2018 i9 MacBook Pro throttling discussion [merged]

[Queen6]

Is anybody having problems with their machine discharging under load and connected to power?

I'm having to run two adapters (both 87W) for my battery to charge.

This can't be right.

No surprises here, nor the first MBP or notebook to discharge the battery under heavy load when plugged into the mains supply.

The i9 in isolation is capable of pulling more power than the wall charger can possibly provide. For perspective my Asus GL703GS with 2.2GHz 8750H has a 230W charger, admittedly it also has a GTX 1070 (max GPU load 120W)

People want thin & light, people want desktop performance, this is one of the trade off's...

Q-6

 

[hajime]

Just went to Apple Store. They tried to sell me the i9 model as it is the only one with 16GB and also 1TB SSD. I told him no way I am buying it due to thermal throttling. He then said that he has been following some threads and assured me that it is the problem of users using software not optimized for i9. He mentioned that there is nothing wrong with the machine. He said Photoshop is not optimized for i9 and Apple would issue an update soon. Isn’t Photoshop Adobe product? I then mentioned about Dave testing it in the fridge and got good results. Then he had nothing to say but to tell me if I need any help, he would be available!

 

[apiro]

Just went to Apple Store. They tried to sell me the i9 model as it is the only one with 16GB and also 1TB SSD. I told him no way I am buying it due to thermal throttling. He then said that he has been following some threads and assured me that it is the problem if users using software not optimized for i9. He said Photoshop is not optimized for i9 and Apple would issue an update soon. Isn’t Photoshop Adobe product? I then mentioned about Dave testing it in the fridge and got good results. Then he had nothing to say but to tell me if I need any help, he would be available!

There may be an update pending, Adobe products might not be optimised... but this specific salesman is full of ****.

 

[zshane1125]

Does the i9, under normal circumstances, use more battery than the i7? Is there a drastic difference in battery life if you're just browsing the web?

Yes. anytime there is CPU utilization, the higher clocked and the higher turbo boost CPU will consume more power.

 

[hajime]

There may be an update pending, Adobe products might not be optimised... but this specific salesman is full of ****.

He was s also the one who said that if online store people said no more than 1 return per year, that is the official policy.

 

[zshane1125]

Just went to Apple Store. They tried to sell me the i9 model as it is the only one with 16GB and also 1TB SSD. I told him no way I am buying it due to thermal throttling. He then said that he has been following some threads and assured me that it is the problem of users using software not optimized for i9. He mentioned that there is nothing wrong with the machine. He said Photoshop is not optimized for i9 and Apple would issue an update soon. Isn’t Photoshop Adobe product? I then mentioned about Dave testing it in the fridge and got good results. Then he had nothing to say but to tell me if I need any help, he would be available!

Tell him to explain the 33% performance boost once the i9 was in a freezer.

 

[LeeW]

People want thin & light, people want desktop performance, this is one of the trade off's...

Wow, you take that common sense thinking to a forum that wants to hear it...

 

[Queen6]

GeekBench 4 is designed in a way that does not measure long-term degradation due to thermal throttling. It would be shocking if that benchmark came in lower for the i9.

Agreed it's a pointless test, as it's over and done with before any thermal effect takes effect.

Good for those that was to show off big number's, and not really disclose real world performance. A ten second test is basically worthless as a point of measurement of a systems performance.

Q-6

 

[hajime]

Andbody brave enough to drill holes at the base of the mbp and see if thermal throttling less?

 

[Queen6]

Wow, you take that common sense thinking to a forum that wants to hear it...

Is what it is...

Q-6

 

[Aea]

Andbody brave enough to drill holes at the base of the mbp and see if thermal throttling less?

This would probably only hurt.

 

[Queen6]

Andbody brave enough to drill holes at the base of the mbp and see if thermal throttling less?

Pointless as the cooling is a sealed system. High performance Windows notebooks have a lot more air intakes for good reason, not ineptitude of the design team.

Apple prefers a much cleaner look, trade off with the new hex cores is deminished performance...

Q-6

 

[thadoggfather]

i7 is on average faster than i9 in these MacBook pros?

Apple should discontinue the i9 immediately imo and offer to refund customers / exchange with partial refund for other models.

 

[Queen6]

Just went to Apple Store. They tried to sell me the i9 model as it is the only one with 16GB and also 1TB SSD. I told him no way I am buying it due to thermal throttling. He then said that he has been following some threads and assured me that it is the problem of users using software not optimized for i9. He mentioned that there is nothing wrong with the machine. He said Photoshop is not optimized for i9 and Apple would issue an update soon. Isn’t Photoshop Adobe product? I then mentioned about Dave testing it in the fridge and got good results. Then he had nothing to say but to tell me if I need any help, he would be available!

Nonsense, this is solely Apple's issue no one else's, same applies to Dell and the XPS-15...

Bigger question is will Apple own it? History rather tells us a resounding No...

Q-6

 

[Elektrofone]

Agreed it's a pointless test, as it's over and done with before any thermal effect takes effect.

Good for those that was to show off big number's, and not really disclose real world performance. A ten second test is basically worthless as a point of measurement of a systems performance.

Q-6

And yet, in day-to-day usage. Rendering video, After Effects, etc... the i9 is outperforming the i7s. It's the case that we're not getting the full performance out of the i9 that we should because of throttling, but to say that the i7s perform better is just not true.

https://twitter.com/tldtoday/status/1020386822046674945

 

[617660]

I feel the membrane keyboard could trap hot air inside and make matter worse.

