(2019) 16" is HOT & NOISY with an external monitor! :(

[Corncab44]

I don't know if you're aware but using the iGPU when connected to an external monitor will require a logic board redesign as only the dGPU is hardwired to external monitor connections. It's Apple's choice of design which is the opposite of Windows laptops which the iGPU is the one hardwired and the dGPU routes through the iGPU when connected to external

Ah so then there's really no possible software fix to this issue. Might just return then. I was hoping they might let users power an external through the integrated GPU, or at least use the video card in some low power mode.

This is my first Mac and for years now I've powered a 4k monitor using the iGPU on some fairly cheap (compared to Mac) Thinkpads. Never occurred to me this would be an issue.

 

[Alex W.]

guys 8x isnt going to gimp a mobile low end dgpu like this prolly done to optimize power usage imo.

Does this fix external monitor fan noise?
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Appears that my email to Mr Tim Cook tcook@apple.com which was sent on Wednesday July 8th was opened today Friday July 10th..

View attachment 932587

..then it was forwarded on and opened several times, which categorised it as a "hot conversation". A little ironic given the topic of this thread...

View attachment 932588
View attachment 932594

..then I got a call from Apple Support around 1400 CET. He thanked me for my valuable feedback, but offered no concrete steps towards making my 2019 MacBook Pro function as well as my 2015 MacBook Pro did. It is indeed a sad day when someone has been forced to set their expectations of a $3000 new device so low that they simply want it to function at least as well as their previous 2015 device. Not better, but at least as well.

One grain of hope was that he said there may be an Apple Service Program created if enough feedback reaches Apple

Everyone needs to go leave feedback ASAP.

 

[spinnn]

I sent feedback recently. Feedback is always good and sometimes you get a reply to follow up on your case.

Product Feedback

We would love to hear your comments about any of our hardware and software products. Send us your thoughts.

www.apple.com

 

[sebien]

Hi, I just found this thread and glad that I'm not alone lol. My 16" Macbook pro is unusable with Dell U3818w monitor. I've tried with a different cable (USD-C to display port) and a cooler pad, but none of them were helpful. I'm reading the thread from page 1, just wanted to check if there's any solution. Can I return this? (it's 7 months old) Really frustrating.

 

[Corncab44]

Sadly my upgrade from a usb-c/mDP adaptor attached to a mDP-HDMI cable to a $50 Moshi usb-c to DisplayPort cable that Apple sells has made zero difference. The Radeon is still drawing the same amount of power when idle -- 20 watts when screen is open and connected to an external monitor, and at least 5 when it is in clamshell mode. The only difference is I have $50 less in my bank account (ok, to be fair I'm sure I'll get some use out of this cable over the years...)

 

[decipherkl]

Hi everyone,

I have stopped using iStat Menus for a while now and have been using various other solutions such as Menu Meters, built in monitors in Turbo Boost Switcher Pro and Little Snitch for traffic.

Just yesterday I switched back to iStat Menus and I noticed something interesting. With iStat Menus, temperature and fan ramps up much faster under load and overall, when idle, temperature is generally higher with iStat Menus in the region of a few degrees (>5C) higher.

For example, when I had a VC on Teams, temperature quickly ramped up to 70C+ and fan was going at 4k+ rpm. Do note that I have stopped using TBSP for a while now. With Menu Meters, the behaviour is more subdued on Teams VC - temperature high 50Cs to mid-60Cs. And under low load with Menu Meters even with the lid opened my temperature sits around 53C (like typing this now). Also I would say my ambient temperature is in the range of 28-30C.

So I have turned off iStat Menus again.

Hope people would find this helpful.

 

[Sartoria]

Hi all, I tried going back quite a few pages but couldn't find a clear and immediate answer, so I figured I'd ask.

I'm on the verge of ordering a new Macbook Pro 16", and am wondering whether to go with the 5500M or the 5600M.

Are the problems with the Macbook fans going crazy fixed with the 5600M? Or is this a problem that persists regardless of the GPU chosen? I would ideally like to use my macbook on an external monitor at my desk.

 

[decipherkl]

Hi all, I tried going back quite a few pages but couldn't find a clear and immediate answer, so I figured I'd ask.

I'm on the verge of ordering a new Macbook Pro 16", and am wondering whether to go with the 5500M or the 5600M.

