Will there ever be a new large iMac (Pro)?

[fireguy286]

Gaming on the Mac has been lacklustre giving the promise of the 1st rate prices you pay with 'last year's gpu tech'.

And the gaming Mac list reflects that as an overview.

With Boot Camp. You can play any game you wish. The perks of an Intel Mac.

But even the last 5 years of Intel/NV/AMD. Hardly 'mind blowing.' At all. If Doom Eternal is anything to go by. Just more of the same big gun running around and hopping about. (I'd prefer Thing on a Spring...myself...)

That's the thing. When you have stalled cpu, ssd and gpu progress. You just get games that look pretty much the same and do the same.

I'd say gaming on the Mac with the respectability you'd expect from the 'industry leading' prices is something that will come from AS. And the unifying iOS/Mac family of cpus, stores and deployment tech'.

As for my own personal needs. I don't have time to game like I did when I was packing a C64. (For me, personally, those experiences won't be equalled. I loved the games. The stories. The imagination. And the innovation.)

But there is the 'odd' PC game I 'must' play.

Though I have enjoyed playing The Last of Us on the PS3. (I bought it for my Mum and the console itself.)

My recent years gaming highlights have been Resident Evil 4 on the Game Cube. (A masterpiece game.) The Batman games on PS3. (Great combat system.) And City of Heroes on PC/Mac. (Hero MMO that has seen a revival thanks to the freedom fighters in the Hero community.) WoW on the Mac is respectible. Don't play it anymore. But if you like MMOs I'd say you have to try a Death Knight or a Demon Hunter....

Tastes vary. But I know what I like. And so do others.

The intensive 'next gen' (graphically?) Has been waiting a long time. Ray Tracing on a console at £399/499? Yes please. And with lightning fast load times?

RDNA2/Ampere for PC. The PS5 for the console market. AS for the Mac market (consumer Macs with decent gpus at last...)

It's been a long time coming. Mac gaming hasn't draped itself in gloring for a litany of reasons. But the much vaunted PC market has to point to an overpriced 2080Ti at £1200 to get acceptable 4k performance to play Doom Eternal?

Meh.

Azrael.

I am also not a major gamer, and my interest has waned quite a bit in recent years. Haven't figured out if it's getting older, decline of engaging game quality, or mobile games shortening our attention spans...or all 3, ha.

The HL-CS/Goldeneye/Quake/Myst era is long over.
FPS games bore me after the first hour, they all blend together after the story wears off and sadly I feel like that's the majority these days.

RE4 is a classic, agree with you there. The rerelease was fun on my Xbox One, probably one of the few things it gets used for. I have also lost more hours...days to FFXI than I care to admit in its day.

Only one that really interests me these days is Flight Sim 2020. Have played every version the last 30 years and enjoyed them all.

 

[Freida]

Nothing from Blizzard? I'm disappointed. Also, this guy has some fetish for horror/blood/killing stuff

The only thing that I agree with is the Tomb Raider and Fortnight although never played either.
I play Reforged and Hearthstone these days.

Azrael.

 

[Fishrrman]

Well, it looks like Apple answered the OP's question a couple of days back... eh...?

 

[xgman]

Well, it looks like Apple answered the OP's question a couple of days back... eh...?

Not really... well sort of...well ....

 

[Homy]

anyone know if you can downgrade from Catalina.

on the 2020 iMac that is

Downgrade to what? You can never downgrade the OS on a new Mac, only if you upgrade to a newer OS.

 

[Azrael9]

Nothing from Blizzard? I'm disappointed. Also, this guy has some fetish for horror/blood/killing stuff

The only thing that I agree with is the Tomb Raider and Fortnight although never played either.
I play Reforged and Hearthstone these days.

Blizzard have been Mac stalwarts for some time.

They also 'got behind' the Metal API...which as boosted Mac 'WoW' performance.

A sound game with Vanilla...they really started to boost the graphical powers with the later patches (as the fps and gpu 'rating' could testify to...) and the ATs playability with the Demon Hunter class. And the music in WoW is it's jewel. Movie like soundtracks.

A bit harsh not to be included. I'd certainly include it on the all time Mac list.

FPS has had a long time in the sun. What I like about Apple Arcade and the iOS gaming 'retrolution' on the App Store is getting back to basics with simpler gaming essences, different graphics styles and innovative story and game play as well as more affordable prices.

