Will there ever be a new large iMac (Pro)?

[Azrael9]

Is ray tracing hardware like nvidia ?

I feel like nvidia is still 2-3 years ahead of amd on this one with the tensor cores. Might be tinted by my experience in ML.

It's arguable if Nvidia are 2-3 years ahead of AMD on Ray Tracing if the PS5 is launching with Ray Tracing for the Masses this fall.

Well, there were clear examples of Ray Tracing on those game play examples. So real time game play Ray Tracing says that Radeon's and RDNA2 have got a working handle on it.

Nvidia's 1st 'beta' Ray Tracing cards were quickly superceded by the 'Super' versions. Of which you realistically need the Titan version to get the uber 4k and Ray tracing frame rates?

I was unimpressed by the 1st two versions.

Ampere offering '50%' improvements on the titan? Then year. It will come of age for Nvidia. For £1200.

Big Navi is coming in around 25% ahead of the 2080 Ti. If they hit Nvidia with a more price accessible stack with the PS5 leading the charge...they can hurt Nv'. And that will 'do' until they really hit them with the RDNA3.

Azrael.
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Everything is a waste of time when you think about it.

I think the old fashioned way of looking at games needs to go away. Is going to a bowling bar and play bowling with friends a waste of time? If not, how is that different when doing the same online?
I occasionally play with my friend. We have tons of fun and we also chat. He is in Europe and I moved to Canada so we can't just go out for a beer/bowling etc.
So we turn on Warcraft Reforged and have good old fashioned 2v2 which we used to play as kids. We are not as good as we used to but it doesn't matter. Its fun!

Its entertainment just like anything else. Labelling it "waste of time" is really old fashioned and unfair.

Sorry, but it is what it is.

If you label it 'waste of time' then you should be fair and label everything else too

Sage words.

I loved that post.

I've done a 'fair bit' of MMO gaming in my spare time. I've met some decent people in countries the world over I would not have 'met' or chatted with in conventional terms.

I did 'quite a bit' of WoW (And enjoyed my Blood Death Knight...) And paid alot of 'gold' for my 'jewelled' Black Panther rider.

Alot of my family have a 'PS4' each...and I bought my Mum a PS3. Seeing her 'rock' a 46 combo on Batman (on of the best 'fight' games ever...) was a wonder to behold.

So yes. I do abit of 'closet' gaming to 'unsponge' my art brain from time to time.

Politically, I don't 'let' PC gamers own that 'gaming title' either. It's a computer with a bar of soap for gaming. So I'm happy to cheer on pretenders such as Sony PS5, ATV going A12x and the iMac getting a better gpu.

All work and no play...

Azrael.
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Jim Keller resigns from Intel - VideoCardz.com

Changes in Intel’s Technology, Systems Architecture and Client Group Jim Keller to Depart Intel; New Leaders Named SANTA CLARA, Calif., June 11, 2020 – Today, Intel announced that Jim Keller has resigned effective June 11, 2020, due to personal reasons. Intel appreciates Mr. Keller’s work over...

videocardz.com

I didn't see this coming. Keller resigns from Intel.

Intel's problems continue.

I wouldn't bet against Intel coming out the other side. Their engineering history can't be written off.

But that's got to hurt. Didn't Keller put AMD back on the map?

Meanwhile, Apple will probably be laser focused on where the 'A' chip is going next...

Azrael.

 

[adr1974]

Is there reason to think that the fact that only one Mac was filed with model # A2330 is indicate of a 23-23" iMac vs 27+"?

 

[Azrael9]

iMac 2019

andrewhudsondesign.co.uk

This was posted by someone on another thread...

Azrael.

 

[applemanit]

Is there reason to think that the fact that only one Mac was filed with model # A2330 is indicate of a 23-23" iMac vs 27+"?

A2330 to 23 and 30 inches displays? Mmh 🤔

 

[Moonjumper]

But a new hope likes with the future Mac ARM. Then, 'Mac' gets access to lots of phone and pad games.

I've said before I don't think the switch to Arm will make much difference to gaming. The processor type isn't the limitation. I thought I'd do a test to demonstrate.

