16GB of RAM should go for around $80. Big question is the motherboard (cost is likely around $100). Then all the other parts (PSU, cooling, optical drive, mouse, keyboard, case, etc). What Dell is charging is actually a fair price.

I'd still rather build my own, and glad I did, my PC/Hackintosh build runs almost completely silent.
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Plus $100 for a Windows licence and you are in for at least $800.

Yes, I would definitely build my own too but I just wanted to show that it is not always cheaper.
And I agree that the card is a dud but I just wanted to use it as an example.
 
xWhiplash said:
Like I said, that is on sale. I can spend a whole year building one that is cheaper if I get the individual parts on sale too.

Plus, I have had XPS systems in the past like that. They are not very well built. I had a couple that had power supplies pop and smoke.
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The price before the sale is still decent, so it really doesn't matter much. What you get out of an iMac though is pretty limiting... and you're stuck with that display forever.

Let's not forget the absolute garbage GPU Apple always throws in. Whether its the craptacular mobile GPU in the iMac or those weak Dxxx series Fire Pros in the Mac Pros, you are SCREWED with those permanently. THAT is the #1 reason I'll never buy another Mac Pro.
 
z31fanatic said:
Plus $100 for a Windows licence and you are in for at least $800.

Yes, I would definitely build my own too but I just wanted to show that it is not always cheaper.
And I agree that the card is a dud but I just wanted to use it as an example.
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Let's not forget labour costs for whomever to put it together. Took me around 3 hours to build my rig with POST test and unboxing everything as well as cleanup and Windows install.
 
bladerunner2000 said:
The price before the sale is still decent, so it really doesn't matter much. What you get out of an iMac though is pretty limiting... and you're stuck with that display forever.
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I didn't say it wasn't. But adding up all the individual components (without getting sales on them on Newegg) would cost about $800. That is less than the original price so again it is still cheaper to build it yourself outside of specials and sales.

And like I said, you can spend a year and get really good deals on Newegg and spend even less when you get each component on sale.

Or you can use eBay and get some used parts for cheaper.
 
xWhiplash said:
I didn't say it wasn't. But adding up all the individual components (without getting sales on them on Newegg) would cost about $800. That is less than the original price so again it is still cheaper to build it yourself outside of specials and sales.

And like I said, you can spend a year and get really good deals on Newegg and spend even less when you get each component on sale.
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Of course, but thats a lot of bargain shopping and would take you a while. I'd rather just fork over a little extra money and get it over with.
 
bladerunner2000 said:
Of course, but thats a lot of bargain shopping and would take you a while. I'd rather just fork over a little extra money and get it over with.
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And that is the same reason I like to get Macs. I like OS X and I do not want to custom build stuff. I am not a fan of any other PC manufacturer. I had had bad experiences with most of them.

Plus, like you said, it takes time to build the system when the parts do arrive. I like just pressing "Order" and have it all ready when it arrives.

My argument was why everybody complains about Apple when they "can build a cheaper system". Like I said, if you are determined enough and shop the sales, you can ALWAYS build a cheaper system than ANYTHING. Not just macs. So why are Macs the only ones part of that argument? We all know you can build a better system than a Mac. Just like you can with Dell, HP, ...
 
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xWhiplash said:
And that is the same reason I like to get Macs. I like OS X and I do not want to custom build stuff. I am not a fan of any other PC manufacturer. I had had bad experiences with most of them.

Plus, like you said, it takes time to build the system when the parts do arrive. I like just pressing "Order" and have it all ready when it arrives.

My argument was why everybody complains about Apple when they "can build a cheaper system". Like I said, if you are determined enough and shop the sales, you can ALWAYS build a cheaper system than ANYTHING. Not just macs. So why are Macs the only ones part of that argument? We all know you can build a better system than a Mac. Just like you can with Dell, HP, ...
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Ok but the difference between custom build and any comparable Mac isn't 'a little'.... it's a lot. And I mean a LOT. If I wanted to get the same performance out of a Mac Pro from a custom PC build, I'd be paying about 1/3rd the price.... which is what I paid for mine build.

So a few hours of fiddling around with a custom build is very much worth the money. I mean, is 3 hours of your time really worth 2 thousand dollars just to have Apple ship it all in one go for you?
 
bladerunner2000 said:
Ok but the difference between custom build and any comparable Mac isn't 'a little'.... it's a lot. And I mean a LOT. If I wanted to get the same performance out of a Mac Pro from a custom PC build, I'd be paying about 1/3rd the price.... which is what I paid for mine build.