The obsession with BFS, FPS and Madame Tussard style 'life like' wax dummies and so called 'realism...' is all a bit much of a muchness.

Back in the 8 bit days. I certainly had a far more varied gaming diet of genre.

Azrael.

 

[Azrael9]

Downgrade to what? You can never downgrade the OS on a new Mac, only if you upgrade to a newer OS.

So...if I have an older OS on an external drive...I can't boot from that on a new Mac (with a new OS?)

Azrael.

 

[John90976]

*Shrugs.* It can make a difference. Sure someone will bench that. But to me. I'm going with the 2666mhz.

Presumably you'd pay more for that 3200mhz..? And is the difference seismic?

Azrael.

I wouldn't normally care about a few hundred mhz, but my housemate says his RAM was underclocked on his motherboard down from 3200mhz to 2666mhz and he had a solid 5-10fps improvement across a few games after resolving it. May need to refigure my RAM order, but hey at least it's possible, I guess Apple had a bunch of 2666 in a warehouse somewhere they had to get rid of.

 

[Azrael9]

I am also not a major gamer, and my interest has waned quite a bit in recent years. Haven't figured out if it's getting older, decline of engaging game quality, or mobile games shortening our attention spans...or all 3, ha.

The HL-CS/Goldeneye/Quake/Myst era is long over.
FPS games bore me after the first hour, they all blend together after the story wears off and sadly I feel like that's the majority these days.

RE4 is a classic, agree with you there. The rerelease was fun on my Xbox One, probably one of the few things it gets used for. I have also lost more hours...days to FFXI than I care to admit in its day.

Only one that really interests me these days is Flight Sim 2020. Have played every version the last 30 years and enjoyed them all.

Not a major gamer either. Though I still have my interest in it...along with computer tech', gpus, monitors.

I had 'the best of it' (years ago...) and probably my 'fill' of it, too.

As for attention span. I did play 'long play' games on the C64...but I did like the more immediate 'arcade' or 'shoot 'em ups.' Though I did platform, puzzles, adventure games etc. I seemed to have more patience or time...or maybe I wasted alot more time....back then.

But sometimes when you get older some things 'pass you by...' (apart from some of the examples I've mentioned in a previous post...). Game quality. Certainly games are depending on graphical 'oooh' alot more these days and some times gild the lilly on interface and gameplay. I find the Assassin's Creed style wander and explore genre particularly tedious. Maybe I just don't have the patience for them. I've got about an hour and then they bore me to tears.

Acquired the Sega collection for PS3. I was very happy playing Streets of Rage II. Press button. Instant smack fu. Don't have to think too much.

Mobile games? I think it's more mobile devices reducing our patience. A kind of 'now culture' perpetrated by social media...online shopping...and the 'blue' light that stops you getting quality sleep. These devices are quite addictive...checking phones many times a an hour every hour of the day etc.

I've taken to just turning my iPhone OFF. And I now don't look at them past 9pm. And I turn the wi-fi OFF before bed time.

Sleeping a lot better...

Azrael.

 

[Homy]

anyone know if you can downgrade from Catalina.

on the 2020 iMac that is

So...if I have an older OS on an external drive...I can't boot from that on a new Mac (with a new OS?)

Azrael.

I haven't tried that but everytime I've tried to install older OS the Mac said I can't because it's older than the OS that came with the Mac. This article suggests you can but I'm not sure. There is a good reason why Apple don't want us to do so. It can involve problems with software and hardware. Specially in this case Mojave would lack support for all the new hardware like GPU and T2.

 

[Azrael9]

AMD 16-core Zen3 (Ryzen 9 4950X?) engineering sample boosts up to 4.9 GHz - VideoCardz.com

New OPN codes for the upcoming Zen3 architecture have been disclosed. AMD Ryzen 9 4950X could boost up to 4.9 GHz Igor’sLAB has an update to his story from yesterday. Igor has been very actively sharing AMD OPN codes for the upcoming Ryzen 4000 series processors. It all began with 4000G “Renoir...

videocardz.com

Azrael.

 

[Azrael9]

I haven't tried that but everytime I've tried to install older OS the Mac said I can't because it's older than the OS that came with the Mac. This article suggests you can but I'm not sure.