I have a mobile game built in Unity (used for more than half of all mobile games) that is almost complete and hope to release in the coming weeks. I tested the time from opening my mobile project to porting it to create a Mac app. I didn't do any of the processor agnostic tasks, which are the larger barrier, such as desktop controls. I just needed to change target platform, check all the settings were in place, and do a build. I'd not done this before, so I don't have any special advantage. I had the game playing as an app 2 minutes after opening the project.

 

[DrRadon]

Radiant ready to ship BLUs for new iPads, iMacs, say sources

Backlit unit (BLU) supplier Radiant Opto-Electronics is said to be ready to ship BLUs for Apple's upcoming iPad and iMac products slated for launch in the second half of 2020, according to industry sources.

www.digitimes.com

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Apple's new offerings for second-half 2020 are likely to include a 10.8-inch ‌iPad‌ Air and a 23-inch ‌iMac‌ device, with prospects to also release an 8.x-inch ‌iPad‌ mini and 12.9-inch iPad Pro with mini LED display in the first half of 2021, said the sources.

Apple is also expected to enlarge the size of 2020 ‌iPad‌ Air to 10.8-inch compared to the 10.2-inch one launched in 2019, said the sources, adding that volume production of the new ‌iPad‌ Air is to kick off in the third quarter 2020.

Major panel suppliers for the planned 10.8-inch ‌iPad‌ Air include LG Display, BOE Technology and Sharp, with Radiant being the sole BLU supplier, the sources added.

 

[applemanit]

iMac 2019

andrewhudsondesign.co.uk

This was posted by someone on another thread...

Azrael.

What if the new iMac had a design inspired by the iMac G4 "lamp"?

I think it would have much more sense with the rumored iPad Pro design language. Flat monitor with all other components inside the bottom support.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1270380852518805505

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[Kjs100]

Only one filed model added to the 23" rumours, plus Prosser's and Dickson's tweets, all suggest a 23" Mac at WWDC for me.

Prosser-

"...There’s still an iMac and AirPods ready to ship..."

Did Prosser just mistakenly omit an "s" after iMac or was he telling us only one iMac model is ready to ship?

Sonny Dickson's tweet also in the singular -

"...New iMac incoming at WWDC...".

Is that reading too much into grammar on twitter? Maybe but the rumours Ive read were for an affordable 23". Zilch on a larger model.

I'm not confident we'll see anything other than a 23". A redesign on the smaller model alone would seem counter-intuitive, but maybe Apple have plans for a larger model, with ARM, mini LED, RDNA 2 for next year.

 

[pldelisle]

What if the new iMac had a design inspired by the iMac G4 "lamp"?

I think it would have much more sense with the rumored iPad Pro design language. Flat monitor with all other components inside the bottom support.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1270380852518805505

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This is the worst concept I ever seen. I bashed it a lot when it first showed up.

 

[Dosing]

Only one filed model added to the 23" rumours, plus Prosser's and Dickson's tweets, all suggest a 23" Mac at WWDC for me.

Prosser-

"...There’s still an iMac and AirPods ready to ship..."

Did Prosser just mistakenly omit an "s" after iMac or was he telling us only one iMac model is ready to ship?

Sonny Dickson's tweet also in the singular -

"...New iMac incoming at WWDC...".

Is that reading too much into grammar on twitter? Maybe but the rumours Ive read were for an affordable 23". Zilch on a larger model.

I'm not confident we'll see anything other than a 23". A redesign on the smaller model alone would seem counter-intuitive, but maybe Apple have plans for a larger model, with ARM, mini LED, RDNA 2 for next year.

It may just be nerves since we're getting closer to the actual event but I'm sliding this way as well. Unless we see another entry added to the DB then, based on the evidence that we have, a new redesigned 23" model seems the most likely outcome. I think we will see a 27/29" iMac at some point this year but I'm starting to doubt that it will be in just over a week. I really want to get a new 27" as well but I guess I can wait a little longer if it comes to it.

 

[AAtte]

I’m slowly shifting to a conclusion that I won’t buy the new iMac if I can’t BTO with RDNA2 gpu. The RDNA2 will be a very good gpu architecture for a long time because XBOX and PS5 will use it. RDNA1 would die in few months. I will probably go with Mac Mini + eGPU if the iMac doesnt deliver me RDNA2.

I don’t care if the size is 23 or 27. Would prefer the 27. I’m ready to drop max 3,5k euros for 10600k-10900k + rdna2 gpu + 500gb ssd + 32gb ram.

