2018 MacBook Pros crashing with "Bridge OS" error

[bobdob]

bobdob: A very depressing analysis. It's very reasonable, but very depressing. What do you see the ultimate resolution of this being? Do you think Apple will ultimately fix the issue with software, or even repair or replace affected MacBooks? Or do you think they'll just continue to sell them and act like there is no problem? More importantly, do you agree with others that it seems like many (if not most) MacBook Pros do not and will not experience this issue?

There is no doubt that most people have no or minimal issues. But even if you read this thread, there are a lot of people that do actually have issues that choose to live with it. Honestly, I can't blame them either. If you have a busy life, kids, work, school, etc., having to deal with a return/tech support, etc. for a computer that is good 95 percent of the time, is a pain in the ass.

They might try and fix it via firmware, but I highly doubt it would solve the issue completely. The fact that its been a year and counting, shows me that they are probably just busy developing a T3 chip without this issue, since they can't fix it. There will be nothing major done until the next version of a T3 chip or a revised board of the T2. Honestly, from a company perspective, there is actually no reason for them to do anything major here until the next chip. Recalling already manufactured chips is a very expensive process. If they admit there is a problem, they have to be willing to lose millions. There is very little press about this issue for them to worry about. The returns are very minimal compared to sales. If you think a few articles, a few youtube videos, and a few forum posts are enough to scare one of the richest companies in the world, it won't. Antenna gate, etc, thats the **** that scares apple. 99 percent of consumers have no idea this issue exists. 98 percent of 2018 MacBook Pro users don't know this exists.

It sucks for the people it's affecting. It's a very expensive device, but the fact that the new Mac mini and the new MacBook Pro w/ Vega 20 have the t2 chip, show this is just the way it will be until the next chip is done.

 

[pttai]

I'm getting panicked here. My AASP still has no idea what problem my MacBook Pro 2018 is facing and it has been almost 2 weeks. I have stopped doing most of the things because all of the data and apps I need to work are on there. The symptoms look exactly how members are having right here: sudden shutdowns, Bridge OS reports... I am so worried that my AASP may do things harmful to the laptop. No calls, no announcements, non updates on their site besides "We've recieved your product".
I have put my faith completely in Apple and this issue is like a big slap on my face, telling me to wake up.

 

[AMKassirMD]

I've been following this thread almost daily since the number of posts was in the 30's, waiting and hoping for a fix before I took the plunge and bought my first MacBook Pro. I've had other Macs for years: 3 iMacs beginning with a Grape iMac, and before that a Mac tower, a Mac clone, a Mac Centris, and a Mac SE/30. My last iMac was early 2009 so it could only run El Capitan and was slow--time to upgrade and I could use the mobility. On a gamble that the number of affected MacBook Pros is relatively small, I decided to go ahead. 10 days ago I received my new 2018 15" MBP i9/32/Vega 20/2TB, with Mojave 10.14.1 preinstalled. I did a clean install of all my third-party software.

The only issue I've encountered is when I leave the MBP for several hours with the lid open, as it does a long Time Machine or Retrospect backup. The display turns off after a few minutes as expected, and the Mac keeps working on the backup. When I return several hours later, the Mac's display is still off and the Mac is quiet, as if asleep. The external hard drive (backup destination) is idle. The Mac is plugged into power. The only peripheral besides power is the hard drive, connected via a USB-C to miniUSB cable.

If I tap the trackpad or the keys the Mac will not wake; the display remains dark. Or, perhaps it seems to start to wake (I hear quiet fan noise, or the display backlight seems to turn on, or the Touch Bar lights up) but in all cases the display stays dark. Closing and opening the lid had no effect. Waiting a minute didn't help. This morning I thought maybe my login prompt was hiding behind the dark display, so I entered my password, and few moments later keystrokes led to beeps as if I had actually logged in. As the display would never wake up, I had to force a reboot. This happened 3 times over the past week. After restarting there was no crash report.

I've reset the SMU about 6 times in the past week, trying to solve this and other more minor glitches. I've reset the NVRAM/PRAM a couple times. I called Apple Support and at the rep's recommendation I reinstalled Mojave yesterday before the same problem occurred a third time.

