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2018 i9 MacBook Pro throttling discussion [merged]

mr.anthonyramos

mr.anthonyramos

macrumors 6502a
Apr 25, 2015
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Hong Kong
M.Rizk said:
The CPU is not even throttling at all while gaming! The 2.6 i7 is pushing stable 4 GHz! And that’s without any modifications whatsoever!

34xgcbr.jpg
Click to expand...

This could possibly be because the GPU is doing most of the work. Other workload rendering intensive work sees that the i7 2.6 still throttles. Also on a side note, his accent annoys me. Haha.
[doublepost=1532173459][/doublepost]
CB98 said:
Can someone explain this comment to me? It’s a comment from Jonathan Morrison’s latest i9 video...

‘The i7 model that this i9 lost to in Dave’s video was not even the 2018 i7. It was the 2017 quad core i7. Jonathan Morrison ignored that and compared the 2018 i7, which is literally the same chip as the i9 but binned worse and requiring more voltage therefore producing more heat and throttling more. Of course the i9 would win in this comparison.’

Is this really the case, and going by this argument is the i9 worth it?

And a link to the video:
Click to expand...

Why would he lie about using the 2018 i7 and destroy his entire reputation?

Worth it is relative. Is the i9 the best real world performer? Yes. Does everyone need the i9? No. Is the difference significant? Depends on your workload but a good calculation is if you are saving 1 minute per process, and you do this at least around 30 times in a work day, that saves you 30 minutes a day. 30 minutes a Day is 15 hours a month. If I am paid an x amount of money per hour. That means I would earn 15 hours more than I normally would. And imagine if I earned 150 bucks an hour minimum. That earns me an extra 2250 bucks a month. Or 27000 bucks a year. Damn that’s good money.

Now if I were smart and don’t really need to be portable, I’d get a desktop Mac and make those numbers even faster. But as someone working with and am a photographer, I need my work to be portable.
 
M.Rizk

M.Rizk

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Apr 20, 2015
785
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DeanPSN said:
What's all about using these apps to change voltage and increase fans?
We pay this much money for something that should work properly out of the box, not tweaking it ourselves...
Click to expand...

That’s true. I agree. I expect Apple to do this stuff in a future software update.

What I read from reviews though is that Apple used to do this with past MBPs including the 2017. They limited the power to the CPU. For some reason they let the new CPUs use as much as they need... It is as if they forgot to lock it, or decided to see how it will work out.
 
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agaskew

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Dec 3, 2009
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mr.anthonyramos said:
This could possibly be because the GPU is doing most of the work. Other workload rendering intensive work sees that the i7 2.6 still throttles. Also on a side note, his accent annoys me. Haha.
[doublepost=1532173459][/doublepost]

Why would he lie about using the 2018 i7 and destroy his entire reputation?

Worth it is relative. Is the i9 the best real world performer? Yes. Does everyone need the i9? No. Is the difference significant? Depends on your workload but a good calculation is if you are saving 1 minute per process, and you do this at least around 30 times in a work day, that saves you 30 minutes a day. 30 minutes a Day is 15 hours a month. If I am paid an x amount of money per hour. That means I would earn 15 hours more than I normally would. And imagine if I earned 150 bucks an hour minimum. That earns me an extra 2250 bucks a month. Or 27000 bucks a year. Damn that’s good money.

Now if I were smart and don’t really need to be portable, I’d get a desktop Mac and make those numbers even faster. But as someone working with and am a photographer, I need my work to be portable.
Click to expand...

How much worse would this i9 MacBook Pro have to be, for you to stop defending it like this?

Or, to use your own logic, if only the i9 performed properly, rather than just a bit better, you'd save even more time and earn even more good money, wouldn't you?

Don't get me wrong, if you're happy with one of these and it's meeting your needs, good for you. I simply wish for more honesty - that Apple would stop ripping people off (which is what is happening here) and start looking after their customers a bit better.
 
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mr.anthonyramos

mr.anthonyramos

macrumors 6502a
Apr 25, 2015
524
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Ploki said:
How did you get that link?
Here its clearly removed...

https://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/intel-power-gadget-20
Click to expand...

Haha. I’m pretty sure Apple asked them to remove it. Then Apple in the next few hours will issue an update for our 2018 MacBook Pros and then it will be up.

The update will optimize voltage of the CPUs, adjust the fan curves and then boom! Looks like we’ll have better running MacBook Pros. Haha.

Either way, I’d like to take this positively and say that Apple is going to do something whatever it is to help with the throttling.
 
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Elektrofone

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Jul 5, 2010
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mr.anthonyramos said:
This could possibly be because the GPU is doing most of the work. Other workload rendering intensive work sees that the i7 2.6 still throttles. Also on a side note, his accent annoys me. Haha.
[doublepost=1532173459][/doublepost]

Why would he lie about using the 2018 i7 and destroy his entire reputation?