Great job, Apple. You could have just given us a normal keyboard.

 

[Queen6]

And yet, in day-to-day usage. Rendering video, After Effects, etc... the i9 is outperforming the i7s. It's the case that we're not getting the full performance out of the i9 that we should because of throttling, but to say that the i7s perform better is just not true.

https://twitter.com/tldtoday/status/1020386822046674945

I agree and what you stated has little to do with what I stated that a 10 second test is not a good indicator of a systems performance.

The i9 will never reach full potential in the MBP, same applies to the vast majority of notebooks, equally it can outperform the i7 depending on workflow.

As I've stated I'm considering either the 2.2 i7 or the i9 and running Geekbench won't make a single cent irrespective of the results...

Q-6

 

[LeeW]

I feel the membrane keyboard could trap hot air inside and make matter worse.

lol.

 

[dazz87]

Apple should throw in a small Refrigerator with the purchase of the i9 version.

 

[Elektrofone]

I agree and what you stated has little to do with what I stated that a 10 second test is not a good indicator of a systems performance.

The i9 will never reach full potential in the MBP, same applies to the vast majority of notebooks, equally it can outperform the i7 depending on workflow.

As I've stated I'm considering either the 2.2 i7 or the i9 and running Geekbench won't make a single cent irrespective of the results...

Q-6

Sorry. Wasn’t meaning to sound combative. It’s hard to measure value of performance, but I see a lot of flippant conversation on the board without trying to get down to the bottom of the issue.

 

[617660]

lol.

lol

 

[sk8r1230]

just got off the phone with a sr apple tech. she stated that she knows about the issues with thermal throttling and said it was only an isolated incident from one youtuber. i informed her how incorrect she was and that she really needed to look into this more. she said all she knows is what she told me and that there are no plans for any updates to the machines fan profile/bios/firmware.

if you actually care about this community and youre not here to banter in forums i highly suggest people call and make this a well known issue.

 

[mr.anthonyramos]

i7 is on average faster than i9 in these MacBook pros?

Apple should discontinue the i9 immediately imo and offer to refund customers / exchange with partial refund for other models.

Nope. Based on real world testing the i9 is still the best performing MacBook Pro you can buy. Now whether it’s performing to its full potential, not really.

 

[OC40]

just got off the phone with a sr apple tech. she stated that she knows about the issues with thermal throttling and said it was only an isolated incident from one youtuber. i informed her how incorrect she was and that she really needed to look into this more. she said all she knows is what she told me and that there are no plans for any updates to the machines fan profile/bios/firmware.

if you actually care about this community and youre not here to banter in forums i highly suggest people call and make this a well known issue.

She only can say what executive management has authorized her to say.

I would bet that: (i) she knows, but was told not to provide any details others that “one youtuber” or (ii) management hasn’t provided any details to her.

I am not sticking up for her, but that is usually the case with very large organizations.

 

[mr.anthonyramos]

Hey guys, my i9 finally arrived today. Loaded up Final Cut and it exported my project 50% faster than last years 2017 i7. And performed 10% faster than the Base i7 I tested in the Apple Store yesterday. Playing back h264 videos was a lot faster than the Base 8-Core iMac Pro. Best thing was that it was whisper quiet during operation, whereas last years 2017 i7 and my 2016 13" would hit the fans hard during an export.

Posted up the perf video on my channel for proof. Still need to do a lot of testing to validate the results, but that's what I have so far.

Now based on what you just said about the fans, my experience and what most reviewers are noticing here is that the fans don’t hit as early or don’t ramp up compared to previous generations. This is worrying. Because, if the system is underload, the fan should ramp up but if it doesn’t then that means something is definitely wrong with the fan curves.
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The thing that most concerns me about his test is that, for the small performance gain of the 2.9 i9 over the 2.6 i7, its temperatures hovered in the 90°s while the i7 ran in the 70°s. For me, that makes the i7 an obvious choice.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the issue here is not just computational power, it's the raw heat that these things are generating. It can't be good for the longevity of your hardware for it to be hovering around the 100° mark frequently, and I'd much rather have one that stays in the 70°s when the CPU is being taxed.

For me, I don't need an insane amount of computational power. I'm not a professional video editor, I'm just a baker who is willing to spend some extra cash on a well-built laptop with great display, speakers, trackpad, and MacOS. My most computationally taxing needs will be playing light games, honestly. I just want to know I won't fry the system by playing Minecraft for a few hours, and if the base model processor can do that for me, I'm about ready to pull the trigger. But I'm waiting for more conclusive tests than we've seen.

Not for professional users who are looking for even an ounce of extra power even if that means only getting a 10% gain is performance (real life not some benchmark ie Cinebench). For us, the i9 is the obvious choice.

I was mentioning earlier some reviewers and even myself now have noticed that there are some issues with how the fan is ramping up. Where during testing, the previous generations would have their fans blasting, the i9 seems to be too quiet for it’s on good handling the same workload, hence it is running hotter. Whereas it should also be ramping up the fans.

Based on what we’re seeing, throttling is less evident and one test showed that the i9 kept at a 3.1-3.2 boost when the fans were manually overriden. So we could possibly see some changes with Apple’s adjustment to the fan curve in a future update.