A few minutes ago, I checked /Library/Logs/DiagnosticReports, finding numerous (23) reports, most not mentioning BridgeOS, or reporting the macOS version followed by the BridgeOS version, without seeming to indicate a problem due to BridgeOS. Then I opened the ProxiedDevice-Bridge folder. There were 2 reports there, both were created about the same time I last woke the Mac and encountered the dark display problem. Here's an excerpt from each report:

File name: ResetCounter-2018-12-03-093904.ips
Contents (entire):
{"bug_type":"115","timestamp":"2018-12-03 09:39:04.51 +0000","name":"Reset count","os_version":"Bridge OS 3.1 (16P2088)","incident_id":"ABA8D8AE-2F51-4836-A980-4D10BA91EBB5"}
Incident Identifier: ABA8D8AE-2F51-4836-A980-4D10BA91EBB5
CrashReporter Key: c0dec0dec0dec0dec0dec0dec0dec0dec0de0001
Date: 2018-12-03 09:39:04.50 +0000
Reset count: 0
Boot failure count: 1
Boot faults: force_off
Boot stage: 255
Boot app: 0

File name:corespeechd-2018-12-03-093904.ips
Contents (excerpt):
{"app_name":"corespeechd","app_version":"","bug_type":"109","timestamp":"2018-12-03 09:39:04.62 +0000","os_version":"Bridge OS 3.1 (16P2088)","incident_id":"00A9C35F-D117-4620-801D-26DBB2DFA2DE","slice_uuid":"3c217d97-157a-3a65-a126-64eaa5fcacca","build_version":"","is_first_party":true,"share_with_app_devs":false,"name":"corespeechd"}
and later in the same file:
Exception Type: EXC_CRASH (SIGABRT)
Exception Codes: 0x0000000000000000, 0x0000000000000000
Exception Note: EXC_CORPSE_NOTIFY

So, would these qualify as BridgeOS KP's? The second log does seem like a KP.

I haven't encountered any KPs while waking from sleep in other situations, like when I close the lid and leave the Mac sleeping overnight, or while working. Only the above 3 situations required me to force a reboot.

Given Apple's holiday return policy, I still have a little more than a month before it's too late to return it. I don't often do hours-long backups (only the first backup is long) and since long backups are the only time I've encountered this problem so far, I might not return it on this basis alone.

I wonder if this problem would have been circumvented if I had changed the Energy Saver prefs to "prevent the computer from sleeping automatically when the display is off.".

 

[brainray]

File name: ResetCounter-2018-12-03-093904.ips

I have seen these reset counter files as well and it seems that they have something to do with the KP's. I also can confirm, that not every KP crash forces a visible bug report to Apple.

 

[Marketh]

I've had my 13" since they were launched in the Summer and it has been completely problem free, yesterday I had it running an external 1080p display whilst streaming video for upwards of about 6/7 hours, probably the longest un-interrupted time it's been awake constantly. Was slightly nervous that this would trigger my first KP however happy to report all was well. Does baffle me this one, I imagine Apple engineers feel the same.

 

[xgman]

I am working with Apple on this case right now and I really get the feeling that they don't really know what the problem is, what causes it or remotely how to fix it. (I mean other than ditching T2 entirely in future products) So like someone said above, it is that we just live with it and try to work around it. My advice along those line is that even if it may seem wrong to avoid some of the built in "features", disabling sleep, turning off file vault and even (in the recovery mode (CMD R), disable secure startup boot options. I even turned Siri off. Personally, since I don't have a laptop, I don't care that much about any of those features, but it has reduced my Bridge OS crashes to a minimum and generally only on startup or restart occasionally. Certainly not a great answer, but a workaround that seems less of a pain than starting over with a replacement that after many hours of redoing my mac, may not help at all. I need something more definitive before going down that road.

 

[Plutonius]

They might try and fix it via firmware, but I highly doubt it would solve the issue completely. The fact that its been a year and counting, shows me that they are probably just busy developing a T3 chip without this issue, since they can't fix it. There will be nothing major done until the next version of a T3 chip or a revised board of the T2.

The T2 chip is an intermediate step for Apple. Longer term, Apple is working replacing Intel with an Arm processor that would eliminate the need for a T2 chip. If it's an easy and inexpensive fix, Apple might update the T2 or design a T3. Otherwise, I think Apple will probably rely on software / firmware to correct as many T2 problems as they can until they start using Arm processors (i.e. I believe that most of Apples hardware effort is going into replacing Intel with Arm).

 

[RumorConsumer]

bobdob: A very depressing analysis. It's very reasonable, but very depressing. What do you see the ultimate resolution of this being? Do you think Apple will ultimately fix the issue with software, or even repair or replace affected MacBooks? Or do you think they'll just continue to sell them and act like there is no problem? More importantly, do you agree with others that it seems like many (if not most) MacBook Pros do not and will not experience this issue?

They'll fix it with software one thread at a time. they also had to have known this was going to happen. Somebody knew.
[doublepost=1543868715][/doublepost]

Rumorconsumer hit the nail on the head. A lot of folks seem to be treating this as a single error, because the error message is the same. Sadly, these are all various issues, disguised under one user facing error message, because they involve the T2 chip and the bridge between that and the intel chip. A firmware fix to simply correct a multitude of errors at any given time seems to be an uphill battle, considering Apple probably has to get intel involved for any handshake/handoffs caused by bridging the two chips, multiply that times how many various “calls” there are between both processes.

