(2019) 16" is HOT & NOISY with an external monitor! :(

[thedocbwarren]

Starting to think there might have been an expectation by a few here that the MBP 16 was a big MacBook Air. Some of the external usage (full clock) I get to a degree but I think it's an AMD problem. Either way these laptops were kind of last big Intel push to push full power in it. It's why I thought there is only so far a desktop replacement laptop will be able to go. I have some regret only because I wanted a desktop in the first place but can't due to space and other factors in my living space, but later on will change that. The laptop is powerful for sure, you will always have to mitigate that in this form factor, no way around it.

 

[Kogut]

GPUs can be used for more than just paint the display. Likely using for extra processing.

MBP16 after restart, only music app is turned on, the general temperature of laptop reached 61 because of very demanding computing from music app for DGPU ?
okay ...
This only shows how bad various parts of MacOS are bad designed. And there isn’t any excuse for that.

 

[Grohowiak]

MBP16 after restart, only music app is turned on, the general temperature of laptop reached 61 because of very demanding computing from music app for DGPU ?
okay ...

If there was anything moving / displayed on the screen then yes, gpu (hardware acceleration) can get to work.

 

[Kogut]

If there was anything moving / displayed on the screen then yes, gpu (hardware acceleration) can get to work.

There weren’t. Only constant image and sound, you can try on your own.

 

[thedocbwarren]

Again, GPUs can be used for parallel processing (see ML or any kind of decoding.) this alleviates the CPU of stuff that is more efficient. Yes this design is more suited for desktop. Every single laptop that has a powerful GPU in it will throttle itself because you are cramming something that generates a lot of heat into a metal sheet. Fans are minimal cooling for most modern GPUs and CPUs. This is why people water cool desktops. And this is why Apple is moving to a new design, you can only go so far with these desktop shrink-down chips.

End of the day I'm positive these were all designed for desktop first not laptops. In fact that was the major issue for PPC as well (know this first hand.) Apple silicon will be a major leap forward for sure.

There weren’t. Only constant image and sound, you can try on your own.

 

[thedocbwarren]

Just imagine if Apple had jumped Heavily into OpenCL. This laptop would combust.

 

[LithiumChrome]

Oh man, this sudo pmset -a gpuswitch 0 really nailed the system to how it should be.
internal + eGPU - 2x external. Xcode + 3 apps + safari 9 tabs total across 3 screens & video running on internal.
Loving it!

View attachment 960391

Hi,sorry I'm out to the loop (haven't read all 160 pages) but please would you be able to share what I can do to achieve these results? I use a far less demanding set up than you but still have the same problem with my 5300 like many others.

 

[DesertNomad]

I received my 16" today: 2.4GHz, 64GB, 4TB, 5600M. I have it connected to an XDR Display on the right port and on the left side via a TB3/TB2 adapter to an OWC RAID and then a 27" Thunderbolt Display. I have only had the fans come on during a large WiFi transfer and during a Geekbench run. So far I have not done much other than install software and start getting my files moved. Fingers crossed.

 

[Mity]

I received my 16" today: 2.4GHz, 64GB, 4TB, 5600M. I have it connected to an XDR Display on the right port and on the left side via a TB3/TB2 adapter to an OWC RAID and then a 27" Thunderbolt Display. I have only had the fans come on during a large WiFi transfer and during a Geekbench run. So far I have not done much other than install software and start getting my files moved. Fingers crossed.

Can you run some 4K YouTube videos? Someone stated earlier that connecting to an external display and watching YouTube videos was enough for the fan on the 5600m to come on.

 

[DesertNomad]

Can you run some 4K YouTube videos? Someone stated earlier that connecting to an external display and watching YouTube videos was enough for the fan on the 5600m to come on.

I would think that depends on the codec but a few that I have tried work ok. The area above the TouchBar gets quite warm, but I can still comfortably touch it... sometimes my 2014 MBP 15" would got too hot to touch. The fans were on but at very low speed.

 

[Grohowiak]

Hi,sorry I'm out to the loop (haven't read all 160 pages) but please would you be able to share what I can do to achieve these results? I use a far less demanding set up than you but still have the same problem with my 5300 like many others.

I have the 5300 as well.
Basically I have a eGPU connected to my 16" (top right port).
I connect two monitors to the eGPU. This lowers the power draw of the 5300 to about 5W
It works fine untill I start doing something on the internal screen. For example, if I play a video on my internal screen the wattage goes up and while it is not constant 18W it still IS something SO to completely eliminate the unnecessary (in my particular scenario. This might not work for others so keep that in mind) power draw of the 5300 you run the sudo command using terminal app.

Open terminal
copy and paste this: sudo pmset -a gpuswitch 0 and hit return. You will be asked to enter password. As you type nothing will happen on the screen so make sure you're type it correctly. Once done hit return again.
Now internal screen will use the on board intel graphics.

If you want to power the 5300 up just copy and paste this: sudo pmset -a gpuswitch 1 and hit return.