Worth it is relative. Is the i9 the best real world performer? Yes. Does everyone need the i9? No. Is the difference significant? Depends on your workload but a good calculation is if you are saving 1 minute per process, and you do this at least around 30 times in a work day, that saves you 30 minutes a day. 30 minutes a Day is 15 hours a month. If I am paid an x amount of money per hour. That means I would earn 15 hours more than I normally would. And imagine if I earned 150 bucks an hour minimum. That earns me an extra 2250 bucks a month. Or 27000 bucks a year. Damn that’s good money.

Now if I were smart and don’t really need to be portable, I’d get a desktop Mac and make those numbers even faster. But as someone working with and am a photographer, I need my work to be portable.
Click to expand...

One of the most frustrating aspects of this conversation so far is that it seems that other people don't really understand the situation that professionals are in. I have been a macOS user for 14 years, All of my software, plugins and workflows are based in macOS, I'm not switching over to a PC. It's just not gonna happen anytime soon. I know I could get more performance. I know it could be cheaper, but it's not going to happen. Also, I need a laptop now so the situation is I need a MacBook Pro now. Am I upset that Apple's design choices have made it so that the new 6 core processors can't function to their full potential? Yes. But at the end of the day I need a MacBook Pro and I have to decide which one to get.

I'm still wrestling with whether the i9 is really worth the extra $300 bucks. But you can keep going with that thought process too. Do I really need 32GB of RAM? Do I really need a 1TB SSD. I was doing work fine on my late 2013 MacBook Pro albeit, so much slower than the current models so it's all relative I guess.
 
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mr.anthonyramos

mr.anthonyramos

macrumors 6502a
Apr 25, 2015
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agaskew said:
How much worse would this i9 MacBook Pro have to be, for you to stop defending it like this?

Or, to use your own logic, if only the i9 performed properly, rather than just a bit better, you'd save even more time and earn even more good money, wouldn't you?

Don't get me wrong, if you're happy with one of these and it's meeting your needs, good for you. I simply wish for more honesty - that Apple would stop ripping people off (which is what is happening here) and start looking after their customers a bit better.
Click to expand...

Defending?

Would you kindly reread what I have been saying the entire time. There is a throttling issue yes there is. But is the MacBook performing? Sure it is. Only not to its full potential due to thermal issues because of the extremely thin chassis.

You wanna know what defending sounds like? Here:

Guys you have it all wrong! Apple only makes good products and they never fail. They designed the MacBook like it is and it’s performing anyways so there is no need to fuss everyone!

That is defending Apple’s fault here. Just in case you need a contrast. I am saying there is an issue and Apple needs to address and do something about it. I hope you get it now.
[doublepost=1532175212][/doublepost]
stringerhye said:
I think a lot of people


One of the most frustrating aspects of this conversation so far is that it seems that other people don't really understand the situation that professionals are in. I have been a macOS user for 14 years, All of my software, plugins and workflows are based in macOS, I'm not switching over to a PC. It's just not gonna happen anytime soon. I know I could get more performance. I know it could be cheaper, but it's not going to happen. Also, I need a laptop now so the situation is I need a MacBook Pro now. Am I upset that Apple's design choices have made it so that the new 6 core processors can't function to their full potential? Yes. But at the end of the day I need a MacBook Pro and I have to decide which one to get.

I'm still wrestling with whether the i9 is really worth the extra $300 bucks. But you can keep going with that thought process too. Do I really need 32GB of RAM? Do I really need a 1TB SSD. I was doing work fine on my late 2013 MacBook Pro albeit, so much slower than the current models so it's all relative I guess.
Click to expand...

I couldn’t agree more and I too am upset like you. And like you, wouldn’t want and could not bare going back to a PC.

Honestly speaking, the extra 300 bucks for the i9 is worth it if you are not tight with your budget but if you were gonna balance a budget and choose between i9 or more ram, I’d get more ram than get the i9. Get the base i7 and then 32GB Ran and 1TB. I would personally choose RAM, then storage then CPU in regards to which is most important to me. If budget is no issue. Get it all! :)
 
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Falhófnir

Falhófnir

macrumors 603
Aug 19, 2017
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hajime said:
Really, they could make the laptop case a bit thicker.
Click to expand...
Trying to look at it objectively, I’m genuinely unsure if making the casing ‘a bit thicker’ - even back to the 2015 size - would actually make that much of a difference? They were able to make the cooling solution on the touch bars better than the retinas despite it being thinner. So by increasing the size I’m not sure it would inherently help the thermals, they’d also have to design a cooling system that could manage it - which looking at the Dell XPS struggling while being thicker might actually mean they’d have to create an inch-thick (unibody generation style?) computer to accommodate it. That then, is a completely different beast, a real step change that would not be without controversy itself. I’m not saying they should not make a computer like this, but perhaps they should make it a big showcase tech like the iMac Pro, a 15 and 17 inch unibody sized ‘powerbook’ to really let the i9 shine and include a truly powerful graphics card.
 