So a few hours of fiddling around with a custom build is very much worth the money. I mean, is 3 hours of your time really worth 2 thousand dollars just to have Apple ship it all in one go for you?
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Yes it is. What of one of your parts go bad? It is way more than 3 hours at that point. There is no 100% guarantee that your stuff will work 100%. If I get a Mac and it doesn't work, it doesn't take hours of diagnostics on MY part and ordering specific replacement parts.

About the price difference. The same can be said with a $4,000 Dell Workstation. Or a $3,600 Alienware.
 
xWhiplash said:
Yes it is. What of one of your parts go bad? It is way more than 3 hours at that point. There is no 100% guarantee that your stuff will work 100%. If I get a Mac and it doesn't work, it doesn't take hours of diagnostics on MY part and ordering specific replacement parts.
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You're not getting a 100% guarantee that your Mac will work either. I'm sure it's happened before where a Mac was shipped defective, or shortly after messed up. But I can tell you this; my motherboard went through a 168 hour burn test before it was shipped to the retailer, which pretty much guarantees a working mobo.

But let's say that one of my parts does crap out. Ok, I'm on my own. But I know my way around hardware real well so it won't take me long to figure out. Let's say it's my GPU that fizzled out. No biggie; I get an RMA, done. Some manufacturers will even send you a replacement part with another box to ship back the defective part. Even if they didn't, I could always resort to the oboard GPU or use something else off the shelf.

With Apple the story is very different. And I know firsthand because I had the GPU in my 2011 MBP fry on me. I handed Apple my MacBook Pro for diagnosis, the GPU was in fact dead, and the repair cost me $600 CAD. But not just the GPU, it needed a whole new motherboard as its soldered. I was without a computer for 3 weeks as they needed a replacement mobo shipped out to me. Now, your immediate argument is going to be 'but thats a laptop'. Sure, it is. But the GPU is also soldered on the iMac. And the GPUs on the Mac Pros are proprietary. And a whack load of other components are soldered on the Macs as well, if not proprietary in other areas.

So now while you have the comfort of Apple holding your hand throughout the process, you also have the pleasure of waiting ages for things to get fixed.... at a price premium.

About the price difference. The same can be said with a $4,000 Dell Workstation. Or a $3,600 Alienware.
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Sure, but that's not what we're comparing it to. You have a 'whopping' THREE choices for a desktop computer from Apple; Mac Mini, iMac and Mac Pro. That's it. In the Windows world you've got a plethora of options, so while you COULD spend as much as you would on a PC as you would on an Apple, you are NOT going to run into the same bottlenecks.
 
Frankly, Apple's desktop lineup right now kinda sucks.

The 21" iMacs have literally been downgraded from 7200rpm HDD's to 5400rpm HDD's. What on Earth possessed them to do that, I'll never know. A 1TB Fusion Drive or 256GB SSD is a $250 upgrade, as in F U. Same for the Mini (except the Server).

Even my 2007 20" iMac had a 7200rpm drive standard.

Apple's laptops are actually not bad value, but Apple needs to come correct on the Mini and the iMac. It is disgraceful.
 
bladerunner2000 said:
You're not getting a 100% guarantee that your Mac will work either. I'm sure it's happened before where a Mac was shipped defective, or shortly after messed up. But I can tell you this; my motherboard went through a 168 hour burn test before it was shipped to the retailer, which pretty much guarantees a working mobo.

But let's say that one of my parts does crap out. Ok, I'm on my own. But I know my way around hardware real well so it won't take me long to figure out. Let's say it's my GPU that fizzled out. No biggie; I get an RMA, done. Some manufacturers will even send you a replacement part with another box to ship back the defective part. Even if they didn't, I could always resort to the oboard GPU or use something else off the shelf.

With Apple the story is very different. And I know firsthand because I had the GPU in my 2011 MBP fry on me. I handed Apple my MacBook Pro for diagnosis, the GPU was in fact dead, and the repair cost me $600 CAD. But not just the GPU, it needed a whole new motherboard as its soldered. I was without a computer for 3 weeks as they needed a replacement mobo shipped out to me. Now, your immediate argument is going to be 'but thats a laptop'. Sure, it is. But the GPU is also soldered on the iMac. And the GPUs on the Mac Pros are proprietary. And a whack load of other components are soldered on the Macs as well, if not proprietary in other areas.