*****
on a side note no matter what I do Today I can't get the terminal command to work. It does nothing lol.
So weird.

 

[orion73]

Hi there,
I got my MB 16" since two weeks, with 6 core i7 and 5300 GPU, 16 GB ram, and macOS 10.15.7.
Here it is my experience (all tests done disabling turbo boost, except the one with zoom), room temperature ~ 23/24 C. I have a laptop pad without any fan, it has just some room and holes, to allow air circulation.

1) in general the machine is silent, I hear noise only with high cpu load, e.g. multithreading, but in general the cpu is not stressed. I did some test running an astrophotography code working in parallel on 12 24mp images, fans where always~<2400 rmp, and average temp did not exceed 60 C

2) When I do normal work, i.e. coding, plus some standard stuff (browsing, ect..) fans never go above 1800 rpm, average temp is always< 50 C.

3) When connecting external monitor I have the issue, but again, the heat is acceptable, and I can't hear the fans (always ~ 1800 rpm)

4) The issue with the DGPU is present also in clamshell mode, and in my opinion it depends on the ratio between original and scaled resolution. My external monitor is very old, and the resolution I get is too low, so I will buy a new one.

5) I tried to play 4k videos on internal screen (no external monitor connected) with chrome in fullscreen, my Radeon High Side sensor was showing 2W

6) I had a one hour zoom meeting, without disabling the turbo boost, no issue, average temp ~ 50 C.

7) Indexing after importing backup from old machine: I did the migration not in one shot. I moved only the directories I needed (use rsync to preserve permission and creation/modification date). The indexing was active in a reasonable way, and I heard funs only a few times. It is logical that if you copy 400GB in one shot, then you will have your indexing processes running for a long long time...

8) While writing these notes (no external monitor), CPUs ~ 40 C, average load (3-4)%, chrome has ~ 40 tabs open, in background I have PyCharm, vscode, Docker desktop, X11 with sshx on remote server (x2go), Whatsapp, Mendely desktop, and others apps.

In conclusion, I agree, it is a pity that the DGPU kicks in with the external monitor, but to be honest, the overall effect is negligible. To me the machine looks impressive! By the way, if you feel the keyboard that is too hot, why to buy an external gpu, when you can buy an external keyboard? And, if you buy a full desktop replacement, but squeezed into <1cm thick chassis, you can't expect much better, even though I agree, the DGPU was mistake in the design. But when judging it, you should also take into account all the pros of this machine. I really have the impression, that most of the people don't have any idea of what, and how complex, is the the stuff inside their machine, probably they never installed linux on laptop in the 2000, that was a in issue ?

 

[IceStormNG]

Well. Nice that it works for you. But the 16" is actually not that impressive. Look at all the issues that thing has and are still neither fixed nor acknowledged by Apple. They probably just ignore that and move forward with Apple Silicon.

1. Heating issue with 5300M/5500M and external Monitor. Solution: 5600M(?) or eGPU
2. GPU panics for several reasons (still not fixed). Apple says it's a software bug and we should wait for an update. That was many months ago. No fixes yet and they refuse to refund or repair the machine.
3. Sleep crashes (for some people still not fixed) Solution: Disable PowerNap.
4. Speaker popping when using professional audio software (like Logic Pro or GarageBand). Solution: Don't use the internal speakers
5. Extreme battery degradation on some models. Solution: Get a new battery (?)
6. T2 issues (like all T2 MacBooks). Solution: None.
7. Not specific 16" but all USB-C only MacBooks. External displays are a pain. There are different technologies (TB3, USB-C, DP, MST, DisplayLink etc) and not all of them work because Apple decided to not support some of them for whatever reason. The hardware supports it under Bootcamp, but macOS doesn't.

Maybe I'm just overly pessimistic. But the 16" really made me think about whether I really need a Mac for my type of work. Windows Laptops are not perfect. But a) they're cheaper and b) usually don't have such extreme issues. I'm talking about higher quality Windows laptops here.

 

[bomby0]

Well. Nice that it works for you. But the 16" is actually not that impressive. Look at all the issues that thing has and are still neither fixed nor acknowledged by Apple. They probably just ignore that and move forward with Apple Silicon.

1. Heating issue with 5300M/5500M and external Monitor. Solution: 5600M(?) or eGPU
2. GPU panics for several reasons (still not fixed). Apple says it's a software bug and we should wait for an update. That was many months ago. No fixes yet and they refuse to refund or repair the machine.
3. Sleep crashes (for some people still not fixed) Solution: Disable PowerNap.
4. Speaker popping when using professional audio software (like Logic Pro or GarageBand). Solution: Don't use the internal speakers
5. Extreme battery degradation on some models. Solution: Get a new battery (?)
6. T2 issues (like all T2 MacBooks). Solution: None.
7. Not specific 16" but all USB-C only MacBooks. External displays are a pain. There are different technologies (TB3, USB-C, DP, MST, DisplayLink etc) and not all of them work because Apple decided to not support some of them for whatever reason. The hardware supports it under Bootcamp, but macOS doesn't.