Are the problems with the Macbook fans going crazy fixed with the 5600M? Or is this a problem that persists regardless of the GPU chosen? I would ideally like to use my macbook on an external monitor at my desk.

Given that I am still here I will help answer.

Based on what I have read so far is that the 5600M appears to not have the fan issue with external monitor attached.

 

[Norbert Mikołajczyk]

Hi everyone,

I have stopped using iStat Menus for a while now and have been using various other solutions such as Menu Meters, built in monitors in Turbo Boost Switcher Pro and Little Snitch for traffic.

Just yesterday I switched back to iStat Menus and I noticed something interesting. With iStat Menus, temperature and fan ramps up much faster under load and overall, when idle, temperature is generally higher with iStat Menus in the region of a few degrees (>5C) higher.

For example, when I had a VC on Teams, temperature quickly ramped up to 70C+ and fan was going at 4k+ rpm. Do note that I have stopped using TBSP for a while now. With Menu Meters, the behaviour is more subdued on Teams VC - temperature high 50Cs to mid-60Cs. And under low load with Menu Meters even with the lid opened my temperature sits around 53C (like typing this now). Also I would say my ambient temperature is in the range of 28-30C.

So I have turned off iStat Menus again.

Hope people would find this helpful.

Same here, 55C on idle with lid open - 5C lower than with istat! Nice finding but I'm not sure which one is showing right temp, maybe they are showing different temps... I think I'm gonna uninstall both and just use my mbp as I'm happy with mine. ;P

 

[sco]

Are the problems with the Macbook fans going crazy fixed with the 5600M? Or is this a problem that persists regardless of the GPU chosen? I would ideally like to use my macbook on an external monitor at my desk.

It's pot luck whether you'll have problems with the 5500M. You could try the 5500M and return it if you're having trouble then switch to the 5600M ... which is what I did.

Just yesterday I switched back to iStat Menus and I noticed something interesting. With iStat Menus, temperature and fan ramps up much faster under load and overall, when idle, temperature is generally higher with iStat Menus in the region of a few degrees (>5C) higher.

Interesting. I think someone else posted they were noticing spikes caused by Turbo Switcher. I've ditched using the Intel Power Gadget for similar reasons. I found my VMWare VMs were a bit laggy. Stopping using the Intel Power Gadget fixed that.
[automerge]1594808761[/automerge]

Based on what I have read so far is that the 5600M appears to not have the fan issue with external monitor attached.

I've noticed the fan less with the 5600M. It is still possible to get it to hit 5000RPM with turbo boost on and making the machine work hard. In my case having the 5600M results in around 10W less heat from the GPU so that gives the system more headroom before it heats up.

I posted a while back I was experimenting with Volta. I'm finding with my workload setting the CPU power limit to 36W keeps the fans under 3200RPM which is when I start to notice them. This has a negligible effect on single CPU geekbench results. Knocks about 25% off the multi-core results. I can remove the CPU limit if I want the machine to run at full speed and not worried at the time about fan noise. e.g. running a compile while I'm off grabbing a coffee.

 

[gsbabil]

I'm finding with my workload setting the CPU power limit to 36W keeps the fans under 3200RPM which is when I start to notice them. This has a negligible effect on single CPU geekbench results. Knocks about 25% off the multi-core results. I can remove the CPU limit if I want the machine to run at full speed and not worried at the time about fan noise. e.g. running a compile while I'm off grabbing a coffee.

Hi @sco,

Could you please share the names of the softwares you use to manage your CPU/GPU heat and performance under control?

Thank you.

 

[sco]

Hi @sco,

Could you please share the names of the softwares you use to manage your CPU/GPU heat and performance under control?

Thank you.

First line of my post... Volta...

Volta - Ultimate power control for Mac

volta.garymathews.com

Found it courtesy of a post by @AFPBoy on this thread.

 

[Corncab44]

Unfortunately the 5600M is out of the price range for most of us. In any case I don't need anything above a 5300m, so why should I be forced to spend $720 for better thermals!

I did run some more tests last night between the two models I have in hand. I played a video on HBO max in clamshell mode, with a few other browser tabs open. On my i7/5300m the dGPU was pulling around 13w in full screen in Chrome, while the 5500m was pulling around 20. This seems clear evidence that the 5300m can do better in certain low-taxing use cases. I've had more trouble figuring out which processor does well when running turbo mode. A case in this thread has been made for the i9 2.4ghz with power reduced or at least turbo boost off.