So now while you have the comfort of Apple holding your hand throughout the process, you also have the pleasure of waiting ages for things to get fixed.... at a price premium.



Sure, but that's not what we're comparing it to. You have a 'whopping' THREE choices for a desktop computer from Apple; Mac Mini, iMac and Mac Pro. That's it. In the Windows world you've got a plethora of options, so while you COULD spend as much as you would on a PC as you would on an Apple, you are NOT going to run into the same bottlenecks.
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You are comparing building your own vs getting a system from Apple. But how is that Apples fault or why are they the ONLY ones part of that argument? That is why I mentioned Dell workstations or Alienwares. The same can be said with them. I can build a cheaper system than an Alienware too. But no, it is only Apples fault because it is cool to hate on Apple?

If you know that much about hardware, good for you. Even though I like building my own systems sometimes, I hate doing diagnostics when things do not work.

I didn't say Macs are immune to issues. All you need to do is visit the Apple store and THEY will do the diagnostics.

All I am saying here, is stop saying Macs suck because you can build a better system cheaper yourself. We all know it is possible. But there are those of us that do not want to do that.
 
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PowerMac G4 MDD said:
How is it false? Have you ever f*cked around with Disk Manager or Windows' entire networking approach? It's horrendous. Even Linux, in all its barbarity, has better system managers than Windows does. I've had plenty of experience dealing with Windows and Windows machines. In fact, my first computer was a Windows PC (utter piece of garbage), and I currently own over a dozen of them.
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So what. I own lots of cars but it doesn’t make me a bonafide mechanic.
 
tony3dd said:
Ok guys, I need your best arguments why Macs are better than PC's. Going over to my wife's bosses house tonight, and her kid is a PC NUT! Already was warned that he will rip me apart the moment I walk in the door. I need really good ammo! Not the normal stuff. This kid is an avid gamer, and he probably has me there. OMG MY GOD I'm dreading this! LOK!
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Just agree with him. Any other response is a waste of time. As is this thread which has been started in the same way several hundred times.
 
H2SO4 said:
So what. I own lots of cars but it doesn’t make me a bonafide mechanic.
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Well, hey, that's you. Many people don't realize that I have 83+ Macs and Windows PCs that I regularly deal with. I've been through hell and back with Windows, but even my earliest of Macs have worked just fine. Time to take out the trash soon... anyone want a handful of cr@ppy Windows PCs?
 
H2SO4 said:
Then you are not as familiar as you think. you might not like them but they are perfectly functional and they are there.
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It seems as though you either run into some wall or exception with their utilities and have to go on a wild goose chase to get something to work. Mac OSX's utilities are spot-on and work just fine.
 
bladerunner2000 said:
That doesn't make it less flexible than what OS X offers though, lol. Sorry bud, but you're not putting up a strong case right now.

It's ok though, because it doesn't matter. You use whatever OS satisfies your needs or wants and so will everyone else. But OS X is still pretty locked down... and only going to get worse with Rootless in El Capitan.
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Everyone has their own story about how Windows has screwed something up, so even if I were to think back to a specific example, it may mean nothing to you. One thing I know for certain (as someone else has tried this) is that the process if striping disks in Windows is a mess, while it's easy in Mac OSX. I haven't used anything better than Disk Utility - it simply works without hassle. Disk Manager is a complete mess... I have even run into issues where I wasn't able to delete a partition (and, no, it wasn't the partition I was currently running). It just locked it and said, "no, you can't screw with this." You won't run into hideous things like that when you're using Mac OSX. Get Windows mad, and you get a dialogue box like this: ERROR: sdflkasdfjal;kf39192309123093.14159FAT32xjq.binfile=retarded1212@@@ could not install.

You can get a serial-number-long error when doing something as simple as installing a system driver. In fact, I downloaded a necessary driver straight from Microsoft's website once, and it just couldn't install due to some mysterious, missing file. Gee, Windows is touchy. I've never had ballistic or unreasonable errors with Mac OSX. Usually, if you get an error on Mac OSX (or ANY Mac OS for that matter), it's something reasonable (that can be fixed), and it actually tells you what went wrong, rather than leaving you with convoluted script.
 
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