Maybe I'm just overly pessimistic. But the 16" really made me think about whether I really need a Mac for my type of work. Windows Laptops are not perfect. But a) they're cheaper and b) usually don't have such extreme issues. I'm talking about higher quality Windows laptops here.

Yeah 100%. Compared to my old 13" MBP from 2013 my 16" MBP is super super buggy and overheats easily. I don't recommend the 16" to anyone at all.

 

[jeffjank33]

Haven't gone through the 160 pages.. but have you all tried ensuring you are plugging power into the right side USB vs the left?

Suppose to play a role in reducing heat and keeping the fan off..

 

[IceStormNG]

Haven't gone through the 160 pages.. but have you all tried ensuring you are plugging power into the right side USB vs the left?

Suppose to play a role in reducing heat and keeping the fan off..

That’s doesn’t make a difference on the 16“. There was exactly one model (13“ not sure which year) that was affected by this. The 16“ has then same capacity and features on both sides.

 

[mrkkbb]

Haven't gone through the 160 pages.. but have you all tried ensuring you are plugging power into the right side USB vs the left?

Suppose to play a role in reducing heat and keeping the fan off..

I'm sorry about the way this will sound, but there are a lot of highly skilled users commenting on this issue throughout the 160 pages. Your question is like the standard tech-support question, "Is it plugged in?"

 

[Alex W.]

Guys, has anyone had an official response from Apple on this -- have you contact the executive office?
What is the status from apple, are they going to fix it?

 

[thedocbwarren]

Official answer is: "working as designed."

I contacted support for a battery issue (that mysteriously went away) and spoke to them about this issue as well. they know about it but it's not something they can change at the hardware level, as I was told.

Guys, has anyone had an official response from Apple on this -- have you contact the executive office?
What is the status from apple, are they going to fix it?

 

[Alex W.]

Official answer is: "working as designed."

I contacted support for a battery issue (that mysteriously went away) and spoke to them about this issue as well. they know about it but it's not something they can change at the hardware level, as I was told.

Battery issue?

 

[thedocbwarren]

Well laptop is new and I was getting a warning to service the battery. It did not change after a reboot and I did notice it was draining fast. After speaking with them they asked for a diagnostic. Once I ran it the warning went away. Battery life is still the same but I discussed the heat issues as throttling as part of a battery drain discussion. The tech acknowledged this is a known thing but they can't fix without changes to hardware.

Battery issue?

 

[nick9191]

I’ve just received a new baseline 16” through work. Connecting to a 24” 1920x1200 HP monitor via an Anker dock and then HDMI.

Seems pretty fine to me. Definitely runs hotter when connected to the display but not very hot. I would say hotter than warm. Fan noise is there but pretty unnoticeable in a quiet room.

This is with multiple Chrome tabs, the full MS Office suite and Dreamweaver open and usually dialled in to a meeting via Cisco Webex, amongst other smaller Apps.

Did I get lucky or am I just not very picky?

 

[thedocbwarren]

Sounds normal to me. I don't use Chrome so I've not seen the massive issues on my personal, however on another work laptop (also a 16) Chrome destroyed the thing and throttled it to hell. It caused video issues and spun the fans way up plus massive heat. Honestly I think Chrome is a pig and likely a big part of the problem.

I’ve just received a new baseline 16” through work. Connecting to a 24” 1920x1200 HP monitor via an Anker dock and then HDMI.

Seems pretty fine to me. Definitely runs hotter when connected to the display but not very hot. I would say hotter than warm. Fan noise is there but pretty unnoticeable in a quiet room.

This is with multiple Chrome tabs, the full MS Office suite and Dreamweaver open and usually dialled in to a meeting via Cisco Webex, amongst other smaller Apps.

Did I get lucky or am I just not very picky?

 

[supaninjax]

I would think that depends on the codec but a few that I have tried work ok. The area above the TouchBar gets quite warm, but I can still comfortably touch it... sometimes my 2014 MBP 15" would got too hot to touch. The fans were on but at very low speed.

What browser are you using? Are you using clamshell mode or open? Try watching a 4k youtube video fullscreen with full resolution on the XDR display for a few minutes and report back. It doesn’t start right away. Also what resolution are you using on the XDR display?

 

[jeffjank33]

That’s doesn’t make a difference on the 16“. There was exactly one model (13“ not sure which year) that was affected by this. The 16“ has then same capacity and features on both sides.

There are multiple sites saying you are incorrect. They talk to both the older 15" and the newer 16" having the same issue.. Not saying they are right but not sure what you are using as fact.

Why You Shouldn’t Charge Your MacBook Pro From The Left-Hand Side

A new piece of research claims that plugging in a MacBook Pro charger on the left-hand side of the device can cause the laptop to run hot, potentially affecting its performance

www.forbes.com

Can a simple charging mistake cause your MacBook Pro to overheat?

Can you really charge your MacBook Pro a "wrong way," causing overheating and throttling of the CPU? If so, what can you do about it?

www.zdnet.com

I never read anything it was only for the 13" MBP..