Cheers, Homy.

I have data on my external SSD drive with has an earlier than Catalina Mac OS to boot from.

Ofc. I can put the 'failed' iMac into Target Mode? So I can see the hard drive from the newer iMac?

Not something I've ever done. But I want to get the data off.

Azrael.

 

[xgman]

Would this not indicate dual TB3 busses required at this config? Is there any other evidence of this?

Two 6016-by-3384 (6K) external displays at 60Hz with support for 1 billion colors (requires Radeon Pro 5700 or Radeon Pro 5700 XT), or

 

[Homy]

Cheers, Homy.

I have data on my external SSD drive with has an earlier than Catalina Mac OS to boot from.

Ofc. I can put the 'failed' iMac into Target Mode? So I can see the hard drive from the newer iMac?

Not something I've ever done. But I want to get the data off.

Azrael.

Yes, if you only want to get the data you can use Target mode, but now I'm a bit confused. First you talked about an external drive and now a "failed" iMac? Which one has the data you want to save? If it is from the older iMac you can just use the Target mode or copy the data to the external drive and back to your new iMac.

 

[Azrael9]

Yes, if you only want to get the data you can use Target mode, but now I'm a bit confused. First you talked about an external drive and now a "failed" iMac? Which one has the data you want to save? If it is from the older iMac you can just use the Target mode or copy the data to the external drive and back to your new iMac.

My iMac has a fried gpu. So I can only boot, ironically, in to Bootcamp...to make these posts.

On my 'dead' Mac side, the reason I can't boot into it is down to the failed gpu...but I can boot into 'Windows' safe mode.

My internal hard drive on the Mac still works but the boot sequence doesn't due to the gpu. (With all my core files....)
My external hard drive won't boot either. But it has a newer MacOS...and 'slightly' older copies of the 'core files' I need to get off.

So, both have the data I want to save. With the internal hard drive in my iMac having 'slightly' more up to date files I want to get off.

So option one. I'm guessing the new iMac (incoming can use the older Mac in target mode to see the Hard drive.)
...and I'm hoping the newer iMac can boot the OS/drive. If not. It's not much good unless I have access to a older Mac?

I have 'slightly' older 'core' files on my Thumn Drive. But getting access to the hard drive on the Mac partition of this iMac would be...very useful.

Azrael.

 

[Freida]

I feel that games in the 90's had much better gameplay than most games now.
Sure, the graphics are so nice and polished and blah blah blah but who cares? If the game is not engaging and gameplay is not amazing then nothing will save it.
Its the same like Marvel movies - they look great with all the fluff but story is crap. (And I did work on some of those titles too )))) )

I would rather have games from 90's refreshed to today's standard but keep the gameplay etc.
ie. remastered versions. Some of the gems are pretty much lost these days.

WoW - I played (and cleared) everything in Burning Crusade (including Illidan himself) but then I kinda lost interest (or I grew up, one of those ))) )
Haven't tried vanilla but my partner wants to so maybe when winter in Canada hits we might give it a go. )

I was always support healer. Loved to be responsible for others and keep them alive - always good fun

Blizzard have been Mac stalwarts for some time.

They also 'got behind' the Metal API...which as boosted Mac 'WoW' performance.

A sound game with Vanilla...they really started to boost the graphical powers with the later patches (as the fps and gpu 'rating' could testify to...) and the ATs playability with the Demon Hunter class. And the music in WoW is it's jewel. Movie like soundtracks.

A bit harsh not to be included. I'd certainly include it on the all time Mac list.

FPS has had a long time in the sun. What I like about Apple Arcade and the iOS gaming 'retrolution' on the App Store is getting back to basics with simpler gaming essences, different graphics styles and innovative story and game play as well as more affordable prices.

The obsession with BFS, FPS and Madame Tussard style 'life like' wax dummies and so called 'realism...' is all a bit much of a muchness.

Back in the 8 bit days. I certainly had a far more varied gaming diet of genre.

Azrael.

 

[Homy]

My external hard drive won't boot either. But it has a newer MacOS...and 'slightly' older copies of the 'core files' I need to get off.

...and I'm hoping the newer iMac can boot the OS/drive. If not. It's not much good unless I have access to a older Mac?