I may return both models and order a 5300m with an i9 2.4ghz, and run that with turbo boost off, or pay around with Volta. Seems like the best option outside of destroying my savings to get a 5600m.

 

[Corncab44]

First line of my post... Volta...

Volta - Ultimate power control for Mac

volta.garymathews.com

Found it courtesy of a post by @AFPBoy on this thread.

What settings did you ultimately settle on with Volta? You're on an i9 2.4?

 

[kilihn]

I wish I never saw this thread lol I purchase a new one a few days ago and was debating dropping money on a 5600 card bbut it didnt make sense to drop the money so i got the 5500, now im reconsidering again since my order is processing. Any tips/advice? Just wanna get the most out of the money im dropping but spending 4k on specs seems crazy to me. I do work with an external monitor a lot as an interactive designer/coder

 

[LinkRS]

Hi everyone,

I have stopped using iStat Menus for a while now and have been using various other solutions such as Menu Meters, built in monitors in Turbo Boost Switcher Pro and Little Snitch for traffic.

Just yesterday I switched back to iStat Menus and I noticed something interesting. With iStat Menus, temperature and fan ramps up much faster under load and overall, when idle, temperature is generally higher with iStat Menus in the region of a few degrees (>5C) higher.

For example, when I had a VC on Teams, temperature quickly ramped up to 70C+ and fan was going at 4k+ rpm. Do note that I have stopped using TBSP for a while now. With Menu Meters, the behaviour is more subdued on Teams VC - temperature high 50Cs to mid-60Cs. And under low load with Menu Meters even with the lid opened my temperature sits around 53C (like typing this now). Also I would say my ambient temperature is in the range of 28-30C.

So I have turned off iStat Menus again.

Hope people would find this helpful.

Hi decipherkl,

I find your information quite intriguing. In the PC/Windows world, it is common to see discrepancies with temperature reports using different tools, but yours is the first evidence I have become aware of, indicating this is true on the Mac side. Do you think you are you seeing reported higher temps using iStat Menus, or actual higher temps? I was under the impression that iStat Menus uses the built-in monitors provided by macOS, vices its own, but it is till possible that the values are being interpreted differently. Thanks!

Rich S.

 

[chah3]

I'm on the fence about buying the base model 16in on Amazon for $2k and I really would like to use it when paired with my LG external monitor (LG 29UM68-P). It looks like the base model has the Radeon Pro 5300M. Is this a good idea? It sounds like this model has the same overheating issues when connected to an external monitor and the MBP will be connected to this monitor about 75% of the time it's in use. Would a 13in have the same issue?

 

[Corncab44]

I also noticed a 5-6-7 degree celsius difference between iStat and MenuMeters (with iStat reporting higher temperatures). However, as the system controls the fans, presumably it doesn't matter the exact measurements these apps are spitting out since we can measure the results by fan speeds, which would be the same across any app. And they are high!

 

[bomby0]

I don't know if you're aware but using the iGPU when connected to an external monitor will require a logic board redesign as only the dGPU is hardwired to external monitor connections. It's Apple's choice of design which is the opposite of Windows laptops which the iGPU is the one hardwired and the dGPU routes through the iGPU when connected to external

Is this confirmed the dGPU is hardwired? In clamshell mode it's possible (with some weird resolution hacks) to get it to 5W as others report so maybe not all hope is lost. Maybe it's still possible to get it to 5W with the screen open and external monitor attached? In other words, the fan noise is the huge issue not whether it's using the iGPU or dGPU

 

[dooyou]

We should probably take a break here until there is something really new. For days the same questions have been asked, which were actually answered long ago. Actually everything has been said. No update, no solution.

 

[MacosaurusNEXT]

Just a quick update on 10.15.6, just installed it, tested it under my previous conditions, sorry to say: but no change in temp behavior on the i9 5500m 4GB.

Idle 54C with 1830/1700 rpm, 5,5w-6,5w on dGPU in clamshell mode, open 19W dGPU, with Logic X Playback (low CPU 3-5%) 5mins: 80C, 4200 rpm, 22W dGPU on avg.