 

[DrRadon]

You guys are getting riled up way to much on that one model.

If you desperately want to talk yourself into thinking that not the entire lineup is going to be refreshed you have to look at the 27 inch being out of stock for more than two weeks by now... thats were you would point at, not at the 21.5 being replaced while back in stock again.
Parts numbers for GPUs have surfaced weeks ago and there were enough for the entire lineup. Relax.

 

[Azrael9]

I have a mobile game built in Unity (used for more than half of all mobile games) that is almost complete and hope to release in the coming weeks. I tested the time from opening my mobile project to porting it to create a Mac app. I didn't do any of the processor agnostic tasks, which are the larger barrier, such as desktop controls. I just needed to change target platform, check all the settings were in place, and do a build. I'd not done this before, so I don't have any special advantage. I had the game playing as an app 2 minutes after opening the project.

Cool stuff. Build on gaming engine and deploy to platform of your choice?

So, for you, it wasn't a difficult task to take mobile to Mac?

And that's the thrust of Marzipan? Allowing the 'tons' of iPad apps to work on the 'Mac' which will one day be 'Mac ARM' thus the Mac won't be windows RT and start with 'nothing...?' in terms of Mac "ARM" base.

The more devs you have. The more apps that you have on 'Mac' the better. And the same 'osmosis' gaming that happened on iOS will happen on 'Mac ARM.' When the market becomes 'big' the £££ is there.

Moonjumper, will you submit your game to Apple Arcade? Or do Apple approach devs for that service?

ie. Heavily curated?

Azrael.

 

[DrRadon]

I’m slowly shifting to a conclusion that I won’t buy the new iMac if I can’t BTO with RDNA2 gpu. The RDNA2 will be a very good gpu architecture for a long time because XBOX and PS5 will use it. RDNA1 would die in few months. I will probably go with Mac Mini + eGPU if the iMac doesnt deliver me RDNA2.

i don’t care if the size is 23 or 27. Would prefer the 27.

You should really stop worrying about bigger, newer and shiny and instead buy what you actually need dude. It's technology, everything is going to be dated less than a year from now.

 

[Dosing]

You guys are getting riled up way to much on that one model.

If you desperately want to talk yourself into thinking that not the entire lineup is going to be refreshed you have to look at the 27 inch being out of stock for more than two weeks by now... thats were you would point at, not at the 21.5 being replaced while back in stock again.
Parts numbers for GPUs have surfaced weeks ago and there were enough for the entire lineup. Relax.

I hope you're right dude!

 

[pldelisle]

Unless you are heavily crunching data in Metal or OpenCL1.2, there are virtually no reason a RDNA1 radeon pro 5700 would not suffice for any macOS usage (mostly productivity).

 

[Kjs100]

This is the worst concept I ever seen. I bashed it a lot when it first showed up.

The base in that concept is truly hideous. It reminded me of the Smash Martions in the Mash Potatoes adverts.

 

[Azrael9]

I’m slowly shifting to a conclusion that I won’t buy the new iMac if I can’t BTO with RDNA2 gpu. The RDNA2 will be a very good gpu architecture for a long time because XBOX and PS5 will use it. RDNA1 would die in few months. I will probably go with Mac Mini + eGPU if the iMac doesnt deliver me RDNA2.

i don’t care if the size is 23 or 27. Would prefer the 27.

I'd love the 'new' iMac to even get a '36' CU PS5 version. Knowing Apple? It will be an exclusive to £5k and £6k Macs. That's Apple's rigid upsell marketing.

When any PC tower will have access to it from £799 tower to £2k+ tower.

If it was launched now. I doubt the 23 inch version would have the RDNA2. They'd probably lump some die shrunk RDNA1 on it. RDNA1 is about to be old news in 3 months time. But...they'll STILL have die shrunk RDNA1 rebadged for as part of the RDNA2 stack. Or 'as cheaper' options beneath the RDNA2 stack.

So? ...that doesn't mean that the 23 or 27 inch can't have RDNA2. eGPU. And you have one helluva performer. 5700pro/xt base with RDNA2 'big' via your eGPU. We'll be able to buy it 3rd party and plug it in via TB3.

It's not totally immutable law according to Apple's marketing. The new 23/27 iMacs will be 'good enough.' They'll dim the halo of the currently model, for sure. How progressive they'll be in eg. GPU tech' is another matter.