Queen6

Queen6

macrumors G4
Dec 11, 2008
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Flying over the rainforest at dawn - Priceless
stringerhye said:
One of the most frustrating aspects of this conversation so far is that it seems that other people don't really understand the situation that professionals are in. I have been a macOS user for 14 years, All of my software, plugins and workflows are based in macOS, I'm not switching over to a PC. It's just not gonna happen anytime soon. I know I could get more performance. I know it could be cheaper, but it's not going to happen. Also, I need a laptop now so the situation is I need a MacBook Pro now. Am I upset that Apple's design choices have made it so that the new 6 core processors can't function to their full potential? Yes. But at the end of the day I need a MacBook Pro and I have to decide which one to get.

I'm still wrestling with whether the i9 is really worth the extra $300 bucks. But you can keep going with that thought process too. Do I really need 32GB of RAM? Do I really need a 1TB SSD. I was doing work fine on my late 2013 MacBook Pro albeit, so much slower than the current models so it's all relative I guess.
Click to expand...

I'm still tempted to go with the i9 and live with it's downsides. I'd look rein it in a little with Volta & ThrottleStop and a manual fan curve profile.

Q-6
 
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AndyMacAndMic

AndyMacAndMic

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mr.anthonyramos said:
This is by far one of the best explanations/reviews I’ve heard so far. Yeah sure it throttles but is it a slouch? No. Is the 2017 top spec 15 inch faster? No. Is the 2018 i7 faster? No.

Will the i9 run hotter? Yes. Is there an issue with Apple’s thermal build on the chassis? Yes. Is the i9 the best performing MacBook Pro you can buy? Yes. Is the i9 needed for everyone...of course not.

@stringerhye I think we can keep an eye on this guy who has done a flurry of different tests with different applications and different workflows.
Click to expand...

I agree that this is a very good explanation/review. I have one slight problem though:
  1. In the above mentioned video he compares the i7 2018 2.2 GHz to the i9 2018 which are basically the same processors. Logical conclusion here is that the i9 is faster then the i7.
  2. Dave Lee in his video compares the i7 2017 2.6 Ghz to the i9 2018 and concludes the i9 is not faster than the i7 2017.
So, correct me if I am wrong, but it seems that the video in 1) is not conclusive at all because he is comparing it to a completely different machine than Dave Lee does.

I have great respect for both youtubers, but..... am I missing something here?
 
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mr.anthonyramos

mr.anthonyramos

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AndyMacAndMic said:
I agree that this is a very good explanation/review. I have one slight problem though:
  1. In the above mentioned video he compares the i7 2018 to the i9 2018 which are basically the same processors. Logical conclusion here is that the i9 is faster then the i7.
  2. Dave Lee in his video compares the i7 2017 to the i9 2018 and concludes the i9 is not faster than the i7 2017.
So, correct me if I am wrong, but it seems that the video in 1) is not conclusive at all because he is comparing it to a different machine than Dave Lee does.

I have great respect for both youtubers, but, am I missing something here?
Click to expand...

There is another YouTube video posted here that compares the top of the line 2017 i7 15 inch, base 2018 15 inch and of course the i9. In all aspects the i9 still performed the best. I’m typing this on my phone so kind of a hassle to go find it here but have a look around this thread if you can’t find it message me I’ll send it to you in a PM. :)
 
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E

Elektrofone

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Jul 5, 2010
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AndyMacAndMic said:
I agree that this is a very good explanation/review. I have one slight problem though:
  1. In the above mentioned video he compares the i7 2018 2.2 GHz to the i9 2018 which are basically the same processors. Logical conclusion here is that the i9 is faster then the i7.
  2. Dave Lee in his video compares the i7 2017 2.6 Ghz to the i9 2018 and concludes the i9 is not faster than the i7 2017.
So, correct me if I am wrong, but it seems that the video in 1) is not conclusive at all because he is comparing it to a completely different machine than Dave Lee does.

I have great respect for both youtubers, but..... am I missing something here?
Click to expand...

What? He doesn’t compare the 2.6GHz? That’s dissapointing.
 
AndyMacAndMic

AndyMacAndMic

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mr.anthonyramos said:
There is another YouTube video posted here that compares the top of the line 2017 i7 15 inch, base 2018 15 inch and of course the i9. In all aspects the i9 still performed the best. I’m typing this on my phone so kind of a hassle to go find it here but have a look around this thread if you can’t find it message me I’ll send it to you in a PM. :)
Click to expand...

Thanks, I must have missed that post ;)
 
Mr Screech

Mr Screech

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Mar 2, 2018
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Apple dropped the ball, that's clear.

And if all you do is render/simulate most of the day, sure you can complain.

I however, and most people I see working on laptops or computers in general, make small edits with a second or more of delay in between them. And maybe a preview render every few minutes.

During all those small edits, it can access the 6 cores at full potential. The long renders usually occur during lunch or at the end of the day, right?

Most people will see vast improvements in their workflow with the i9, is what I'm saying.
If I have to wait a few minutes longer at the end of the day, while saving 1 hour or more during the day, that's fine for me.
 
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