 

[Norbert Mikołajczyk]

Hi decipherkl,

I find your information quite intriguing. In the PC/Windows world, it is common to see discrepancies with temperature reports using different tools, but yours is the first evidence I have become aware of, indicating this is true on the Mac side. Do you think you are you seeing reported higher temps using iStat Menus, or actual higher temps? I was under the impression that iStat Menus uses the built-in monitors provided by macOS, vices its own, but it is till possible that the values are being interpreted differently. Thanks!

Rich S.

We don’t know what temp is menu meters showing. The istat have so many. It would be better to see faq, source code or ask developer...

 

[sco]

What settings did you ultimately settle on with Volta? You're on an i9 2.4?

2.3Ghz CPU. I did mention my current settings...

I posted a while back I was experimenting with Volta. I'm finding with my workload setting the CPU power limit to 36W keeps the fans under 3200RPM which is when I start to notice them. This has a negligible effect on single CPU geekbench results. Knocks about 25% off the multi-core results. I can remove the CPU limit if I want the machine to run at full speed and not worried at the time about fan noise. e.g. running a compile while I'm off grabbing a coffee.

Probably need a few more days before I settle on a setting. I’m at the point where I am nudging up 1W at a time and seeing how I go for a day.

 

[mrmachine79]

Unfortunately the 5600M is out of the price range for most of us. In any case I don't need anything above a 5300m, so why should I be forced to spend $720 for better thermals!

I did run some more tests last night between the two models I have in hand. I played a video on HBO max in clamshell mode, with a few other browser tabs open. On my i7/5300m the dGPU was pulling around 13w in full screen in Chrome, while the 5500m was pulling around 20. This seems clear evidence that the 5300m can do better in certain low-taxing use cases. I've had more trouble figuring out which processor does well when running turbo mode. A case in this thread has been made for the i9 2.4ghz with power reduced or at least turbo boost off.

I may return both models and order a 5300m with an i9 2.4ghz, and run that with turbo boost off, or pay around with Volta. Seems like the best option outside of destroying my savings to get a 5600m.

While not as expensive as the 5600m upgrade, the 2.4ghz CPU is still an expensive upgrade if you are only wanting it for reduced fan noise and don't care about or need or want the improved CPU performance. It will not solve the problem, like it sounds the 5600m will. It might be at best, very slightly less noisy. Not worth it.

That said, while I've only used the machine without eGPU for a few days to test and this was a few weeks ago, I believe the noise levels with 2.4ghz and 5300m were not that bad with lid open and external display under light to medium load. Maybe around 3500rpm on average.

Keep in mind all these kind of reports are anecdotal at best. I'd be we wary of making a purchase decision based on this. But on the plus side, it might be worth testing if the fan noise is really absolutely critical for you, because apple has a good return policy.

 

[datpricetho]

Setup = {
Specs : 2.3 i9, 5500M 8GB,
Laptop Orientation/ Setup : Clamshell,
Turbo Boost : OFF,
High Refresh Monitor : 1440p @ 144hz
Monitor connected with : This USB-C to Display Port cable ! Important
Work load : Chrome 5 tabs with a youtube video.VS Code.Slack,
}

Outcome = {
Radeon High side : 5W-7W
Total System Power : 20Wish
CPU PCEI Temp: 54C
Fans: 0 RPM
My mood : Not happy about having to use the damn thing in Clamshell AND then buy a keyboard and mouse AND another cable to connect the monitor AND External Speakers if I want to play music AND Needing to Setup a 2nd Monitor AND BUY ANOTHER CONNECTION CABLE just to replace the Monitor I was using on the laptop!
}
---------------------------------------------
Setup = {
Specs : 2.3 i9, 5500M 8GB,
Laptop Orientation/ Setup : Open with external monitor
Turbo Boost : OFF,
Monitor : 1440p @ 60HZ
Monitor connected with : USB C to HDMI dongle
Work load : Chrome 5 tabs with a youtube video.VS Code.Slack,
}

Outcome = {
Radeon High side : 18W-20W
Total System Power : 40-50W ish
CPU PCEI Temp: 65C
Fans: 3500 RPM Ish
My mood : Hot fingers, small office is hot and stuffy after a few hours of work, wearing headphones to block out fan noise.
}