Having a chip talk to one of their own manufacturered chips is hard enough. Now try that while also dealing with another vendors chip. Now add in a possible hardware defect. Now add in possible software defects. Now you have something that should have been scraped on the workbench before it went into production. Engineering tip - don’t bridge two processors together unless you have the keys to both cars. Engineering tip two - if you do bridge them together and you see issues, stop putting them in mass production in new computers.

I think what is happening is the T2 chip is reacting poorly to variable environment changes - some that speak to 3rd party software or devices - some that happen after sleep, but not always after sleep, etc. Point being, it’s an absolute mess, because it’s a possible defect - but not always reproducible - chip, dealing with a 3rd party chip (intel), while also having various computing tasks tripping it up. It’s not a single issue, it’s hundreds of issues, happening at different times, very little constant.

But, the real truth is most people aren’t replacing their laptops. Apple already made and paid for the chips and is banking on having them in new gear, which is why they continued to put it in. From a sales perspective - it doesn’t hurt them and the returns are probably 1 percent of sales - because the average Joe will simply think “damn, my computer crash, back to Facebook, I hope Facebook doesn’t crash it again”.

I believe the programming lingo is a "race condition". No doubt in my mind Apple and Intel are talking about it and how to make it better but also likely the relationship is a bit strained.

 

[Beancamel]

I've been a lurker on these forums for years, lots of great info. i decided to join cause this whole T2 thing has me at an impasse. so heres my dilemma. I use my MBP for DJ'ing (currently i have a 2012 MBP and 2014 MBPr) been saving up for weeks to get this new 2018 but this T2 problem has me having seconds thoughts.... i cant stress enough how important enough during live play that i cannot have a crash. Should i wait until apple irons these bugs out... wait til fall of 2019 ( possible T3 chip ) or just go with a 2017 MBPr ? kinda bummed out as i was looking forward to the newer tech of the 6 cores.

 

[RumorConsumer]

I've been a lurker on these forums for years, lots of great info. i decided to join cause this whole T2 thing has me at an impasse. so heres my dilemma. I use my MBP for DJ'ing (currently i have a 2012 MBP and 2014 MBPr) been saving up for weeks to get this new 2018 but this T2 problem has me having seconds thoughts.... i cant stress enough how important enough during live play that i cannot have a crash. Should i wait until apple irons these bugs out... wait til fall of 2019 ( possible T3 chip ) or just go with a 2017 MBPr ? kinda bummed out as i was looking forward to the newer tech of the 6 cores.

Pains me to say but if you need that kind of reliability steer clear for now.

 

[Plutonius]

I've been a lurker on these forums for years, lots of great info. i decided to join cause this whole T2 thing has me at an impasse. so heres my dilemma. I use my MBP for DJ'ing (currently i have a 2012 MBP and 2014 MBPr) been saving up for weeks to get this new 2018 but this T2 problem has me having seconds thoughts.... i cant stress enough how important enough during live play that i cannot have a crash. Should i wait until apple irons these bugs out... wait til fall of 2019 ( possible T3 chip ) or just go with a 2017 MBPr ? kinda bummed out as i was looking forward to the newer tech of the 6 cores.

Another option is to get a 2017 MacBook Pro. B&H and others still carry them in stock (I'm not sure how long that will last).

The 2017 model has a T1 chip which has had no issues that I have seen reported.

The only issue on the 2017 you might run into is the keyboard which is covered by a four year warranty.

 

[pubmsu]

I have decided to skip 2018 models and wait for 2019. I have the 2016 15-inch with topcase, keyboard and display replaced by Apple.

2019 models will have the hopefully reliable gen 4 keyboard, T3, better thermals and maybe even better battery life.

If we are lucky, there might be early 2019 models with the updates.

 

[KDLM]

I have ordered another 2018 MacBook Pro with the same specifications. Hopefully it will not have these problems, though I won't get it for about 10 days.

I have been thinking that the new Mac Mini will be my fallback option, but I just looked and saw that it also has the T2 chip. Does anyone know if the new Mac Mini is also affected by these T2/Bridge OS problems?

 

[xgman]

I don't really see any consensus as to what is causing this, or a common workaround. My thinking is that probably all T2 chips are vulnerable but whatever send the macs to a panic is not really very well understood even after a year of this. That said most people obviously never have the issue or don't realize it or don't report it, but there are many reports of connected TB3 or USB situations that seem suspect. I have been able to trigger with certain TB3 connections for instance, but not consistently. I really doubt that after a year and several Bridge OS updates in version, that only some of the T2 chips are affected. Possible, but you would think that they would have weeded out that by now. (again my imac pro built in November, 2018 in China was still affected).