I have 'slightly' older 'core' files on my Thumn Drive. But getting access to the hard drive on the Mac partition of this iMac would be...very useful.

Azrael.

Can't your external drive boot at all because it's faulty or it can't boot with the faulty iMac? If it's not faulty then you should be able to see it with your new iMac without booting from MacOS on it, just by connecting it to iMac? Otherwise you have to send it in for rescue.

 

[Reaper0bot0]

Nobody talks about iOS app on Apple Silicon Macs.
Yes it will be able to run native iOS ARM Apps, but not exclusively that. Full fledged Mac apps will still exists and more than ever on AS iMac

I’m aware. That said, my point stands. Both run MacOS apps. One set runs Windows but not iOS apps, and vice versions.

 

[filmak]

It was confirmed in an Apple support doc that it is NOT soldered on, but it uses a proprietary Apple connector to the motherboard.

No dear, it's complicated and unfortunately soldered.

New 27-Inch iMac's Storage Affixed to Logic Board, 4TB and 8TB Configurations Have Expansion Connector

Following a report from German blog iFun.de that claimed the new 27-inch iMac's flash storage is soldered to the logic board, MacRumors has...

www.macrumors.com

 

[krazzix]

Well, it looks like Apple answered the OP's question a couple of days back... eh...?

Nope, there may or may not still arrive a redesigned iMac in 2020.

 

[timerickson]

The 21.5" was not updated, just a price adjustment for many SKUs. The rumored 24" replaces the 21.5" and is still likely slated for a release before the holidays.

 

[deconstruct60]

Would this not indicate dual TB3 busses required at this config? Is there any other evidence of this?

Two 6016-by-3384 (6K) external displays at 60Hz with support for 1 billion colors (requires Radeon Pro 5700 or Radeon Pro 5700 XT), or

What Apple calls a "TB bus" isn't physically a single bus. it is a combination of PCI-e lane feed ( x4) and two DisplayPort streams. DisplayPort v1.4 allows for DSC ( display stream compression). If can push the 6K HDR into one stream then the two inputs to the lastest TBv3 controller that aceepts DPv1.4 should work. Just means the XDR has to decompress it on its side ( since the Mac Pro's W5700X MPX module does it too; not too surprising.)


See compression chart here for 5K 100Hz ... DSC works. ( 6K is a bit bigger but also only at 60Hz or slower in the alternative XDR refresh modes . Need to slide under 40Gb/s . )

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DisplayPort#Refresh_frequency_limits_for_HDR_video

And if it didn't fit on DSC could use two controllers. Although get into zone where are juggling other issues with the PCI-e v3 feeds at that point.

 

[deconstruct60]

.....

Intel had to deal with AMD. A cash strapped company.

2 trillion Apple are getting in the ring with its own Apple Silicon.

Apple doesn't have 2 Trillion dollars. Apple stockholders have $1-2T. None of that directly funds R&D at all. Zip. nada. nothing.

Apple also in part has lots of money because they don't do "everything". The notion that they are going to try to go blow for blow with Intel across Intels whole line up is loopy. In part that is where AMD made their chance. They stopped trying to go blow-for-blow across the whole line up. Even now where they have more cash ttey still are not.

Apple doesn't "have to win" because their Scrooge McDuck money pit is deeper. It is pretty doubtful Apple is going to charge head first into the zone where Intel and AMD are competing heaviest. More likely they'll do a 'good enough' Mac Pro / iMac Pro SoC for the largest systems relative to the current Mac Pro. Better Mac Pro as oppose to "king of the world" system. Apple is very probably going to throw as sizable transistor budget at doing Mac specific things whereas Intel and AMD are not. Similarly the packaging is likely going to be smaller and cheaper ( one reason Apple has more money is that they spend less and keep more of the margin. ) That is a dual edged sword. It will be a better contemporary Mac, but probably not a better "King of the world" system. That is OK because it will be a Mac.

 

[Mr. Warbles]

Question everyone:

when I get this new iMac is it a good idea to pop the RAM in first or set everything up, shutdown, then install RAM?

Thanks!

 

[costica1234]

Judging by the peak clock speed, wouldn’t the 5700 run the coolest compared to all the other options? I’m tempted to jump to the 5700 for this reason alone (and also for a bit of future-proofing).

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