Azrael.
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Unless you are heavily crunching data in Metal or OpenCL1.2, there are virtually no reason a RDNA1 radeon pro 5700 would not suffice for any macOS usage (mostly productivity).

For me, personally, it's a significant step forwards. For rendering and 3d display work. As will a 5k display. Genuine SSD. More ram.

And if it can use the tech' without the fans kicking up or getting hot then I'll settle for that. For now.

If I suddenly want to go crazy with gpu rendering the RDNA2 will be waiting for me later.

Azrael.
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You should really stop worrying about bigger, newer and shiny and instead buy what you actually need dude. It's technology, everything is going to be dated less than a year from now.

Amen to that. *Wallet waiting.

Azrael.

 

[pldelisle]

Never heard of any die shrink for rdna1. It’s already on TSMC 7nm, the smallest fab process at TSMC right now. 5nm is reserved for Apple A Chip A14.

 

[Azrael9]

Never heard of any die shrink for rdna1. It’s already on TSMC 7nm, the smallest fab process at TSMC right now. 5nm is reserved for Apple A Chip A14.

Wasn't there a 7nm'+'...on AMD's roadmap? To allow for a rebadging of RDNA1 under the RDNA2 stack?

The A14. The beast awaits...

Azrael.

 

[pldelisle]

For me, personally, it's a significant step forwards. For rendering and 3d display work. As will a 5k display. Genuine SSD. More ram.

And if it can use the tech' without the fans kicking up or getting hot then I'll settle for that. For now

Fans will always kick. It’s not because a Gpu is more powerful that it will heat less. Good paralellized applications can spawn threads accordingly to the gpu architecture. It will take less time to render, but will heat the same. The fans will kick in the same.

there is nothing RDNA1 can‘t do vs. RDNA2. it will just take a bit more time to render the same task.
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Wasn't there a 7nm'+'...on AMD's roadmap? To allow for a rebadging of RDNA1 under the RDNA2 stack?

The A14. The beast awaits...

Azrael.

Maybe. Didn’t see this anywhere.

 

[Azrael9]

there is nothing RDNA1 can‘t do vs. RDNA2. it will just take a bit more time to render the same task.

As my PC owning friend said before I bought my 1st PPC Tower back in 1997.

"Mhz. You're just buying seconds."

ERgo. The price difference. Is time.

Azrael.

 

[pldelisle]

If render times are such important, there are other solutions that work a lot faster... you are not in the right market tier (not speaking about *you*)

 

[iPadified]

An old 27 inch with long lead time and a new 23 inch at the same time after WWDC. Very unlikely. Second half of 2020 for a 23 inch. Technically 1 July is second half but usually second half means december.

At any rate, I hope for a newly designed iMac and an AirPod studio on sale next Monday evening. Expensive night, I hope!

I found a cure for large screens dependancy. I have worked from home on a laptop for three months. I got to work today and looked into the 27 inch screen, it was so big I could not orientate myself!

 

[Azrael9]

If render times are such important, there are other solutions that work a lot faster... you are not in the right market tier (not speaking about *you*)

I remember using Kai's Vector Tools to render pseudo 3d lettering. And just adding 'bevelled' edges would cripple my Power PC. So it was 'coffee break' time.

Having done Lightwave 3D (2018) render tests on my i7 quad core...I was pleasantly surprised that the rendering didn't take 'that' long. Sure about 5 minutes for this radiosity soaked green dragon and it dragged on the final pass to get rid of the last 'render noise' (or final bits of detail...). But overall. I remember waiting 30 minutes or even an hour for things to 'happen.'

Any 8-10 core iMac is going to be rendering the 3D scenes I want to do in around a minute or so give or take. And I won't have to wait for the 3D viewpoint to update or chug either. It's going to be massive progress from where I'm coming from.

But I will augment the set up with a PC tower. 12 core looks like the sweet spot...in a tower costing just over £1k. I've thought about adding an RDNA2 to it and a NV Ampere for a dual GPU set up. I'll get one gpu. And add the other 'later.'

Azrael.
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If render times are such important, there are other solutions that work a lot faster...

I think I caught a post re: your work set up re: Nv' 'big boy' GPUs. And waiting for a 'month' (for some medical images to render? OR something like that...)

Respect.

It puts even the best current tech' hardware in perspective.

Azrael.