 

[RumorConsumer]

I don't really see any consensus as to what is causing this, or a common workaround. My thinking is that probably all T2 chips are vulnerable but whatever send the macs to a panic is not really very well understood even after a year of this. That said most people obviously never have the issue or don't realize it or don't report it, but there are many reports of connected TB3 or USB situations that seem suspect. I have been able to trigger with certain TB3 connections for instance, but not consistently. I really doubt that after a year and several Bridge OS updates in version, that only some of the T2 chips are affected. Possible, but you would think that they would have weeded out that by now. (again my imac pro built in November, 2018 in China was still affected).

Given that the T2 controls most of the internals of the Mac right now, you could just as easily say "there's a few bugs/incompatibilities". I dont mean to minimize the issue but its not quite that THE T2 has *a* single flaw. You can think of it like a computer within a computer with its own OS that's just getting past 1.0.

 

[xgman]

Given that the T2 controls most of the internals of the Mac right now, you could just as easily say "there's a few bugs/incompatibilities". I dont mean to minimize the issue but its not quite that THE T2 has *a* single flaw. You can think of it like a computer within a computer with its own OS that's just getting past 1.0.

bridge OS is already at v3.2x or so.

 

[Idefix]

I've seen a few posts about the 2018 mac mini spontaneously rebooting, such as this one:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mac-mini-2018-unexpectedly-reboots.2157292/

I'm thinking that's the same T2 problem, which they're oblivious to in the mac mini forum...

 

[KDLM]

I've seen a few posts about the 2018 mac mini spontaneously rebooting, such as this one:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mac-mini-2018-unexpectedly-reboots.2157292/

I'm thinking that's the same T2 problem, which they're oblivious to in the mac mini forum...

Wow, thanks for that. So much for my backup plan. What I wouldn't give for a 2018 MacBook Pro that was only subject to keyboard failure!

 

[Beancamel]

Another option is to get a 2017 MacBook Pro. B&H and others still carry them in stock (I'm not sure how long that will last).

The 2017 model has a T1 chip which has had no issues that I have seen reported.

The only issue on the 2017 you might run into is the keyboard which is covered by a four year warranty.

thanks, thats what i was thinking... kinda frustrates me as its not a super leap forward from my 2014. so at the moment its down to a 2017 or wait til fall of 2019 see if this T2 issue is resolved .

 

[donawalt]

I keep wondering, without any substantiation, if use case(s) aren't part of identifying the problem. Anecdotally it sure seems like the people who have the issue have it repeatedly, and on multiple machines. The people that don't, never see it - sometimes on 2 or more machines. What I have NOT seen here is that a batch of initial computers had it, and now the problem is gone as people traded in those machines. For some they continue to experience the problem on new computers, yet time and updates and even different computer designs have taken place. This is not like some of the "-gate" issues of the past.

I wonder if there is some way people are using their computer(s), some software, some APIs, some type of stress that uncovers the bug - whether it's OS, firmware, hardware, or all of the above.

 

[KDLM]

I keep wondering, without any substantiation, if use case(s) aren't part of identifying the problem. Anecdotally it sure seems like the people who have the issue have it repeatedly, and on multiple machines. The people that don't, never see it - sometimes on 2 or more machines. What I have NOT seen here is that a batch of initial computers had it, and now the problem is gone as people traded in those machines. For some they continue to experience the problem on new computers, yet time and updates and even different computer designs have taken place. This is not like some of the "-gate" issues of the past.

I wonder if there is some way people are using their computer(s), some software, some APIs, some type of stress that uncovers the bug - whether it's OS, firmware, hardware, or all of the above.

That is an interesting point, but not correct, I believe. Some people have reported getting an affected MacBook Pro, and then exchanging it for a MacBook Pro that ends up not having the problem. There is a post in these last couple of pages of this thread by @SDColorado (post #2762) in which he describes having bought four different MacBook Pros, and only one of them having this issue. Of course, the best way to test all of this would be to have a bunch of people who have as-of-yet unaffected MacBook Pros swap them with those of us who have affected ones. Any takers?

 

[doitdada]

Of course, the best way to test all of this would be to have a bunch of people who have as-of-yet unaffected MacBook Pros swap them with those of us who have affected ones. Any takers?

So keep away from the refurbished ones

 

[brainray]

So keep away from the refurbished ones

Exactly: 2 of my 2 refurbished ones had KP issues.

 

[Ploki]

I have decided to skip 2018 models and wait for 2019. I have the 2016 15-inch with topcase, keyboard and display replaced by Apple.

2019 models will have the hopefully reliable gen 4 keyboard, T3, better thermals and maybe even better battery life.

If we are lucky, there might be early 2019 models with the updates.

vega20 was just released and apple replaced a few - doubt they want to go through that again hehe.

fwiw, my retalier said nobody yet returned their 13”.

 

[KDLM]

Exactly: 2 of my 2 refurbished ones had KP issues.

brainray: How did you end up with two refurbished MacBook Pros?